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TheOctopusKid

Oh How I Hate the Capitals

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C'mon Cindy....paint in the rest of the beard. or shave. or dye it blond. Nobody here thinks it's sexy except carman.

OT: Refreshingly disjointed thread. It's like a saga. Or an Adventure. (lookin at you echolalia)

Keep it going, I say.

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Sweet Beans! How is the world did this become a Crosby thread? You stop checking the forums for half a day and your thread goes straight to hell! It was surprising that what was originally intended as cathartic venting turned towards a photoshopped picture of Crosby.

Before I continue I think I need to clarify a couple of points that seem to have driven some discontent:

I am by no means an overty aggressive and angry person. Far from it. The hyberbole of "rage" is more of general dissappointment and I suppose anger to some extent over my personal Capitals experience. What was once an incredibly fun and entertaining event has devolved into nonsense gibberish and force fed exclamation of supposed greatness. I love hockey. I believe it to be the greatest sport to watch and beyond just being a life long fan of the Red Wings for over 25 years, I can honestly say I enjoying watching the game. Period. Where a lot of my resentment over this whole experience is the fact that those new to the game here in the Metro DC area are not there because of hockey, but there for the winning. I know that seems like a very subtle distinction but it is incredibly different. The more fans that I interact (I use it in the plural), the more arrogant and ignorant they appear to be.

There is nothing wrong with Pride in your team - it's what drives us and distinguishes as fans (again in the plural). However zeal that is not tempered by knowledge leads down an ugly path.

As for "stop going or watching the games" - yes, I suppose that is an option. The Capitals coverage here is pretty substantail but I could avoid it to some extent. But what's frustrating is the fact that I have to avoid at all. Even Colorado, The Chris Pronger St Louis Blues, and the old Chelios/Roenick Era of the Hawks - I had less issue with these teams than I do with the Washington DC experience. What was once something I was genuinely excited about has grown incredibly distasteful.

Additionally, there are some games that I cannot avoid - when I said I cherry picked some of the games of teams I wanted to see - I mean, collectively my managing director has season tickets for us to use to soft sell clients - as the Capitals are a very hot commodity and afterwards, I or a colleague will often take them to dinner and the Capitals game. Hence why I have to stay generally buttoned up over the whole experience and was forced to vent here on the forum. Certainly I can ask someone else to do it - but if it's my client, it's my responsibility. The reason I know the intent of a lot of the "fans" in my section is that many of the season ticket holders are corporate wholesalers, government consultants, politicals, and lobbyists. This was not the case three years ago when the section was relatively empty and full of Petr Bonda and Adam Oates jerseys.

I have been to many other arenas throughout the league and a handful of colleges. I was fortunate in my job required me to travel a great deal and lead me to games in: New York, New Jersey, Calgary, LA, Dallas, Florida (that was weird), Chicago, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and of course Washington DC. Actually, I can say that I've seen as many away games for the Red Wings that I've seen at home. I was a partial season ticket holder for the Bruins when I lived in Boston for 6 months. And of course (Chicago poster) the crowds said a lot of things that could not be seen as favorable to the Wings. But almost in every case (Florida is still iffy, this was during the whole Rubber Rat fiasco), the fans were genuinely fans of their respective teams and had some grounding in the game, it's tradition, the rules, rosters, history, strategy, etc. So when a Chicago fan told me to "Eat s*** and Die" - I was far more comfortable with that:

1) Chicago and Detroit have a long standing rivalry and that level of familiarity breeds contempt.

2) After he told me how much he hated the Wings, he yelled and screamed at Shawn Thornton to stop forechecking like a girl (Not exactly in those words)

3) The Fan made no pretense that his team was anything but what it was - a rebuilding franchise with a smattering of old veterans and draft picks and carried no sense of entitlement - his insults were driven soley for his love of his team and his hatred of the Red Wings because you sure as hell couldn't accuse him of being there for all of his team's success (circa early 2000's - maybe 2002?).

The collective fan bases of the more established teams, albeit hostile, are knowledgable and generally passionate about their team.

In my opinion, and perhaps I wasn't explicit enough - The Capitals fan base is "hockey dumb", arrogant with no justification, and more passionate about the sense of winning than the overall Capitals team as a whole. This, combined with offensive focus, defensive lazy hockey has exacerbated the situation. Christ, it's like watching a team full of Jagr's flanked by Leino's. Sigh.

I hope that clarified my intent whether you agree with it or not. To those that doubt what I am saying - I know that it resonantes wtih some of the prior posters who do live in the DC Metro area who have parrotted almost exactly what I've said so far. Take it from the Wings fans down here, it's not pretty and I know I'm not alone on this. I don't really see the point to continue this as I feel better. I apologize that I just took an emotional dump on the forums but I feared my head would pop off. I will say that I will be watching the Capitals closely come playoff time when they square off against Boston and hope Shawn Thornton stops forechecking like a girl (not exactly in those words).

