CAP TALK: What the Wings would do

[Turretin 0]

Looking at Franzen's performance last night, you can't blame the guy for wanting his payday. He needs to do what's right for him and his family in the long run, and you just never know whether you are going to have a career ending injury next season. However, I think that all the talk about the cap situation has ignored a pretty glaring reality:

The Wings are willing to let the older guys play out their contract (i.e. they are not applying pressure for these guys to retire), even though the younger guys are ready. When you talk about reducing the cap number, I want to give you some names:

Kirk Maltby - about .9 ave through next year

Kris Draper - about 1.6 ave through 2011

Tomas Holmstrom - 2.25 through next year

Right now, we are commited to about 47.3 next year already.

Without those 3, the Wings would be at around 42.5. All of those guys could be replaced by younger players. Clearly, Maltby and Draper could be replaced by Helm and Abdelkader (we even have Ritola and Axellson out there in the queue). Homer would be the toughest one to lose because of chemistry and he still has a fair amount of skill. The reality is, Homer can be replaced by Franzen and, to a lesser extent, Cleary.

Conclusion: If the Wings were less loyal, the discussion as to who can and should be traded for picks would be different. However, part of what makes players come here, take cuts to play here, and love this organization, is their loyalty.

[Chunkylover 26]

Looking at Franzen's performance last night, you can't blame the guy for wanting his payday. He needs to do what's right for him and his family in the long run, and you just never know whether you are going to have a career ending injury next season. However, I think that all the talk about the cap situation has ignored a pretty glaring reality:

The Wings are willing to let the older guys play out their contract (i.e. they are not applying pressure for these guys to retire), even though the younger guys are ready. When you talk about reducing the cap number, I want to give you some names:

Kirk Maltby - about .9 ave through next year

Kris Draper - about 1.6 ave through 2011

Tomas Holmstrom - 2.25 through next year

Right now, we are commited to about 47.3 next year already.

Without those 3, the Wings would be at around 42.5. All of those guys could be replaced by younger players. Clearly, Maltby and Draper could be replaced by Helm and Abdelkader (we even have Ritola and Axellson out there in the queue). Homer would be the toughest one to lose because of chemistry and he still has a fair amount of skill. The reality is, Homer can be replaced by Franzen and, to a lesser extent, Cleary.

Conclusion: If the Wings were less loyal, the discussion as to who can and should be traded for picks would be different. However, part of what makes players come here, take cuts to play here, and love this organization, is their loyalty.

You're right about everything you posted, yet I would be remiss if I did not point out the impact that the washed-up, useless, has-beens (I know, my words not yours, just some hyperbole for dramatic effect) Draper and Drake had in the playoffs last year. If the team can keep their offense going while tightening up on their defense, we'll benefit from having those guys for the playoff grind.

[Echolalia 2,961]

I see what you're saying, but loyalty isn't the only reason why those three are on the squad. They're all role players, but with the exception of Maltby, they're just about the best in the league at what they do. Draper is a faceoff specialist and a solid defensive forward. That makes him worth a lot to this team, especially on the pk, where a faceoff or a smart defensive play can easily decide the outcome of a game. Homer just about has the biggest ass in the nhl and for some reason doesn't feel pain, so players can whack him and crosscheck him and he's still going to have his butt in some goalie's face. Nobody screens like Homer. Nobody. There's also a certain sense of veteranship that is invaluable in teh playoffs; especially to younger guys who haven't experienced quite as much, but one of the biggest things that I think people often overlook is how these guys make the Wings organization look. Other players see they're still around and think "job security" when they come play for the Wings. Of course that isn't always going to be the case, but its a strong point in the emphasis of class that the Wings organization is known so well for, and that's part of what makes players like Zetterberg and Hossa and Datsyuk and Lidstrom take team discounts, so the 4M that the organization is spending on Homer and Draper and Maltby has already been paid off by the fact that Dats and Hossa and Z and Lids could've collectively demanded much more than that on their salaries, but for whatever reason, did not.

As for replacing declining veterans with rising AHL stars, its a very risky business, because these kids have such little professional experience, and that really becomes evident in a playoff atmosphere, especially when there's no one like Draper or Maltby anymore to talk a team down from a cataclysmic situation and get back into the running to win a game.

However I wouldn't lose any sleep if Maltby were to retire.

[DMAC 25 18]

Looking at Franzen's performance last night, you can't blame the guy for wanting his payday. He needs to do what's right for him and his family in the long run, and you just never know whether you are going to have a career ending injury next season. However, I think that all the talk about the cap situation has ignored a pretty glaring reality:

The Wings are willing to let the older guys play out their contract (i.e. they are not applying pressure for these guys to retire), even though the younger guys are ready. When you talk about reducing the cap number, I want to give you some names:

Kirk Maltby - about .9 ave through next year

Kris Draper - about 1.6 ave through 2011

Tomas Holmstrom - 2.25 through next year

Right now, we are commited to about 47.3 next year already.

