2008 NASCAR Thread

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

I'm kind of new to this whole following NASCAR closely thing.

Then you have an excuse to ditch Robbie Gordan as your favorite . I know my favorite sucks too, but he was good when I started liking him in the mid 90's. Why do you like R. Gordan?

I was hoping after that caution there would be a great finish between JR, and Edwards, but Edwards had a great car.

[betterREDthandead 58]

Then you have an excuse to ditch Robbie Gordan as your favorite . I know my favorite sucks too, but he was good when I started liking him in the mid 90's. Why do you like R. Gordan?

Speaking of rooting interests that aren't good now, never were, and never will be, aren't you a Lions fan?

Why Robby Gordon? 'Cause he's the last independent owner-driver in NASCAR. I dig that. And he'll race anywhere he can get a race, be it NASCAR, open wheel, even the Dakar rally. And his racing style is very boom-or-bust. One of the few drivers who can appear in someone else's rearview mirror and make them go "ah s***." Gotta get away from #7 before he wrecks us both. Did I mention the independent thing? I really think that's awesome.

Not to worry though. Robby Gordon's not the only one I'm rooting for these days. I also found myself pulling for the Penske drivers - Busch, Newman, and this year, Hornish. (I think it's hilarious that a driver named Busch drives the Miller Lite car.) Penske's a huge booster of Detroit, so I want his cars to do well. But in that case, I don't really care who the drivers are, specifically....just the owner.

P.S. - it's not all bad, pulling for Gordon. 8th at Daytona - not too shabby

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Speaking of rooting interests that aren't good now, never were, and never will be, aren't you a Lions fan?

Probably add U-M basketball to that list too

Interesting why you like Gordan.....being independent is a big time disadvantage.

[Packer487 3]

Interesting why you like Gordan.....being independent is a big time disadvantage.

It was really smart of him to align his team with Gillette Evernham. That's probably going to pay off, even if the switch to Dodge might have cost him 100 points b/c of that penalty.

He almost ran me over on Belle Isle like 15 years ago. That dude absolutely FLIES through the paddock on his motorscooter.

Nascar is VERY inconsistent with the penalties that they apply. They kicked Harvick out of a Cup race because of rough driving in the Truck series, but guys like Jarrett and Robby Gordon have (admittedly) intentionally wrecked other drivers and nothing happens. The Jarrett one was the worst. I forget who he got into it with at Richmond two years ago, but he intentionally wrecked him and it took Harvick (and maybe Ryan Newman?) out of the race, and ended Harvick's chances to make the Chase. Even though it was clearly intentional, Nascar penalized Jarrett five laps. Too bad he was 15 laps behind the car in front of him and 10 laps ahead of the car behind him so it was NO penalty whatsoever. They really don't make sense sometimes.

I'm excited about Harvick's start. He hasn't really been in contention for any wins yet, but last year when the car was bad they'd get like 20-25th place finishes out of it. This year so far, he's managed to get top 10s. And I don't think his car was very good at Daytona or California. It's a nice change.

[Guest Jeremy88]

today i realized i've become a jimmie johnson fan

somebody help me

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

today i realized i've become a jimmie johnson fan

somebody help me

So you're coming out of the closet today too?

I love to hate JJ. He's a good guy, and a great driver, but I'm just not fond of him.....

[Guest Jeremy88]

So you're coming out of the closet today too?

I love to hate JJ. He's a good guy, and a great driver, but I'm just not fond of him.....

I've always respected him...cuz he's a great driver..he has great dedication, and he's a great face for nascar. but i've always been a mix. like, i hate him but i like him. now i don't hate him anymore.

[betterREDthandead 58]

Rooting for Jeff Gordon and Jimmie Johnson is like rooting for the Yankees and Red Sox, only they're on the same team.

Plus the 24 is still one of the ugliest cars on the circuit, and the 5 is even worse.

It's cool that they race Chevys and all - anything but a Toyota - but Hendrick is too much of a superteam, I just can't pull for them.

[Guest Jeremy88]

Rooting for Jeff Gordon and Jimmie Johnson is like rooting for the Yankees and Red Sox, only they're on the same team.

Plus the 24 is still one of the ugliest cars on the circuit, and the 5 is even worse.

