Wings physical play is underrated

[Guest micah]

If the Wings don't fight or wrestle crocodiles they're not manly, and especially not physical.

This is another example of a typical LGW anti-fighting post, sadly. Make it sound as if your opponents are calling for a squad chock full of goons, the rebirth of th '75 Flyers. They aren't.

Nobody wants a squad of unskilled hacks, nobody wants a team that focussing more on fighting than hockey, nobody on LGW wants to see the hockey become the UFC. If they wanted the UFC they'd watch the UFC. What some of us want is a good, skilled team that doesn't take s*** from people and that doesn't look so flippin' scared everytime some 200lb meanie on the other team doesn't take kindly to the facewashes we give out. There is no excuse for the cowardly post-whistle play of guys like Franzen, Maltby, Sammet etc. If you are a chickens*** who isn't willing to back up your talk, skate back to the bench quietly. Don't talk tough and fail to deliver, that sucks and it's embarassing.

[Guest Shoreline]

This is another example of a typical LGW anti-fighting post, sadly. Make it sound as if your opponents are calling for a squad chock full of goons, the rebirth of th '75 Flyers. They aren't.

Nobody wants a squad of unskilled hacks, nobody wants a team that focussing more on fighting than hockey, nobody on LGW wants to see the hockey become the UFC. If they wanted the UFC they'd watch the UFC. What some of us want is a good, skilled team that doesn't take s*** from people and that doesn't look so flippin' scared everytime some 200lb meanie on the other team doesn't take kindly to the facewashes we give out. There is no excuse for the cowardly post-whistle play of guys like Franzen, Maltby, Sammet etc. If you are a chickens*** who isn't willing to back up your talk, skate back to the bench quietly. Don't talk tough and fail to deliver, that sucks and it's embarassing.

No, actually it's a "I'm tired of whining people with a pre-existing Wings agenda complaining about the Wings lacking something they personally want rather than just accepting and enjoying the team they have" post. Weirdly, this is very much similar to every other post I've made ranging from those who couldn't shut up about Ozzie at the end of the regular season to people who have nothing better to talk about than how wuss-like the Wings are or, humorously, how boring they are or how they need a bunch of crap that isn't who these Wings are. If the Wings get some fighters, enforcers, and all this s*** I see you complain about often, good for the Wings. I still cheer for them the same way. Unlike you I'm not going to spend my time bitching about them nor putting them down like you do. Instead, I'm going to mock you, since you can't seem to grasp how ridiculous your fanaticism for this team fighting is. It's fun.

CRIKEY!

Edited May 27, 2009 by Shoreline

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

This is another example of a typical LGW anti-fighting post, sadly. Make it sound as if your opponents are calling for a squad chock full of goons, the rebirth of th '75 Flyers. They aren't.

Nobody wants a squad of unskilled hacks, nobody wants a team that focussing more on fighting than hockey, nobody on LGW wants to see the hockey become the UFC. If they wanted the UFC they'd watch the UFC. What some of us want is a good, skilled team that doesn't take s*** from people and that doesn't look so flippin' scared everytime some 200lb meanie on the other team doesn't take kindly to the facewashes we give out. There is no excuse for the cowardly post-whistle play of guys like Franzen, Maltby, Sammet etc. If you are a chickens*** who isn't willing to back up your talk, skate back to the bench quietly. Don't talk tough and fail to deliver, that sucks and it's embarassing.

Nobody's against fighting. We are tired of your obnoxious train of thought that you seem to be alone on and that has been explained to you countless times and that you seem to still not get. The Red Wings don't get involved in that stuff. Get that through your thick skull and get over it.

[NomadFromKazoo 42]

No, actually it's a "I'm tired of whining people with a pre-existing Wings agenda complaining about the Wings lacking something they personally want rather than just accepting and enjoying the team they have" post

Ding, ding, ding, we have a winner! That's EXACTLY what it is. A noodle who's life is getting sand kicked in his eyes lives vicariously through others doing his fighting for him. The problems being he thinks it's WWF/cartoon fighting and doesn't get the danger of professional athletes hitting each other and his understanding of the impact of it on playing quality hockey is absolutely zero. Unfortunately his understanding of the sport is SO low he doesn't understand the utter fool he is. Then again you and I are always on the same page, shoreline.

[NomadFromKazoo 42]

This is another example of a typical LGW anti-fighting post, sadly. Make it sound as if your opponents are calling for a squad chock full of goons, the rebirth of th '75 Flyers. They aren't.

