eva unit zero 271 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 so basically , according to you, b/c Zetterberg won the CS last year that Pasha has just this year been the better player? He wasn't before? He was the more valuable player in the PO's , his offensive numbers were almost as good and his backchecking and leading the team in hits in the PO's where physical play is up'ed 100 times was far more impressive. Check out his takeaway numbers, best in the NHL. Why was Rob Blake voted the Norris over Lidstom? Datsyuk and Zetterberg have been very closely matched in skill level for a while. I would take Zetterberg most years honestly. As far as the Blake question, because he was Canadian and had a goal scoring streak at the end of the season. People remembered how well he seemed to be doing right before the voting. There's no way he even deserved to be a finalist, but Blake's goal scoring was the only thing anyone had on Lidstrom, and a lot of people just didn't want a European to win it. Same with Pronger in 2000 over Lidstrom (and Jagr for the Hart) It took consistent domination by Lidstrom for people to get over it and give him the award. He should probably have won it three years running in 98, 99, and 2000. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SouthernWingsFan 854 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 so basically , according to you, b/c Zetterberg won the CS last year that Pasha has just this year been the better player? He wasn't before? He was the more valuable player in the PO's , his offensive numbers were almost as good and his backchecking and leading the team in hits in the PO's where physical play is up'ed 100 times was far more impressive. Check out his takeaway numbers, best in the NHL. Why was Rob Blake voted the Norris over Lidstom? No. I'm basically saying that you saying that Datsyuk has always been better than Zetterberg is a big stretch. Sometimes better than Zetterberg? Yes. Always better than Zetterberg? No. This past postesason? No, Zetterberg has a personal trophy which signifies the best overall player to show for that. This season so far? Yes. There is a big difference between always and sometimes. I don't know why Rob Blake was voted the Norris over Lidstrom, have to ask the actual voters on that one I guess. And I'm not really sure what this has to do with the conversation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Somebody mentioned he doesn't always have strongest hits, then you may want to look at that! We all should remember that one: Not only was that may favorite hit in the entire playoffs, it was my favorite single moment. Maybe even of the whole season. I loved that hit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Icteria virens 11 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 I don't know why Rob Blake was voted the Norris over Lidstrom, have to ask the actual voters on that one I guess. And I'm not really sure what this has to do with the conversation. of course you don't because it weakens your argument. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SouthernWingsFan 854 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 of course you don't because it weakens your argument. How so? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blikst 1 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Interesting that Zetterberg has only 26hits in 39 games. Would like to know how many fans on here still consider Zetterberg the better overall player than Datsyuk. There used to be a lot of discussion on this subject, not so much anymore, so just curious? You could probably still make that argument, right now Dats is playing better so you would probably be ripped a part or maybe laught at a bit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blikst 1 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 so basically , according to you, b/c Zetterberg won the CS last year that Pasha has just this year been the better player? He wasn't before? He was the more valuable player in the PO's , his offensive numbers were almost as good and his backchecking and leading the team in hits in the PO's where physical play is up'ed 100 times was far more impressive. Check out his takeaway numbers, best in the NHL. Why was Rob Blake voted the Norris over Lidstom? Lean reading comprehension... His point was that Datsyk hasn't necesserily always been the better player. Which I'm pretty sure he hasn't. And you are sure looking like you are unbiased dismissing Zetterbergs CS that way. He was deserving of it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest GordieSid&Ted Report post Posted January 12, 2009 He's taking off from where he left off in the playoffs last year leading our team in hits. I hope he finds yet another gear this postseason. Just goes to show how truly versatile a player Datsyuk is, dare I say the league's best even? It's been well over a year since I started saying Datsyuk may indeed be the best forward in all of hockey. Sid, AO, Iggy, Getzlaf, all do a great many things, but Datsyuk just does more things better than pretty much anybody. Not only does he playmake, but he creates more offense out of nothing than probably anybody in the league, he rarely loses the puck, even 1 against 3. And in the past 2 years he's added, hitting, shot blocking and penalty killing...and now more goal scoring to the things he already did well like setting up plays and winning faceoffs. And he almost never misses time so his ability to stay healthy is a major key. Z is the closest player in my mind in the league that is as all around good as Dats, but those who know me know I clearly think Datsyuk is a step above Z. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 (edited) It's been well over a year since I started saying Datsyuk may indeed be the best forward in all of hockey. It's my personal opinion that Datsyuk is the best active forward in all of hockey, and the 3rd best player behind only Lidstrom (a 6 time Norris winner who still kicks ass) and Brodeur (a top 10 goalie of all time who showed no signs of slowing down before his injury this year). I've grown to enjoy the hell I sometimes catch for this opinion, because I enjoy watching Datsyuk dominate the ice even more. To clarify: Regularly among the league leaders in points, lead the Wings for several seasons. Reigning Selke winner. Nowadays, hits (hard!) on the rare occasion that he needs to. More often he or the Wings possess the puck when he's on the ice, and he uses the body very well in these situations. Frequently comes out of battles against multiple players with the puck. Lead the Wings forwards last year in SB. (Again, not a stat he has to partake in often) A very solid shooting % that's a testament to his tricky shots. Superb vision. Fast and extremely agile skater. Arguably the best stickhandler in the league, even more so at full speed. A leader (else he wouldn't have an A in the Wings org, bank on it). Well above average faceoff man. Shootout monster, and also arguably the scariest player in one on one situations. Probably the cleanest player in the game per ATOI. Spirited, humble, and funny as hell. My only real knock on Datsyuk is that he sometimes tries to get too complicated with his playmaking, but imagine how many Datsyuk setup highlights would've never happened if he didn't. Edited January 12, 2009 by Datsyerberger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T.Low 1,011 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Somebody mentioned he doesn't always have strongest hits, then you may want to look at that! We all should remember that one: Made my day, bro, thanks! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 (edited) Thanks for pointing this out, YG. Furthermore, if you point out the high possession time Detroit has when Datsyuk is on the ice, and his 47 takeaways, it pretty much paints a picture that if he doesn't have the puck, he's a constant threat to either strip it or deliver a hit to the carrier. Couple that with 12 PIM in 40 games with ~19:50 TOI/G! On average, he's racking up about 1 point, 1 TA, and 1 hit per game. And he's a leader. He gets involved in scraps, too. Almost.. sounds like a power forward. With finesse! Or is regular cheapshotting a prerequisite of being a power forward nowadays? Edited January 12, 2009 by Datsyerberger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kozac 10 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Alex Ovechkin, WAS LW 138 Hits Hehehe, had to throw this out there. Datsyuk is awesome though, every year he's becoming better and better. That hit on Kane(?) in overtime earlier this year was awesome. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 (edited) Edit: Nevermind, lol. Edited January 12, 2009 by Datsyerberger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kira 451 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Again, it's the sense of surprise that his hits generate. I just wonder how many guys go back to the bench thinking, "I just got run by Pavel Datsyuk?????" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T.Low 1,011 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Again, it's the sense of surprise that his hits generate. I just wonder how many guys go back to the bench thinking, "I just got run by Pavel Datsyuk?????" Ha! Or, "I was watching Datsyuk then all the sudden someone hit me outta nowhere!" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Again, it's the sense of surprise that his hits generate. I just wonder how many guys go back to the bench thinking, "I just got run by Pavel Datsyuk?????" To tell you the truth, I'm willing to bet that players in the league in the last year or two respect Datsyuk's physicality more than, say, hfboards posters. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stactum 4 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Alex Ovechkin, WAS LW 138 Hits Hehehe, had to throw this out there. Datsyuk is awesome though, every year he's becoming better and better. That hit on Kane(?) in overtime earlier this year was awesome. Datsyuk is a Power forward! Love it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