It's cool that they race Chevys and all - anything but a Toyota - but Hendrick is too much of a superteam, I just can't pull for them.

I love Gordon's car...especially his Pepsi schemes, I think those are some of the coolest cars to be raced in nascar.

And ever since Jr went to Hendrick...well, he's always been my favorite.

It sucks having multiple drivers you like. Jr, Stewart, Johnson...

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Rooting for Jeff Gordon and Jimmie Johnson is like rooting for the Yankees and Red Sox, only they're on the same team.

Plus the 24 is still one of the ugliest cars on the circuit, and the 5 is even worse.

It's cool that they race Chevys and all - anything but a Toyota - but Hendrick is too much of a superteam, I just can't pull for them.

You are right on about that, except I don't think Gordon's car is ugly. It's way better then his rainbow car!

[Guest Jeremy88]

You are right on about that, except I don't think Gordon's car is ugly. It's way better then his rainbow car!

I wish Jeff would run a retro rainbow paint scheme...that'd be sweet.

[betterREDthandead 58]

Pleased to see that Robby Gordon was given back his points from the appeal. Interesting that they hit Carl Edwards with the exact same penalty for the oil cap.

[mannysBETTER3434 1]

Pleased to see that Robby Gordon was given back his points from the appeal. Interesting that they hit Carl Edwards with the exact same penalty for the oil cap.

That oil cap thing is stupid! It doesn't help the car performance, and could give the driver serious heath problems. I don't understand how they think that is cheating........

[Guest Jeremy88]

That oil cap thing is stupid! It doesn't help the car performance, and could give the driver serious heath problems. I don't understand how they think that is cheating........

Apparantly is added downforce

[Sting 11 0]

That oil cap thing is stupid! It doesn't help the car performance, and could give the driver serious heath problems. I don't understand how they think that is cheating........

From what I understand, it wasn't actually the oil cap missing, but the cover on the box that houses the oil tank that was missing...it's a tank within a box, and the box's cover was gone. It is said that without this cover airflow under the car changes, increasing downforce.

[Guest Jeremy88]

Kyle Busch wins at atlanta, Toyota gets their first win in the cup series.

[timothy1997 0]

Kyle Busch wins at atlanta, Toyota gets their first win in the cup series.

Kyle Busch is absolutely dominating this year. The question I have is can he keep it up. I think he has a lot of promise but don't think he is quite there yet.

[Guest Jeremy88]

Kyle Busch is absolutely dominating this year. The question I have is can he keep it up. I think he has a lot of promise but don't think he is quite there yet.

He's too aggressive. He had the race won on the last lap, but instead nearly wrecked himself and Dale Jarrett. That kind of aggression is really gonna keep him from being a champion. Like DW always says...he needs to learn how to be less aggressive if he's ever gonna seriously contend for a championship.

[Packer487 3]

What Stewart said about the tires today was absolutely absurd. I can understand criticizing the tires for a single race. Junior and Gordon both agreed that the tires were junk today. But to say that Hoosier or Firestone could do a better job, that they got out of the other series because they can't build a decent racing tire, and that Nascar should open it up to competition is idiotic.

How many guys actually wrecked today that weren't named Elliot Sadler? I can think of Kahne wrecking and that's really about it. How many tires blew? None?

See, the problem with opening it up to competition is that the tire companies stop worrying about safety and worry more about speed. Does Stewart not remember what happened when Hoosier entered Nascar back in the mid 90s? Talk to Neil Bonnett and Rodney Orr about how well that worked out.

Goodyear has had issues in some of the other series, but how many Nascar races in recent memory have really had tire problems? Maybe Goodyear did go too conservative this week, but it's rare that they have major issues. And if anyone has problems with tires blowing, people are a lot MORE pissed off because that's dangerous.

I guess Tony needed to find something to really ***** about. It had been a couple of weeks.

[Guest Jeremy88]

What Stewart said about the tires today was absolutely absurd. I can understand criticizing the tires for a single race. Junior and Gordon both agreed that the tires were junk today. But to say that Hoosier or Firestone could do a better job, that they got out of the other series because they can't build a decent racing tire, and that Nascar should open it up to competition is idiotic.

How many guys actually wrecked today that weren't named Elliot Sadler? I can think of Kahne wrecking and that's really about it. How many tires blew? None?

