University of Michigan - The upset - The future

[GoWings1905 2,694]

Michigan will beat Notre Dame this weekend. Mike Hart said so himself.

Honestly, I don't see any way my Fighting Irish beat Michigan, even with the current state of the UM football team. Notre Dame can't even score an offensive touchdown, let alone stop players like Hart and Manningham. I expect Notre Dame to do nothing offensively again. By nothing, I mean run screen passes every play, go three-and-out, and then punt. Michigan's offense will be on the field so much that their defense won't even be able to look awful. Even with Mallett starting, UM can run the ball with Hart all game, against ND's weak front seven, and be successful like Georgia Tech and Penn State were with their running games. Notre Dame's defense is improved, but the offense leaves them in terrible situations.

While the 0-2 starts for both schools are surprising, it has to be worse in Michigan's case with the lofty expectations they had going into the season. Nobody expected anything from a Notre Dame team losing a ton of talent, facing a brutal schedule, and playing with guys that had minimal to no experience. While I am disappointed that this is going to be a very long season for Notre Dame, I find some solace in what the future can hold. Michigan had everything lined up in their favor this year, and now look what has happened. That being said, the better team will still be wearing maize and blue on Saturday. I know it seems like Michigan can't beat anybody right now, but trust me, as bad as Michigan has looked, Notre Dame is even worse.

Edited September 12, 2007 by GoWings1905

[Guest jaytan]

Too bad there aren't ties in college football anymore. This would be like that '66 game against MSU, except it would be memorable for being pathetic.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Michigan will beat Notre Dame this weekend. Mike Hart said so himself.

Honestly, I don't see any way my Fighting Irish beat Michigan, even with the current state of the UM football team. Notre Dame can't even score an offensive touchdown, let alone stop players like Hart and Manningham. I expect Notre Dame to do nothing offensively again. By nothing, I mean run screen passes every play, go three-and-out, and then punt. Michigan's offense will be on the field so much that their defense won't even be able to look awful. Even with Mallett starting, UM can run the ball with Hart all game, against ND's weak front seven, and be successful like Georgia Tech and Penn State were with their running games. Notre Dame's defense is improved, but the offense leaves them in terrible situations.

While the 0-2 starts for both schools are surprising, it has to be worse in Michigan's case with the lofty expectations they had going into the season. Nobody expected anything from a Notre Dame team losing a ton of talent, facing a brutal schedule, and playing with guys that had minimal to no experience. While I am disappointed that this is going to be a very long season for Notre Dame, I find some solace in what the future can hold. Michigan had everything lined up in their favor this year, and now look what has happened. That being said, the better team will still be wearing maize and blue on Saturday. I know it seems like Michigan can't beat anybody right now, but trust me, as bad as Michigan has looked, Notre Dame is even worse.

I actually think the oppisite. I can't see U-M winning. If Henne was playing I would be very confident because Henne is very good with Arrington/Maningham (even though it hasn't looked that way this year). I think they will be playing very conservative with Mallett in, but I guess ND will be doing the same thing with Clausen. I never would have thought the Mallett/Clausen rivalry would be starting this year already!

[OsGOD 3]

man does mallett have an arm... although the throws it 150mph at a player who is about 10 yards away, causing him to miss it ohwell. I still can't wait for the EMU game on the 6th.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

man does mallett have an arm... although the throws it 150mph at a player who is about 10 yards away, causing him to miss it ohwell. I still can't wait for the EMU game on the 6th.

Last year at Elite 11 Mallett threw the ball 75 yards without a bounce. Word is it's 85 yards now. Hope he has some accuracy along with that cannon!

[Packer487 3]

I'm honestly just really curious to see how Michigan's defense fares against a team that runs a conventional offense. At this point, nothing would shock me. It wouldn't shock me to end up 0-4 after the next two games, and it wouldn't shock me if Michigan continued their mastery of Penn State (a win this year would really push their fans off the deep end I think).

Honestly, I think the best thing that Lloyd could do would be to take the kid gloves off Mallett. You can't treat this like a Tecmo Bowl offense (two passes, two runs) and expect to be successful. You have to give the kid a chance to use his immense talent, and hopefully limit his mistakes. When the guy has an arm like that, you can't just have him throw 5 yard outs and screen passes the entire game.