Edited by TheOctopusKid

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That reminds me of the LA Kings in the late 80's/early 90's. When Gretzky (and coincidentally Rollerblades)came to town, every s***head and their mother started going to games. Whereas before Gretzky the Kings maybe pulled 8000-10000 fans a game, they started packing the house after he came, and every single one of them wore a white 99 jersey. The hockey community was so small then that the only people in attendance were kids that played and their parents, and we all wore out team jackets so you would see tons of people you knew. Afterward, the Forum was packed with people in Gretzky jerseys who didn't know a thing about hockey. I remember one such person sitting behind me at a 93 Stanley Cup game asking what icing was. I enjoyed the purple and gold, but absolutely loathed the black and silver Gretzky Kings in much the same way you do the Caps.

The truth is that in many or even most US markets a star player will get a lot of newbies to the game. Us vets may not want to suffer them, but thats the price of having an Ovechkin or a Crosby or a Gretzky. The upside is that many of those new (currently hockey dumb) fans will share their love for the game with their kids, who will play. California probably has 5-8x as many teams now as there were when I played, and can consistently put together national level youth teams. So long as Ovi is around and doing what he does, the DC area will without a doubt enjoy an expansion its hockey base too. That's a good thing. Does that mean you have to like the people? No.

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Sweet Beans! How is the world did this become a Crosby thread? You stop checking the forums for half a day and your thread goes straight to hell! It was surprising that what was originally intended as cathartic venting turned towards a photoshopped picture of Crosby.

Before I continue I think I need to clarify a couple of points that seem to have driven some discontent:

I am by no means an overty aggressive and angry person. Far from it. The hyberbole of "rage" is more of general dissappointment and I suppose anger to some extent over my personal Capitals experience. What was once an incredibly fun and entertaining event has devolved into nonsense gibberish and force fed exclamation of supposed greatness. I love hockey. I believe it to be the greatest sport to watch and beyond just being a life long fan of the Red Wings for over 25 years, I can honestly say I enjoying watching the game. Period. Where a lot of my resentment over this whole experience is the fact that those new to the game here in the Metro DC area are not there because of hockey, but there for the winning. I know that seems like a very subtle distinction but it is incredibly different. The more fans that I interact (I use it in the plural), the more arrogant and ignorant they appear to be.

There is nothing wrong with Pride in your team - it's what drives us and distinguishes as fans (again in the plural). However zeal that is not tempered by knowledge leads down an ugly path.

As for "stop going or watching the games" - yes, I suppose that is an option. The Capitals coverage here is pretty substantail but I could avoid it to some extent. But what's frustrating is the fact that I have to avoid at all. Even Colorado, The Chris Pronger St Louis Blues, and the old Chelios/Roenick Era of the Hawks - I had less issue with these teams than I do with the Washington DC experience. What was once something I was genuinely excited about has grown incredibly distasteful.

Additionally, there are some games that I cannot avoid - when I said I cherry picked some of the games of teams I wanted to see - I mean, collectively my managing director has season tickets for us to use to soft sell clients - as the Capitals are a very hot commodity and afterwards, I or a colleague will often take them to dinner and the Capitals game. Hence why I have to stay generally buttoned up over the whole experience and was forced to vent here on the forum. Certainly I can ask someone else to do it - but if it's my client, it's my responsibility. The reason I know the intent of a lot of the "fans" in my section is that many of the season ticket holders are corporate wholesalers, government consultants, politicals, and lobbyists. This was not the case three years ago when the section was relatively empty and full of Petr Bonda and Adam Oates jerseys.

I have been to many other arenas throughout the league and a handful of colleges. I was fortunate in my job required me to travel a great deal and lead me to games in: New York, New Jersey, Calgary, LA, Dallas, Florida (that was weird), Chicago, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and of course Washington DC. Actually, I can say that I've seen as many away games for the Red Wings that I've seen at home. I was a partial season ticket holder for the Bruins when I lived in Boston for 6 months. And of course (Chicago poster) the crowds said a lot of things that could not be seen as favorable to the Wings. But almost in every case (Florida is still iffy, this was during the whole Rubber Rat fiasco), the fans were genuinely fans of their respective teams and had some grounding in the game, it's tradition, the rules, rosters, history, strategy, etc. So when a Chicago fan told me to "Eat s*** and Die" - I was far more comfortable with that:

1) Chicago and Detroit have a long standing rivalry and that level of familiarity breeds contempt.

