anyone interested in Raycroft?

[Lou_Siffer 1]

NO to Raycroft and NO to Bryzgalov. We have Hasek and Osgood. Are ya'll forgetting that? Now with Toskala to the Leafs, and Vokoun to the Panthers the Wings EASILY have the best 1-2 goaltending punch in the league. Hasgood 4 lyfe.

Well at the moment you still have to say its Giguere and Bryzgalov...but obviously that will change soon. Hey how 'bout the nickname Bryzuere? Good name for a pair! (if only they "supported" each other it'd be perfect!)

[rage 24]

No way.

[KrazyGangsta 79]

Raycroft ... out of question ... he is not a clutch goalie ... he chocked against the canadiens last game of the season, luckilly his team came up with the win or else everyone in toronto would be out looking for raycroft, he also couldnt finish the canadiens out when he was in boston his rookie season ... i think they were up 3-0 or 3-1 against the habs and he chocked, anyways i wouldnt want him in the wings jersey unless his planning to be a backup but i would rather have ozzy over him ...

Hasek and Osgood ... is the best goalie tandem in the nhl ... its better then Giguerre and wtv his bryzgolov name is lol :$ ... i dont think giguerre is better then hasek i just think they have grittier team , dirtier team, they had an overall bigger faster stronger team and they got some lucky bounces either then that giguerre and hasek were pretty even (and i want to see what giguerre would do without pronger or niedermayer on that team) yes i also know that when they swept us he played amazing and he is a really good goalie anyways just to keep it short hasek > giguerre ......................................

1 more thing lol i know it doesnt have anything to do with anything butt...

Hasek = 1 Stanley Cup

Osoog = 2 Stanley Cup 1 as backup 1 as starter

3 stanley cup total ...

Bryzz = 1 Stanley Cup As Backup

Giguerre= 1 Stanley Cup ....

2 Stanley Cup Total

Lol that just made me realised that our backup has won more stanley cups then our starter

Ya i know im weird

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Hasgood 4 lyfe.

*Flashes secret Hasgood Gang Sign*

[Earthhuman 8]

Yeah, he was pretty bad. But remember it's Toronto. It's probably the toughest place to play goaltender in the league. There is a ton of pressure on the guy.

Yeah, if they had someone like Kaberle, McCabe, Kubina, Gill, or Colaiacovo on their roster, ok, things would be different. But you just can't live up to your potential without a defense like that.

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

I halfway agree. Im just not sure Ozzie really has what it takes to be a great backup in this league. He seamed to let in alot of softies earlier in the season. I like the guy alot. But Im not so sure I have the faith in him that I once did.

Wait...what? Chris Osgood is not a great back up? First we were all arguing that Ozzie should be starter. I'm talking about some of us on these boards earlier in the season. And now Ozzie isn't even good enough for a back up role?

I don't know whether I should laugh or cry. I think I'll laugh.

He played great this season especially near the end of the season with stealing the Wings 5 outta 6 point away from the Preds. THAT was great goaltending and he was solid throughout the season.

Ozzie is more than capable of becoming a starter again. Maybe not right now because of Dom being #1 but Holland would have no problem handing over the reigns to Ozzie had dom retired, and I know that a lot of teams would consider Ozzie for #1 if/when he becomes a free agent again.

I mean I'm not trying to sound rude or anything..but come on..

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Technically we Osgood

Hopefully soon we'll have Dom back

Haha true.

It's just that I don't see Hasek going anywhere else.

[#1redwingfan 0]

NO to Raycroft and NO to Bryzgalov. We have Hasek and Osgood. Are ya'll forgetting that? Now with Toskala to the Leafs, and Vokoun to the Panthers the Wings EASILY have the best 1-2 goaltending punch in the league. Hasgood 4 lyfe.

i cannot possibly agree with the statement that wings easily have the best 1-2 goaltending punch in the league. but i guess thats because i prefer the younger goalies and their technically sound positioning in comparison to flopping like a fish out of water. also because dom and chris are older. dont get me wrong though, they are pretty damn good

[Guest DetroitIan]

Wait...what? Chris Osgood is not a great back up? First we were all arguing that Ozzie should be starter. I'm talking about some of us on these boards earlier in the season. And now Ozzie isn't even good enough for a back up role?

