Dom Bashers Welcome!

[Booster313 138]

I've had some more time to reflect on the past two games for Dom. Out of the 8 supposed bad goals only 4 were truly bad. One last night was a third attempt on a shot, The previous night he let in a 5 on 3 scrum goal and a 5 on 4 scrum goal, he also let in a roofed shot that knocked the water bottle off the net.

Now lets take a look at the four bad goals... 3 were breakaways and one was a turn over that resulted in a chicago player wide open in front of his net. I don't care how many shots you don't give up, when the other team has 4 chances to be one on one with your goalie that's a defensive breakdown. Osgood has yet to face one breakaway this season.

My point is lets not give on Dom just yet. Yes his play is off and I'm sure he would have liked to have a few of those back, but if you look at it subjectivly the situation isn't quite as dire as it looks. Much of this is fueled by Ozzy's great play to this point and the fact that the grass is always greener on the otherside when it comes to goaltending in Detroit. Dom will be fine, Ozzy will be fine...the team will be fine.

[puckloo39 5,686]

Here's a fact. Dom had 2 bad games in a row. Where are all the people who said "He NEVER has two bad games in a row. He always plays like a beast when he is humiliated the game before."

I wonder if he has ever had 3 s***ty games in a row. Well Babs, only one way to find out...

He rarely has two bad ones like last night's, since you rarely see the combination of breakdowns and errors. For example, the best D-man in the business, falling down and allowing the game winner. SInce tonight is potentially a record-setting loss in that it could be 4 in a row, I am shocked and amazed that they aren't throwing Hasek to the wolves. It's possible they still might. May as well dump all the crap on one player so the rest of them can feel OK about it, huh? Sarcasm, here, since I know the players do not blame that game or Anaheim on Dom.

Ozzie says he's ready to go, and I bet they play him, since it's a back to back and that's not allowed if you're Dom. This is just the way this season has gone for Hasek, I don't see an end in sight.

Now lets take a look at the four bad goals... 3 were breakaways and one was a turn over that resulted in a chicago player wide open in front of his net. I don't care how many shots you don't give up, when the other team has 4 chances to be one on one with your goalie that's a defensive breakdown. Osgood has yet to face one breakaway this season.

the Wings reserve those just for Dom, apparently. Along with deflected goals and assorted other brain-farts. Some of them he saves, and some he doesn't.

They don't want to hear this, Booster. Dom is the sole reason we've lost 4 games, don't you know that?

Edited November 18, 2007 by puckloo39

[RabidWingFan_N_BuffaloNY 0]

I read nearly every post on this thead and I didn't see anyone mention what I noticed the last few losses with Dom. He has been giving up the 5-hole with quite regularity. I'm wondering if there still isn't a problem with his hip and Dom being a competitive warrior wanted to get back in net and not let Osgood build overwhelming public and private support with his stellar play.

Watching the game last night I noticed that the short handed goals were all scored 5-hole with Dom never laying out on his side while kicking his top leg up along with his top arm. I have watched nearly all his NHL games played since he came to Buffalo in 1992 and I have never seen him stand up 3 times in the same game against breakaways/shorthanded rushes.

I had the fortune of talking to him for a few hours during his daughters pre-K graduation in Buffalo in 2000 and let me tell you this guy not only is a fearless, fierce, warrior, he is highly educated and pretty articulate for not having english as his first language. The Dominator will be back to form and it will be before the Christmas season.

We have nothing to worry about. I'm glad we aren't the Sabres or Penguins!!

[Dominator2005 558]

Hasek will be fine - I'm more concern with our def - in St-Louis game Tkachuk was alone in front od Hasek for about 10 secs and no one even tried to move him... we really need one BIG STAY AT HOME DEF...

St-Louis game I think that he allowed ONE bad goal - Mayers

I hope that HASEK will be back - and he will because he's a warrior.

[Booster313 138]

I read nearly every post on this thead and I didn't see anyone mention what I noticed the last few losses with Dom. He has been giving up the 5-hole with quite regularity. I'm wondering if there still isn't a problem with his hip and Dom being a competitive warrior wanted to get back in net and not let Osgood build overwhelming public and private support with his stellar play.

