Babcock not happy with top line

[Icesurfer 75]

The point of trying Abby with Maltby for a few shifts is so that Z's and Helmer's lines ARE NOT broken up. Who said anything about breaking up the DHE EXPRESS line? I was the one who actually talked about putting that line together BEFORE the start of the season.... you can search my posts and you will see. At the time I said it would be the fastest line in the league...... and as it turns out it may be very true.

I love good skating lines. And the first line as it is now is NOT a good skating line. Same with Williams.... horrible skater.... and the second line did much better once Williams went down ..... why???? Because they are skating much better.

Bowman wouldn't keep the same line together all game long anyway..... Babcock use to mix lines up his first few years also.... and this year he hasn't done much of in-game line mixing as in his first two years. Bowman was the best at it.

With regard to points.... I am pointing out that you have to remove the PP points to see how they are performing 5 on 5.

Edited November 21, 2009 by Icesurfer

[Icesurfer 75]

The point of trying Abby with Maltby for a few shifts is so that Z's and Helmer's lines ARE NOT broken up. Who said anything about breaking up the DHE EXPRESS line? I was the one who actually talked about putting that line together BEFORE the start of the season.... you can search my posts and you will see. At the time I said it would be the fastest line in the league...... and as it turns out it may be very true.

I love good skating lines. And the first line as it is now is NOT a good skating line. Same with Williams.... horrible skater.... and the second line did much better once Williams went down ..... why???? Because they are skating much better.

Bowman wouldn't keep the same line together all game long anyway..... Babcock use to mix lines up his first few years also.... and this year he hasn't done much of in-game line mixing as in his first two years. Bowman was the best at it.

With regard to points.... I am pointing out that you have to remove the PP points to see how they are performing 5 on 5.

Edited November 21, 2009 by Icesurfer

[Carman 387]

Ok fair enough, I agree with experimenting with the lines especially with Abby. I was mostly posting in regard for your comment about Bertuzzi as a "wasted signing". That's all.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

As far as Datsyuk being cold goes... coming into tonight's game he had 12pts in 10 games. He's got 17pt in 18 games so far this year. He's cold for Datsyuk, but I wouldn't say he's struggling.

I was just watching the Sharks game on the team teal webcast and they think Datsyuk's having a terrible season so far. They told me he'll have a point total in the low 70's and definitely won't top 80. They said he's ice cold.

So I told them about the 13pts in the last 11 games thing and mentioned that he's got 17 in 18 games coming off a really cold start.... and they didn't mention another word about it. So I just told them to count on him having a "Datsyuk" season.

[Icesurfer 75]

Ok fair enough, I agree with experimenting with the lines especially with Abby. I was mostly posting in regard for your comment about Bertuzzi as a "wasted signing". That's all.

For $1.5 million I would rather have Travis Moen or Manny Malhotra..... there were a lot of decent players available and ANY of them would have jumped at the chance to come Detroit and I was so pissed that Holland went after HAS-BEENS whose careers are declining rapidly.

Malhotra was the first star of the game tonight for the Sharks btw..... LOL... It was a good game.

Holland went after Williams and Bertuzzi based on PAST performances..... bad move. And Holland traded Williams once before because of his pathetic skating ...... so exactly what did he expect to change this time?????

[Carman 387]

Yeah, actually I thought his stats were worse then they actually are. He's going to be just fine. I really think the Wing's should just stay pat and things will work out.

Holland went after Williams and Bertuzzi based on PAST performances..... bad move. And Holland traded Williams once before because of his pathetic skating ...... so exactly what did he expect to change this time?????

Well, guys Holland completely messed up with signing Bertuzzi. Might as well fire Holland for that absurd signing. I mean come on. What do you hope to accomplish here?

Edited November 21, 2009 by Carman

[Icesurfer 75]

Yeah, actually I thought his stats were worse then they actually are. He's going to be just fine. I really think the Wing's should just stay pat and things will work out.

