Bleeding vein likely to keep Lilja out for start of postseason

[HenrikRules40 14]

Thanks for the input. But if the fight/hits didn't cause the hemangioma, what do the doctors think caused it? And if it's not the fight that's causing the headaches, what do they think caused those? Thanks for any clarification.

Your explanation may be clear to others who read it, but it's late and I'm tired and I'm going with that so I need more clarification.

That kind of stuff is something you're usually born with. It was only just caught now.

[HenrikRules40 14]

Do you have a source?

Honestly, I don't have anything I can link you to. Sorry. If you don't believe me, I understand.

[HenrikRules40 14]

Interesting use of medical jargon, but where in hell do you see that from a bridging vein tear? That's a classic subdural hematoma, not a hemangioma.

Thanks for the first semester med school definition. I know what a subdural is.

Regardless, I hope he gets better and can play hockey soon.

Edited April 9, 2009 by HenrikRules40

[Electrophile 3,554]

A bleeding vein is not something you mess with. Don't expect him on the ice any time soon. Anything that deals with the lungs, heart or brain is automatic shut-down mode.

Edited April 9, 2009 by Electrophile

[Rivalred 630]

Privacy Issues here folks...

[Vladifan 680]

A bleeding vein is not something you mess with. Don't expect him on the ice any time soon. Anything that deals with the lungs, heart or brain is automatic shut-down mode.

This is the thing. No matter what caused it (and the headaches?!), if it doesn't stop, I can't imagine they won't have to go in and repair it. The scary part is the waiting and the complications that can ensue. That's why I'm thinking it's deeper than they're letting on and possibly too dangerous to try to repair.

I fervently hope I am SO wrong on this.

[Electrophile 3,554]

This is the thing. No matter what caused it (and the headaches?!), if it doesn't stop, I can't imagine they won't have to go in and repair it. The scary part is the waiting and the complications that can ensue. That's why I'm thinking it's deeper than they're letting on and possibly too dangerous to try to repair.

I fervently hope I am SO wrong on this.

I'm not a doctor (although I do play one on TV), but my limited knowledge tells me that if a vein is bleeding, they would have to go in and cauterize it to stop the bleeding, before the blood seeps in the cranial cavity. I've seen enough of those hospital series on Discovery Health to know they talk about that a lot, especially with closed-head injuries, which this is. In a closed-head injury there's nowhere for the blood to escape from, it just pools around. Frankly, I want to know why nothing has been done about it to this point. If this was me, and the doctor told me I had a bleed in my brain, I'd be asking when I was booked for the operating room. Because something like this can rapidly get out of control. This is the circuit breaker of the human body we're talking about here, not the appendix.

Not knowing where the vein is located or what kind of bleed it is, I don't know how high on the "Really Severe s*** Here, Folks" scale this is. I've never even heard of this occurring as a result of a concussive injury.

I'd say I hope this isn't severe, but a bleeding vein in the brain IS severe, regardless. I think we're already at "severe" and hoping this doesn't move into "really freakin' severe". I pray that my worst fears are just that.....fears. This just doesn't sound right......it sounds off. I hope you understand where I'm coming from.

Edited April 9, 2009 by Electrophile

[Casey 145]

Thanks for the first semester med school definition. I know what a subdural is.

Regardless, I hope he gets better and can play hockey soon.

I believe you know what it is, and I know exactly what it is, your slight against my education notwithstanding. Yet, that's not what they say it is.

Edited April 9, 2009 by Casey

[Guest CaliWingsNut]

That is indeed a rotten thing to happen to him. The scariest part to me is that they will only go in and sew it up if they have to. Which suggests the damage is not in a good place.

Get well, Lils. Hockey or no, may you heal completely.

Is there a good place?

[55fan 5,133]

The freep has a photo gallery "best of Lilja". Some good pics in there.

Here's hoping that all will be well and he will return in good time when he's physically ready.

[LivoniaGrinder 37]

Aw geez, a bleeding vein in his skull? Is that all? What a ******* *****! Pull up your panties and get the f*** back in the rotation SallY!

God, I didn't even know they could sew up a bleeding brain-vein. That's crazy, I hope the doctors are very cautious with him. That is precious Red Wings cargo there! Get well soon Lils, we miss you!

[Doc Holiday 0]

Scary stuff, this kind of stuff ruins careers. Get well soon Andreas.

I'm seriously biting my tongue regarding the whole purpose of needing an enforcer during the regular season. Andreas would never have been in this situation. The anti-enforcer crew can't have a plausible argument against it now.

