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Guest Hatethedrake!

Next season's Red Wings

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Filppula=Datsyuk-Holmstom

Clear-Zetterberg-Samuelsson

Hudler-Brunnstrom-Franzen

Maltby-Draper-McCarty

Downey

Lidstrom Rafalski

Stuart-Kronwall

Chelios-Ericsson

Lilja

Osgood-Howard

Where do all of you guys think Cheli is going. He is not going to retire.

Edited by Herr Hockey

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Well, what do you expect? A team full of great, useful players like Hudler?

:sly:

Last time the Wings were full of big, strong Canadians who would fight and hit...was the 1980s.

I'd rather have a team that played solid, gritty hockey at a high level and had maybe one or two guys who were really capable of fighting than a team full of fighters that only had marginal talent. Just as you can have too many finesse players, you can have too many enforcers.

I think this year's Wings are pretty close to the right mix. Maybe a tweak here and there, but nothing major.

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Well I dunno, if having "players like Hudler" means having Lidström, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Rafalski, Cleary, Holmström, etc then why not.

Note that I don't actually have any major complaint with what you're wanting. Having some guys like Shanny, McCarty (in their prime) would no doubt make the team more versatile. But I think the major worry, esp for the coming seasons, is the goalie. Getting a top-6 physical forward wouldn't hurt either...

That SWE in your name wouldn't stand for Sweden would it? If it does your response, although incredibly asinine (ya, thats exactly what he meant when he said 'useless guys like Hudler', you saw right through him. He really meant Lidstron, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Rafalski, Cleary, Holmstron, et cetera). You idiot.

It's called balance, I know you don't like that kind of chemistry on a team, and people like you have a perception that the only acceptable "tough" guy is someone like Shannahan (who happens to be your types de facto 'fighter' litmus test) Well guess what, there ain't many like him, theres a reason he's going to the hall of fame. So please get off the repetitive, and ignorant argument that the only tough guy worth having is a "Shannahan type player".

That said, I will also stop you before you can even say it. Cleary is not a "tough guy", yes he is tough, and he has more heart then 99% of players in the league, but that does not qualify him as a "team tough guy" in the sense that us NA hockey fans, or at least some of us, speak of. Definitely a guy I wouldn't get rid of though, guys like him usually end up being the staples in Stanley cup winning teams.

n12107106_36572838_3503.jpg

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Guest Hatethedrake!
That SWE in your name wouldn't stand for Sweden would it? If it does your response, although incredibly asinine (ya, thats exactly what he meant when he said 'useless guys like Hudler', you saw right through him. He really meant Lidstron, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Rafalski, Cleary, Holmstron, et cetera). You idiot.

It's called balance, I know you don't like that kind of chemistry on a team, and people like you have a perception that the only acceptable "tough" guy is someone like Shannahan (who happens to be your types de facto 'fighter' litmus test) Well guess what, there ain't many like him, theres a reason he's going to the hall of fame. So please get off the repetitive, and ignorant argument that the only tough guy worth having is a "Shannahan type player".

That said, I will also stop you before you can even say it. Cleary is not a "tough guy", yes he is tough, and he has more heart then 99% of players in the league, but that does not qualify him as a "team tough guy" in the sense that us NA hockey fans, or at least some of us, speak of. Definitely a guy I wouldn't get rid of though, guys like him usually end up being the staples in Stanley cup winning teams.

n12107106_36572838_3503.jpg

Who is "Shannahan?" Any relation to Yzzerman or Feddorov. What about Liddstrom? I'd say your posts are about as useful as condom machine at the Vatican.