2) After he told me how much he hated the Wings, he yelled and screamed at Shawn Thornton to stop forechecking like a girl (Not exactly in those words)

3) The Fan made no pretense that his team was anything but what it was - a rebuilding franchise with a smattering of old veterans and draft picks and carried no sense of entitlement - his insults were driven soley for his love of his team and his hatred of the Red Wings because you sure as hell couldn't accuse him of being there for all of his team's success (circa early 2000's - maybe 2002?).

The collective fan bases of the more established teams, albeit hostile, are knowledgable and generally passionate about their team.

In my opinion, and perhaps I wasn't explicit enough - The Capitals fan base is "hockey dumb", arrogant with no justification, and more passionate about the sense of winning than the overall Capitals team as a whole. This, combined with offensive focus, defensive lazy hockey has exacerbated the situation. Christ, it's like watching a team full of Jagr's flanked by Leino's. Sigh.

I hope that clarified my intent whether you agree with it or not. To those that doubt what I am saying - I know that it resonantes wtih some of the prior posters who do live in the DC Metro area who have parrotted almost exactly what I've said so far. Take it from the Wings fans down here, it's not pretty and I know I'm not alone on this. I don't really see the point to continue this as I feel better. I apologize that I just took an emotional dump on the forums but I feared my head would pop off. I will say that I will be watching the Capitals closely come playoff time when they square off against Boston and hope Shawn Thornton stops forechecking like a girl (not exactly in those words).

Never leave your topic unattended that long.

BTW, what makes you think that photo was shopped?:)

Ok, it's been a long season and for a time it looked like we might miss the playoffs, now I'm just ready for them to start. I was just having fun with another poster and apologize for helping to hijack your thread.

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Maybe the portion of his thread title with the "I" in it could be a clue? ("Oh How I Hate the Capitals")

He's not asking you to share his feelings, only sharing his own (and well, I might add).

Well said. Whether I agree or not (and I don't have enough facts or history on which to base an opinion), the posts are fun to read and well-written.

I also agree with whoever said they hope we meet up with them in the playoffs/finals. If they do not play much of a defensive style then methinks "we" can teach 'em a thing or two.

As for the Crosby crap, PLEASE STOP. Start a new thread if you must. Thenk yew.

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I have to say this is one of the best posts I've seen on LGW since I joined a few months ago. As someone who spent a year working in DC and someone now getting their 2nd degree at Virginia Tech, a town littered with Northern Virginia/DC/MD suburbanite kids I wholeheartedly agree with what has happened.

The transition from knowing that there was another team playing in the same arena as the Wizards/Bullets to undeserved arrogance of the notion that the Capitals are the best team to play the game of hockey this season (actual quote will come later) is ridiculous. When I go out to Big Als, my favorite sports bar and watering hole, I always enjoy when any hockey game, even non RW games, are on. I love the sport and as someone who has been to other arenas of non-Wings rivals, I generally love talking to opposing fans about traditions, history, favorite players, experience, and their take on the modern state of the NHL. Capitals fans do not allow me this option anymore. They truly believe what they are doing is unheard of in hockey and that they are the standard of what everyone wants to be, regardless of the fact that that Stanley Cup trophy case is empty. Instead of posting another encyclopedia, I'll leave you with a few direct quotes from recent discussions with Capitals fans both in Blacksburg and at the Verizon Center in DC:

1- You just wish Detroit had what Washington has

2- We win this year and we half what, half as many Stanley Cups as Detroit in a lot less years?! (seriously)

3- (Overheard sitting next to a pair of fans in matching jerseys)Is this the greatest team in NHL history? (not at this point, not in the regular season, just ever)

4- (During Capitals-Canes game last season; I was wearing a Red Wings shirt at Verizon) Capitals fan turns in reference to recent crowd volume to say: Hey buddy don't you wish Detroit had it this good?

Stuff like this which is ridiculous and nonstop from people who didn't even know they had a team pre-Ovechkin just leads me to agree with Octopus- I hate the capitals.

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I've got to say, I'm a little surprised by this thread. I guess I just see things differently.

In my opinion, and I watch the team a fair bit, the gung-ho offensive attitude is a product of Boudreau's system more than anything else. You make it sound like the whole team is a bunch of hooligans who have never played a lick of defensive hockey in their lives. That's just not the case. The Caps have some of the hardest working depth forwards in the league in Steckel, Bradley, Laing, Gordon, Chimera, and now Belanger. And the stars' defensive abilities are vastly underrated. Backstrom is great in his own end and Ovechkin, when he senses danger, backchecks as furiously as he does anything in the offensive zone.