Watching the game last night I noticed that the short handed goals were all scored 5-hole with Dom never laying out on his side while kicking his top leg up along with his top arm. I have watched nearly all his NHL games played since he came to Buffalo in 1992 and I have never seen him stand up 3 times in the same game against breakaways/shorthanded rushes.

I had the fortune of talking to him for a few hours during his daughters pre-K graduation in Buffalo in 2000 and let me tell you this guy not only is a fearless, fierce, warrior, he is highly educated and pretty articulate for not having english as his first language. The Dominator will be back to form and it will be before the Christmas season.

We have nothing to worry about. I'm glad we aren't the Sabres or Penguins!!

Rabid,

I agree with you on the five hole issue. It is uncharatristic of Dom not to stack the pads on a breakaway goal. That being said I'm not certain that it's due in injury. Dom is not shy on telling the team that he can't play due to injury. I think someone said once that he is like a Ferrari he needs to be in perfect running condition in order to perform to his utmost ability. Not like a chevy you can kick the tires on everyone once in a while and run for 100k miles. Dom has a lot of pride and if he's not 100% he's not going to play and risk humilating himself.

On a side note I've met him half a dozen times and talked to him on each occasion for a few minutes. I agree with you 100%. Dom is a great competitor. He is a champion and he will find a way to win. I have the utmost respect for him as a man and as a player.

[omnipotent_hudler 0]

The consensus seems to be that he needs more shots to get back into top form. The problem is that no one knows how many "more shots" he needs and how many "more shots" will be back breaking goals against us. Every point matters and we should go with our best goalie every game. Are you really going to tell me that Hasek is our best goalie right now?

[puckloo39 5,686]

Rabid,

I agree with you on the five hole issue. It is uncharatristic of Dom not to stack the pads on a breakaway goal. That being said I'm not certain that it's due in injury. Dom is not shy on telling the team that he can't play due to injury. I think someone said once that he is like a Ferrari he needs to be in perfect running condition in order to perform to his utmost ability. Not like a chevy you can kick the tires on everyone once in a while and run for 100k miles. Dom has a lot of pride and if he's not 100% he's not going to play and risk humilating himself.

On a side note I've met him half a dozen times and talked to him on each occasion for a few minutes. I agree with you 100%. Dom is a great competitor. He is a champion and he will find a way to win. I have the utmost respect for him as a man and as a player.

Rabid, welcome and thanks for the insight. Booster, you're my man.

Dom isn't done, not by a long shot. No pun intended.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Since when is Bryzgalov a gamebreaker? And if he's such a gamebreaker, how come no team wanted to give up anything of signifigance to acquire Bryz? Instead he was placed on waivers, and it wasent until the next morning when Phoenix of all teams claimed him.

I'll agree Bryz is a starter, but is by no means a gamebreaker.

The teams in need of a goalie were dealing from a position of strength. They knew a few things.

1. Byz wasn't going to a WC team with any chance of making the playoffs (Detroit, Edmonton, ect..).

2. Burke wanted to trade him to an EC, but there weren't many EC teams biting. Teams like Tampa didn't have the pieces to entice Burke enough.

3. Cap space is more valuable than a late round pick in a salary cap era.

By putting Bryz on waivers Burke accomplished everything he wanted. He avoided Bryz becoming uneasy and causing problems. He didn't take on any unecessary cap hits. And Bryz didn't go to a team that will make the playoffs.

I never said Bryz was a gamebreaker. Only that the Wings need a gamebreaker in net, and that I'd like to seem the Wings pursue Bryz in the offseason.

[Booster313 138]

The consensus seems to be that he needs more shots to get back into top form. The problem is that no one knows how many "more shots" he needs and how many "more shots" will be back breaking goals against us. Every point matters and we should go with our best goalie every game. Are you really going to tell me that Hasek is our best goalie right now?