Wngs have no choice but to stand pat..... who in the heck would want to trade for Bertuzzi and Williams.... at $1.5 mil each you probably couldn't find a team to take on either one. The only choice they have is to put Bertuzzi and Williams on the same line with Filppula...... 3rd line. And since Filppula doesn't shoot but Williams does maybe they will click if Bertuzzi goes to the net..... but that probably won't happen until Franzen comes back.

[Carman 387]

Exactly, so what is the point of this post? The Wing's don't have many options if they have any at all. I'm having trouble finding a discussion point.

[Icesurfer 75]

Holland was more concerned with COUNTING GOALS he lost in the off-season and trying to replace the lost goals rather than getting a quality player. So he was looking at Bertuzzi's and William's goal total not their overall performance and skating ability. What good is scoring 20 goals when your line gives up 20 goals in the process?

[Carman 387]

Holland was more concerned with COUNTING GOALS he lost in the off-season and trying to replace the lost goals rather than getting a quality player. So he was looking at Bertuzzi's and William's goal total not their overall performance and skating ability. What good is scoring 20 goals when your line gives up 20 goals in the process?

So you are blaming Holland? It's 1/4 through the season and you are blaming Holland. ...

Anyways good night, good luck making a Holland dart board to help you get through November loses.

[skyphoenix 153]

If you do the math, Bertuzzi has 9 points and is still a -5 which means he has been out there for 14 goals against, right? I don't see any upside at all from having him on the top line.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Holland was more concerned with COUNTING GOALS he lost in the off-season and trying to replace the lost goals rather than getting a quality player. So he was looking at Bertuzzi's and William's goal total not their overall performance and skating ability. What good is scoring 20 goals when your line gives up 20 goals in the process?

When you phrase it like that there are two options:

1. Your astute analysis and vision far surpasses that of the man who is widely considered the best GM in hockey. You've seen through his careful planning and unmasked him as a short-sighted fool who made a pair of poorly thought out signings.

2. You're over-simplifying a complicated situation and giving yourself too much credit.

[brett 1,029]

i think abs has been playing good the past couple games. if babs wants to switch anything up

might want to try abs or eaves with datsyuk just for a few shifts..IMO they can hold on the puck alot better and will work a s*** load harder then bert would to be on the top line

[Jake Ryan 1]

Uh oh... i see another Jake Ryan thread coming if that line doesn't score tonight..

but really, Datsyuk is trying hard he just doesn't have any chemistry with Bert (who can't find the back of the net to save his life). Maybe they should try putting Abby up there. He is a goal scorer and with Datsyuk passing it to him he can't do much worse than Bert... Now to contradict myself, i still think Bert best option for that line, skill wise.

p.s. On a good note, only 3ish more months until Franzen is back!!!

Don't worry. You won't hear any more complaints about Holmstrom from me. You get banned for a month around here if you express your dislike for a Red Wing 2 years past his usefullness. Holmstrom's the best. We'll have to just keep searching for the reason Datsyuk has gone from Hart trophy candidate to a big question mark. It has nothing to do with Holmstrom. That's for sure. Holmstrom just oozes awesomeness for any linemate on his line. It's a guarantee you're going to be close to 100 pts with Holmstrom on your line. Funny how Z doesn't seem to be struggling. Perhaps Tomas Holmstrom is really playing on Zetterberg's line in Cleary's jersey and we're just not looking close enough to catch it?

[Theophany 110]

Don't worry. You won't hear any more complaints about Holmstrom from me. You get banned for a month around here if you express your dislike for a Red Wing 2 years past his usefullness. Holmstrom's the best. We'll have to just keep searching for the reason Datsyuk has gone from Hart trophy candidate to a big question mark. It has nothing to do with Holmstrom. That's for sure. Holmstrom just oozes awesomeness for any linemate on his line. It's a guarantee you're going to be close to 100 pts with Holmstrom on your line. Funny how Z doesn't seem to be struggling. Perhaps Tomas Holmstrom is really playing on Zetterberg's line in Cleary's jersey and we're just not looking close enough to catch it?

You realize that your sarcasm is really blatant and you're probably gonna get banned again, right?