Yes, Boudreau's system does emphasize offense, but it's not all lackadaisical "oh well, we'll just score another goal" as you make it out to be. The system emphasizes moving the puck forward. The farther away you are from your own goal, the better you limit your opponent's chances. As you've probably noticed, the Caps run a much more aggressive breakout than the Red Wings, and it's not because the players are all goal-hungry, it's because the system mandates a fast breakout that puts defenses on their heels and requires the opposing forwards to expend energy backchecking instead of playing offense.

Their 214 GA at the moment is third worst among all playoff-bound teams currently, which is troubling, but they have a +78 goal differential (+28 higher than the second best team) and their 109 points with seven games remaining would seem to indicate that the system is pretty damn effective given the right personnel, which they have.

So I guess if you wanna hate, hate the system, not the team. Obviously, nothing's proven until the playoffs are over, and it could wind up that Boudreau's system never sees success in the playoffs and never produces a Cup. But for now, it'd be a shame not to enjoy the most exciting team in the sport.

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Sweet Beans! How is the world did this become a Crosby thread? You stop checking the forums for half a day and your thread goes straight to hell! It was surprising that what was originally intended as cathartic venting turned towards a photoshopped picture of Crosby.

Because this is LGW :cool:

Good posts, btw.

Michgal89 likes this

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Interesting post, OP. I can't stand the Caps, but I come from a completely different perspective than most on here, as they were once a divisional rival of the Pens, and a lot of that still lingers. There's a lot of other things I could say about the subject but it would take up a lot of time. Hate also takes up energy and I've been on vacation....so I won't go there. :dozing:

I will say this: I ******* hate it when people yell things like "RED" during the national anthem. They also yell "RED" in Carolina, and when they say "you see", they yell "JUSSI." I don't care what team it is, I can't stand it when people do that. For a brief moment you're paying respect to your country, you have the rest of the evening to root for your team. Not to get all Uncle Sam and Apple Pie on your ass, but that is a pet peeve of mine.

Frozen-Man likes this

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Interesting post, OP. I can't stand the Caps, but I come from a completely different perspective than most on here, as they were once a divisional rival of the Pens, and a lot of that still lingers. There's a lot of other things I could say about the subject but it would take up a lot of time. Hate also takes up energy and I've been on vacation....so I won't go there. :dozing:

I will say this: I ******* hate it when people yell things like "RED" during the national anthem. They also yell "RED" in Carolina, and when they say "you see", they yell "JUSSI." I don't care what team it is, I can't stand it when people do that. For a brief moment you're paying respect to your country, you have the rest of the evening to root for your team. Not to get all Uncle Sam and Apple Pie on your ass, but that is a pet peeve of mine.

Or when Dallas fans shout "STARS!"

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For a brief moment you're paying respect to your country, you have the rest of the evening to root for your team. Not to get all Uncle Sam and Apple Pie on your ass, but that is a pet peeve of mine.

This might stir the return of "Pat Honda".

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If you are going to be a ****** and attempt to belittle his opinion based on specific players he watches, then do it in a thread involving the player in question.

If you really can't help it, then just ignore him. It makes your life much easier and everyone else doesn't have to watch you get all pissy because Carman the "Crosby troll" said something you don't like.

Wow, quite the attack, we have always had civil posts in the past, sorry whatever I did pissed you off so bad. I don't think there was a need to delve into name calling or state that everyone had to watch me get all pissy (which is pretty pissy itself and ignores the fact that my post was polite and that I even acknowledged that his favorite player was "exceedingly talented.") but whatever. I was not attempting to belittle his opinion at all I was honestly questioning how he "cannot stand the Capitals because of one person, and one person only." He cannot stand the Capitals solely because of Boudreau and partially because Boudreau whines. I acknowledged in my post Crosby was talented but was curious of how he could reconcile disliking a coach because he whines and yet think Crosby is the greatest thing going. He answered the question and had a reasonable explanation for his sentiments, Crosby gets a pass to some degree in his book because he is in his early 20s whereas Boudreau is 60. I was genuinely asking, partially because I wish I could like Crosby, I think he is amazingly talented but cannot stand that he always seems to be whining. It was a simple question based upon his post and previous posts, it received a legitimate answer from Carmen I don't see what your problem was, but again sorry it bothered you so much.

edit: grammar

Edited by Frozen-Man

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Good thread.

Re:

So I guess if you wanna hate, hate the system, not the team. Obviously, nothing's proven until the playoffs are over, and it could wind up that Boudreau's system never sees success in the playoffs and never produces a Cup. But for now, it'd be a shame not to enjoy the most exciting team in the sport.

I don't believe the problem lies with the team. I to am trapped in the DC area watching more Caps games than RW is just a fact of life out here and while we'd all prefer to watch the Wings the Caps play a good game (for the most part).