If this were true you'd be thrilled with the reality of the Wings physical play in the playoffs this year, that we stood up to the Ducks and out hit them and matched them punch for punch and now we're taking it to the physical Hawks and Havlat doesn't know what week it is because Stuart followed up Kronwall. Seriously dude, I know you won't answer this question because if you could you wouldn't be arguing the drivel you are, but what do you even THINK you want? The Wings have been very physical when it counts. Babcock is so different from Lewis. Yet all you do is ignore, or fail to grasp, everything happening around you that the Wings are being SMART physical, and it's no where enough for you. You want STUPID physical.

[Datsyerberger 279]

Dropping pounds like they was dope beatz, suckas.

On a side note... what?

[Guest micah]

On a side note... what?

Dropping pounds. Springtime. Getting back into shape after hibernation. Chopping wood. Running....also beats, because I'm an MC. I scribble and I scrabble on the microphone I babble...or something.

/not really an MC, believe it or not.

[Heaton 1]

This is another example of a typical LGW anti-fighting post, sadly. Make it sound as if your opponents are calling for a squad chock full of goons, the rebirth of th '75 Flyers. They aren't.

Nobody wants a squad of unskilled hacks, nobody wants a team that focussing more on fighting than hockey, nobody on LGW wants to see the hockey become the UFC. If they wanted the UFC they'd watch the UFC. What some of us want is a good, skilled team that doesn't take s*** from people and that doesn't look so flippin' scared everytime some 200lb meanie on the other team doesn't take kindly to the facewashes we give out. There is no excuse for the cowardly post-whistle play of guys like Franzen, Maltby, Sammet etc. If you are a chickens*** who isn't willing to back up your talk, skate back to the bench quietly. Don't talk tough and fail to deliver, that sucks and it's embarassing.

If that's anti-fighting, your post is clearly anti-Wings. Your posts are generally selfishly toned and ill advised.

The teams who do stuff after the whistle are the cowards. They don't have enough heart to do it when it matters.

Seriously, that macho crap is for the teams who don't know how to win.

[Guest micah]

If this were true you'd be thrilled with the reality of the Wings physical play in the playoffs this year, that we stood up to the Ducks and out hit them and matched them punch for punch and now we're taking it to the physical Hawks and Havlat doesn't know what week it is because Stuart followed up Kronwall.

Hi. I'm sure you're a busy guy, so maybe you've just missed the threads where I've praised the Wings for the hits and fists they've thrown thus far this playoff run.

The topic of this thread is whether the Wings are soft or not. My oppinion, as stated in my first post in this thread IIRC, is that they've been doing a great job with physical play this series, but that some of their players, most notably Lids, Maltby and Sammy, are soft. They don't often throw big hits, they don't fight, they don't do anything to indicate they aren't soft except play in the NHL. If merely playing means you're not soft, then nobody in this league is soft. Is that your argument, that the NHL has no soft players?

Seriously dude, I know you won't answer this question because if you could you wouldn't be arguing the drivel you are, but what do you even THINK you want? The Wings have been very physical when it counts. Babcock is so different from Lewis. Yet all you do is ignore, or fail to grasp, everything happening around you that the Wings are being SMART physical, and it's no where enough for you. You want STUPID physical.

I want the WIngs to carry one guy who is willing to say "nobody f***s with my guys" for the majority of the regular season. His job is to not take penalties and not take s***. That's all. I think that this team is skilled enough that they would be in the exact same situation they're in right now, had they had a toughguy in the lineup in place of MAltby for most of the reg season. I think that such a guy would cost the Wings zero games and perhaps have the added benefit of giving his teammates a little swagger. Despite what you keep telling me I want, I don't want some thug who hooks and slashes and crosschecks his way through his 4 minutes of nightly icetime. I want a guy who is fearless and confident in his abilities to throw down with anyone anywhere anytime if need be. A guy who knows his role, a guy who'll rack up 5 minute fighting majors but not put the team shorthanded...just like I've always wanted. Someone like Downey, Goddard (the Pens made it to the Cup finals in spite of the fact that they dressed him durring the reg season!), Boogaard, etc. I'd appreciate a power forward too, but I understand that guys who can score and play rough are expenssive and popular in drafts and that we can't afford one of them. No biggie. Maybe Ablekader will grow into such a role.

Please explain how Maltby and Sammy aren't soft. I'd love to hear this.

[Guest micah]

If that's anti-fighting, your post is clearly anti-Wings. Your posts are generally selfishly toned and ill advised.

The teams who do stuff after the whistle are the cowards. They don't have enough heart to do it when it matters.

Seriously, that macho crap is for the teams who don't know how to win.

