Red Wings Take Beating, Walk Away With Win

[HockeyCrazy3033 168]

So by me saying the Ducks are tougher than us, that translates into we are weak or we took a beating?

I'd like to see where I might have said that, in case you were directing your comments to me.

Yet another example that you can't say anything good about another team without it having to "mean" something negative about the Wings.

Hell, I could say something great about ******* Ak Bars Kazan and somebody here would say I was dissing the wings.

sheesh

I don't believe I was directing this towards you, so you can calm yourself..

I don't understand your whole saying something nice about another team means it's negative towards the Wings. I don't take it that way at all. I say great things about different teams and players all the time. I know the Ducks are MUCH better physically than the Wings. I know the Wings need to get tougher up front, I want them to as well. I'm just saying that the ESPN article is overboard because they certainly did not take a beating.

Edited January 24, 2008 by HockeyCrazy3033

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

My, you're a prickly pear.

The Red Wings power play has been suffering lately, and I think they can do better. With a team like Anaheim, we did a decent job of capitalizing on their mistakes, but I think they were lucky we did not capitalize on more of them. I think this team is capable of doing much better on the power play.

My argument is that the Red Wings need to play their game, not the Ducks' game. I see a lot of out-of-position Ducks out there because they go for the big hit to "send a message". The Wings message should be "Run at us all day, but we will make you pay for it on the score board." *NOT* "We'll go toe-to-toe with you all night." They did a decent job of that last night. It doesn't matter if it is a broken stick, a 5-3 or Giguere going temporarily blind - the Ducks are a team that make a lot of mistakes.

That the Wings won at Anaheim, in a back-to-back game, and without their top forward is a great thing.

Ducks' fans also seem to take for granted Selanne coming back, and while I think it is a given he will, I do not think it is guaranteed he will play in the same ballpark as he did last year. Their secondary scoring will still be an issue. We do not need a complete facelift in players or philosophy to beat this team if we run into them in the playoffs.

All your points are completely valid. I have no beef with them at all. I did say it was impressive that we won whilst on a road trip, with no Z. I haven't disagreed with any of that.

I'm just saying this is a heck of alot closer matchup than people want to believe around here. And those are the people who just can't fathom how we could ever lose to anyone. I call it delusion and it stems from games like this where people lose all sense of perspective.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

I don't believe I was directing this towards you, so you can calm yourself..

I don't understand your whole saying something nice about another team means it's negative towards the Wings. I don't take it that way at all. I say great things about different teams and players all the time. I know the Ducks are MUCH better physically than the Wings. I know the Wings need to get tougher up front, I want them to as well. I'm just saying that the ESPN article is overboard because they certainly did not take a beating.

Maybe it's not you crazy, i'm just saying that if you look at the thread its so typical. I say the Ducks are tougher than us and people say we aren't weak? WTF? Did I say we were weak?

It's like if I said Derek Boogaard is tougher than Mark Messier. Am I saying Messier is weak?

Some people here take any positive said about another team and instantly think the poster is saying the exact opposite about the wings.

And I don't need to calm down. I'm always calm. I'm just emphatic!

[Sergeiwasmyfav 0]

My bad, I wasn't directing that at you, just a general comment for those it applies to. There are others in this thread that claim we handed the ducks their asses, that's who those comments are meant for.

No problem, it's all good. I know we didn't dominate the Ducks by any means. We do need more toughness, but not just for the Ducks. I understand what you are saying in your posts. I just think people were really excited about the win and didn't want to think about the other implications of the game. I'm not saying you were wrong to bring them up b/c a truly versed fan notices all aspects of the game, not just the positive ones. But sometimes people just don't want to think about that stuff. Call it homerism, favoritism, rose-colored glasses, whatever you want, but I think it explains the backlash your post received. I don't agree with it, b/c I think you were accurate in everything you said except for the point about the broken stick.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

The next time we play them, we should load up our team with infamous goons, like at the end of Slapshot. We need Ogie Ogelthorpe!

[Still MIGHTY 0]

I'm so glad there are rational Wings fans out there.

It's restored my faith in your fan base.

Over a seven game series (go ahead call me a homer or look at it unbiased) I think the Ducks' play would wear on the Wings and the Ducks would win in 6 or 7. Almost every Ducks/Wings series from now on will probably be similar to last year's West Finals. Ducks or Wings in 6 or 7. I believe it would be the Ducks, and most of you would believe it would be the Wings. Thats how it goes, and how it will go.

[egroen 384]

Over a seven game series (go ahead call me a homer or look at it unbiased) I think the Ducks' play would wear on the Wings and the Ducks would win in 6 or 7.

I agree, if the Wings try to play the Duck's game.

Otherwise, I think the Ducks are in trouble. You take way too many penalties, your penalty kill is terribly inconsistent and you have next to no secondary scoring. Selanne will certainly help, but it is no guarantee he will be 100%.