The problem is with the 'fans' in the DC area. Many of the new Caps 'fans' are free agent Redskins fans and the have brought along their irritating and infantile behavior (if they win a game their destined to be 'world champs' for the next decade, but if the lose a game all is lost, trade everyone fire the coaches and start rebuilding tonight.) They lack any fundamental knowledge of the rules, customs and traditions, and they demonstrate no desire to gain a proper understanding. I actually had a 'conversation' with a couple of Caps fans claiming to be 'Hockey Buffs.' They didn't know the Caps had ever been to the Finals and then refused to believe that the Caps could have been swept by the Wings (they used this years standings as evidence!?)

I grant that all teams have regrettable fans, but since the switch to red sweaters and Ovie's arrival it has become increasingly the norm.

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Good thread.

Re:

I don't believe the problem lies with the team. I to am trapped in the DC area watching more Caps games than RW is just a fact of life out here and while we'd all prefer to watch the Wings the Caps play a good game (for the most part).

The problem is with the 'fans' in the DC area. Many of the new Caps 'fans' are free agent Redskins fans and the have brought along their irritating and infantile behavior (if they win a game their destined to be 'world champs' for the next decade, but if the lose a game all is lost, trade everyone fire the coaches and start rebuilding tonight.) They lack any fundamental knowledge of the rules, customs and traditions, and they demonstrate no desire to gain a proper understanding. I actually had a 'conversation' with a couple of Caps fans claiming to be 'Hockey Buffs.' They didn't know the Caps had ever been to the Finals and then refused to believe that the Caps could have been swept by the Wings (they used this years standings as evidence!?)

I grant that all teams have regrettable fans, but since the switch to red sweaters and Ovie's arrival it has become increasingly the norm.

I find it funny that some members of the LGW forum are calling out the Caps fans. Especially considering there are a good portion of LGW fans that were willing to throw the team under the bus when they faced adversity this season. IMHO, true fans don't do that to their team. There are some members in this forum that showed their true colors. There is a small part of me that wished the Wings would have tanked this season and missed playoffs just so the bandwagon fans would have left and not come back.

That being said, I will say this about the Caps fans. They are passionate and enjoy a good show. That is what the Caps bring every night. A lot of their fans are new, and I am not going to hold that against them. Heck, I was a new fan back in 1995 when I first started watching hockey. Everyone has to start somewhere.

I am not going to judge new fans of a team. Rather, I will see how the fans support the team years later. Look at the Tampa Bay Lightning. They make a cup run, the place fills up. Now, their attendance is starting to struggle again. People love a winner, but the bandwagon fans will leave once as the team starts to struggle. Then, when you go see a Caps game, you will meet the fans who know the team and players and love the sport.

Case in point on the Lightning, I have a friend who is 68 and retired. He never saw a hockey game before. I took him to a Tampa Bay Lightning game the year before they won the cup and he was a fan. Today, he goes to about 10 lightning games a year and watches them all on TV when he can't go. He is a hockey fan and a bolts fan today. He hated the bandwagon fans that supported the team and then left after the team sucked. He said that it is a lot of fun being a fan today because when he goes to see a game, a vast majority of the other people in the arena are true Bolts fans or hockey fans. Unlike a few years ago when there were people he would sit by that wouldn't know the rules or know anything about hockey.

In conclusion, give these fans a chance. Some of them will be great hockey fans and caps fans a few years from now. Just gotta give them time. :)

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Especially considering there are a good portion of LGW fans that were willing to throw the team under the bus when they faced adversity this season. IMHO, true fans don't do that to their team. There are some members in this forum that showed their true colors.

I agree with this, big time.

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For the third segment, I had originally intended to script a handful of interactions that I've had with Capitals Fans and some actually with the players but I believe that the majority of the DC Metro residents on this board have accurately portrayed what we endure on a nigh-daily basis.

Instead I'll respond to smattering of the posts that have been appears throughout the coversation thus far -

hooon:

As I said in my earlier post... stop going to the games if you are this sensitive about fans being fans. Get over it, man.

The cries to ignore them or to avoid it - yes, that would be the most logical option however not really a possibility. Living directly in the heart of the city, it makes it almost impossible to not encounter a car covered in stickers and blasts the quinessential *BEEP* BEEP *BEEEEEEP* which is promptly followed by a "Let's Go Caps!" from everyone in earshot. When you turn on the morning news to see constant updates on the Capitals practice or last night's highlights. To open a newspaper and see the Flaming Bird logo on the front page.