He might make mistakes, but you still have to attack the defense like you normally would. You know Weis is going to have some tricks up his sleeve to try and exploit what he's seen in our defense the last couple of weeks. And they're in the same boat as us. Mallett has been here since the bowl practices. He should have a better grasp of the offense than a typical freshman.

If he effs up, he effs up. But both teams are starting true freshmen quarterbacks and I think ours is better. It'd be a mistake to reign him in so much that it makes our ultra-predictable offense even more predictable.

[betterREDthandead 58]

I'm honestly just really curious to see how Michigan's defense fares against a team that runs a conventional offense. At this point, nothing would shock me. It wouldn't shock me to end up 0-4 after the next two games, and it wouldn't shock me if Michigan continued their mastery of Penn State (a win this year would really push their fans off the deep end I think).

Honestly, I think the best thing that Lloyd could do would be to take the kid gloves off Mallett. You can't treat this like a Tecmo Bowl offense (two passes, two runs) and expect to be successful. You have to give the kid a chance to use his immense talent, and hopefully limit his mistakes. When the guy has an arm like that, you can't just have him throw 5 yard outs and screen passes the entire game.

He might make mistakes, but you still have to attack the defense like you normally would. You know Weis is going to have some tricks up his sleeve to try and exploit what he's seen in our defense the last couple of weeks. And they're in the same boat as us. Mallett has been here since the bowl practices. He should have a better grasp of the offense than a typical freshman.

If he effs up, he effs up. But both teams are starting true freshmen quarterbacks and I think ours is better. It'd be a mistake to reign him in so much that it makes our ultra-predictable offense even more predictable.

Thoroughly agree about Mallett. What's to lose? Notre Dame is going to try and unleash their golden boy too. Hart should get his 30 carries, but when Mallett passes, they really need to go for those big 20 and 30 yard plays. Michigan needs a huge dose of confidence right now and dinking and dunking the way down the field isn't the way to do that.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Michigan needs a huge dose of confidence right now and dinking and dunking the way down the field isn't the way to do that.

You are right on, but sadly you and Mike Debord think different

[Guest DetroitIan]

Honestly, I think this might be a slop-fest. Mike Hart is gonna have to have a huge game in order for Michigan to win by alteast 7-10 points. Otherwise, I see this going into OT. And with the college overtime format, this could be a looooonnnnggg game....

[BlakChamber 8]

Honestly, I think this might be a slop-fest. Mike Hart is gonna have to have a huge game in order for Michigan to win by alteast 7-10 points. Otherwise, I see this going into OT. And with the college overtime format, this could be a looooonnnnggg game....

It's going to be ugly period. Ultimately, I think UM is going to win based on they still have a pretty good offense. ND doesn't have a good offense or defense.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

I think ND is going to win. Debord will play so conservative with Mallett while on the other side Weiss will at least try to open things up a little for Clausen. Unless Clausen throws a bunch of picks (which is very possible) I think ND wins. I do agree Hart will have a huge game if he doesn't pull his hammy.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Dear Notre Dame: Please don't hurt Ryan Mallett or you will receive the wrath of David Cone!!!

[GoWings1905 2,694]

I would have never imagined that after the game tomorrow, either Michigan or Notre Dame will be on a five-game losing streak. That's hard to comprehend from the two most successful college football programs ever.

Anyways, good luck to all of the Michigan fans here tomorrow.

May the "better" team win.

Edited September 14, 2007 by GoWings1905

[Packer487 3]

Dear Notre Dame: Please don't hurt Ryan Mallett or you will receive the wrath of David Cone!!!

You mean "The Shermanator" right?

[RedWingedKitten 9]

Well that game was intersting... :-D (Michigan won 38-0)

Edited September 16, 2007 by RedWingedKitten

[Sergei Fedorov91 24]

I've been watching games with my buddies all day at the bar, and we finally got to enjoy watching Michigan play. After the game, a notre dame fan said 'at least we didn't lose to a division 1AA team, and a Michigan fan turned around and said how does it feel to get your ass kicked by a team that lost to a 1AA team. lol.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

I must say it was very funny to see the golden boy get bashed around.