I don't know whether I should laugh or cry. I think I'll laugh.

He played great this season especially near the end of the season with stealing the Wings 5 outta 6 point away from the Preds. THAT was great goaltending and he was solid throughout the season.

Ozzie is more than capable of becoming a starter again. Maybe not right now because of Dom being #1 but Holland would have no problem handing over the reigns to Ozzie had dom retired, and I know that a lot of teams would consider Ozzie for #1 if/when he becomes a free agent again.

I mean I'm not trying to sound rude or anything..but come on..

Actually you're right. Ozzie played great against the Preds. But I remember earlier in the season where he was letting several soft goals go by. I don't ever fault the goaltender for giving up great goals. But when a tender lets in softies. I absolutely hate that. He might be able to keep the backup job. And im not trying to be a jerk or anything, but If you actually think Osgood will be a starter for the Wings again you're crazy. Mark my words, Osgood will NEVER, and I do mean NEVER will be a starter for the Red Wings. Im actually quite shocked that you think he would even be considered by Kenny. Trust me, if Hasek were to retire, there is no way on Gods green earth that Ozzie would be our starter. You gotta admit, early in the season Osgood looked very shakey. So you may be right, he might have what it takes to be a "legace" type backup for us. But come on girlie, you cant actually believe that he will start for us right?

Edited June 24, 2007 by DetroitIan

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

Actually you're right. Ozzie played great against the Preds. But I remember earlier in the season where he was letting several soft goals go by. I don't ever fault the goaltender for giving up great goals. But when a tender lets in softies. I absolutely hate that. He might be able to keep the backup job. And im not trying to be a jerk or anything, but If you actually think Osgood will be a starter for the Wings again you're crazy. Mark my words, Osgood will NEVER, and I do mean NEVER will be a starter for the Red Wings. Im actually quite shocked that you think he would even be considered by Kenny. Trust me, if Hasek were to retire, there is no way on Gods green earth that Ozzie would be our starter. You gotta admit, early in the season Osgood looked very shakey. So you may be right, he might have what it takes to be a "legace" type backup for us. But come on girlie, you cant actually believe that he will start for us right?

I don't remember Oz being shakey at all this season. In the first half of the season he was mostly on IR with injuries.

I think IF Dom retired, that Holland would have no problem with Ozzie as starter. It would be Ozzie-Howard. So yeah I do actually believe so.

[Guest DetroitIan]

I don't remember Oz being shakey at all this season. In the first half of the season he was mostly on IR with injuries.

I think IF Dom retired, that Holland would have no problem with Ozzie as starter. It would be Ozzie-Howard. So yeah I do actually believe so.

Think about it though. Osgood is our backup for a reason. Because we have Hasek. If Ozzie was a true NHL starter, should he just get the boot without even having a chance to fight for the job? Hasek is our starter because Hasek is a better goaltender. And think about how many teams out there have starters that are just as good if not better than Hasek(Hasek at 41 that is). So wouldnt you want us to get a goalie via trade or free agency that is up there with Hasek or better? Cause obviously Ozzie isnt or else he would contend to be our starter. But there is no contention there. Its Hasek's job(for good reason). Or do you wanna take the huge risk of putting Osgood in there all season, a guy who gets bumped to backup for a 40+ year old. It just makes sense to wanna have a better starting goalie than Osgood. Thats my opinion atleast. I think most would agree. It does make sense doesnt it?