When Washington says "Caps Fever", it is quite literal. This town (which is certainly a positive) is in the throes of mania. Any sports bar within two miles of this city is chalk full of Capitals jerseys, chanting fans, and the inevitable insanity of conversations like "Ovechkin is better than Gretzky" (Sigh), "Mike Green is the Best Defenseman in the League" (who doesn't play defense), "This team could score 5 goals a game if they wanted to" (then why are they losing), and my personal favorite, "How many goals the Capitals would win by against Team Canada if they played each other"(The answer was 2 if you're curious). All topics from last night when the played the Senators.

I went to dinner with my girlfriend and overheard the first two topics and then preceeded to the bar to meet some friends to watch the end of the Red Wings game and heard the last two conversations and without trying to hear anything but the Red Wings game. The only viable option to avoid Capitals is to sequester yourself in your own home. I would imagine that any person in the Baltimore, Virginia, or DC areas would most likely be able to add to this.

kook_10:

The truth is that in many or even most US markets a star player will get a lot of newbies to the game. Us vets may not want to suffer them, but thats the price of having an Ovechkin or a Crosby or a Gretzky. The upside is that many of those new (currently hockey dumb) fans will share their love for the game with their kids, who will play. California probably has 5-8x as many teams now as there were when I played, and can consistently put together national level youth teams. So long as Ovi is around and doing what he does, the DC area will without a doubt enjoy an expansion its hockey base too. That's a good thing. Does that mean you have to like the people? No.

I agree with this statement completely and fully. It is actually the same justification that I use to defend players like Crosby. They improve the overall visibility of the league and the sport and encourage participation and interest of new fans. Ovechkin is a galvanizing star and his freakish talents, flair for theatrics, and what appears to be an honest yearning to improve his play and become a champion is admirable. More so, my colleague whom I work with (and is a Capitals fan from the 80's) has a 6 year old son who plays hockey solely because he wants to be Mike Green. Not exactly the guy I would've chosen to emulate but Hey! The Capitals helped a kid find a great sport and hopefully lead to a long and rewarding relationship with the sport we all love. That can never be bad. But like you qualified, during this rapid expansion of interest it has a way of producing a lot of unfortunate and poorly intended "fans" - which appear to be the rule, not the exception.

Washington DC is a unique place, socially and culturally. This is a direct result of the amalgamation of so many unique backgrounds from all over the country. People move in and move out as quickly as anywhere. As a direct result, the fan base is also incredibly transcient. Fans come and they go in the city proper. You will find more consistency in the suburbs of Virginia and Maryland but the city is where much of the fan base resides - particularly 22-40 year old, urban professionals who can afford the games and have reasonable access. Since the period in which the crowds are here, the grab on to a hot franchise and move with it. The better the team, the more random fans it will collect and so forth. Actually not much different than what I did when I adopted the Caps a few years ago. So any level of consistency becomes difficult because they is absoluetly no loyalty to these franchises as there is very little loyalty to Washington DC. The Capitals fans of 1998 are several iterations of fan groups till they turned around in 2006. And when the Caps become "bad", the fans will leave and it will start all over again. Expansion of DC Sports is difficult because your fan base is always changing. It doesn't have the retention of a Buffalo, Pittsburgh, and Detroit till recently.

The fan base becomes a product of desperate sports fans looking for some outlet for the next 2-3 years that they live here and take it to an unnecessary extreme. The possibility that this could grow into a long standing fan base? Doubtful

Nightfall:

That being said, I will say this about the Caps fans. They are passionate and enjoy a good show. That is what the Caps bring every night. A lot of their fans are new, and I am not going to hold that against them. Heck, I was a new fan back in 1995 when I first started watching hockey. Everyone has to start somewhere.

Exactly the sentiment I shared two seasons ago. I am more than happy to give the benefit of the doubt. We were all new to this game at some point and it was attending a handful of games, watching them on TV, reading what we could that we began to familarize ourselves and really foster a true love for the sport. However, in all my years I don't remember ever going out of my way before I even knew the playoff format or the names on an opposing team and proclaim to all the world my never ending love for the Red Wings and how stupid and terrible every other franchise was. In fact, since you seem to be a magnanimous and reasonable fellow, that in 1995 you didn't randomly call out a Canadians fan as "f*gs" and rally a group around him chanting "Let's Go Caps" (poor kid). A Canadians fan? Really?

I forgot who said it earlier, but the Verizon center (and by proxy the related sports bar...Green Turtle I'm looking you general direction) are no longer hospitable places to be. Be cognizant on who votes for the Norris Trophy before you tell me Lidstrom is a joke and "Green was robbed by the other GMs because they are jealous they don't have him," or that "Yzerman doesn't know anything about hockey otherwise he would've picked Green for Team Canada," because he's "twice the player Yzerman ever was".