See, the problem with opening it up to competition is that the tire companies stop worrying about safety and worry more about speed. Does Stewart not remember what happened when Hoosier entered Nascar back in the mid 90s? Talk to Neil Bonnett and Rodney Orr about how well that worked out.

Goodyear has had issues in some of the other series, but how many Nascar races in recent memory have really had tire problems? Maybe Goodyear did go too conservative this week, but it's rare that they have major issues. And if anyone has problems with tires blowing, people are a lot MORE pissed off because that's dangerous.

I guess Tony needed to find something to really ***** about. It had been a couple of weeks.

Your comments are idiotic. As a 2 time champion, Tony Stewart has every right to tell it how he sees it. I'm disappointed in Goodyear for providing such a crappy tire for the race. The cars had such little grip, nobody could race...for once, Nascar was 43 guys driving in circles. Like Dale Jr said, if someone tried to pass you, you had no choice, you had to let them go...because if you raced them, you were putting yourself in jeapordy of wrecking.

Nascar should open it up to competition. I'm sick and tired of companies getting exclusive rights for things. If Goodyear can provide a good tire, then they shouldn't worry about competitors. In the post race press conference, Dale Jr said "You don't blow a tire out because of a faulty tire...you blow it out 'cause you're running it so hard."

The race was boring. The only reason I watched it was 'cause Jr was around the front the whole race. Drivers don't want to race on tires with no grip...fans don't want to watch a race where nobody can race.

Safety...tires blowing aren't cuz of bad tires...and what's more dangerous? A couple of blown tires or every car on the verge of spinning out and wrecking every lap? The only reason these drivers (other than Sadler and Kahne) didn't wreck is because A) They were extremely conservative...they weren't racing, they were just trying to survive, and B) They're some of the best drivers in the world.

Oh, and the reason Stewart is "bitching" is because A) He's begging Goodyear to not do this again, B) Because somebody has to, and C) Because he's Tony f**kin Stewart...he can say whatever he wants...his 2 Championships give him that right.

[Packer487 3]

Your comments are idiotic. As a 2 time champion, Tony Stewart has every right to tell it how he sees it. I'm disappointed in Goodyear for providing such a crappy tire for the race. The cars had such little grip, nobody could race...for once, Nascar was 43 guys driving in circles. Like Dale Jr said, if someone tried to pass you, you had no choice, you had to let them go...because if you raced them, you were putting yourself in jeapordy of wrecking.

I don't deny that he's earned the right to be a strong voice in this series. Stewart's biggest problem, though, is that he goes WAY overboard regularly. I don't have a problem with him criticizing the tire. I have no problem with what Junior said. I have no problem with what Jeff Gordon said. But to say that Goodyear can't produce a racing tire worth a crap and that Hoosier could do better? That's way out of line. Goodyear has been the sole supplier of tires for almost a decade and a half, and there haven't really been all that many races with major tire problems. By and large, Goodyear does a great job in Nascar. You said it yourself. "For one Nascar was 43 guys driving in circles". Goodyear bringing a bad tire to the track is a very rare occasion.

People need to remember, this car is still new to everyone...not just the teams and drivers. The COT on its own has proven to be a handful thusfar, so I'm not sure it's even fair to blame everything on the tire Goodyear brought. It most definitely contributed to the problems today, but it ain't like these things handle real well as it is. Carl Edwards had a car that was on rails for a lot of the race, and he had no real problems with the tire from what I heard.

Nascar should open it up to competition. I'm sick and tired of companies getting exclusive rights for things. If Goodyear can provide a good tire, then they shouldn't worry about competitors. In the post race press conference, Dale Jr said "You don't blow a tire out because of a faulty tire...you blow it out 'cause you're running it so hard."

Do you remember what happened the last time Nascar had a tire competition? It was a disaster and people died. With no competition, Goodyear can focus on providing a fast, safe tire. And a very very high percentage of the time they succeed. Today they failed, but they failed because they were trying to bring a tire that wouldn't explode and they went too conservative. Again, unless I'm mistaken, this was the first time this car raced at Atlanta which was (at least previously--don't know if it still is) the fastest track in the series, with a lot of it being corners and putting a heavy load on the right side tires.