Umm, yeah. Watch a few Wings games. We ARE the team that's doing stuff after the whistle. Jawing, pushing, facewashing....but refusing to back it up. I have no use for that sort of person, sorry. If you wanna talk s*** or stick your hand in another man's face, be ready and willing to fight. Otherwise just skate back to the bench with your tail between your legs. I'm okay with either way, but I'm not okay with sticking out your chest all yough-like but then refusing to drop 'em when you're called out.

[Heaton 1]

Umm, yeah. Watch a few Wings games. We ARE the team that's doing stuff after the whistle. Jawing, pushing, facewashing....but refusing to back it up. I have no use for that sort of person, sorry. If you wanna talk s*** or stick your hand in another man's face, be ready and willing to fight. Otherwise just skate back to the bench with your tail between your legs. I'm okay with either way, but I'm not okay with sticking out your chest all yough-like but then refusing to drop 'em when you're called out.

Your requests are unreasonable. You don't have to back everything up with a fight. The Wings indeed jaw, push, facewash whatever. It's a turf war. Fighting in the playoffs and the majority of the time in the regular season is useless and more for aesthetics than anything else. It still has a place in the game, just not when the games matter.

Fans wanting to see the Wings back up their talking is more for their own personal satisfaction than the good of the team. Seriously, this team is on the verge of back-to-back finals and we're calling guys like Franzen cowards? Get a grip, dude. Your priorities are severely out of whack.

[Rocket Queen 30 1]

Heh, beer cans eh Rocket Queen?

Didn't know that was you, micah! Thought you died years ago.

Eh.

[Frozen-Man 144]

No, actually it's a "I'm tired of whining people with a pre-existing Wings agenda complaining about the Wings lacking something they personally want rather than just accepting and enjoying the team they have" post. Weirdly, this is very much similar to every other post I've made ranging from those who couldn't shut up about Ozzie at the end of the regular season to people who have nothing better to talk about than how wuss-like the Wings are or, humorously, how boring they are or how they need a bunch of crap that isn't who these Wings are. If the Wings get some fighters, enforcers, and all this s*** I see you complain about often, good for the Wings. I still cheer for them the same way. Unlike you I'm not going to spend my time bitching about them nor putting them down like you do. Instead, I'm going to mock you, since you can't seem to grasp how ridiculous your fanaticism for this team fighting is. It's fun.

CRIKEY!

GREATEST POST EVER!

Nobody's against fighting. We are tired of your obnoxious train of thought that you seem to be alone on and that has been explained to you countless times and that you seem to still not get. The Red Wings don't get involved in that stuff. Get that through your thick skull and get over it.

Umm, yeah. Watch a few Wings games. We ARE the team that's doing stuff after the whistle. Jawing, pushing, facewashing....but refusing to back it up. I have no use for that sort of person, sorry. If you wanna talk s*** or stick your hand in another man's face, be ready and willing to fight. Otherwise just skate back to the bench with your tail between your legs. I'm okay with either way, but I'm not okay with sticking out your chest all yough-like but then refusing to drop 'em when you're called out.

:caution:

If the players on this team are that sort of people (which they aren't except in your warped view) and you have no use for that sort of person . . . then find another team with the sort of people you do like. Don't come here whining nonstop about how you don't like the Red Wings players and have no use for them but then act as if you like them anyway. - OK now come back with your typical response and tell me how much money you make (P.S. if you do make that much money how about becoming a booster on this site and help pay the expenses, $50 shouldn't really shouldn't cut into your millions that much.)

[NomadFromKazoo 42]

Hi. I'm sure you're a busy guy, so maybe you've just missed the threads where I've praised the Wings for the hits and fists they've thrown thus far this playoff run.

Really?

Oh, they're quite clearly soft - but the instigator rule allows them to be soft without much consequence. They very rarely accept and invitation to fight, and when they do, they have an irritating tendency as of late to get their asses kicked and their heads broken. Some of them will throw their bodies around sure, but of them very few will answer the bell when they're called out by their opponents. You can call it smart, and maybe theuy're so physically weak ansd fragile that it is smart to avoid the fisticuff like they was the swine flu, but I'll call it soft.

You spin like a ballerina. And apparently you fight like one. But go back to your quote summarizing the Wings as being "clearly soft." I realize it is dated making it somewhat unfair as it goes clear back to YESTERDAY. Spin all you want, Michelle Kwan, but this is clearly an indictment of the Wings overall and says NOTHING about the reality of their hard hitting or their standing up for themselves. It's not required to see some minor point you made that works for your spin when this quote is comprehensive and clear. It's also a comprehensive indictment of your own complete and utter lack of knowledge of the sport and demonstrates you can't even watch games and process the basics of what's going on. You just watch the hard hitting and legal checking and call for WWF on ice with no grasp of the reality it's not cartoon violence and it's no way to win hockey games because you end up distracted and in the penalty box.

