Nashville forum

[Hockeytown Red Wings 245]

already did. thank you

Cool, I'm done. By the way, your avatar still makes me laugh.

[Legionnaire11 0]

i don't know how long this rivalry will last though because i just saw something (i believe on CBC) about how low their attendance is even with the winning team. the owner has already had several discussions with other cities about possibly moving the preds.

cite some sources on it buddy. Attendance is up and the only place you'll ever hear about the Preds moving are on rumor sites. Nothing has ever been said by the franchise about moving, only by media sources who speculate on such things. Maybe you're confusing Predators with Penguins, who ARE currently talking to other cities about relocation.

Another subject for another day.

But I will tell you about it if you don't know: The Predators have a clause in their agreement that if they attendance average is lower than 12,000 or something like that, after the 2007-2008 season the team would pack up and move from Nashville. This is why everyone thinks it's so important that Nashville does something this year in the playoffs, which it is. I can't imagine the fans were happy about how they crumpled up last year.

You have no idea what you're talking about. The Preds have never averaged lower than 12,000. We're near 15,000 right now actually. The clause is about the city subsidizing the team's revenue, not about them moving. The attendance issue is with the NHL and it has to do with revenue sharing and how much we get. We have to meet certain attendance marks to recieve full revenue sharing, and if we don't, then the % that we can recieve goes down. I believe the goal to recieve 100% revenue sharing funds is 14,200 next season.

The predators are not moving. Craig Leipold has said this over, and over, and over again. He is an honest man, and so far in 9 years with this franchise everything he has ever said he would do, he has done. He says that he has NEVER spoken to any other city about relocating, he hasn't even ever BEEN to Kansas City. He's only interested in building the best franchise he can build in Nashville.

Edited March 8, 2007 by Legionnaire11

[redwingfan19 293]

lol WOW what a bunch of dummies. There is actually a hockey 101 thread, that was just priceless.

[Legionnaire11 0]

lol WOW what a bunch of dummies. There is actually a hockey 101 thread, that was just priceless.

oh yeah, because i'm sure you were just born with a complete knowledge of hockey, all the rules, and history. And you have never in your life needed to ask someone a question, or look something up, or just watch and learn. Sooooooooo Sorry that there are new fans here and that we have information available to them to help learn the game. You're right, it's pretty stupid. I mean, we have attendance issues, and people don't know the game... so it makes absolutely no sense at all to try and help people out with understanding hockey and maybe getting them in the doors.

[hillbillywingsfan 794]

im not sure if this falls into your credible sources but this is just what i found..i don't think they will go anywhere persoanlly but who knows.

STLtoday

your own tennessean

[Legionnaire11 0]

im not sure if this falls into your credible sources but this is just what i found..i don't think they will go anywhere persoanlly but who knows.

STLtoday

your own tennessean

The Tennessean doesn't tell the whole truth though. In fact Leipold was on the radio that same day because he was so irate about that article coming out. It was just supposed to be a casual lunch, off the record with the reporter. They were talking about corporate support and Leipold suggested that maybe it's because he's from Milwaukee and that maybe if he sold a minority ownership (40%) to local investors, then the local business community would more quickly come back around to supporting the team... two days later, the headline in the paper suggests that Leipold is selling and the team could be moving.

People are pulling all of these clauses out of the contract that have been there since day 1. And now with attendance on the rise for the last two seasons, moving farther and farther away from these figures that would allow them to trigger the clauses, it's hardly the time for fans to panic and overreact. I'm not worried about the team leaving. I'm not worried about Leipold exercising options that would cause bad blood between the team and the city. And Predators fans who are here and know the whole story aren't worried either.

The only people making noise about this are in the traditional markets who can't stand to see our team doing so well. I mean, attendance was pretty crappy during the seasons that we weren't making the playoffs, but it was never this big of a story. Now that we're good, people want to try to drag us through the mud. Whatever, i'll take that tradeoff any day of the week.

[donfishmaster 62]

In all fairness, your (Nashville) coach looks like he fathered the banjo-playing kid from "Deliverance."