No I can't honestly say that...but I believe that he will be before the season is up. Nothing against Ozzy but I've seen the both at their best and when Dom is at his best I'll take him over any current goalie in the league.

Rabid, welcome and thanks for the insight. Booster, you're my man.

Dom isn't done, not by a long shot. No pun intended.

Puck,

Your my girl! We Dom supporters have to stick together!

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Well, I don't think there is a goalie that can make up for all glaring holes..or more goalies on sucky teams would win Cups...like Luongo We should just fill a couple holes and not worry about a goalie, becaue we're not getting Luongo.

But anyhoo. My main thing against Bryz is his inexperience. I've seen many flash in the pan goalies have good runs in times of need. I'm not saying he is...I'm just not certain he isn't. Also, he might eventually come to win a cup in a few years...but to come in next year and do it...nah. You and I both know that!

The sad thing about the playoffs is that it relies just as much on luck and boucnes and injuries as it does in skill and longevity and leadership...so the perfect team can still lose. A worse team can get hot and make it far. It's just weird. With all my watching I've never been able to predict (with acuracy) the teams that will crumble or the ones that will succeed. Sure, occasionally a seemingly destined team comes alone, but then again half the time you think that and they have injuries, or go cold...so yeah. I'm not going to put it all on the goalie.

Bryz doesn't have a ton of NHL experience, just 70 games, but he has proven he can play, and do very well at the NHL level. He has a lot more experience than Howard. I think Bryz has proven he isn't just a flash in the pan, he may not be the next Luongo, but he certianally can do better than Dom/Ozzie/Howard as next years starter. I don't think the Wings have an outside chance, but I'm just saying it would be nice.

No I can't honestly say that...but I believe that he will be before the season is up. Nothing against Ozzy but I've seen the both at their best and when Dom is at his best I'll take him over any current goalie in the league.

Dom pre-2002, yes. Present day Dom, not a chance he is top 5.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

No I can't honestly say that...but I believe that he will be before the season is up. Nothing against Ozzy but I've seen the both at their best and when Dom is at his best I'll take him over any current goalie in the league.

Puck,

Your my girl! We Dom supporters have to stick together!

Unfortunately that hasn't happened since at least 2002.

He's been good, but not the Dominator.

And for a little perspective, yes some are overreacting in bashing Dom, but if it were Ozzy, he'd be called the worst goaltender of all time and the lynch mob would be lighting torches. One category that Osgood unquestionably has Dom beat is in the lack of respect and the amount of bashing he gets here.

It's not even close.

They both won the same number of the Cups for the Wings, but you'd never know it from the way most people talk about Ozzy.

[Booster313 138]

Unfortunately that hasn't happened since at least 2002.

He's been good, but not the Dominator.

And for a little perspective, yes some are overreacting in bashing Dom, but if it were Ozzy, he'd be called the worst goaltender of all time and the lynch mob would be lighting torches. One category that Osgood unquestionably has Dom beat is in the lack of respect and the amount of bashing he gets here.

It's not even close.

They both won the same number of the Cups for the Wings, but you'd never know it from the way most people talk about Ozzy.

Agreed you won't catch me bashing Ozzy just defending Dom 100%.

[HenryMalredo 2]

And for a little perspective, yes some are overreacting in bashing Dom, but if it were Ozzy, he'd be called the worst goaltender of all time and the lynch mob would be lighting torches. One category that Osgood unquestionably has Dom beat is in the lack of respect and the amount of bashing he gets here.

I have no personal preference towards either goalie, but Dom definately gets more hatred on LGW than Ozzie. There have been several threads dedicated to how horrible Dom is, while most recent Ozzie threads seem to be dedicated to the fact that he is the loyalist Red Wing ever and a great person (which certainly may be true) and is one of the elite goaltenders of the nineties and a surefire future hall of famer (which is only true among the posters of this message board).

[puckloo39 5,686]

Unfortunately that hasn't happened since at least 2002.

He's been good, but not the Dominator.