When there's a tire competition, the companies have to worry more about speed. With no competitor, every team is on equal footing and Goodyear can bring the fastest safe tire that they can come up with.

When did Goodyear have their problems in CART? When they were battling with Firestone. Since then, have there been any major problems with Firestone being the sole supplier? Not that I can recall. When you have tire wars, you get things like this. Do you think there's any way that incident happens if F1 has a single tire supplier? I sure don't.

Safety...tires blowing aren't cuz of bad tires...and what's more dangerous? A couple of blown tires or every car on the verge of spinning out and wrecking every lap? The only reason these drivers (other than Sadler and Kahne) didn't wreck is because A) They were extremely conservative...they weren't racing, they were just trying to survive, and B) They're some of the best drivers in the world.

You're kidding right? A couple of blown tires are a LOT more dangerous. If you blow a tire, a good amount of the time you're going into the wall at a severe angle and it's not going to be pleasant. To the best of my knowledge (and I was flipping with the Wings game) Sadler was the only one that even hit the wall in a wreck today and he just touched it.

It wasn't entertaining, but I'm sure Goodyear knows that they stuffed up and they'll do better next time. They don't need Tony Stewart telling them that they can't build a racing tire for anything and that they should get out of the series. That's completely out of line.

Oh, and the reason Stewart is "bitching" is because A) He's begging Goodyear to not do this again, B) Because somebody has to, and C) Because he's Tony f**kin Stewart...he can say whatever he wants...his 2 Championships give him that right.

Saying what Junior said would've been sufficient. Saying what Gordon said would've been sufficient. Saying what Stewart said--but behind closed doors with Goodyear--would been sufficient. I understand that with Dale Sr. gone, someone needs to step up and be the voice. And with Stewart, Gordon and Junior all saying the tire was junk, that's enough to make me believe that the tire was junk. But don't try to tell me that it was necessary to go as far as Stewart did.

By and large, Goodyear does a great job in Nascar. There have been very few incidents since Hoosier got out of the series. The vast majority of races have a tire that provides great competition and is as safe as it can possibly be. One bad race doesn't change that--especially since no one even really wrecked. Boring? Sure. But we've seen boring races due to the aero package Nascar came up with as well. It doesn't mean the sanctioning body should step aside.

The tires today were probably third in the "least safe" things that have happened over the past 3 races alone (driving with the wet track in California, no SAFER barrier + the opening in the inside wall at Vegas).

I fail to see how a race like this warranted the reaction Stewart had. If the integrity of the tire kept failing? Sure. If this becomes an ongoing problem and Goodyear won't listen? Sure. But a bad race with a new car on an extremely fast track where NO ONE WRECKED and suddenly Goodyear should get out of the series? C'mon.

There's a classy way to make a point (Junior, Gordon) and then there's saying what Stewart said. Par for the course, I guess. It's not like I should expect anything more out of him. I'm not sure why Stewart cares about being able to race anyway, since Nascar just fixes races, right? ****** bag.

Edited March 10, 2008 by Packer487

[Guest Jeremy88]

I don't deny that he's earned the right to be a strong voice in this series. Stewart's biggest problem, though, is that he goes WAY overboard regularly. I don't have a problem with him criticizing the tire. I have no problem with what Junior said. I have no problem with what Jeff Gordon said. But to say that Goodyear can't produce a racing tire worth a crap and that Hoosier could do better? That's way out of line. Goodyear has been the sole supplier of tires for almost a decade and a half, and there haven't really been all that many races with major tire problems. By and large, Goodyear does a great job in Nascar. You said it yourself. "For one Nascar was 43 guys driving in circles". Goodyear bringing a bad tire to the track is a very rare occasion.

People need to remember, this car is still new to everyone...not just the teams and drivers. The COT on its own has proven to be a handful thusfar, so I'm not sure it's even fair to blame everything on the tire Goodyear brought. It most definitely contributed to the problems today, but it ain't like these things handle real well as it is. Carl Edwards had a car that was on rails for a lot of the race, and he had no real problems with the tire from what I heard.

Do you remember what happened the last time Nascar had a tire competition? It was a disaster and people died. With no competition, Goodyear can focus on providing a fast, safe tire. And a very very high percentage of the time they succeed. Today they failed, but they failed because they were trying to bring a tire that wouldn't explode and they went too conservative. Again, unless I'm mistaken, this was the first time this car raced at Atlanta which was (at least previously--don't know if it still is) the fastest track in the series, with a lot of it being corners and putting a heavy load on the right side tires.