Edited June 24, 2007 by DetroitIan

[Guest DetroitIan]

But that doesn't mean Ozzie isn't capable of being a starter on some teams such as Florida, TB, Columbus, St.Louis, and possibly even the dreaded Avalanche.

I could see that actually. Just never for the Red Wings. Kenny will never make Ozzie our starter. No matter what Hasek's decision was. That im sure of.

Edited June 24, 2007 by DetroitIan

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Osgood played a major role in helping turn around the New York Islanders to get to the playoffs for the first time in a while when he was there for two years, and he helped the Blues maintain their consistency in making the playoffs before the Blues started to tank a few seasons ago. And he did it AS A STARTER.

If Osgood wasn't fighting injury in the Edmonton series, we would've eventually seen him over Legace I think.

Can Osgood "carry" a team as a starter in the NHL? I don't know, but "carry" in that sense is such a strong label, i.e. Hasek days when he was back in Buffalo when Buffalo didn't have much offense. Is he capable of sitill being a starter. Yes.

I will never, ever understand the bad bias towards Osgood in here by many members.

EDIT: spelling at end of post

Edited June 24, 2007 by SouthernWingsFan

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Raycroft ... out of question ... he is not a clutch goalie ... he chocked against the canadiens last game of the season, luckilly his team came up with the win or else everyone in toronto would be out looking for raycroft, he also couldnt finish the canadiens out when he was in boston his rookie season ... i think they were up 3-0 or 3-1 against the habs and he chocked, anyways i wouldnt want him in the wings jersey unless his planning to be a backup but i would rather have ozzy over him ...

Hasek and Osgood ... is the best goalie tandem in the nhl ... its better then Giguerre and wtv his bryzgolov name is lol :$ ... i dont think giguerre is better then hasek i just think they have grittier team , dirtier team, they had an overall bigger faster stronger team and they got some lucky bounces either then that giguerre and hasek were pretty even (and i want to see what giguerre would do without pronger or niedermayer on that team) yes i also know that when they swept us he played amazing and he is a really good goalie anyways just to keep it short hasek > giguerre ......................................

1 more thing lol i know it doesnt have anything to do with anything butt...

Hasek = 1 Stanley Cup

Osoog = 2 Stanley Cup 1 as backup 1 as starter

3 stanley cup total ...

Bryzz = 1 Stanley Cup As Backup

Giguerre= 1 Stanley Cup ....

2 Stanley Cup Total

Lol that just made me realised that our backup has won more stanley cups then our starter

Ya i know im weird

Wow, Ozzie and Dom the best tandom? How about Luongo and anyone? Or Marty and anyone? Dom is no longer an elite goaltender. He is good. Not great. Ozzie, I love him, but he is average.

Anyone who wants Ozzie as a starter over Raycroft is just nuts. Raycroft is better than Ozzie, hands down. Again, Ozzie is a great guy, perfect for a backup, but that's it. He isn't a starter.

So the tandom of Osgood and Hasek has won 1 more Cup than Bryz and Giggy, what's your point?

Lastly, the Bruins did have the Habs on the brink of elimination and blew it. But to blame that on completely Raycroft is just insane. If it had anything to do with his play, he wouldn't have had the chance to lose game 7, most likely even game 6.

Yeah, if they had someone like Kaberle, McCabe, Kubina, Gill, or Colaiacovo on their roster, ok, things would be different. But you just can't live up to your potential without a defense like that.

What? I can't tell if you are trying to be sarcastic or if you just have no idea what you are talking about.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Wow, Ozzie and Dom the best tandom? How about Luongo and anyone? Or Marty and anyone? Dom is no longer an elite goaltender. He is good. Not great. Ozzie, I love him, but he is average.

Hasek was good/great a good bit in the playoffs.

Anyone who wants Ozzie as a starter over Raycroft is just nuts. Raycroft is better than Ozzie, hands down. Again, Ozzie is a great guy, perfect for a backup, but that's it. He isn't a starter.