[NomadFromKazoo 42]

I want the WIngs to carry one guy who is willing to say "nobody f***s with my guys" for the majority of the regular season. His job is to not take penalties and not take s***. That's all. I think that this team is skilled enough that they would be in the exact same situation they're in right now, had they had a toughguy in the lineup in place of MAltby for most of the reg season. I think that such a guy would cost the Wings zero games and perhaps have the added benefit of giving his teammates a little swagger. Despite what you keep telling me I want, I don't want some thug who hooks and slashes and crosschecks his way through his 4 minutes of nightly icetime. I want a guy who is fearless and confident in his abilities to throw down with anyone anywhere anytime if need be. A guy who knows his role, a guy who'll rack up 5 minute fighting majors but not put the team shorthanded...just like I've always wanted. Someone like Downey, Goddard (the Pens made it to the Cup finals in spite of the fact that they dressed him durring the reg season!), Boogaard, etc. I'd appreciate a power forward too, but I understand that guys who can score and play rough are expenssive and popular in drafts and that we can't afford one of them. No biggie. Maybe Ablekader will grow into such a role.

Please explain how Maltby and Sammy aren't soft. I'd love to hear this.

I don't know what's funnier. Your lack of knowledge of hockey thinking a talentless The Rock fighter's going to improve the team and he's not going to take penalties while he does it or your lack of awareness of history that the Wings have tried this and failed multiple times, Babcock's making us tougher was the answer. The funniest is the bolded part that you want your WWF on ice. I can see you strutting by the TV making a muscle in the mirror with your toothpick arms saying, "yeah, we bad." I'm sure your cat will be impressed. I am amazed someone that unobservant of what's going on in the games and with a dearth of knowledge of NHL hockey would be SO willing to flaunt it like you do.

Edited May 27, 2009 by NomadFromKazoo

[Bannedforlife 403]

This is another example of a typical LGW anti-fighting post, sadly. Make it sound as if your opponents are calling for a squad chock full of goons, the rebirth of th '75 Flyers. They aren't.

Nobody wants a squad of unskilled hacks, nobody wants a team that focussing more on fighting than hockey, nobody on LGW wants to see the hockey become the UFC. If they wanted the UFC they'd watch the UFC. What some of us want is a good, skilled team that doesn't take s*** from people and that doesn't look so flippin' scared everytime some 200lb meanie on the other team doesn't take kindly to the facewashes we give out. There is no excuse for the cowardly post-whistle play of guys like Franzen, Maltby, Sammet etc. If you are a chickens*** who isn't willing to back up your talk, skate back to the bench quietly. Don't talk tough and fail to deliver, that sucks and it's embarassing.

I've read through most of this thread, and from what I can remember you think that Lidstrom, Franzen, Samuelsson, Maltby, Holmstrom, and Kopecky are too soft, and I'm pretty sure you don't think too highly of Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Rafalski, Hudler, Filppula, Draper, Leino, Kronwall or Lebda, either.

I gotta ask, who do you want on this team? Should we just trade the entire team and all of our prospects straight up for the Ducks? Wouldn't it just be easier for everyone involved if you just traded your Wings jersey instead?

[Datsyerberger 279]

Eh.

Couldn't find a gif of him doing the old beer can smash.

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

I posted this in another thread, but I think it bares repeating:

If you seriously have that big of a problem with the Wings not being as "tough" of a team as you want them to be, then its time to cheer for another team. I understand that people like hockey fights (I do too), but not at the expense of smart hockey and winning. The way the current wave of grit-slappies talk about the team and their feelings towards fighting is downright absurd.

The problem I have is that every one of the slappies knows the type of team the Wings are and the type of team Holland is going to put together year-after-year as long as it remains successful. Given that you know this is how its going to be going forward either shut the f*ck up or move on to cheering for another squad.

[Dabura 12,232]

Some guys must still think it's fun. Shanny didn't fight because it's what he had to do to keep a job. Clark didn't. Neely didn't. Lucic and Chara don't. Those guys fight because they want to. Sure, there are guys like Kocur who would have never got a whiff of the NHL if they didn't fight, but there are just as many who fight because they want to, because they believe it's either honorable or kinda fun.....they just don't play in Detroit anymore.