[Matt 1,049]

I must say it was very funny to see the golden boy get bashed around.

Is it just me or does he come off as some prissy trust fund prick that if he didn't have shoulder pads on he'd have a sweater tied around his scrawny neck?

He just screams "I'm a little *****" when you look at him.

Nice to see Mallett make some nice throws out there, even if he needs to get his accuracy refined. That howitzer of an arm will be lethal once it's accurate. That long bomb to Manningham in the first half that was overthrown...... it didn't even look like it took any effort for him to blast that out there.

Who else wonders what App. State would've done to Notre Dame?

[GoWings1905 2,694]

Is it just me or does he come off as some prissy trust fund prick that if he didn't have shoulder pads on he'd have a sweater tied around his scrawny neck?

He just screams "I'm a little *****" when you look at him.

Nice to see Mallett make some nice throws out there, even if he needs to get his accuracy refined. That howitzer of an arm will be lethal once it's accurate. That long bomb to Manningham in the first half that was overthrown...... it didn't even look like it took any effort for him to blast that out there.

Who else wonders what App. State would've done to Notre Dame?

It doesn't really matter what Appalachian State could do against Notre Dame. They aren't on ND's schedule. In terms of the first eight games, find me a team that has a tougher schedule than Notre Dame. I think the whole idea now is for Michigan fans to find a way to defend their loss to a Division II school. I don't really know what would happen if ND played Appalchian State. I do know Michigan played them and lost.

The transitive property doesn't really work in sports. Because Appalachian State beat Michigan, and Michigan beat Notre Dame, then we assume Appalachian State would beat Notre Dame as well? You could go in circles for every team in college football if that was the case.

As far as Clausen goes, give the kid a chance. He's made two starts in two stadiums of 110,000 people. On top of having a downright terrible offensive line in front of him, Clausen also has no help from the skill positions. Mallett still has Hart, Manningham, and Arrington to fall back on. Plus, an offensive line that actually blocks. Once the young talent, and the offensive line develop around him, Clausen will live up to the hype.

Edited September 16, 2007 by GoWings1905

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Is it just me or does he come off as some prissy trust fund prick that if he didn't have shoulder pads on he'd have a sweater tied around his scrawny neck?

He just screams "I'm a little *****" when you look at him.

Nice to see Mallett make some nice throws out there, even if he needs to get his accuracy refined. That howitzer of an arm will be lethal once it's accurate. That long bomb to Manningham in the first half that was overthrown...... it didn't even look like it took any effort for him to blast that out there.

Who else wonders what App. State would've done to Notre Dame?

I agree with that on Clausen. I'm not saying he won't be a good QB, because he is only a freshmen afterall, and has no OL help. I'm a pretty hardcore recruiting fanatic, and from watching film, and reading many things I always wondered why Clausen was so hyped up. He played in a Christian football conference, and played no Cali powerhouses. It's safe to say he played some of the worst teams out there. He also had a 5 star RB along side him that goes to USC now. When you have him in the backfield it is much easier to find the open man. He was very far ahead though on his technique, and I'm sure he can thank his average brothers for that. I guess we will see in 4 years.

[Guest DetroitIan]

It doesn't really matter what Appalachian State could do against Notre Dame. They aren't on ND's schedule. In terms of the first eight games, find me a team that has a tougher schedule than Notre Dame. I think the whole idea now is for Michigan fans to find a way to defend their loss to a Division II school. I don't really know what would happen if ND played Appalchian State. I do know Michigan played them and lost.

The transitive property doesn't really work in sports. Because Appalachian State beat Michigan, and Michigan beat Notre Dame, then we assume Appalachian State would beat Notre Dame as well? You could go in circles for every team in college football if that was the case.

As far as Clausen goes, give the kid a chance. He's made two starts in two stadiums of 110,000 people. On top of having a downright terrible offensive line in front of him, Clausen also has no help from the skill positions. Mallett still has Hart, Manningham, and Arrington to fall back on. Plus, an offensive line that actually blocks. Once the young talent, and the offensive line develop around him, Clausen will live up to the hype.

