GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 I figured it was that way with a specific few, but now it seems like the whole forum (besides those of us who post regularly in the fight thread) are against having any sort of player like that. It's gotten much worse. And I hate how everyone brings in this "new NHL" excuse. They make it sound like the new NHL consists of teams rolling 4 lines of all-stars, leaving no room for enforcers. I guarantee you the Wings record wouldn't be any worse than it is if our 4th line had another enforcer on it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingsrock34 0 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 my money is on Martin Lapointe he's the kind of forward I would like to see on the team, not necessarily him but the style of play. He is averaging about 5 1/2 min. a game...and that's just under what Downey or Matt Ellis play so i doubt he's happy about that considering he has an "A" on his chest. He is also a UFA after this year so it's not like the 'Hawks could ask for much. Also on the topic of trades with the 'Hawks, I said it before and I'll say it again I'm freakin' pissed we did not get Jim Vandermeer. He was 100% what we neded as a physical D-man. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 my money is on Martin Lapointe he's the kind of forward I would like to see on the team, not necessarily him but the style of play. He is averaging about 5 1/2 min. a game...and that's just under what Downey or Matt Ellis play so i doubt he's happy about that considering he has an "A" on his chest. He is also a UFA after this year so it's not like the 'Hawks could ask for much. Also on the topic of trades with the 'Hawks, I said it before and I'll say it again I'm freakin' pissed we did not get Jim Vandermeer. He was 100% what we neded as a physical D-man. Lapointe has done nothing for the hawks this year. Granted, as I've posted before we have some 4th liners who aren't putting up stats either, but he's not my ideal deadline acquisition. I agree with you on Vandermeer, though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
up2here 41 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 my money is on Martin Lapointe he's the kind of forward I would like to see on the team, not necessarily him but the style of play. He is averaging about 5 1/2 min. a game...and that's just under what Downey or Matt Ellis play so i doubt he's happy about that considering he has an "A" on his chest. He is also a UFA after this year so it's not like the 'Hawks could ask for much. Also on the topic of trades with the 'Hawks, I said it before and I'll say it again I'm freakin' pissed we did not get Jim Vandermeer. He was 100% what we neded as a physical D-man. Ever watch Vandermeer skate? It looks like the ice is made of molasses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingsrock34 0 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Ever watch Vandermeer skate? It looks like the ice is made of molasses. That may be true but you are not going to find an All-Star perfect d-man that hits like Phaneuf, plays angles like Lidstrom, and skates like Lebda. It's just not going to happen, so you get a guy who might have sub-par skating but well above average physical play. he's a stay at home d-man. It's not like he's going to be rushing up the ice and getting caught out of position. And the classic line: he's better than Lilja. I think he's only making 500,000 more or so then Lilja Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingsrock34 0 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Lapointe has done nothing for the hawks this year. Granted, as I've posted before we have some 4th liners who aren't putting up stats either, but he's not my ideal deadline acquisition. I agree with you on Vandermeer, though. I have not seen as many games as last year, so is it a case of Lapointe playing bad or the fact that he's not getting the ice time to play? you know that whole player and coach ice time catch-22 argument. I'd also bring up that Yzerman even said its not easy to lead from the bench (not that I'm comparing the two), when his ice time was low. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bannedforlife 403 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 I figured it was that way with a specific few, but now it seems like the whole forum (besides those of us who post regularly in the fight thread) are against having any sort of player like that. It's gotten much worse. It's not that the people on this forum are against that sort of thing, it's just that we're tired of hearing you guys ***** about it ALL THE TIME. Of course we all want 4 lines full of great big, tough, physical Canadians, ***** who crash and bang and fight and can skate and chip in offensively and still be responsible in their own end, but guess what? There aren't enough guys out there for every team in the league to have one or two. Christ, there aren't even enough of them for half the league to have ONE! If you can name 30 guys currently playing in the NHL that fit the bill of what you're looking for, then I'll shut the hell up. Otherwise, give it a rest already. (oh, and they have to be willing to play for peanuts, because heaven forbid we ever give up Zetterberg or Datsyuk or Lidstrom or Filppula or Hudler or Cleary or Rafalski or anyone else that is the exact opposite of what you claim to really want) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yemack 1 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 why does every thread turn into ***** fest about 'we need big tough player'? how about some respect and class among us? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yemack 1 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 as for the scout, my first guess was fedorov but it coulda have been anybody or maybe we were scouting our potential 1st round opponent Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoogs 8 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Feds and Lang!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lou_Siffer 1 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 (edited) I guarantee guaransheed it was for Fedorov. He fits the criteria of what the Wings will end up with perfectly. Underachieving older guy with name value, who wont cost very much as the interest level will not be high amongst other teams. And of course...theres the former Wing thing as well. I bet they'll strike this deal rather early on deadline day, before the teams that miss out on Sundin, Hossa, and the other premier guys available look at Fedorov as their last resort. EDIT - obvious reason Edited January 26, 2008 by Lou_Siffer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Pred 48 337 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Feds didn't play thou Lou! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lou_Siffer 1 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Feds didn't play thou Lou! umm....hmmm....oops lol. However, i still guarantee he's the guy we're going to get. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Feds didn't play thou Lou! Haha Lou man your theory just got toasted! Seriously though, Id put my money on Foote. I'm betting everybody already forgot about this, but Detroit was actually NOT supposed to go with this defensive lineup. They were saying all through the off-season that they wanted a physical top 4, but couldnt find any Dman that would sign short term. Im guessing they still want that physical Dman and Im sure they know they need it. Foote fits the bill.. (or does he foot it?) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
betterREDthandead 58 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Again - I think it's hilarious that you all think they were scouting trade possibilities. You do know the Wings have game scouts who watch the other teams for tendencies, weaknesses, strengths, in order to formulate a game plan. Right? We have a combined eight games left against CHI and CLS, which is a hefty chunk of the schedule. It's silly to try and turn this into a trade rumor. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kp-Wings 3 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 (edited) It's not that the people on this forum are against that sort of thing, it's just that we're tired of hearing you guys ***** about it ALL THE TIME. Of course we all want 4 lines full of great big, tough, physical Canadians, ***** who crash and bang and fight and can skate and chip in offensivelyand still be responsible in their own end, but guess what? There aren't enough guys out there for every team in the league to have one or two. Christ, there aren't even enough of them for half the league to have ONE! If you can name 30 guys currently playing in the NHL that fit the bill of what you're looking for, then I'll shut the hell up. Otherwise, give it a rest already. (oh, and they have to be willing to play for peanuts, because heaven forbid we ever give up Zetterberg or Datsyuk or Lidstrom or Filppula or Hudler or Cleary or Rafalski or anyone else that is the exact opposite of what you claim to really want) Why is this always the breaking point with people? If the guy doesn't put up points, he all of a sudden doesn't have a place on this team. You can't tell me guys like Kopecky, Drake, Lilja, etc. put up decent points offensivily. They don't. I still don't see why that's always the roadblock with people here when enforcers are involved: if he's not a 20 goal scorer, he has no place on this team. Yet, at the same time, people are clamoring for useless players like Kopecky to be the new 2nd line center. I don't get it. ...and besides that, find wherever I said we need tough guys to be goal scorers at the same time. I never said that. It would be nice, but when I look at the current makeup of this team, with guys like Kopecky and Drake up front who contribute little to absolutley nothing, a tough in general who doesn't score would be fine with me. Heck, it would be great to have a heavyweight on this team from a fight fan perspective, since it's been a good 10 years or so since we've had one. Like someone else said: if the Wings had a full time tough guy, this teams record would be no worse than it already is. Unlike what everyone around here tries to say, enforcers do not destroy teams. Considering the useless dead weight this team has up front on the 3rd/4th lines, I don't see how having a tough guy would hurt them. At least the said tough guy would contribute something, where as players like those of whom I already mentioned are only there to take up space. Edited January 26, 2008 by Kp-Wings Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
up2here 41 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 That may be true but you are not going to find an All-Star perfect d-man that hits like Phaneuf, plays angles like Lidstrom, and skates like Lebda. It's just not going to happen, so you get a guy who might have sub-par skating but well above average physical play. he's a stay at home d-man. It's not like he's going to be rushing up the ice and getting caught out of position. And the classic line: he's better than Lilja. I think he's only making 500,000 more or so then Lilja Youre right about all those things but our system requires that players be good skaters above all else. Say what you want about Lilja but he is an above average skater. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Why is this always the breaking point with people? If the guy doesn't put up points, he all of a sudden doesn't have a place on this team. You can't tell me guys like Kopecky, Drake, Lilja, etc. put up decent points offensivily. They don't. I still don't see why that's always the roadblock with people here when enforcers are involved: if he's not a 20 goal scorer, he has no place on this team. Yet, at the same time, people are clamoring for useless players like Kopecky to be the new 2nd line center. I don't get it. ...and besides that, find wherever I said we need tough guys to be goal scorers at the same time. I never said that. It would be nice, but when I look at the current makeup of this team, with guys like Kopecky and Drake up front who contribute little to absolutley nothing, a tough in general who doesn't score would be fine with me. Heck, it would be great to have a heavyweight on this team from a fight fan perspective, since it's been a good 10 years or so since we've had one. Like someone else said: if the Wings had a full time tough guy, this teams record would be no worse than it already is. Unlike what everyone around here tries to say, enforcers do not destroy teams. Considering the useless dead weight this team has up front on the 3rd/4th lines, I don't see how having a tough guy would hurt them. At least the said tough guy would contribute something, where as players like those of whom I already mentioned are only there to take up space. Most Wings fans have been cultured into having a soft team with no enforcers, because that's what we've had for the longest time. When this team started loading up on Hall of Famers, the winning immunized everyone from complaining about the enforcer position. People are just used to it by now, and they'll always have justifications for Holland's philosophy. For instance, most Flyers fans have been so used to having a tough team, that in the past when they lost a bit of tougness, they complained about it and couldn't stand that fact even though they still had a tougher lineup than most teams in the league. I just wish people would understand that having a couple of tough guys on the 4th line isn't going to change the puck possession style that the top liners play. In fact, it won't change anything, since our 4th line still gets minimal minutes each night. Nobody's counting on those guys to score anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