When there's a tire competition, the companies have to worry more about speed. With no competitor, every team is on equal footing and Goodyear can bring the fastest safe tire that they can come up with.

When did Goodyear have their problems in CART? When they were battling with Firestone. Since then, have there been any major problems with Firestone being the sole supplier? Not that I can recall. When you have tire wars, you get things like this. Do you think there's any way that incident happens if F1 has a single tire supplier? I sure don't.

You're kidding right? A couple of blown tires are a LOT more dangerous. If you blow a tire, a good amount of the time you're going into the wall at a severe angle and it's not going to be pleasant. To the best of my knowledge (and I was flipping with the Wings game) Sadler was the only one that even hit the wall in a wreck today and he just touched it.

It wasn't entertaining, but I'm sure Goodyear knows that they stuffed up and they'll do better next time. They don't need Tony Stewart telling them that they can't build a racing tire for anything and that they should get out of the series. That's completely out of line.

Saying what Junior said would've been sufficient. Saying what Gordon said would've been sufficient. Saying what Stewart said--but behind closed doors with Goodyear--would been sufficient. I understand that with Dale Sr. gone, someone needs to step up and be the voice. And with Stewart, Gordon and Junior all saying the tire was junk, that's enough to make me believe that the tire was junk. But don't try to tell me that it was necessary to go as far as Stewart did.

By and large, Goodyear does a great job in Nascar. There have been very few incidents since Hoosier got out of the series. The vast majority of races have a tire that provides great competition and is as safe as it can possibly be. One bad race doesn't change that--especially since no one even really wrecked. Boring? Sure. But we've seen boring races due to the aero package Nascar came up with as well. It doesn't mean the sanctioning body should step aside.

The tires today were probably third in the "least safe" things that have happened over the past 3 races alone (driving with the wet track in California, no SAFER barrier + the opening in the inside wall at Vegas).

I fail to see how a race like this warranted the reaction Stewart had. If the integrity of the tire kept failing? Sure. If this becomes an ongoing problem and Goodyear won't listen? Sure. But a bad race with a new car on an extremely fast track where NO ONE WRECKED and suddenly Goodyear should get out of the series? C'mon.

There's a classy way to make a point (Junior, Gordon) and then there's saying what Stewart said. Par for the course, I guess. It's not like I should expect anything more out of him. I'm not sure why Stewart cares about being able to race anyway, since Nascar just fixes races, right? ****** bag.

I hope you're calling Stewart a douchebag and not me.

You made some good points. I will agree Stewart went overboard...but idk, that's just how he is. I'm a Tony fan...mainly because of his talent on the race track...but man, he does ***** a lot. Sometimes I agree, sometimes I don't. For instance, when he got in the back of Denny Hamlin at the Pepsi 400 last year, he blamed it on Hamlin...and even though I don't like Hamlin, that wreck was mostly Tony's fault...yeah, Denny slowed up in front of Tony...but Tony could have easily lifted off the gas.

Whatever it takes to get Goodyears attention, do it. Jr and Gordon politely commenting that the tire was bad is probably enough to get Goodyear to do some more testing and make a better tire...but Stewart directly insulting Goodyear will damn well light a fire under their ass. I really like what Dale Jr said in the press conference where he was practically begging Goodyear not to do this at Darlington.

Your point about competing tire companies is great...and I cannot argue against it. You win there, hands down. If there are multiple tire companies, it will be all about speed, and safety comes second...or not at all. I just hate seeing companies get exclusive rights...particulary EA sports with the Nascar video game license (luckily I have nr2003 tho)...but now I'm rambling.

I'm not gonna go and say Nascar fixes races...but the conspiracy is there. I've heard rumors that Nascar may give some teams an edge in the race for a storybook ending (Jr wins the Pepsi 400 after his dad dies, Johnson wins after the Hendrick plane crash)...but what really pisses me off is when you get a debris caution and the tv crew doesn't even show the debris. There is no way to fix a race...but there are ways to give one or two teams an edge, but that's just a rumor.