Like I said earlier - zeal, or passion not tempered by knowledge or respect leads down an ugly path. This has unfortunately gotten worse over time, not better. The fan base seems louder and more ignorant than they did only two seasons ago. The genuine air of excitment and eagerness to learn the game has been replaced with whining, entitlement, and arrogance and that is very unfortunate. Yes, I suspect that you're right when this all ebbs and the bandwagon is empty - new and knowledgable fans will remain and ready to support their team regardless. That sounds like a fan base and team that I would be happy to be a part of. However, it by no means makes it easier for those of us here now who want to enjoy hockey as the bandwagon appears to be fully stocked like a clown car on its way to a three week bender in Tijuana.

Look, I know that my repsonses have been a tad extreme, but purposefully so to clarify an overarching point: my personal capitals experience in Washington DC has been dissappointing.

I say "experience" because you are absolutely correct: the fan base and the team itself are exclusive to one another. It's not Mike Green's responsibility to ensure that no insults are spoken in his defense nor is it the fan who directs Green's approach to how he runs the powerplay. I chose to evaluate the fans from the organization. The organization moved towards a style of play that I am not particular interested in or actually convinced that it can result in a championship, and the fans are...well, the fans. The Capitals experience is not "malicious" or purposefully evil - it is an experience that I felt was special and exciting and has devolved to something ugly and unfortunate.

Edited by TheOctopusKid

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I forgot who said it earlier, but the Verizon center (and by proxy the related sports bar...Green Turtle I'm looking you general direction) are no longer hospitable places to be. Be cognizant on who votes for the Norris Trophy before you tell me Lidstrom is a joke and "Green was robbed by the other GMs because they are jealous they don't have him," or that "Yzerman doesn't know anything about hockey otherwise he would've picked Green for Team Canada," because he's "twice the player Yzerman ever was".

facepalm_implied.jpg

Edited by Hockeytown0001

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Exactly the sentiment I shared two seasons ago. I am more than happy to give the benefit of the doubt. We were all new to this game at some point and it was attending a handful of games, watching them on TV, reading what we could that we began to familarize ourselves and really foster a true love for the sport. However, in all my years I don't remember ever going out of my way before I even knew the playoff format or the names on an opposing team and proclaim to all the world my never ending love for the Red Wings and how stupid and terrible every other franchise was. In fact, since you seem to be a magnanimous and reasonable fellow, that in 1995 you didn't randomly call out a Canadians fan as "f*gs" and rally a group around him chanting "Let's Go Caps" (poor kid). A Canadians fan? Really?

I agree 100%. I barely knew the game back in 1995. I was still trying to determine the difference between college hockey rules and NHL rules. That being said, I hated the Devils. It wasn't until the NHL came back from the lockout when I started enjoying just about all hockey I could watch. I became a fan of the game about as much as I became a fan of the Red Wings. I think you can call me a magnanimous and reasonable person just based on the fact that while I love the Wings, I can enjoy the sport for what it is. :)

I forgot who said it earlier, but the Verizon center (and by proxy the related sports bar...Green Turtle I'm looking you general direction) are no longer hospitable places to be. Be cognizant on who votes for the Norris Trophy before you tell me Lidstrom is a joke and "Green was robbed by the other GMs because they are jealous they don't have him," or that "Yzerman doesn't know anything about hockey otherwise he would've picked Green for Team Canada," because he's "twice the player Yzerman ever was".

Ignorance knows no bounds. I have to agree that these people who said these things are dumb. However, I hear the same damn quotes from Wings fans relating to players on the Wings roster. Look at the discussion about the Calder voting for instance. Some Wings fans already have a chip on their shoulder because Tyler Myers seems to be getting all the press. Some are already saying "Howard is getting robbed." I don't equate this to ignorant Caps fans, but ignorant fans overall. These are the same fans, when the chips are down and their team is struggling, will bandwagon jump to another team.

Like I said earlier - zeal, or passion not tempered by knowledge or respect leads down an ugly path. This has unfortunately gotten worse over time, not better. The fan base seems louder and more ignorant than they did only two seasons ago. The genuine air of excitment and eagerness to learn the game has been replaced with whining, entitlement, and arrogance and that is very unfortunate. Yes, I suspect that you're right when this all ebbs and the bandwagon is empty - new and knowledgable fans will remain and ready to support their team regardless. That sounds like a fan base and team that I would be happy to be a part of. However, it by no means makes it easier for those of us here now who want to enjoy hockey as the bandwagon appears to be fully stocked like a clown car on its way to a three week bender in Tijuana.

Look, I know that my repsonses have been a tad extreme, but purposefully so to clarify an overarching point: my personal capitals experience in Washington DC has been dissappointing.