And for a little perspective, yes some are overreacting in bashing Dom, but if it were Ozzy, he'd be called the worst goaltender of all time and the lynch mob would be lighting torches. One category that Osgood unquestionably has Dom beat is in the lack of respect and the amount of bashing he gets here.

It's not even close.

They both won the same number of the Cups for the Wings, but you'd never know it from the way most people talk about Ozzy.

I agree with Harold, I have never understood the bashing Ozzie was subject to. Now, the villagers have the torches and pitchforks out over Dom, instead. I guess it's Dom's turn to be run out of town this season.

I have no personal preference towards either goalie, but Dom definately gets more hatred on LGW than Ozzie. There have been several threads dedicated to how horrible Dom is, while most recent Ozzie threads seem to be dedicated to the fact that he is the loyalist Red Wing ever and a great person (which certainly may be true) and is one of the elite goaltenders of the nineties and a surefire future hall of famer (which is only true among the posters of this message board).

remarkable, isn't it? Dom will be fine, regardless of what LGWers say.

Agreed you won't catch me bashing Ozzy just defending Dom 100%.

we actually have plenty of company, Booster. A lot of them no longer post here because of the over-the-top bashing, but they're there.

[OsGOD 3]

present and accounted for!!!

[savaking72 0]

Me too...Hasek's new store needs a dominating register clerk...glad he's out till he find's his game.

Just kidding...I can't live with that last post. I'm sure he'll be back around...sometime.

[puckloo39 5,686]

Me too...Hasek's new store needs a dominating register clerk...glad he's out till he find's his game.

Just kidding...I can't live with that last post. I'm sure he'll be back around...sometime.

He will play one of the back to backs on 11/21 and 11/22, I am sure. Are you coming back in here when he plays great? Just asking.

[chrisdetroit 189]

While I support the notion that Ozzie should start until Dom can get his head together, none of that matters.

The Wings won't win the Cup with that tandem in net. They won't win the Cup with Howard and Ozzie either. The Wings need a gamebreaker in net. It would be nice to see the Wings aggressively pursue Bryz if he is available this offseason.

Bryz went to Phoenix yesterday. As far as they won't win the cup with Ozzie or Dom, what do you base that on? Can you believe that Tampa won with Khabibulin? or Carolina with Cam Ward (who?). Then there is the fact that the wings did in fact win the cup with Ozzie at one time and with Hasek another time. They could very easily have won the cup last year with Dom and in fact they almost did.

The wings can win the cup again with a very good goaltender. They don't have to have the #1 in the league. The way Ozzie is playing, he would fit the bill. The way Dom played last year, would do it also.

[omaratcho 0]

okay now, i honestly love dominick hasek, i love his sloppy style of play, i love the way he practically juggles his entire body to get one puck. but as i've said many times before, HE'S TOO OLD and hecan't play like this anymore. he's either got to go condition some more or chagne his style or sumthing. i kno it's gotten old and you've heard enoug hof that but come on. We all know dom has slow starts and needs consistant shots to get into a groove, but how long is it gonna take him to get back on track. and when you've got a defense like detroit's, ur usually not goign to et a consistant flow of shots so if dom wants to stay our starter and be good at it, he's gotta learn to play through that . the fact that he doens't get many shots on goal during a game is absolutely no excuse for his poor play

and chrisdetroit , y can't we win the cup wiht ozzie in net? he's barely had the chance to show us what he's got and of what we've seen so far this year.... HE LOOKS AMAZING IN NET

Edited November 19, 2007 by omaratcho

[Offsides 21]

I have no personal preference towards either goalie, but Dom definately gets more hatred on LGW than Ozzie. There have been several threads dedicated to how horrible Dom is, while most recent Ozzie threads seem to be dedicated to the fact that he is the loyalist Red Wing ever and a great person (which certainly may be true) and is one of the elite goaltenders of the nineties and a surefire future hall of famer (which is only true among the posters of this message board).

Totally wrong. The only reason Ozzie hasn't been bashed lately is that he's been really really good...and before that he wasn't playing bad enough to be bashed.