I think the Wings lost the series because their power play was not able to capitalize (a few key PP guys out, as well), not because the Ducks wore them down.

Edited January 24, 2008 by egroen

[Dabura 12,232]

The bottom line is that we need more tougness on this team when we play Anaheim, because you know they're going to take advantage of the biggest asset they have over us.

Yep.

Like I said, Melrose was actually spot-on -- he just reiterated the point too many times because he's a jackass like that. The Wings squeaked away with two points here, and I'm glad they did, but a best-of-seven against this Ducks team (which will undoubtedly make at least one more reasonably significant acquisition) is going to be brutal, especially if we're down a few men.

A big, physical d-man is a must, and if we do pick up a winger, I hope he's a big guy (cough Hossa cough).

[esteef 2,679]

The next time we play them, we should load up our team with infamous goons, like at the end of Slapshot. We need Ogie Ogelthorpe!

As funny as that sounds, I would be fine if Kenny brought in a pure fighter for the playoff run, one that could play minutes that is. I mean, with all of this talk I keep hearing about we don't really NEED to add anything as far as scoring and defense are concerned, then isn't this the perfect setting (with cap space available) to bring in someone just to make us tougher? A lot of people said they'd be fine not adding anything at the deadline so why not take a shot and add someone with some soupbones for fists!

esteef

[Lidsyukerberg 0]

Everybodys talking about how hard it is to play against a team thats looking to run you all the time, but nobodys pointing out how it is almost equally tiring to play aggressively night in and night out. Detroit lost to Anaheim because, if you remember correctly, their PP crapped out. When their PP was firing on all cylinders, they blew out Anaheim. You can talk all you want about how Detroit will be toast against big bodies, but the bruise brother fans never seem to point out that it can kill a team when they have to chase a puck possession team around all night, especially when you commit to the hit when youve finally caught up with the puck and its possessor. Theres a positive and negative to both types of play.

Ill take solace in the fact that its going to be a lot easier for Detroit to add size and grit to its roster at the deadline than it wil be for Anaheim to afford taking on a key top 6 forward.

Good point, great argument. Thank you.

How do we know we are going to even play Anaheim in the playoffs? A first round match-up is highly unlikely barring a major collapse on one of the team's parts. Who knows, Anaheim might get upset in the first round (personally, I would like nothing better), and as we know all too well, the Wings could too. I don't think it would make sense for the Wings to structure their team around beating one team in the league that we may never even need to face to win the Cup. I would like to see the Wings get a little bit tougher for the playoffs b/c, in general, the playoffs see an increase in physical play. However, I don't think this has to be done strictly b/c of Anaheim. We need to, most likely, get through at least the first round before we would even see them in the playoffs. I think the focus should be on getting the team ready for the playoffs as a whole, not on getting them ready for one team they may not even play.

I thought the Wings did well last night all things considered. The argument about the broken stick is pointless in my opinion, b/c, as others have pointed out, many times playoff games are decided by one goal scored in a very weird way. Did the Wings get a little bit lucky? Sure. But that's how hockey goes. There's no need to use that goal to take away from the win. I don't disagree with people who say we need more toughness, b/c I think we do too. I just don't think the focus should be all about Anaheim.

This is a good point as well, but I don't think we need to beef up for Anaheim, I think we need to beef up a little for every team who is going to try to use physical play to try and wear us down. I in know way think we need to become a physical team, just that we need a little more physical presence. Just a dab will do it. I think that our style of play is unmatched in the league and I would never suggest changing that. But, other teams know that and instead of trying to match us in puck handling they will just knock us off the puck and wear us down. We just need one or two more tough guys to make a statement that, if teams want to get physical we're happy to oblige. But when it comes down to hockey, our boys will outclass the best of them, and I think that is the game we need to stick with, we just need some physical play up front to allow for our puck handlers to do their thing without having to look over their shoulders so much.

Let the Wings play their game, just give them some protection while they do it.

[wingslogo19 281]

At the end there, it goes something like Downey is there only fighter.. .. Oh well the better team skated away with the big 2 points

[Zion 93]

There is a lot of stupid s*** being said here.

The broken stick argument is about as credible as the bounce off of Lidstrom's stick in Game 5 of the WCF. It happens.

Once again, the Western Conference will be decided by these two teams. Pretty hard to bet against that at this point. I can't wait to see what these teams do at the trade deadline, especially if Teemu comes back.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

As funny as that sounds, I would be fine if Kenny brought in a pure fighter for the playoff run, one that could play minutes that is. I mean, with all of this talk I keep hearing about we don't really NEED to add anything as far as scoring and defense are concerned, then isn't this the perfect setting (with cap space available) to bring in someone just to make us tougher? A lot of people said they'd be fine not adding anything at the deadline so why not take a shot and add someone with some soupbones for fists!

esteef

what would this team look like if we replaced Drake with Jamal Mayers, Downey with Chris Neil and Lilja with Jason Smith.