[hillbillywingsfan 794]

The Tennessean doesn't tell the whole truth though. In fact Leipold was on the radio that same day because he was so irate about that article coming out. It was just supposed to be a casual lunch, off the record with the reporter. They were talking about corporate support and Leipold suggested that maybe it's because he's from Milwaukee and that maybe if he sold a minority ownership (40%) to local investors, then the local business community would more quickly come back around to supporting the team... two days later, the headline in the paper suggests that Leipold is selling and the team could be moving.

People are pulling all of these clauses out of the contract that have been there since day 1. And now with attendance on the rise for the last two seasons, moving farther and farther away from these figures that would allow them to trigger the clauses, it's hardly the time for fans to panic and overreact. I'm not worried about the team leaving. I'm not worried about Leipold exercising options that would cause bad blood between the team and the city. And Predators fans who are here and know the whole story aren't worried either.

The only people making noise about this are in the traditional markets who can't stand to see our team doing so well. I mean, attendance was pretty crappy during the seasons that we weren't making the playoffs, but it was never this big of a story. Now that we're good, people want to try to drag us through the mud. Whatever, i'll take that tradeoff any day of the week.

thats cool..wasn't saying that they were gonna move..but its good to get alittle more of the truth...for me i wish they would move and then start sucking again...i hate playing them..hahahahah

[Legionnaire11 0]

In all fairness, your (Nashville) coach looks like he fathered the banjo-playing kid from "Deliverance."

I always thought he would be good for the role of "The Penguin" if they ever used him in a batman movie again. We know he has no neck, and he does weird stuff with his eyebrows... we like it.

[redwingfan19 293]

oh yeah, because i'm sure you were just born with a complete knowledge of hockey, all the rules, and history. And you have never in your life needed to ask someone a question, or look something up, or just watch and learn. Sooooooooo Sorry that there are new fans here and that we have information available to them to help learn the game. You're right, it's pretty stupid. I mean, we have attendance issues, and people don't know the game... so it makes absolutely no sense at all to try and help people out with understanding hockey and maybe getting them in the doors.

Actually I have had to look up some rules, yeah the "new" rules. Becuase Buttman keeps changing them to cater to all these expansion teams fans cuase they don't know jack about hockey. It makes my blood boil when all the Canadian fans and fans of Teams Such as the Red Wings and any ORIGINAL 6 team that have a rich history some of which go back 80 years get the shaft.

Edited March 8, 2007 by redwingfan19

[betterREDthandead 58]

Once again people need to be told not to throw idiotic stereotypes at another fanbase. redwingfan19, do you know how unbelievably arrogant you sound? Thanks once again for being the lowest common denominator and reflecting badly on all of us.

The fact that there's a Hockey 101 thread on their site is a good thing. How does we expect the NHL to do well and grow its following among new fans in new cities if there's no way at all to learn the game?

This thread is one arrogant post away from getting the A-bomb treatment. Don't be the next person to stereotype Nashville fans as know-nothing crackers.

[hillbillywingsfan 794]

Once again people need to be told not to throw idiotic stereotypes at another fanbase. redwingfan19, do you know how unbelievably arrogant you sound? Thanks once again for being the lowest common denominator and reflecting badly on all of us.

The fact that there's a Hockey 101 thread on their site is a good thing. How does we expect the NHL to do well and grow its following among new fans in new cities if there's no way at all to learn the game?

This thread is one arrogant post away from getting the A-bomb treatment. Don't be the next person to stereotype Nashville fans as know-nothing crackers.

hey i take offense to being called a cracker HR HR HR.. hahahahahah j/k

[redwingfan19 293]

Sorry if I come off as arrogant. Im just a traditonalist who loves hockey. Im all for attracting new fans, but putting Hockey teams in non traditional markets and changing the rules of the game to cater to these "new fans" doesn't go well with me. You either like hockey or you don't, theres no need to change the rules of the game we love to get a couple "new fans" and make a quick buck. Cities should earn the right to have a team, not them just being dropped in thier laps in hope of making more money. Thats why the NHL is on life support, to many teams not enough fans.