Without those 3, the Wings would be at around 42.5. All of those guys could be replaced by younger players. Clearly, Maltby and Draper could be replaced by Helm and Abdelkader (we even have Ritola and Axellson out there in the queue). Homer would be the toughest one to lose because of chemistry and he still has a fair amount of skill. The reality is, Homer can be replaced by Franzen and, to a lesser extent, Cleary.

Conclusion: If the Wings were less loyal, the discussion as to who can and should be traded for picks would be different. However, part of what makes players come here, take cuts to play here, and love this organization, is their loyalty.

one problem with this homer being replaced by franzen, yes he could. but remember franzen is probably gonna have a higher salary this year because of his numbers so it would be cheaper to keep homer and let the mule walk

[egroen 384]

Draper is immovable -- he has a no-trade clause and his contract went into effect after the age of 35 -- so even if he retires, is sent to the minors or even dies, his remaining salary is figured into the cap.

[Turretin 0]

one problem with this homer being replaced by franzen, yes he could. but remember franzen is probably gonna have a higher salary this year because of his numbers so it would be cheaper to keep homer and let the mule walk

True, that is why you couldn't do a 1 for 1 replacement. You need to look at the entire group and offset that difference with the AHL players for Drapes and Malts. However, these guys are convincing me that loyalty to vets is financially smarter in the long run.

[Turretin 0]

Draper is immovable -- he has a no-trade clause and his contract went into effect after the age of 35 -- so even if he retires, is sent to the minors or even dies, his remaining salary is figured into the cap.

I either forgot about that or didn't know about it. Well, that changes my analysis quite a bit.

[talex 1]

Well since some players seemingly will have to go, I hate to say it but flip seems the best option because of the 3M hit. I would attempt to sign Hossa and Franzen Long term, yes there is risk, but I would submit that short of playoffs we could allow our players rest more often than other teams due to the depth of talent, thus hopefully prolonging their ability to perform at a high level.

If I was Holland I would be looking at the upcoming retirements (Maltby,Draper,Homer,Lids) and try to convince some players like Hudler to stick around stay with a good team and their time will come. I would not consider doing anything with Cleary, he is solid, likewise for Sammy for his salary. Due to the coming retirements, there will be some freed up room in the horizon, it is a matter of trust and convincing some of the good role players to stick with the team until these occur, whether they choose the payday or not is up to them. Obviously we have talent waiting in the wings as well.

So in a nutshell if I was Holland I would be talking to the role players 1st, then to Franzen and Hossa to see if and which ones would take a shorter term deal until the retirements occur, if that did not work I would 1st get Hossa, Franzen, Hudler, Sammy in that order.

Just my 2 cents.

[Shaman 713]

The best way to clear salary is to move people like Sammy and Kopecky at the deadline, people who are FA's and are gone anyway at the end of the year and we'll get nothing for anyway. If we can get 3 or 4 good picks or prospects for them id be happy, we'd have more cap space and not lose them for nothing.

[egroen 384]

The best way to clear salary is to move people like Sammy and Kopecky at the deadline, people who are FA's and are gone anyway at the end of the year and we'll get nothing for anyway. If we can get 3 or 4 good picks or prospects for them id be happy, we'd have more cap space and not lose them for nothing.

Unless you are making a significant roster upgrade, trading Sammy (or Filppula, Kronwall, Hudler, Lilja, Lebda, etc.) at the trade deadline is a huge mistake. You want to win the Stanley Cup this year. Depth is vital.

[Wingsallwin 0]

We do not have to move Homlstrom. As we watch right now, no one in the league can do screen job as much as Homer does. Besides, I do not mind if we trade or do not resign Draper, Kopecky, and Sammy.

I have loved Sammy's play this season but if we consider Franzen will resign around 3.5 to 4 million, we cannot get Sammy. If we resign both Hossa and Franzen, that means we cannot resign Hudler either. Then, if we want to resign Hudler, we have to trade one player who make around 2 to 2.5 million. That's why people say trade Filp who has not been spetacular. However, I don't think Filp is moved because Kenny resigned him only 2 million this season and next season is 2.5 so let's wait for him.

If we can trade Sammy, Draper, Maltby, or Kopecky to other teams, there is a bunch of chance that Osgood, and Stuart can be traded too.

Besides, don't forget we have to resign Leino again after this season. He will be RFA but he will ask around .8 to 1million.

It is never an easy choice but the bottom line is we have to have one of Franzen and Hossa and keep Hudler and Leino because they are the futures of the Red Wings