Ozzie is definitely in the top 5 all-time bashed players of all time (haha, I have no stats to support this). I'm not just talking about critisism...just out and out hatred. He's supposed 'backup' right now and so he's golden, but he's never gotten the respect he deserves.

Dom is one of the worst goalies in the league right now...that's what it takes to get these threads. Everyone's got their panties in a bunch because Dom used to be sort of the golden boy who could do no wrong. Everyone salivated over getting him for years, he came in...won a cup in his first year and he was a god. Now no one can handle if he gets a little critisism. I will admit..he's getting really bad treatment right now, but he is one of the worst goalies in the league right now too.

If he is our backup, he'll be treated well there until he gets better...if he does. This is Detroit...hello..goalies aren't treated well here...Dom always has been. If he's not right now...well that's too bad....I would feel alot worse if he'd been treated anywhere to the level of Ozzie or Manny or Cujo. No other goalie in recent history has been treate quite so god-like as Hasek. Unfortunately memories are short lived. The goalie bashing here goes to extreme levels, but do not get that wrong, Ozzie is by far the most bashed goalie of..probably Red Wing history. Which is sad, he doesn't deserve it.

[HenryMalredo 2]

Totally wrong. The only reason Ozzie hasn't been bashed lately is that he's been really really good...and before that he wasn't playing bad enough to be bashed.

Ozzie is definitely in the top 5 all-time bashed players of all time (haha, I have no stats to support this). I'm not just talking about critisism...just out and out hatred. He's supposed 'backup' right now and so he's golden, but he's never gotten the respect he deserves.

Dom is one of the worst goalies in the league right now...that's what it takes to get these threads. Everyone's got their panties in a bunch because Dom used to be sort of the golden boy who could do no wrong. Everyone salivated over getting him for years, he came in...won a cup in his first year and he was a god. Now no one can handle if he gets a little critisism. I will admit..he's getting really bad treatment right now, but he is one of the worst goalies in the league right now too.

If he is our backup, he'll be treated well there until he gets better...if he does. This is Detroit...hello..goalies aren't treated well here...Dom always has been. If he's not right now...well that's too bad....I would feel a lot worse if he'd been treated anywhere to the level of Ozzie or Manny or Cujo. No other goalie in recent history has been treate quite so god-like as Hasek. Unfortunately memories are short lived. The goalie bashing here goes to extreme levels, but do not get that wrong, Ozzie is by far the most bashed goalie of..probably Red Wing history. Which is sad, he doesn't deserve it.

In my time on these boards, I have never seen a thread bashing Osgood. Now part of that may be due to the fact that Osgood has either been on another team or been backup since I've been a member of these boards. But I do know that Dom has been bashed on these boards since his failed comback with the Wings a few years ago, because I was one of the people critical of the move. Ozzie is far from the most bashed player on LGW. In fact I would say that he is one of the most popular players among the members of this forum, and definately has the most fervent following of any Wings players on LGW.

[Offsides 21]

In my time on these boards, I have never seen a thread bashing Osgood. Now part of that may be due to the fact that Osgood has either been on another team or been backup since I've been a member of these boards. But I do know that Dom has been bashed on these boards since his failed comback with the Wings a few years ago, because I was one of the people critical of the move. Ozzie is far from the most bashed player on LGW. In fact I would say that he is one of the most popular players among the members of this forum, and definately has the most fervent following of any Wings players on LGW.

This isn't me being biased...I wish Ozzie was more well liked. HEY! HE IS RIGHT NOW...I'm thrilled...but it won't last. Our 'backup' is always well liked, which Ozzie is supposedly perceived as. Manny was too, until he was starter and then when we didn't win the Cup he was ripped into little pieces. I know I'm not crazy on this one. Ozzie is one of the most bashed players, he's just not been playing enough to get it. The Ozzie lovefest has indeed grown as of late, but I can certainly remember when Ozzie supporters were few and far between and out and out bashing was prevailent. I do hope the Ozzie lovefest lasts though.

edit: I wanted to say to when you said that there is no thread bashing Osgood, I was going to say, EVERY thread can be a thread bashing Osgood..haha. Although, that seems particularly true of Dom right now.