I can assure you, the "fun" factor had and has very little to do with any of those guys' throwdown efforts. We're talking 97% "Do it for the team," 3% "Oh, this'll be loads of fun!" Again, this isn't peewee. This is guys who train with boxing gloves and take them off for the real deal. That's how fast and hard those punches are coming.

Unless we're talking about a hugfest. Yeah, sure, those are fun, seeing as how you're not risking permanently destroying your face.

[Rocket Queen 30 1]

Couldn't find a gif of him doing the old beer can smash.

That's a shame... It would have been perfect!

[Guest micah]

I've read through most of this thread, and from what I can remember you think that Lidstrom, Franzen, Samuelsson, Maltby, Holmstrom, and Kopecky are too soft, and I'm pretty sure you don't think too highly of Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Rafalski, Hudler, Filppula, Draper, Leino, Kronwall or Lebda, either.

I gotta ask, who do you want on this team? Should we just trade the entire team and all of our prospects straight up for the Ducks? Wouldn't it just be easier for everyone involved if you just traded your Wings jersey instead?

As far as what I want on this team, I explained it in detail a few posts ago. I want a lunchbucket type, regular season guy on the roster who will play his heart out (even in the first 60 games when other players apparently aren't).

I don't like Maltby or Sammy. I don't like that Franzen is perhaps softer than either of them, but I do like his play, especially this playoff run. He's been a machine and I've said on several occasions that he's MVP so far. Ditto Homer, in that I like his game, but not his attitude always. If you're afraid to get hit by a puck, why are you afraid to get hit by Chris Pronger? Doesn't make sence to me, but it doesn't have to. I like Z and D and Lidstrom. I like Kopy too, for the most part. I LOVE Ozzie. I'm a Conklin fan, because I watched him play when he was a kid. I like Ablekader and Ericcson alot, and I can't wait for them to be full-timers.

Trade my Wings jerseys? Nobody wants them. Fans of this team have pretty short memories, I'm afraid. You wouldn't believe the number of "fans" who don't know the names on my sweaters. I've always been a Wings fan, as long as I can remember. As a child I read up on everything I could about the Wings of old, especially the pre-50s teams that seldom get much press these days.

I love the Wings. I like alot of their players, even if I don't always like the way they act in every situation. I can both applaud them when they do great things and laud them when they don't.

[Guest micah]

I don't know what's funnier. Your lack of knowledge of hockey thinking a talentless The Rock fighter's going to improve the team and he's not going to take penalties while he does it or your lack of awareness of history that the Wings have tried this and failed multiple times, Babcock's making us tougher was the answer.

I don't remeber Joey Kocur costing us alot of games. Or Shanahan (though he was far from tallentles, I'd quit calling for a tough 4th liner if we could have a tough 2nd liner....I don't clamour for such because I know they're expensive and rare though). Or even Puschor, as God-awful as he was at both fighting and hockey. Downey didn't cost us a whole lot of games last year, did he?

The funniest is the bolded part that you want your WWF on ice. I can see you strutting by the TV making a muscle in the mirror with your toothpick arms saying, "yeah, we bad." I'm sure your cat will be impressed. I am amazed someone that unobservant of what's going on in the games and with a dearth of knowledge of NHL hockey would be SO willing to flaunt it like you do.

What's with all the personal shots here? I don't know if I've ever talked about or even considered what another poster is like (except those that seem to have a little crush on me), just what their posts say. Think and say what you will by all means, I have thick skin and am not the type to get my feelings hurt on the internet. If you ever want to really meet me and see my arms for yourself, zip me a PM. I spend a fair ammount of time in Grand Rapids, I can meet you for a drink sometime if you're still in KZoo. I'll let you touch my "toothpick arms" if you want.

Though I don't have a cat, I am, as of very early this morning, a father again! Yeeahhhhhhh me! A 7lb 4oz beautiful baby girl. That's two of each, I think our collection is complete now.

I'm not sure why you take pains to point out my apparent lack of hockey knowledge. I know more about hockey than some, less than others. I'm okay with that. On the list of "top million things I'd change about myself", niether my arms nor my hockey knowledge make the cut.

[kook_10 1,705]

congrats on the baby! my wife is due with our first, a girl too, in 3 weeks now. I've been trying to convince her, but I dont think I will successfully be able to name her Connie Smythe !

[ltgator333 3]

Ok I don't want to get into the above discussion, sorry! It'll just get me going..

I was born into wings fan-dom, but have been paying attention since about '94-'95 and as far and well as I can remember the wings' physical play has always been underrated! So what's new? When the bruise brothers left, it started shortly thereafter from what I've been told.

[esteef 2,679]

The Wings hacky sack ability is underrated.

esteef