Ohhh, I just had an accident in my pants...

[esteef 2,679]

what would this team look like if we replaced Drake with Jamal Mayers, Downey with Chris Neil and Lilja with Jason Smith.

Ohhh, I just had an accident in my pants...

Mayers would be enough for me.

[egroen 384]

I would literally kidnap Mayers and drive him to Holland in the trunk of my car if it would help

[Wings_Dynasty 267]

Gratton, Neil, Forsberg. Done.

[Nev 1,085]

what would this team look like if we replaced Drake Samuelsson with Jamal Mayers, Downey Hudler with Chris Neil and Lilja Lebda with Jason Smith.

Ohhh, I just had an accident in my pants...

Fixed. Now that's a line-up I'd be happy with going into the playoffs

But yeah, I'd be content just to swap Samuelsson for Mayers.

[Lidsyukerberg 0]

I would literally kidnap Mayers and drive him to Holland in the trunk of my car if it would help

Awesome, let us know how that works out for you.

egroen?...egroen?....

Oh know, Mayers got egroen!

Just kidding

[Guest octopusdank]

man i love these forums. such great analyzations, keep up the good work guys!! i learn so much from these boards

[Dominator2005 558]

You're missing the point entirely.

People are saying we handed the Ducks their asses. What i'm saying is that's bulls***. We didn't hand anybody their asses. We scored a 5 on 3 goal and a goal off a broken stick. Is that how we measure handing somebody their ass? I reiterate, let's get some perspective people.

And regarding clearly. The point, which you missed, is that we don't have enough toughness. The point is that Dan Cleary having to go toe to toe with a guy who clearly outmatches him is not my idea of a tactically good strategy. Yes, it's always good to get Pronger off the ice. But, I don't think having our valuable, non-fighters going head to head against 6-6 guys who can fight is a good plan. And what happened? We lost Danny for the game and Pronger was fine and came back to score a goal.

If we were tougher maybe a Jamal Mayers would be a better trade off to fight Pronger is what i'm saying. We don't need nor should we want our guys going toe to toe with Anaheim.

Downey is a different story, I don't care who he fights, its all good.

If we have to match up against them are we going to be able to keep up that style for a series? They outsize us, they're stronger than us, they hit with more emphasis and they can outfight us.

The whole point was that we didn't hand their asses to them. And no, I don't try to be different. I try to be reasonable in a sea of homer bulls*** that seems to plague the board whenever we're on a roll.

I've seen this team be on a roll too many times to just think everything is fine and dandy. I don't watch the games just to see how great we are and toot our own horn. I look for weaknesses that another team can exploit so I don't have delusions of grandeur about how good we are or how great we match up to someone or how we handed somebody their ass in a 2-1 game where we got one goal on a 5 on 3 and another off a lucky break. 5 on 3's and a broken stick are not handing somebody their ass. Now, what Montreal did to Boston the other day, that's handing somebody their ass. Perspective!

I agree 100%

Detroit should:

trade Hudler for Malone... (we have two similar players in Filppula and Hudler - I would rather keep Valtteri than Jiri)

try to go after Vandermeer, Lebda + late draft pick (Flyers gave Eager for Vandermeer...)

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Homer

Cleary - Filppula - Malone

Maltby - Draper - Downey

Sammy - Franzen - Drake/Kopecky

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Kronwall - Vandermeer

Chelios - Lilja

Hasek/Ozzy

I know people would like to have Neil - he's not going anywhere...

With today's roster we are not going to WIN against Anaheim IN PLAYOFF. This is GREAT REGULAR SEASON TEAM - BUT NOT PLAYOFF TEAM.

[ashenhigh 9]

I still think at the deadline the most important deal we need to make is adding a couple head hunters, along with downie, to add some more grit and physical play. Even if its only for the serious with the ducks. We wont last 7 games of getting tossed around.

[Kira 451]

The best revenge, and the final one, is the scoreboard. This night, we had more goals than they did. That's all that matters.

[Dominator2005 558]

what would this team look like if we replaced Drake with Jamal Mayers, Downey with Chris Neil and Lilja with Jason Smith.

Ohhh, I just had an accident in my pants...

we can also add Lebda for Komisarek!!!

[drwscc 212]

And Rafalski for Chara, straight up.

[Mudvayneowns91 0]

The best revenge, and the final one, is the scoreboard. This night, we had more goals than they did. That's all that matters.

I agree with you if looking at a one game scenario. I don't know if we'd have similar success in a best of 7 if we "took a beating" like the topic says. A lot of wear and tear can happen to us. I just hope come playoff time we can dish out as much physical play as the Duckies do, if we play them that is.

Edited January 24, 2008 by Mudvayneowns91