How is Raycroft better than Osgood? Is that fact or just strong opinion? Give us some insight on why.

[redwingfan19 293]

Hasek was good/great a good bit in the playoffs.

How is Raycroft better than Osgood? Is that fact or just strong opinion? Give us some insight on why.

yes please feel free to elaborate :?

[KrazyGangsta 79]

BringHomeTheCup! .... let me put it this way ... Let's say your in the playoffs ... luongo or marty goes down ... they dont have a goalie that has allready been in that situation or even a backup that has actually won the cup ... And i dont blame raycroft for the loss against the habs ... im just saying his not a clutch goalie he just cant step up and steal a game when he needs too

Edited June 24, 2007 by KrazyGangsta

[redwingfan19 293]

BringHomeTheCup! .... let me put it this way ... Let's say your in the playoffs ... luongo or marty goes down ... they dont have a goalie that has allready been in that situation or even a backup that has actually won the cup ... And i dont blame raycroft for the loss against the habs ... im just saying his not a clutch goalie he just cant step up and steal a game when he needs too

I saw him blow a 4 goal lead in buffalo, I actaully saw him blow several multiple goal leads this past year. He's an average goalie at best and nowhere near clutch. Prove me wrong Andrew, prove me wrong.....

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Hasek was good/great a good bit in the playoffs.

How is Raycroft better than Osgood? Is that fact or just strong opinion? Give us some insight on why.

First, when was the last season that Ozzie didn't have an injury that cost him a decent chunk of time? He isn't durable enough to handle the starting role. He was pretty solid at one point in his career, but not any longer.

In the past 3 seasons, Ozzie has only started 120 games, 53 in the last 2. Over that same time period, Raycroft has started 159, with 102 the past 2 seasons.

Raycroft is younger, more of a work horse, and has proven in recent years that he is a starter in this league. I don't think anyone can really argue that.

Osgood isn't a starter any longer. He couldn't even wrestle the starting job from Manny. And I think most people would agree that Raycroft is better than Manny.

Hasek needed to play better in the playoffs this year. I don't care what anyone says, he didn't play well enough. I'm not blaming him for the loss. But he didn't play great. fact is he did let in a lot of soft goals this year. He was good, and there were flashes of greatness. But not enough.

BringHomeTheCup! .... let me put it this way ... Let's say your in the playoffs ... luongo or marty goes down ... they dont have a goalie that has allready been in that situation or even a backup that has actually won the cup ... And i dont blame raycroft for the loss against the habs ... im just saying his not a clutch goalie he just cant step up and steal a game when he needs too

Let me put it this way. You wouldn't take Luongo or Marty and any combo of our young goalies or Dom and Ozzie?

[KrazyGangsta 79]

Im not saying i wouldnt take luongo or marty on my team ... im just saying hasek and osgood are a better combo then any1 else in the league

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Let me put it this way. You wouldn't take Luongo or Marty and any combo of our young goalies or Dom and Ozzie?

Night in/night out? That's debatable.

But if it's a 1, 2 game deal where Osgood might have to come in on emergency duty, I'd put Hasek/Osgood up against any NHL goalie tandem in a heartbeat, Osgood knows what it is like in big-time games, he's been on both the winning and losing end of them, much more experience than a rookie/2nd year goalie that's backup in the NHL in all likelihood.

[puckloo39 5,686]

First, when was the last season that Ozzie didn't have an injury that cost him a decent chunk of time? He isn't durable enough to handle the starting role. He was pretty solid at one point in his career, but not any longer.

In the past 3 seasons, Ozzie has only started 120 games, 53 in the last 2. Over that same time period, Raycroft has started 159, with 102 the past 2 seasons.

Raycroft is younger, more of a work horse, and has proven in recent years that he is a starter in this league. I don't think anyone can really argue that.

Osgood isn't a starter any longer. He couldn't even wrestle the starting job from Manny. And I think most people would agree that Raycroft is better than Manny.