C-Dub 0 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Datsyuk's da bomb...nuff said. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted January 12, 2009 Actually, I wouldn't call Datsyuk a power forward, on second thought... not because he lacks the skills to be one, but has skills that normally aren't associated with power forwards.. amazing stick handling, awesome defensive play, great pokecheck. I think "complete forward" describes Pavel better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kira 451 Report post Posted January 13, 2009 To tell you the truth, I'm willing to bet that players in the league in the last year or two respect Datsyuk's physicality more than, say, hfboards posters. Are you kidding??? Those idiots over there don't appreciate, respect or even acknowledge his existence most days. And you wonder why I finally told them to go to hell? They would not appreciate Pasha if he came up and threw them money. Moronic cretins. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
b.shanafan14 733 Report post Posted January 13, 2009 It's my personal opinion that Datsyuk is the best active forward in all of hockey, and the 3rd best player behind only Lidstrom (a 6 time Norris winner who still kicks ass) and Brodeur (a top 10 goalie of all time who showed no signs of slowing down before his injury this year). I've grown to enjoy the hell I sometimes catch for this opinion, because I enjoy watching Datsyuk dominate the ice even more. To clarify: Regularly among the league leaders in points, lead the Wings for several seasons. Reigning Selke winner. Nowadays, hits (hard!) on the rare occasion that he needs to. More often he or the Wings possess the puck when he's on the ice, and he uses the body very well in these situations. Frequently comes out of battles against multiple players with the puck. Lead the Wings forwards last year in SB. (Again, not a stat he has to partake in often) A very solid shooting % that's a testament to his tricky shots. Superb vision. Fast and extremely agile skater. Arguably the best stickhandler in the league, even more so at full speed. A leader (else he wouldn't have an A in the Wings org, bank on it). Well above average faceoff man. Shootout monster, and also arguably the scariest player in one on one situations. Probably the cleanest player in the game per ATOI. Spirited, humble, and funny as hell. My only real knock on Datsyuk is that he sometimes tries to get too complicated with his playmaking, but imagine how many Datsyuk setup highlights would've never happened if he didn't. True throughout. Oh and last year he nearly doubled the second place guy in Takeaways to set a league record. And he is on the PK, which doesn't happen (successfully) often with the upper echilon in scoring. The league is never going to look hard at Datsyuk for Hart because he is on the Wings and doesn't rack up 120 points a season, but give me him over Malkin or Crosby anyday. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted January 13, 2009 Alex Ovechkin, WAS LW 138 Hits Hehehe, had to throw this out there. Datsyuk is awesome though, every year he's becoming better and better. That hit on Kane(?) in overtime earlier this year was awesome. Thats a given, though. Everyone knows Ovechkin loves to hit and does it well. Hes a huge body as is. I'd definitely take him over Datsyuk, but Datsyuk's elite defensive game makes it close. Although, if Ovechkin ever becomes a great two-way forward, he'll have my vote for top 3 forward of all time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted January 13, 2009 Datsyuk is a Power forward! Love it! Haha, if that was the only clip you'd ever seen of Datsyuk, you'd think he was up there with Dustin Brown. Looked like a one man wrecking crew on that shift. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted January 13, 2009 Are you kidding??? Those idiots over there don't appreciate, respect or even acknowledge his existence most days. And you wonder why I finally told them to go to hell? They would not appreciate Pasha if he came up and threw them money. Moronic cretins. Huh? I think my statement must have been confusing. Here's what I said, simplified. Players in the NHL probably respect Datsyuk's physicality more than we do. They certainly respect his physicality more than the average joe on hfboards, who are a bunch of hosers. Better? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dat's sick 1,002 Report post Posted January 13, 2009 Thats a given, though. Everyone knows Ovechkin loves to hit and does it well. Hes a huge body as is. I'd definitely take him over Datsyuk, but Datsyuk's elite defensive game makes it close. Although, if Ovechkin ever becomes a great two-way forward, he'll have my vote for top 3 forward of all time. Top 3 of all time? He certainly has the qualities to become so.. his speed, shot, strenght etc. But he's such a stupid hockey player at the same time. I don't think he will ever be a really good two-way player. Just look at how many attacking opportunities he throws away because he just wants to shoot the puck all the time, no matter the angle or the situation. Sure, that's why he scores so many goals as well, and I guess that is the main job of a forward. He's one hell of an attacking machine. But compared to Datsyuk or even Zetterberg, he often feels extremely one-dimensional. They can mix it up, pass, shoot, deke etc. With Ovie it's always the same thing.. he goes in and takes a shot. I'd take Pasha over Ovie without question. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