Hitting the wall after blowing a tire can be a hard hit...but getting sideways because of no grip can be just as bad...Some of the worst crashes I've seen are someone getting loose, try to save it, but it whips back and the car slams nose-first into the wall. I'd rather see a cut tire wreck than a nose first into the wall...either way...both are dangerous, and that's what Goodyear needs to make...a safe tire that has grip.

But yeah...I def. think Tony got his message across to Goodyear.

[Packer487 3]

I hope you're calling Stewart a douchebag and not me.

I most definitely was referring to Stewart and his comments to that effect last year.

Your point about competing tire companies is great...and I cannot argue against it. You win there, hands down. If there are multiple tire companies, it will be all about speed, and safety comes second...or not at all. I just hate seeing companies get exclusive rights...particulary EA sports with the Nascar video game license (luckily I have nr2003 tho)...but now I'm rambling.

Yeaaaaaah there hasn't been a good Nascar video game since Papyrus/Sierra lost that license. NR2003 Season is awesome. I really should play that game more often than I do. When my gf got me a day at the Richard Petty Driving Experience as a birthday gift (SO effing cool, by the way), I must've spent 3 hours doing laps around the Milwaukee Mile (imported that track) to get used to the braking zones and whatnot.

I'm not gonna go and say Nascar fixes races...but the conspiracy is there. I've heard rumors that Nascar may give some teams an edge in the race for a storybook ending (Jr wins the Pepsi 400 after his dad dies, Johnson wins after the Hendrick plane crash)...but what really pisses me off is when you get a debris caution and the tv crew doesn't even show the debris. There is no way to fix a race...but there are ways to give one or two teams an edge, but that's just a rumor.

That was another example of Stewart going over the line. The debris cautions are a little iffy sometimes, but I don't believe for a second that they rigged Junior's car in Daytona/Johnson's car at Martinsville. They've got too much to lose if something like that were to get out and there's still way too many factors that can determine the outcome of a race. It's impossible to guarantee a winner like that.

Hitting the wall after blowing a tire can be a hard hit...but getting sideways because of no grip can be just as bad...Some of the worst crashes I've seen are someone getting loose, try to save it, but it whips back and the car slams nose-first into the wall. I'd rather see a cut tire wreck than a nose first into the wall...either way...

But with that huge spoiler, it's a LOT easier to save a loose racecar now than it used to be. Hell, Kyle Busch spends half the race sideways. At least the driver still has some input with a loose car. With a blown tire, you're screwed.

both are dangerous, and that's what Goodyear needs to make...a safe tire that has grip.

And an extremely high percentage of the time, they deliver. I can't imagine how hard it is to come up with a tire compound when you've never been on that track for a race with the COT. Everyone's learning and there's no reason to think that Goodyear won't improve the next time they come to Atlanta (or when they head to Darlington). To me, this race was akin to a motor shop building a bad batch of motors. If it's not a regular thing, you don't need to fire the shop or even call them out in the media. They know they screwed up and they've got a track record of doing great work.

By no means was it warranted to throw the shots at them that Stewart took. I respect the hell out of him as a driver, but I'll never cheer for him because of crap like that. He's the first to throw stones at everyone else, but he'll run and hide or pass the buck when it's his fault.

Edited March 10, 2008 by Packer487

[BlakChamber 8]

I have a NASCAR question. Why is it that, at least to this non-nascar fan, the same handful of guys win every race? Is it that they're that much better drivers, or they have a better car?

[Guest Jeremy88]

I have a NASCAR question. Why is it that, at least to this non-nascar fan, the same handful of guys win every race? Is it that they're that much better drivers, or they have a better car?

There are teams in Nascar. Hendrick Motorsports owns the 24, 48, 88, and 5 car...(yeah guys, Casey Mears is part of Hendrick too)...and since Rick Hendrick has DEEP pockets, he can spend so much money on his racing program. Therefore Jimmie Johnson (48) can go out and win 10 races a year and win the championship. Yeah, Jimmie a really good driver, but last year he had the best equipment.

Now Roush Racing and Joe Gibbs Racing seem to be the two top teams. Roush has a ton of money, and Toyota gave Gibbs a ton of money, so they're to two best teams...although Dale Jr (88) has been the best Hendrick driver so far this year (we're only in 4 races tho).

So the short answer to your question is: Money = Fast.