Hasek needed to play better in the playoffs this year. I don't care what anyone says, he didn't play well enough. I'm not blaming him for the loss. But he didn't play great. fact is he did let in a lot of soft goals this year. He was good, and there were flashes of greatness. But not enough.

Let me put it this way. You wouldn't take Luongo or Marty and any combo of our young goalies or Dom and Ozzie?

Let me put it this way. We are not getting Luongo or Brodeur, nor would any of the young goalie prospects be able to get the Wings to the third round for the first time since 2001. Hasek did. If Kenny plays his cards right, we get Dom back for one more year. If he doesn't for some reason, what exactly did you have in mind? The WIngs can't afford a pricey goalie, even if there was one available, and also keep other key players. Like it or not, Dom is probably coming back.

Aside from Dom and Lidstrom, the rest of the team needed to play better in the playoffs. I don't care what you say, Hasek is the reason the Wings were even in a couple of games in the playoffs long enough to wake the hell up and play hockey! Why don't you try giving some credit where it is due? Soft goals? Please. Dom let in a couple, sure. So did the esteemed Brodeur, who didn't make it to game 6, round 3. So did Luongo, so did the wundergoalie, Giguere. So did Kipper (remember???) So did Emery. Hasek also was the victim of goals scored on him by his own defense and deflections and flukes no one could have stopped. So what?

Oz and Hasek are not good enough sadly for you, so you're going to have a full season to complain about having a top three goalie for millions less than other teams who won't win the conference, and the leagues best backup. I'll never understand the attitude of some people toward goalies in Detroit. Never good enough.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Im not saying i wouldnt take luongo or marty on my team ... im just saying hasek and osgood are a better combo then any1 else in the league

No way. That's nuts. Simply having a guy like Marty or Luongo who will play 75+ games gives you the best tandom in the league. I don't care if you pull Jim Carey out of retirement to back either of those guys up. NO question the 'Nucks, and Devils are better suited in goal than Detroit.

Night in/night out? That's debatable.

But if it's a 1, 2 game deal where Osgood might have to come in on emergency duty, I'd put Hasek/Osgood up against any NHL goalie tandem in a heartbeat, Osgood knows what it is like in big-time games, he's been on both the winning and losing end of them, much more experience than a rookie/2nd year goalie that's backup in the NHL in all likelihood.

What's debatable?

Let me put it this way. We are not getting Luongo or Brodeur, nor would any of the young goalie prospects be able to get the Wings to the third round for the first time since 2001. Hasek did. If Kenny plays his cards right, we get Dom back for one more year. If he doesn't for some reason, what exactly did you have in mind? The WIngs can't afford a pricey goalie, even if there was one available, and also keep other key players. Like it or not, Dom is probably coming back.

Aside from Dom and Lidstrom, the rest of the team needed to play better in the playoffs. I don't care what you say, Hasek is the reason the Wings were even in a couple of games in the playoffs long enough to wake the hell up and play hockey! Why don't you try giving some credit where it is due? Soft goals? Please. Dom let in a couple, sure. So did the esteemed Brodeur, who didn't make it to game 6, round 3. So did Luongo, so did the wundergoalie, Giguere. So did Kipper (remember???) So did Emery. Hasek also was the victim of goals scored on him by his own defense and deflections and flukes no one could have stopped. So what?

Oz and Hasek are not good enough sadly for you, so you're going to have a full season to complain about having a top three goalie for millions less than other teams who won't win the conference, and the leagues best backup. I'll never understand the attitude of some people toward goalies in Detroit. Never good enough.

Did you read the entire discussion? Or did you just read one or two posts, and make a knee-jerk reaction?

We weren't talking about who the Wings should try to get. We were talking about the best goaltending tandom in the league. So why would you even bring that up?