I say "experience" because you are absolutely correct: the fan base and the team itself are exclusive to one another. It's not Mike Green's responsibility to ensure that no insults are spoken in his defense nor is it the fan who directs Green's approach to how he runs the powerplay. I chose to evaluate the fans from the organization. The organization moved towards a style of play that I am not particular interested in or actually convinced that it can result in a championship, and the fans are...well, the fans. The Capitals experience is not "malicious" or purposefully evil - it is an experience that I felt was special and exciting and has devolved to something ugly and unfortunate.

I completely agree with your assessment as a whole though. I just give the Caps fans a lot more leeway. I think you need to give these fans a little more than 2 years in order to get their attitude in order.

Let me give you another example here. I am a Ferris State Bulldogs hockey fan. Always have been. In fact, that was the first team I ever saw play live. Heck, my first game I ever saw was Ferris State vrs Lake Superior State. Anyway, Ferris State has never been a national powerhouse. They have always languished in the middle to bottom of the pack with a couple exceptional years thrown in. In 2002-2003, Chris Kunitz led the Bulldogs to a NCAA playoff birth and a CCHA regular season championship. The rink was full that season as well as the next season.

As a fan, I noticed that the rink went from true hockey fans to bandwagon fans in the span of a season. The second year, the fans move from excited to be part of a winning team to what I like to call "right to entitlement". That is the same area the Caps fans are in today. In short, the fans of a winning team want to see more success next season. If that success doesn't come, well, its the refs, league, coach, or player's fault. If the team has more success the next season, then it gets worse the next season.

The only way you get fans to calm down is to have a period of 5-10+ years of success like the Wings have done. The Devils would be another success story. Eventually, the fans become more educated about the game of hockey and since fans love a winner, they stick around.

It all ends though when the team starts to go downhill again. The fans will leave the game and go to other teams. The true fans will stick around (like my friend in Tampa Bay has figured out), but the mass amount of fans will leave. These are the people that you and I both like to talk to. These are the people that I got to know at Ferris State when the team sucked that stayed with the team and continue to stay with the team today. Its good to know these are true fans of the game and the team. Talking hockey with these people are a privilege.

In conclusion, I know you are sick of the Caps fans. I am just asking that you give them a bit more time. In a period of 10 years or so, the Caps will win a Stanley Cup and the team will be slipping back into mediocrity. The fans that stick around when all the bandwagon fans leave will be the ones you will enjoy talking too the most. You just don't know which fans will shake out until the team starts dropping in the overall standings which is going to be a while. Just know its all a vicious cycle. Its going to happen with the Wings eventually.

Personally, I watch the Caps on NHL Center Ice quite often. If the Wings don't win the cup this year, I would be a happy hockey fan if Washington lifted it (or any other team who hasn't won it in a while or ever).

Uncle Danny likes this

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Interesting post, OP. I can't stand the Caps, but I come from a completely different perspective than most on here, as they were once a divisional rival of the Pens, and a lot of that still lingers. There's a lot of other things I could say about the subject but it would take up a lot of time. Hate also takes up energy and I've been on vacation....so I won't go there. :dozing:

I will say this: I ******* hate it when people yell things like "RED" during the national anthem. They also yell "RED" in Carolina, and when they say "you see", they yell "JUSSI." I don't care what team it is, I can't stand it when people do that. For a brief moment you're paying respect to your country, you have the rest of the evening to root for your team. Not to get all Uncle Sam and Apple Pie on your ass, but that is a pet peeve of mine.

:clap: :clap: Couldn't agree more. The Stars do it too and it always annoys me.

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Honestly, I don't see what the big deal is. Every team in every city has bandwagoner fans. That's not good, that's not bad, it just is what it is. People are going to typically pay attention to a team when it wins more, whether they know the players or know what is going on or not. When they lose, they'll probably watch less. Natural. Just because we might be more knowledgable or smarter doesn't make us "better" than bandwagoners who might not know their stuff. Let them have fun and enjoy the games and seeing a winning product (if that is what they are seeing).

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Octopus, you really need to calm down about it, because every fanbase has what you describe. I've heard Wings fans talk about the same bulls*** that you accuse the Caps fans of doing it, and it is even worse for us because of the sense of entitlement some Wings fans have. If they aren't winning they are either playing like crap or there is something going against them. That doesn't make Wings fans in general whining, entitled, snobs who only think the world revolves around them.

Seriously, your experience in Washington is the rule of fans across the country, for every team out there. They have new fans because they are a new powerhouse and as a Wings fan you should be able to sympathize considering the amount of bandwagoning for the Wings in the 90s.

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I find it incredibly entertaining that folks who post on forums think that their opinion is any more valid, or matter more than anyone else's. Some of the logic folks come up with to prop up their views, or tear differing opinions down is comical to me. Get mad. Post in anger. Free Willie. Go flamers.

Edited by HOCKEY MATTERS

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