That is completely false.

Weber chose to fight lilja because he was clotheslined during the play. Having Downey in the lineup wouldn't have changed a thing.

[Guest micah]

Furthermore, Weber was not even given a match penalty for the injury.

Causing injury does not warrant a match penalty, attempting to injure does. Without a doubt Shea Weber wanted to hurt Lilja, but I'm quite sure that he did not want to injure him.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Interesting use of medical jargon, but where in hell do you see that from a bridging vein tear? That's a classic subdural hematoma, not a hemangioma.

Has somebody been staying up late to watch House on the USA Network?

*Edit - (Just a joke, I know nothing about medical stuff but that is one of the diagnoses that they always say on House).

Edited April 9, 2009 by Frozen-Man

[Frozen-Man 144]

That is completely false.

Weber chose to fight lilja because he was clotheslined during the play. Having Downey in the lineup wouldn't have changed a thing.

I agree, Lils and Weber got into it against the glass and Lils pulled him down with his hand around his neck. This was one of those actual spontaneous fights that occured because of the actions of the two players involved. Downey would not have even been in a position to keep anything from happening. He might have tried to fight Weber later for retribution but that wouldn't have changed anything about the initial exchange.

[Guest micah]

I agree, Lils and Weber got into it against the glass and Lils pulled him down with his hand around his neck. This was one of those actual spontaneous fights that occured because of the actions of the two players involved. Downey would not have even been in a position to keep anything from happening. He might have tried to fight Weber later for retribution but that wouldn't have changed anything about the initial exchange.

Lilja, being a valuable superstar, could have turtled and said "if you want me, you gotta go through our toughguy first". Lots of superstars get away with that sort of thing.

[55fan 5,133]

Has somebody been staying up late to watch House on the USA Network?

*Edit - (Just a joke, I know nothing about medical stuff but that is one of the diagnoses that they always say on House).

They used to say it on MASH as well.

About the only thing I know about it is that subdural refers to under (sub) the dura mater. Dura mater translates as "tough mother".

Get well soon, Lils, you're one dura mater.

[Doc Holiday 0]

Lilja, being a valuable superstar, could have turtled and said "if you want me, you gotta go through our toughguy first". Lots of superstars get away with that sort of thing.

Nothing about this post makes any sense.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Lilja, being a valuable superstar, could have turtled and said "if you want me, you gotta go through our toughguy first". Lots of superstars get away with that sort of thing.

Are you serious? :caution:

First off, Lilja would never have done that whether Downey was in the game or not, he's not that type of player and, contrary to your contention, he's not a "superstar" ($6-10M dollar or 60+ point player - I mean I really like the guy but he's a 3rd pairing D man not a superstar) where it might be deemed acceptable to not risk the loss.

Second, had he turtled you, ESAD, and a few others would most likely have started a new thread and bashed him (and the Wings, and the coaches, and management) for being such a pansy.

Third, your assuming that this would have happened to be part of the 5 minutes of ice time that Downey gets when he is in the line-up. Since he is actually on the ice so few minutes it is unlikely that Downey would have even been on the ice when the fight started. Also, since it was Z's line out there when the fight broke out is makes it almost unfathomable that Downey would have been on the ice.

Fourth, had Downey (by coincidence) happened to be on the ice during the altercation, he would have gotten the additional penalty for jumping in as the third person in the fight and it would have been a crappy thing for Lilly and Downey to do as Lilja was the one that started the confrontation when he grabbed Weber under the chin and pulled him to the ground.

Finally, you are always advocating for the TEAM to be tougher now you are advocating for one of the guys that will fight to just turtle?

[Vladifan 680]

I'm not a doctor (although I do play one on TV), but my limited knowledge tells me that if a vein is bleeding, they would have to go in and cauterize it to stop the bleeding, before the blood seeps in the cranial cavity. I've seen enough of those hospital series on Discovery Health to know they talk about that a lot, especially with closed-head injuries, which this is. In a closed-head injury there's nowhere for the blood to escape from, it just pools around. Frankly, I want to know why nothing has been done about it to this point. If this was me, and the doctor told me I had a bleed in my brain, I'd be asking when I was booked for the operating room. Because something like this can rapidly get out of control. This is the circuit breaker of the human body we're talking about here, not the appendix.

Not knowing where the vein is located or what kind of bleed it is, I don't know how high on the "Really Severe s*** Here, Folks" scale this is. I've never even heard of this occurring as a result of a concussive injury.