[sibiriak 84]

Sorry if I come off as arrogant. Im just a traditonalist who loves hockey. Im all for attracting new fans, but putting Hockey teams in non traditional markets and changing the rules of the game to cater to these "new fans" doesn't go well with me. You either like hockey or you don't, theres no need to change the rules of the game we love to get a couple "new fans" and make a quick buck. Cities should earn the right to have a team, not them just being dropped in thier laps in hope of making more money. Thats why the NHL is on life support, to many teams not enough fans.

So, in your opinion, the way for the NHL to attract new fans is to NOT put the new teams out of the "traditional" hockey markets? NOT modify the rules to make the game more dynamic and attractive (like it used to be 20 years ago)?

I've followed hocley for all but the first 5 yearsof my life, but if my dad wasn't a hockey fan, and if there was no hockey on TV, and if there was no hockey team in my hometown, I'd not be a hockey fan today. You could like hockey if you had a chance to see it. I'm sure that the Aussie rules football is a great game, but since I never seen one, I am not likely to become a fan. Do you want for hockey to become a niche sport for reverse snobs?

As to cities "earning the right" to shell out $150-$250 mil. for a new arena, provide the developers with tax breaks and buy 18,000 seats at $50 a pop on average, for 41 home games + playoffs, every year ... Are you sure you didn't mean that we all should be so lucky to be catered to, like the pro sports teams are?

[BlakChamber 8]

Sorry if I come off as arrogant. Im just a traditonalist who loves hockey. Im all for attracting new fans, but putting Hockey teams in non traditional markets and changing the rules of the game to cater to these "new fans" doesn't go well with me. You either like hockey or you don't, theres no need to change the rules of the game we love to get a couple "new fans" and make a quick buck. Cities should earn the right to have a team, not them just being dropped in thier laps in hope of making more money. Thats why the NHL is on life support, to many teams not enough fans.

First you say that you're all for attracting new fans, than you say you either like hockey or you don't. As if there's some hockey gene that you're born with that makes you like it. That doesn't make much sense. If you want to get new fans, you need to give people something to cheer for. You can't just expect people in places like Florida or Tenneesee to start cheering for a Canadian team or an O6 team. Plus, if you want new fans, you have to go where the people are. More and more people are moving to the south and the southwest. So why not put teams where they are.

As far as cities earning the right to have a team, how do you earn a team? If the NHL is expanding and cities want a team, that city submits a proposal to the NHL explaining why they're the best and what they have to offer. The NHL then decides where to put a team. It's not like the NHL just called up Nashville and said "build an arena, you're getting a hockey team whether you like it or not."

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

Wonderfully spoken, sibiriak.

YOU DID PRETTY OK TOO BLAK

[redwingfan19 293]

Like it used to be 20 years ago? I don't think the refs were the most important people on the ice back then. I also don't think they called penalties for a guy finger touching the other players jersey. Also you never saw Gretzky getting pounded like Crosby does, you were actually allowed to protect your star players back then. Also I played hockey for 17 years so im pretty sure i've seen it. ANd as I am a Red Wings fan in ontario I have to drive 2hrs and pay double to see them play I don't exactly call that being catered to. I don't want any trouble here, this is from my prespective. I was wrong for sterotyping other fanbases. I guess Im just jealeous that fans that never really liked or watched hockey before got a team in there backyard and can go to games anytime they want, exc.

[Legionnaire11 0]

The rules naturally have to change. Players are bigger and faster, coaching strategies change, goaltending styles change. I mean, taking a trip on the way-back machine, you'll find a time when there were no forward passes allowed in hockey. But the game was boring and in order to compete with other sports, they had to get more scoring to generate interest in the game... Sounds familiar.

Anyway, sure there are a lot of newbies here. But there are also a heck of a lot of northern transplants in the south now. It really hasn't been that long, you have to give these things time. If anyone really expected to put a franchise in Nashville, or Phoenix, or Tampa and have their fanbase rival the existing teams, then that person never had a chance to be satisfied with the new teams anyway.

a side note. The Preds are ranked 23rd in the league in Attendance, why is it that we're so often mentioned as the team that needs to move?