Edited November 19, 2007 by Offsides

[good morning 10]

I've had some more time to reflect on the past two games for Dom. Out of the 8 supposed bad goals only 4 were truly bad. One last night was a third attempt on a shot, The previous night he let in a 5 on 3 scrum goal and a 5 on 4 scrum goal, he also let in a roofed shot that knocked the water bottle off the net.

Now lets take a look at the four bad goals... 3 were breakaways and one was a turn over that resulted in a chicago player wide open in front of his net. I don't care how many shots you don't give up, when the other team has 4 chances to be one on one with your goalie that's a defensive breakdown. Osgood has yet to face one breakaway this season.

My point is lets not give on Dom just yet. Yes his play is off and I'm sure he would have liked to have a few of those back, but if you look at it subjectivly the situation isn't quite as dire as it looks. Much of this is fueled by Ozzy's great play to this point and the fact that the grass is always greener on the otherside when it comes to goaltending in Detroit. Dom will be fine, Ozzy will be fine...the team will be fine.

Well, according to Dom supporters, he plays better facing more shots...so defensive breakdowns should HELP him by some twist of logic.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

In my time on these boards, I have never seen a thread bashing Osgood. Now part of that may be due to the fact that Osgood has either been on another team or been backup since I've been a member of these boards. But I do know that Dom has been bashed on these boards since his failed comback with the Wings a few years ago, because I was one of the people critical of the move. Ozzie is far from the most bashed player on LGW. In fact I would say that he is one of the most popular players among the members of this forum, and definately has the most fervent following of any Wings players on LGW.

You seriously have never seen a thread bashing Osgood?

It hasn't happened this year, but it has pretty much any other year he's been on the team. Even those years he wasn't.

When there was the Legace/Osgood tandem, people were falling all over themselves for Legace and would rip on Osgood. The guy won a Cup as the starting goaltender for the Wings, and there are still people who believe it was in spite of him, not because of him.

Actually, that was mentioned just the other day in a thread.

I seriously can't imagine how you've never seen a thread bashing Ozzy.

Hasek has been bashed as of late, and there are a few regular detractors, but that's about it. Seriously, it's not even close to the grief Ozzy gets. People still bring up goals he let in 15 years ago.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Bryz went to Phoenix yesterday. As far as they won't win the cup with Ozzie or Dom, what do you base that on? Can you believe that Tampa won with Khabibulin? or Carolina with Cam Ward (who?). Then there is the fact that the wings did in fact win the cup with Ozzie at one time and with Hasek another time. They could very easily have won the cup last year with Dom and in fact they almost did.

The wings can win the cup again with a very good goaltender. They don't have to have the #1 in the league. The way Ozzie is playing, he would fit the bill. The way Dom played last year, would do it also.

Did you actually read my post Sparky? I said " It would be nice to see the Wings aggressively pursue Bryz if he is available this offseason." I said nothing about the Wings trying to get him this season. With the waiver rules being what they are, there is 0 chance of Bryz becoming a Red Wing this season.

If you really want to compare Hasek and Osgood to Khabibulin and Ward, you are just being silly. Yeah, sure, I would agree the Dom of 6-8 years ago is better than Ward, and as good as The Bulin Wall. But the Dom of today? No chance in hell he is taken before those two guys. Dom isn't a top 10 netminder any longer. Osgood has never been as good as Khabibulin, and it's debatable that he was ever as good as Ward.

True, the Wings don't need the number 1 goalie in the league to win the Cup this year, but it's ludicrous to think that the team as is can win the Cup with the current tandem. They didn't almost win the Cup last year. They almost won the WC, that's a far cry from almost winning the Cup. Ottawa almost showed up in the SFC, they didn't even almost win the Cup.

Why is it so hard to swallow that the Wings, as is, don't really stack up against teams like Anahiem, Ottawa, or Carolina? Take off your homer lenses, try to see things objectively.