Obviously you read only what you want to see. I said I didn't blame him for the loss, merely that he needed to be better. That's all. Yeah, he was the reason we were in a couple of game. But he was also the reason we were out of a couple of games. When I spoke of 'soft goals', I wasn't referring to the playoffs, that's why I didn't say, 'in the playoffs...'. Dom was not very good in the regular season. He let in a lot of soft goals.

Contratry to your thoughts about me, I am in favor of signing Dom, and keeping Ozzie as his back up for one more year. It is the Wings best goaltending option. I will complain. But it won't be about not having Luongo or Marty. It will be about Hasek playing like an idiot, and wandering from his net. It won't be about how I wish the Wings would have traded for Vokoun, it will be about Dom letting in soft goals that should be stopped. I don't care how many tough saves you make, as a player, when you see your goaltender let in a softie, it takes the life out of you. If you've ever played, you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Being a goaltender in Detroit is the second toughest place to be a goaltender. We expect greatness, and when we don't get it, we get upset. It's our right as fans. We are paying the salaries. Something I will never understand? How you defend Hasek to no end, how he can do no wrong. Wandering is just 'part of his game'. You have this love affair with Dom. He WAS great, he WAS a top 3 goaltender. He is just a shell of what he used to be, that is undeniable.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Being a goaltender in Detroit is the second toughest place to be a goaltender. We expect greatness, and when we don't get it, we get upset. It's our right as fans. We are paying the salaries.

Maybe we need to keep or expectations in check sometimes then.

Something I will never understand? How you defend Hasek to no end, how he can do no wrong. Wandering is just 'part of his game'. You have this love affair with Dom. He WAS great, he WAS a top 3 goaltender. He is just a shell of what he used to be, that is undeniable.

It's called being a big fan of an athlete. Is it annoying sometimes, yes, but it's called defending your favorite athlete.

Wandering from the crease is a part of his game, yes it's a pain sometimes, but he's not going to change his style anytime soon, not for me or anybody else, and especially not because you might want him to. His style is what won him 6 Vezinas, a Cup, and a gold medal.

If being around the league leaders in GAA for a few years straight when you are over 40, and posting a GAA of what, around 1.6/1.7, is being a shell of your former self, I'd like to see what Mutant Ninja Hasek is capable of pulling off at this age.

Hasek isn't the goalie he once was during the Buffalo years but he is far from a shell of his former self.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Maybe we need to keep or expectations in check sometimes then.

It's called being a big fan of an athlete. Is it annoying sometimes, yes, but it's called defending your favorite athlete.

Wandering from the crease is a part of his game, yes it's a pain sometimes, but he's not going to change his style anytime soon, not for me or anybody else, and especially not because you might want him to. His style is what won him 6 Vezinas, a Cup, and a gold medal.

If being around the league leaders in GAA for a few years straight when you are over 40, and posting a GAA of what, around 1.6/1.7, is being a shell of your former self, I'd like to see what Mutant Ninja Hasek is capable of pulling off at this age.

Hasek isn't the goalie he once was during the Buffalo years but he is far from a shell of his former self.

Why should we lower our expectations? It's what makes Detroit one of the best places to play and watch a hockey game.

I understand being loyal to a player. I'll defend Sergei until I'm bluew in the face. But I've got no problems admitting he doesn't have enough heart, he doesn't work hard enough. But most of the Hasek fans act like the guy can do no wrong, and every weak goal he lets in is a direct result of something someone else did, therefore isn't Dom's fault. That's what I dont' get.

GAA of 1.6/1.7?! That's laughable. You should really take a look at stats before you post something like that. Twice in Dom's career he has had a GAA of less than 2.00. 93-94 with a 1.95, and 98-99 with a 1.87. Dom's best GAA since leaving Buffalo was this past season, a 2.05.

Dom is a shell of what he used to be. He is still a decent goaltender, I'd put him in the top 15 in the league. Saying he is a shell of his former self isn't to disredit how he plays now, it's a tribute to what he was.