Also, if we sold out every single game, we would still only be ranked 16th. Would people still complain? Probably, because we'd be in the bottom half.

What if we were among the league leaders in attendance? Wouldn't we still get complaints from bitter fans who hate seeing a southern franchise ranked above theirs?

And last, I don't understand why people complain anyway. On one hand, you say that the market is bad, nobody knows hockey, nobody cares about the game... and then on the other hand, you rip us and say that we should have higher attendance, as if you're surprised that we're at the bottom. Which is it?

[sibiriak 84]

Like it used to be 20 years ago? I don't think the refs were the most important people on the ice back then. I also don't think they called penalties for a guy finger touching the other players jersey. Also you never saw Gretzky getting pounded like Crosby does, you were actually allowed to protect your star players back then. Also I played hockey for 17 years so im pretty sure i've seen it. ANd as I am a Red Wings fan in ontario I have to drive 2hrs and pay double to see them play I don't exactly call that being catered to. I don't want any trouble here, this is from my prespective. I was wrong for sterotyping other fanbases. I guess Im just jealeous that fans that never really liked or watched hockey before got a team in there backyard and can go to games anytime they want, exc.

Let me clarify my meaning. In the 80s, hockey was more open, with less stickwork, hooking and clutching. That, I think, we may agree on. It was also more liberal in allowing hitting and fighting. Inthe 90s and early 2000s, hockey changed to more defensive, closed game, where bigger, stronger, better conditioned athletes were able to get away with illegal tactics to limit the time and space for the opposition's star players. Scoring and entertainment factor of the games were decreased. After the lockout, the rules were changed to penalize ANY contact using your stick or hands to touch opposition players. Other infractions are not called as harshly. This was done toreturn some space and speed tothe game. It is not a perfect solution, and in the future they will probably change the rules again, to allow more physical play (I hope). But you can't deny that the game has opened up and become more lively, if not without some sacrifice in physical play. BTW, the first thing a new fan notices,is the hits and the fights. If you think that a reduction of them was done toplease a casual fan, you are mistaken, it was merely the by-product of opening the game up. I don't remember Lafleur or Gretzky trying to fight their way to the net through hooks and holds, with a 6'4'' defenseman draped over their back. And it wasn't because fighting was not penalized as much. The players then didn't grow up with the style of hockey where you routinely used your stick or hands to slow down the opponent when he is going by you. Today 's players have that on the instinctive level and it will take more than 2 years to re-learn. When they do, the calls vigilance will be softened.

My "catered to" remark refers to the pro teams, not fans.

Your main beef seems to be best summarized as: "I hate that Nashvill's got a hockey team, when I have to drive 2 hours to get to a game." Well, you are lucky. For many fans it is not feasible to drive to an NHL hockey game at all.

And the fewer teams there are, and the closer together they are located, the fewer fans would be able to see a live game at least once in their lives. And the fewer fans the sport has, the more expensive the individual tix will be. As with any product, per unit costs fall when the sales volume increases.

[redwingfan19 293]

There Has to be a fine line though, not "well you got away with tackleing that guy so next time your shadow goes near anyone I better call a penalty" That is one thing that defenitley needs to be addressed immediatley. The reason Gretzky didn't have 6'4 defenceman draped over his back is becuase there were guys that would have their sticks draped around the guys neck if they touched him. I don't recall other players getting that treatment, and for the record there was some vicious stickwork back then. ANd im actually not that lucky if you consider the exchange rate, gas and the fact I don't even have a car to go anywhere, It drives me crazy to be stuck in this dead end town. Lets just agree to disagree.

Edited March 8, 2007 by redwingfan19

[Kp-Wings 3]

You have no idea what you're talking about. The Preds have never averaged lower than 12,000. We're near 15,000 right now actually. The clause is about the city subsidizing the team's revenue, not about them moving. The attendance issue is with the NHL and it has to do with revenue sharing and how much we get. We have to meet certain attendance marks to recieve full revenue sharing, and if we don't, then the % that we can recieve goes down. I believe the goal to recieve 100% revenue sharing funds is 14,200 next season.