And it's not that you expressed your dislike for Homer; it's that you did it to the point that your hate for Homer is a forum meme.

On-topic, I wouldn't be happy with the top line either; when you think of what a healthy Franzen-Dats-Homer line could accomplish at the current level Dats and Homer are both playing at, looking at Bertuzzi in that role just isn't fair.

Yeah, Bertuzzi can still play hockey, but certainly not top-6 forward hockey.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Don't worry. You won't hear any more complaints about Holmstrom from me. You get banned for a month around here if you express your dislike for a Red Wing 2 years past his usefullness. Holmstrom's the best. We'll have to just keep searching for the reason Datsyuk has gone from Hart trophy candidate to a big question mark. It has nothing to do with Holmstrom. That's for sure. Holmstrom just oozes awesomeness for any linemate on his line. It's a guarantee you're going to be close to 100 pts with Holmstrom on your line. Funny how Z doesn't seem to be struggling. Perhaps Tomas Holmstrom is really playing on Zetterberg's line in Cleary's jersey and we're just not looking close enough to catch it?

Q: What's the difference between a Red Wing who's 2 years past his usefulness and a Red Wings who's leading the team in goals?

A: Nothing. (According to Jake Ryan)

[Theophany 110]

Q: What's the difference between a Red Wing who's 2 years past his usefulness and a Red Wings who's leading the team in goals?

A: Nothing. (According to Jake Ryan)

That's not a very good joke.

You should work on your punch lines.

[titanium2 867]

Yeah, Bertuzzi can still play hockey, but certainly not top-6 forward hockey.

I feel that way too but at the same time, isn't Bert in a similar category as Homer as in any effectiveness of his will only come out if he plays a top-six role? They shouldn't really mess with the third line and I can't really see him on the 4th line.

[Theophany 110]

I feel that way too but at the same time, isn't Bert in a similar category as Homer as in any effectiveness of his will only come out if he plays a top-six role? They shouldn't really mess with the third line and I can't really see him on the 4th line.

Not really.

Bert's not a specialist, as Homer is. Homer is perfect for line-mates like Zetterberg/Datsyuk, or Franzen/Datsyuk. When there are two players on the ice that can cycle without needing the third player to help out 100% of the time, you can afford to get a specialist in there like Homer.

Especially when you get scoring defensemen on the blue line like Lidstrom and Rafalski. Having Homer is a huge boost. No one in the NHL is as good at screening or deflections as Homer.

With Bertuzzi on the same line as Datsyuk, I agree, he's not at his most effective (granted with the control Datsyuk has, it's almost superfluous to try to cycle).

But once Franzen is back, you'll see the benefit of Homer; Franzen is a born goal scorer, and that will be an incredibly solid line.

Edited November 21, 2009 by Theophany

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Not really.

Bert's not a specialist, as Homer is. Homer is perfect for lime-mates like Zetterberg/Datsyuk, or Franzen/Datsyuk. When there are two players on the ice that can cycle without needing the third player to help out 100% of the time, you can afford to get a specialist in there like Homer.

Especially when you get scoring defensemen on the blue line like Lidstrom and Rafalski. Having Homer is a huge boost. No one in the NHL is as good at screening or deflections as Homer.

With Bertuzzi on the same line as Datsyuk, I agree, he's not at his most effective (granted with the control Datsyuk has, it's almost superfluous to try to cycle).

But once Franzen is back, you'll see the benefit of Homer; Franzen is a born goal scorer, and that will be an incredibly solid line.

This, this, this!

[Drake_Marcus 890]

That's not a very good joke.

You should work on your punch lines.

Your mom.

[Theophany 110]

Your mom.

Winner! You're officially the funniest person on LGW.

Or you are until someone else makes a your mom joke.

[titanium2 867]

Your mom.

Your... half-sister?

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Your... half-sister?

I actually have one of those. But she's less than a year old. Luckily I'm old enough that when I'm seen with her people inevitably think I'm the father.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Winner! You're officially the funniest person on LGW.

Or you are until someone else makes a your mom joke.

Deal.