I'd say I hope this isn't severe, but a bleeding vein in the brain IS severe, regardless. I think we're already at "severe" and hoping this doesn't move into "really freakin' severe". I pray that my worst fears are just that.....fears. This just doesn't sound right......it sounds off. I hope you understand where I'm coming from.

QFT. I've never used that phrase before but your post pretty much sums up where I am on all this. And I can speak for myself, because I've stayed at those motels.

OK, we gotta smile about something in all this...

Right now, I do not see him coming back at all. Again, I've never hoped I was more wrong - at least as far as hockey goes.

[ben_usmc 253]

Football solved the spearing problem that Tatum perfected, but unfortunately only after the Stingley incident. More recently, they implemented the Roy Williams horse-collar rule more proactively to avoid concussions.

Passes over the middle to wide-outs are virtually already illegal in the NFL due to concussions, as Don Beebe can attest. Hockey is way behind the curve on the ridiculous tolerance of fist-fighting, especially when defenseless players are getting injured.

Even John L. Sullivan never hit a man when he was down.

"Beaning" is hitting someone in the head with a ball. There is already armor against that. In MLB, NO ONE throws at someone's head. When pitchers throw at someone, they throw at their legs. They are warned and tossed after warning, and fined seriously when they do it. As well, there is shin armor, and many players wear it. There are no league rules governing "appropriate" purposeful attempts to hit a batter.

Pro basketball is not a sport with rules, so let's just pass on that.

If "hockey is hockey" it doesn't need ultimate fighting cameos.

Dude it sucks, but s*** happens in hockey. You can't go and change the whole dynamics of a sport because a few bad instances, you also have to keep in mind what the results will be if you do change rules, and we all know it will include alot more dirty play; there wil be a lot more Otts out on the ice and not much anyone can do about it.

Also they didn't make the horse collar rule for concussions it was made to prevent breaking legs. Oh and since they have "protected" players in the NFL namely QB's it has made the game that much less entertaining because the calls are subjective and star QB's get better treatment. They once asked what Joe M what he thought of the new rules and he didn't like them at all.

[MCFreshWes 0]

Pro basketball is not a sport with rules, so let's just pass on that.

LOL. I can agree with that.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Are you serious? :caution:

First off, Lilja would never have done that whether Downey was in the game or not, he's not that type of player and, contrary to your contention, he's not a "superstar" ($6-10M dollar or 60+ point player - I mean I really like the guy but he's a 3rd pairing D man not a superstar) where it might be deemed acceptable to not risk the loss.

Second, had he turtled you, ESAD, and a few others would most likely have started a new thread and bashed him (and the Wings, and the coaches, and management) for being such a pansy.

Third, your assuming that this would have happened to be part of the 5 minutes of ice time that Downey gets when he is in the line-up. Since he is actually on the ice so few minutes it is unlikely that Downey would have even been on the ice when the fight started. Also, since it was Z's line out there when the fight broke out is makes it almost unfathomable that Downey would have been on the ice.

Fourth, had Downey (by coincidence) happened to be on the ice during the altercation, he would have gotten the additional penalty for jumping in as the third person in the fight and it would have been a crappy thing for Lilly and Downey to do as Lilja was the one that started the confrontation when he grabbed Weber under the chin and pulled him to the ground.

Finally, you are always advocating for the TEAM to be tougher now you are advocating for one of the guys that will fight to just turtle?

Keep in mind; however, it was 0-5 at the time or something close to that. The entire dynamics of the game would've been different with an enforcer or someone in that roll to ignite a spark. So, really we can't predict if and what would of happened.

We won't see Lilja for 2009, I gaurantee that though. Poor guy.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Keep in mind; however, it was 0-5 at the time or something close to that. The entire dynamics of the game would've been different with an enforcer or someone in that roll to ignite a spark. So, really we can't predict if and what would of happened.

Did you read Micah's post that I was responding to? Here it is:

Lilja, being a valuable superstar, could have turtled and said "if you want me, you gotta go through our toughguy first". Lots of superstars get away with that sort of thing.

My post was not about the score or if Downey would have changed the dynamic of the game or anything else - it was about Lils turtling until Downey came and saved him. Every single statement that I made as to why Downey would not have changed what happened are true but you don't even discuss them you just say if he had been in the game that it might have been different, well yeah, if they started the game 5 minutes later or had one more icing call earlier everything might have been different, but that is not relevant to Micah's post either.

[Guest micah]

LOL. Easy there, kidos. You can safely assume that any post that starts with "Lilja, a superstar..." is in jest. The intelectual capacity of this thread is just fine, but your sarcasm meeter is broken.