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First off, here is our cap situation for next season:

2008-09 (Going into the offseason)

Pavel Datsyuk 6.7

Daniel Cleary 2.8

Henrik Zetterberg 2.65

Tomas Holmstrom 2.25

Kris Draper 1.583

Mikael Samuelsson 1.2

Jiri Hudler 1.015

Johan Franzen 0.941667

Kirk Maltby 0.883333

Tomas Kopecky 0.5

Nicklas Lidstrom 7.45

Brian Rafalski 6

Niklas Kronwall 3

Brett Lebda 0.65

Derek Meech 0.483

Chris Osgood 1.416667

Cap Number 39.522667

UFA*

Dallas Drake

Aaron Downey

Mark Hartigan

Darren McCarty

Chris Chelios

Andreas Lilja

Brad Stuart

Dominik Hasek

RFA*

Valterri Filppula

Ryan Oulahen

Igor Grigorenko

Jonathan Ericsson

Kyle Quincey

Jimmy Howard

Daniel Larsson

*There are more UFA's/RFA's than I listed, but I'm only listing the ones who have a shot at getting playing-time in the NHL next season.

2008-09 Line-Up*

Hudler - Datsyuk - Holmstrom

Franzen - Zetterberg - Samuelsson

Maltby - Draper - Cleary

Free Agent - Kopecky - Free Agent

Free Agent - Free Agent - Free Agent

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Kronwall - Lebda

Meech - Free Agent

Free Agent - Free Agent

Free Agent - Free Agent

Osgood

Free Agent

Free Agent

*Based on players with a contract for next season as of March 16, 2008

2008-09 Line-Up

Rolston - Datsyuk - Holmstrom

Filppula - Zetterberg - Franzen

Maltby - Draper - Cleary

Hudler - Kopecky - Samuelsson

(Downey - Hartigan - McCarty)

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Kronwall - Stuart

Chelios - Lilja

(Meech - Ericsson)

(Quincey - Kindl)

Osgood

Howard

Drake: Not re-signed/Retired

Lebda: Traded for draft pick(s)

Hasek: Not re-signed/Retired

2008-09 (Going into the regular season)

Pavel Datsyuk 6.7

Brian Rolston 3.75

Daniel Cleary 2.8

Henrik Zetterberg 2.65

Valterri Filppula* 2.5

Tomas Holmstrom 2.25

Kris Draper 1.583

Mikael Samuelsson 1.2

Jiri Hudler 1.015

Johan Franzen 0.941667

Kirk Maltby 0.883333

Aaron Downey* 0.55

Mark Hartigan* 0.55

Darren McCarty* 0.55

Tomas Kopecky 0.5

Nicklas Lidstrom 7.45

Brian Rafalski 6

Niklas Kronwall 3

Brad Stuart* 3

Andreas Lilja* 1.5

Chris Chelios* 1

Jonathan Ericsson* 0.75

Kyle Quincey* 0.75

Derek Meech 0.483

Chris Osgood 1.416667

Jimmy Howard* 1

Cap Number 54.772667

*Projected

That line-up is possible if the expected cap number of $55M is true. It would put us very close tot he cap. My solution would be to trade Samuelsson, Hudler, & Meech for draft picks. Downey and McCarty can be rotated into the line-up whenever the need for their physical play and fists are needed, which is every game so they would be regulars if I was the coach...

Love it?

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Discuss!

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Who is "Shannahan?" Any relation to Yzzerman or Feddorov. What about Liddstrom? I'd say your posts are about as useful as condom machine at the Vatican.

ha ha, do you feel good about yourself, I mean you know, the insult it took you 2 1/2 hours to think up kind of fell short, but hey, you get an A for effort their little buddy. Do you really want to do a spelling critique of each other? I mean I don't, this is a forum, and its a Sunday, the last thing I want to be spending my time is pointing out obviously mis spelled words in a setting where grammar isn't really that prevalent, or stressed.

However, if you would like to talk about hockey, I am fine with that. OK, ASH-HOLE.

lol, see I can think of some "witty" comebacks too ya little whipper snapper!

PS- I know you were trying be funny, but the fact that you used my misspelling of "Shannahan?" which clearly is incorrect, but still quite clear to whom I am referring to kind of makes ya look like a bigger ****** then you already did. Just thought I would point that out to ya.

OHHH YAAA, I also would like to point out something I posted about a couple days ago, well, to be exact, it was minutes after our loss to Nashville. However due to the "fair tratment" which shown around here, the post was quickly deleted.