betterREDthandead 58 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Why is this always the breaking point with people? If the guy doesn't put up points, he all of a sudden doesn't have a place on this team. You can't tell me guys like Kopecky, Drake, Lilja, etc. put up decent points offensivily. They don't. I still don't see why that's always the roadblock with people here when enforcers are involved: if he's not a 20 goal scorer, he has no place on this team. Yet, at the same time, people are clamoring for useless players like Kopecky to be the new 2nd line center. I don't get it. ...and besides that, find wherever I said we need tough guys to be goal scorers at the same time. I never said that. It would be nice, but when I look at the current makeup of this team, with guys like Kopecky and Drake up front who contribute little to absolutley nothing, a tough in general who doesn't score would be fine with me. Heck, it would be great to have a heavyweight on this team from a fight fan perspective, since it's been a good 10 years or so since we've had one. Like someone else said: if the Wings had a full time tough guy, this teams record would be no worse than it already is. Unlike what everyone around here tries to say, enforcers do not destroy teams. Considering the useless dead weight this team has up front on the 3rd/4th lines, I don't see how having a tough guy would hurt them. At least the said tough guy would contribute something, where as players like those of whom I already mentioned are only there to take up space. Downey and Drake are here to do something other than fight? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Again - I think it's hilarious that you all think they were scouting trade possibilities. You do know the Wings have game scouts who watch the other teams for tendencies, weaknesses, strengths, in order to formulate a game plan. Right? We have a combined eight games left against CHI and CLS, which is a hefty chunk of the schedule. It's silly to try and turn this into a trade rumor. Yeah its crazy to think that the Wings would be thinking about trade possibilities with the trade deadline only 4 weeks away! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
betterREDthandead 58 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Yeah its crazy to think that the Wings would be thinking about trade possibilities with the trade deadline only 4 weeks away! Within the division, and with teams that are in the middle of a heated race for playoff berths? Columbus is tied with Colorado for 8th. They've never made the playoffs. If they can even sniff a playoff run, they're likely to do whatever it takes to get there. Columbus will be a buyer, not a seller. What's crazy is to assume that every single time a scout takes in a game, they're automatically looking for trade possibilities. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted January 26, 2008 Downey and Drake are here to do something other than fight? Downey and Drake aren't the best fighters out there, and not exactly the youngest ones either. Nothing says we can't try to improve our toughness. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bannedforlife 403 Report post Posted January 27, 2008 Why is this always the breaking point with people? If the guy doesn't put up points, he all of a sudden doesn't have a place on this team. You can't tell me guys like Kopecky, Drake, Lilja, etc. put up decent points offensivily. They don't. I still don't see why that's always the roadblock with people here when enforcers are involved: if he's not a 20 goal scorer, he has no place on this team. Yet, at the same time, people are clamoring for useless players like Kopecky to be the new 2nd line center. I don't get it. ...and besides that, find wherever I said we need tough guys to be goal scorers at the same time. I never said that. It would be nice, but when I look at the current makeup of this team, with guys like Kopecky and Drake up front who contribute little to absolutley nothing, a tough in general who doesn't score would be fine with me. Heck, it would be great to have a heavyweight on this team from a fight fan perspective, since it's been a good 10 years or so since we've had one. Like someone else said: if the Wings had a full time tough guy, this teams record would be no worse than it already is. Unlike what everyone around here tries to say, enforcers do not destroy teams. Considering the useless dead weight this team has up front on the 3rd/4th lines, I don't see how having a tough guy would hurt them. At least the said tough guy would contribute something, where as players like those of whom I already mentioned are only there to take up space. Like I said, name 30 guys currently playing in the NHL that fit the bill of what you're looking for and I'll leave it alone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
up2here 41 Report post Posted January 27, 2008 (edited) Within the division, and with teams that are in the middle of a heated race for playoff berths? Columbus is tied with Colorado for 8th. They've never made the playoffs. If they can even sniff a playoff run, they're likely to do whatever it takes to get there. Columbus will be a buyer, not a seller. What's crazy is to assume that every single time a scout takes in a game, they're automatically looking for trade possibilities. I think the key here is that the trade deadline is only a month away. They very well could be there to scout tendancies but what fun would that be? A good deal of hockey experts beleive those scouts were there for trade possibilities or they just want people to beleive it, either way its more entertaining discussing trades. Edited January 27, 2008 by UP2HERE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