The predators are not moving. Craig Leipold has said this over, and over, and over again. He is an honest man, and so far in 9 years with this franchise everything he has ever said he would do, he has done. He says that he has NEVER spoken to any other city about relocating, he hasn't even ever BEEN to Kansas City. He's only interested in building the best franchise he can build in Nashville.

Calm down. I never said they have an average of 12,000, I said that was one of the clauses in the team agreement that I've heard from various hockey websites. I don't know any personal information on the Predators, I'm just going by what other websites have said in the past to answer that other guys question. If I'm wrong on what I said, then I apologize.

[Legionnaire11 0]

sorry, didn't mean to sound like I was blowing a gasket. You've got to understand how tiresome it is to hear these stories all the time.

Edited March 8, 2007 by Legionnaire11

[Guest Crymson]

I live in Nashville and am a season ticket holder. I also have been a hockey fan since the sixties since I grew up in NY and saw a "real dynasty" on the Island as a season ticket holder of NY hockey clubs since 1966. The reason the acrimony exists for Preds fans is Wings fans believe they have a right to claim dominance because of their history. Plus we have so many complaining GM workers at Saturn plants in Spring Hill we just cant stand them. They show up in red and root for the wings but the rest of the yr they wear pred gear. Yes the guy who sits next to me is one of those wing flip floppers. And we try to avoid talking to him. I told him why last Wing game and he looked shocked. That is a better flip flop than Al Gore. Truth be told, The Red Wings over the last ten yrs they did less with more. They never won as much as they should have given the roster and payroll and any Wing fan knows that deep inside.

Now the Preds come as a bad expansion team and the wings beat up on their little brother. Well, little brother is not so little anymore and now he can spank the big dog. This decade of the Pred has begun. This team is loaded with tons of young talent and will be good for a long time. The wings, while still solid are close to done over the next decade. Age is everywhere important and the cubbbard is not packed. The wings style will allow them to stay in games and Lids is a stud player and always has been. But the preds are very deep and can play way more styles than any team in hockey. Shea Weber is virtual unknown in most places but watch him play and you will see a future Norris winner. Press goes to a Phaneuf. I'll take Weber for the long haul. They have 4 deep lines, and two proven netminders. Say what you will Foppa is kyptonite to the Wings. And unlike Pavel and Zetterberg he shows up bigger in post season and has avg over a point a game in post season. Oh yeah, he kills the Wings too. Your pain will be over shortly. And Tootoo will kill Boots. I'll leave on a nice note. I have always liked Draper. He is a great and underated hockey player.

Wow.. wow. Wow! I've never seen a post that makes such an effort to play off conjecture as fact as does this one. Wow!

Sorry, man--but what you say ain't reality, despite what you may think.

[Legionnaire11 0]

Wow.. wow. Wow! I've never seen a post that makes such an effort to play off conjecture as fact as does this one. Wow!

Sorry, man--but what you say ain't reality, despite what you may think.

prove it then. don't just come on and say "you're wrong" without giving any reasons. I know there are a lot inaccurate statements in there, but there is also some truth in it as well.

Edited March 8, 2007 by Legionnaire11

[Guest Crymson]

I think the Wings have done quite well in the age of free agency. If they had the owners who would spend money, and the scouting staff that would get the right players in say the 70's or 80's, then they would have won more cups. But in this era, to win 3 cups in 10 years is pretty amazing, so i don't think Wings fans should be feeling like they could have gotten more.

Thanks for saying this! Most people here don't have much perspective on this issue. When confronted by the odd member who only wants to complain and act entitled, I frequently point him or her toward the Kings or the Blue Jackets. All here should understand that, early exits aside, they've been fortunate to root for a team which has had the best track record of any NHL team over the last 10 years.

Good call, and thank you for that bit of outside perspective!