It's ironic because the post was in ragrds to lack of the Wings ability to win game when my man with a plan Aaron Downey is out of the lineup. WE NEED HIM BABY!!!! he needs to shake that flu bug and get back ASAP, cause the wings NEED him to win. THATS A FACT JACK!

n12107106_36556461_8133.jpg

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Guest Hatethedrake!
ha ha, do you feel good about yourself, I mean you know, the insult it took you 2 1/2 hours to think up kind of fell short, but hey, you get an A for effort their little buddy. Do you really want to do a spelling critique of each other? I mean I don't, this is a forum, and its a Sunday, the last thing I want to be spending my time is pointing out obviously mis spelled words in a setting where grammar isn't really that prevalent, or stressed.

However, if you would like to talk about hockey, I am fine with that. OK, ASH-HOLE.

lol, see I can think of some "witty" comebacks too ya little whipper snapper!

PS- I know you were trying be funny, but the fact that you used my misspelling of "Shannahan?" which clearly is incorrect, but still quite clear to whom I am referring to kind of makes ya look like a bigger ****** then you already did. Just thought I would point that out to ya.

OHHH YAAA, I also would like to point out something I posted about a couple days ago, well, to be exact, it was minutes after our loss to Nashville. However due to the "fair tratment" which shown around here, the post was quickly deleted.

It's ironic because the post was in ragrds to lack of the Wings ability to win game when my man with a plan Aaron Downey is out of the lineup. WE NEED HIM BABY!!!! he needs to shake that flu bug and get back ASAP, cause the wings NEED him to win. THATS A FACT JACK!

n12107106_36556461_8133.jpg

The trouble with you is that you lack the power of conversation but not the power of speech. I assume you are a modest little person, with much to be modest about. Do yourself a favour. Leave the Red Wings talk to knowledgeable fans and not feeble minded individuals like yourself. To the people on this board who read this dolt's posts...I apologize for the 1 minute of your life you will never get back.

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First off, here is our cap situation for next season:

2008-09 (Going into the offseason)

Pavel Datsyuk 6.7

Daniel Cleary 2.8

Henrik Zetterberg 2.65

Tomas Holmstrom 2.25

Kris Draper 1.583

Mikael Samuelsson 1.2

Jiri Hudler 1.015

Johan Franzen 0.941667

Kirk Maltby 0.883333

Tomas Kopecky 0.5

Nicklas Lidstrom 7.45

Brian Rafalski 6

Niklas Kronwall 3

Brett Lebda 0.65

Derek Meech 0.483

Chris Osgood 1.416667

Cap Number 39.522667

UFA*

Dallas Drake

Aaron Downey

Mark Hartigan

Darren McCarty

Chris Chelios

Andreas Lilja

Brad Stuart

Dominik Hasek

RFA*

Valterri Filppula

Ryan Oulahen

Igor Grigorenko

Jonathan Ericsson

Kyle Quincey

Jimmy Howard

Daniel Larsson

*There are more UFA's/RFA's than I listed, but I'm only listing the ones who have a shot at getting playing-time in the NHL next season.

2008-09 Line-Up*

Hudler - Datsyuk - Holmstrom

Franzen - Zetterberg - Samuelsson

Maltby - Draper - Cleary

Free Agent - Kopecky - Free Agent

Free Agent - Free Agent - Free Agent

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Kronwall - Lebda

Meech - Free Agent

Free Agent - Free Agent

Free Agent - Free Agent

Osgood

Free Agent

Free Agent

*Based on players with a contract for next season as of March 16, 2008

2008-09 Line-Up

Rolston - Datsyuk - Holmstrom

Filppula - Zetterberg - Franzen

Maltby - Draper - Cleary

Hudler - Kopecky - Samuelsson

(Downey - Hartigan - McCarty)

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Kronwall - Stuart

Chelios - Lilja

(Meech - Ericsson)

(Quincey - Kindl)

Osgood

Howard

Drake: Not re-signed/Retired

Lebda: Traded for draft pick(s)

Hasek: Not re-signed/Retired

2008-09 (Going into the regular season)