Honestly though, Ty Willingham never had this bad of a start. Yet he was fired. Charlie Weiss is praised by Notre Dame, and he's doing a horrible job. Much worse than Willingham.

[GoWings1905 2,694]

Honestly though, Ty Willingham never had this bad of a start. Yet he was fired. Charlie Weiss is praised by Notre Dame, and he's doing a horrible job. Much worse than Willingham.

I agree completely. I'm just as upset as any Notre Dame fan about this seaon so far. However, I disagree with you that Weis is doing a horrible job, and that Willingham was a better coach at Notre Dame. Following Notre Dame as closely as I do, let me just state a couple reasons why Weis has and will be a bigger success than Willingham.

First, based on records alone, Weis is almost certain to have a better record through three seasons than Willingham did. Even with this year looking very bleak, Notre Dame should manage four to five wins, with their weak schedule late. That would put Weis at either 23 or 24 wins through three seasons, as opposed to Willingham's 21. Not significant maybe, but also take into consideration that Weis went to two BCS Bowls, while Willingham had one great year (2002) and two subpar years following that. Weis also has won more games (19) in his first two seasons than any other coach in Irish history.

Second, I really hate to use this as an indicator, but look at the opponents Weis has lost to so far. The only really questionable loss to an inferior opponent was Michigan State in 2005. Besides that, the losses have come against USC twice, Michigan twice, Ohio State, LSU, Georgia Tech, and Penn State. While the margin of defeat in those losses has been typically pretty wide, those are all quality football programs, that were Top 25 teams when they beat Notre Dame. The talent is just so much better at those schools right now, which brings me to my final argument, and the most important factor.

Lastly, the recruiting classes of Willingham and Weis have been night and day. Willingham's numbers have left the program in shambles. The junior and senior classes at Notre Dame right now are sparse in numbers and talent. That has forced Weis to rebuild the program using younger players to make up for Willingham's poor recruiting management. Weis has produced two top-ten classes so far, and is very likely to make that three with the strong start on the 2008 class. I realize Willingham was responsible for Quinn, Samardjiza, Walker, Fasano, Carlson, and McKnight, but he also left the program deprived of depth and talent, and now Weis is suffering the fallout. Weis has recruited extremely well, and that will be evident in 2008, and moreso in 2009 when Weis has gotten the recruiting fully back on-track and is playing with his guys.

While I'm absolutely miserable right now with this version of Notre Dame football, I am very optimistic about the future under Charlie Weis. I will gratefully suffer through 2007, if 2008, 2009, and beyond turns out like it should. It's hard to fathom Notre Dame being 0-8, but 2007 was expected to be a rebuilding year all along. I am very confident that Notre Dame will get through this tough stretch, and return stronger than ever, as a national powerhouse and championship contender for years to come.

Edited September 17, 2007 by GoWings1905

[BlakChamber 8]

I know the ND fans have to convince themselves that Jabba the Weis is better than Ty because they're stuck with him for so long, but now that Weis is in his third year, so shouldn't kids out there be Weis'?

Here's the Scout recruiting rankings for ND.

2002 - 13th in the nation

2003 - 5th in the nation

2004 - 30th in the nation

2005 - 27th in the nation

2006 - 5th in the nation

2007 - 11th in the nation

Ty didn't do so hot in 04, and 05 was going to be lower because of the coaching change, but there's nothing to suggest that Ty was a horrible recruiter. And, according to Pat Forde on ESPN, in 28 games, there has been one offensive touchdown scored by a Weis recruit.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

And, according to Pat Forde on ESPN, in 28 games, there has been one offensive touchdown scored by a Weis recruit.

That is one crazy stat!

[Guest DetroitIan]

in 28 games, there has been one offensive touchdown scored by a Weis recruit.

Wow. That says it all. Anyone thinking Weis is doing a superior job to Willingham, must have their Irish blinders on. Comparing the two at Notre Dame, it's clear that Ty Willingham >>> Charilie Weis.

Edited September 17, 2007 by DetroitIan