Pavel Datsyuk 6.7

Brian Rolston 3.75

Daniel Cleary 2.8

Henrik Zetterberg 2.65

Valterri Filppula* 2.5

Tomas Holmstrom 2.25

Kris Draper 1.583

Mikael Samuelsson 1.2

Jiri Hudler 1.015

Johan Franzen 0.941667

Kirk Maltby 0.883333

Aaron Downey* 0.55

Mark Hartigan* 0.55

Darren McCarty* 0.55

Tomas Kopecky 0.5

Nicklas Lidstrom 7.45

Brian Rafalski 6

Niklas Kronwall 3

Brad Stuart* 3

Andreas Lilja* 1.5

Chris Chelios* 1

Jonathan Ericsson* 0.75

Kyle Quincey* 0.75

Derek Meech 0.483

Chris Osgood 1.416667

Jimmy Howard* 1

Cap Number 54.772667

*Projected

That line-up is possible if the expected cap number of $55M is true. It would put us very close tot he cap. My solution would be to trade Samuelsson, Hudler, & Meech for draft picks. Downey and McCarty can be rotated into the line-up whenever the need for their physical play and fists are needed, which is every game so they would be regulars if I was the coach...

Love it?

Hate it?

Discuss!

We're only close to the cap in that scenario because you are overpaying Filppula by 750k per season and you have three players too many. Ericsson won't be an NHL regular next year due to waiver rules. One of Lilja, Stuart, Quincey, Meech, and Lebda will NOT be here next year. Hartigan won't be on the roster. If we sign Rolston (or any other FA forward), we lose another forward (likely Downey or McCarty) or another defenseman of the five I mentioned earlier.

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The trouble with you is that you lack the power of conversation but not the power of speech. I assume you are a modest little person, with much to be modest about. Do yourself a favour. Leave the Red Wings talk to knowledgeable fans and not feeble minded individuals like yourself. To the people on this board who read this dolt's posts...I apologize for the 1 minute of your life you will never get back.

You may think he is an idiot and you don't share the same ideas relating to hockey - But do everyone else a favour and just ignore the posts if you are going to personally attack people. No need to waste everyone else's time sifting through useless replies, everyone on this board is capable of picking useful responses to reply to - we don't need to be told by you which ones are useful or not.

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Guest EZBAKETHAGANGSTA
ha ha, do you feel good about yourself, I mean you know, the insult it took you 2 1/2 hours to think up kind of fell short, but hey, you get an A for effort their little buddy. Do you really want to do a spelling critique of each other? I mean I don't, this is a forum, and its a Sunday, the last thing I want to be spending my time is pointing out obviously mis spelled words in a setting where grammar isn't really that prevalent, or stressed.

However, if you would like to talk about hockey, I am fine with that. OK, ASH-HOLE.

lol, see I can think of some "witty" comebacks too ya little whipper snapper!

PS- I know you were trying be funny, but the fact that you used my misspelling of "Shannahan?" which clearly is incorrect, but still quite clear to whom I am referring to kind of makes ya look like a bigger ****** then you already did. Just thought I would point that out to ya.

OHHH YAAA, I also would like to point out something I posted about a couple days ago, well, to be exact, it was minutes after our loss to Nashville. However due to the "fair tratment" which shown around here, the post was quickly deleted.

It's ironic because the post was in ragrds to lack of the Wings ability to win game when my man with a plan Aaron Downey is out of the lineup. WE NEED HIM BABY!!!! he needs to shake that flu bug and get back ASAP, cause the wings NEED him to win. THATS A FACT JACK!

n12107106_36556461_8133.jpg

you do realise that that was a mistake on nhl.com's part. They meant to put Pavel Datsyuk

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Guest Hatethedrake!
You may think he is an idiot and you don't share the same ideas relating to hockey - But do everyone else a favour and just ignore the posts if you are going to personally attack people. No need to waste everyone else's time sifting through useless replies, everyone on this board is capable of picking useful responses to reply to - we don't need to be told by you which ones are useful or not.

It's very nice of you to speak for everyone on the board. Your post was needless and I think you just wanted to hear yourself talk. I don't need your permission to post but thanks for caring.

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Grigorenko will make a miraculous overnight recovery to his famed former self, share a line with Datsyuk, and finally take the role of 'young player badly needed to finally take Sidney 'Horse-Face' Crosby down a peg'. :hehe:

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That SWE in your name wouldn't stand for Sweden would it? If it does your response, although incredibly asinine (ya, thats exactly what he meant when he said 'useless guys like Hudler', you saw right through him. He really meant Lidstron, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Rafalski, Cleary, Holmstron, et cetera). You idiot.

It's called balance, I know you don't like that kind of chemistry on a team, and people like you have a perception that the only acceptable "tough" guy is someone like Shannahan (who happens to be your types de facto 'fighter' litmus test) Well guess what, there ain't many like him, theres a reason he's going to the hall of fame. So please get off the repetitive, and ignorant argument that the only tough guy worth having is a "Shannahan type player".

That said, I will also stop you before you can even say it. Cleary is not a "tough guy", yes he is tough, and he has more heart then 99% of players in the league, but that does not qualify him as a "team tough guy" in the sense that us NA hockey fans, or at least some of us, speak of. Definitely a guy I wouldn't get rid of though, guys like him usually end up being the staples in Stanley cup winning teams.

n12107106_36572838_3503.jpg

You know what, I was actually going to try and argue with you. But you called me an idiot and that made me sad.

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One of Lilja, Stuart, Quincey, Meech, and Lebda will NOT be here next year.

Lebda was traded for draft pick(s) in my proposal.

If we sign Rolston (or any other FA forward), we lose another forward (likely Downey or McCarty) or another defenseman of the five I mentioned earlier.

I don't think signing a top-six forward is going to boot one of the 4th liners like McCarty or Downey off the team. My feeling is if we sign a Rolston-type player, either Samuelsson or Hudler will be traded. Neither of them makes much money and they can put up decent production when given solid minutes and good line-mates, so they could easily be fit into most teams roster. Neither will re-sign here next off-season if they are not guaranteed top-six minutes and Holland won't lose a player for nothing.

The hardest thing is going to be figuring out what we are going to do when Zetterberg's next contract comes into play...

Edited by WhiteLightning91

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Guest Hatethedrake!
this whole thread doesn't make sense... it relies so heavily on what we do in the playoffs, what offer sheet is thrown at Flip, what the new cap is, etc...

to even speculate, regardless of how fun it may be, is pointless

Your post is pointless. The Red Wings have a future. After the playoffs, life does and will go on. There is no harm in speculating what the team will look like as I and others have done. If you don't see the point then there is no need to post anything. Hence the pointlessness of your post.

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Honestly, looking at the roster next year does nothing but bring me down. Because in reality, itll look almost entirely the same. Maybe Dmac instead of Drake if hes healthy. Thats it. And that depresses me, because its been a long time since we had a dynamic, varied top 12.

What will next years Red Wings look like? The same roster we have this year. Except we'll probably lose Stuart as he scurries back to LA.

What do I WANT next years Red Wings to look like?

Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Franzen

Cleary - Filppula - Rolston

Holmstrom - Kopecky - Torres

McCarty - Draper - Maltby

Downey

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Kronwall - Commodore

Chelios - Ericsson

Meech

Osgood

Howard

Trade for Torres. Trade off Hudler, Lebda, Samuelsson. Im not a huge fan of the latter two, so they can go where they please, but I dont mind Hudler and I think hes got a lot of talent. I just dont think he should be wasting away in the bottom 6 despite being capable of being in the top 6. Id like to see him go to a team that has some big forwards in their top six who Hudler can play on a line with. He deserves it.

Homer is one of my favorite players, but it seems like his age is catching up with him. No, I dont think Franzen has replaced him on the PP, but I do think Franzen should replace Homer 5 on 5. Franzen is better in terms of skating and has better hands. Id like to see Homer in a more limited role 5 on 5, but still hold his position on the 1st unit of the PK.

I shouldnt have to explain my Torres choice. Hes a beast of a hitter and a pretty clean hitter at that. Hes also good for at least 15 goals on a full season, and two times (out of only 3 full seasons) has he put 20+ goals. Hes got some underrated hands, and he would be a fan favorite. He had a knee injury this year and last Ive heard he was a guy the Oilers wouldnt mind trading. Hed be absolutely awesome on our third line and would really add that North American grit we really lack. Not to mention hes only 26 years old..

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Cleary/Zetterberg/Franzen

Filppula/Datsyuk/Holmstrom

Bruunstrom/Hudler/Kopecky

Maltby/Draper/McCarty

Downey

Lidstrom/Rafalski

Kronwall/Stuart

Ericsson/Chelios

Lebda

Quincey

Osgood

Howard

I think if we somehow shop Samuelsson for whatever bargain bin pick we can get and give this Bruunstrom guy a place to bloom We'll be set with our forwards. Hopefully Bruunstrom doesn't turn out to be another Grigorenko, all hype and no return. Hopefully for Mac's sake he can get back a sliver of the old form and fit back on the Grind Line and we can say 'no thanks' to more Drake. I would keep Downey at the price/pay/play we have him if he is willing to be our grunt, he seems to like it here, then again, he seems to be a generally great guy.

On the back end, I like how Stuart has fit in to the system thus far and he is only getting more and more comfortable. He seems to jump deep into the play ala Kronwall but hasn't been caught deep yet that I've seen. I love this Ericsson kid, big body, seems to move well, overall really impressed with him. And Chelios is an old staple by now, cheap great stay at home guy, another good character in the lockroom.

I like most people see Dom retiring and Ozzy becoming number 1 with Howard getting his first full year in the NHL. Hopefully Ozzy can play like he did earlier this year, and personally he just got caught in goal more often during the Wings slump as a whole when Dom was injured. I think Howard is ready to take over at least a 40% role on the team.

this is the most legit looking line up i've seen on here so far, though i like meech over quincy

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I don't think we are going to make a big splash. We prob are going to look to add an additional top six foward for the right price and perhaps another depth foward.

Our farm system/a new contract for Zetter on the horizon will keep us conservative.

I hope we add Fabin and Rolston for next year.

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It's very nice of you to speak for everyone on the board. Your post was needless and I think you just wanted to hear yourself talk. I don't need your permission to post but thanks for caring.

I am just trying to figure out why you think you know which posts are pointless or not.

- and by the way, if I wanted to hear my own voice - I'd wouldn't by typing replies on a hockey forum. I have been posting here for 5 years, I don't find pleasure in seeing my own avatar anymore.

Get over yourself and make some informed posts, stop personally attacking people and everything will be cool.

Cheers.

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I don't think we are going to make a big splash. We prob are going to look to add an additional top six foward for the right price and perhaps another depth foward.

Our farm system/a new contract for Zetter on the horizon will keep us conservative.

I hope we add Fabin and Rolston for next year.

When all the news about Brunnstrom started to come out, the word in the media was that his agent was looking for a contract at the rookie max. I'm pretty sure the rookie max is somewhere around $3.7M. If that is still true, I do not see him coming to the Wings.

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When all the news about Brunnstrom started to come out, the word in the media was that his agent was looking for a contract at the rookie max. I'm pretty sure the rookie max is somewhere around $3.7M. If that is still true, I do not see him coming to the Wings.

The rookie max is some 800k, and the bonuses can be deferred a few years I think. If thats the case, and the Wings really wanted him, theyd likely defer the bonuses til '10 when Lidstrom will likely either retire or re-sign for a few million less than he makes now. Just a thought.

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When all the news about Brunnstrom started to come out, the word in the media was that his agent was looking for a contract at the rookie max. I'm pretty sure the rookie max is somewhere around $3.7M. If that is still true, I do not see him coming to the Wings.

Well isn't that assuming all the bonuses are hit? I was under the impression that the contract was around 900,000 and then all the bonuses allow the player to hit that 3.7 range. I could be wrong and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am.

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The rookie max is some 800k, and the bonuses can be deferred a few years I think. If thats the case, and the Wings really wanted him, theyd likely defer the bonuses til '10 when Lidstrom will likely either retire or re-sign for a few million less than he makes now. Just a thought.

You can defer it more than 1 year? I don't think thats true but it could be...

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