Latest on Zetterberg talks

[Doogs 0]

For a good portion of players it is risky, but Z has already stated he wants nothing more than to finish his career with the Red Wings. He's about to get married and his fiance just moved over from Sweden to support him. He's found a home in Detroit and he's not going to split over some team offering him $9 million per as opposed to the $7.5-$8 he'll get from the Wings.

Will they break the Lindstrom Line for Z? What about Hossa? Isn't it kind of standard line that they all know Captian Linstrom is the max? I do love the fact that you guys have players that get it. Take a little less stay for a winning ride. Sid did, Geno, Orpik, MAF (kinda), hopefully Staal we are starting to follow your lead and example. How about we pencil the Pens and the Wings in for the next say 5 or 6 Cup Finals and screw the rest of the league?

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

Will they break the Lindstrom Line for Z? What about Hossa? Isn't it kind of standard line that they all know Captian Linstrom is the max? I do love the fact that you guys have players that get it. Take a little less stay for a winning ride. Sid did, Geno, Orpik, MAF (kinda), hopefully Staal we are starting to follow your lead and example. How about we pencil the Pens and the Wings in for the next say 5 or 6 Cup Finals and screw the rest of the league?

For Z, they'll possibly break the Lidstrom line but it will only happen with Nick's blessing. I can see arguments for Z signing anywhere from both $7.45 million (Lidstrom's exact salary) to all the way up to $8 million.

As for Hossa, I don't think 2 players on the Wings will make more than Lidstrom, and if push comes to shove Kenny will be loyal to Z before Hossa.

[chrisdetroit 189]

I think you're over-doing it on the salaries for them. I think if it's for long term Z and Hossa would sign for around 7 million (won't be more than 7.45) and Franzen would get four. 2 mili not a huge difference, but it would very well be the difference (and it might give room for sammy, who I think is more valuable to our team/depth than people realize)

It still doesn't work and with the economy the way it is, league revenues (and thus the cap) are not likely to increase much if at all...

[chrisdetroit 189]

Holland is not going to move Filppula. What people are forgetting is that Hossa was already good and signed and Holland already knew the salary cap situation when he signed Filppula for 5 years.

In the last two games we have seen what we should have seen a while ago: Filppula moved to wing with Zetterberg on the second line, and he has looked great, giving Hank a more creative and all-around more skilled forward in Val. The money is being spent wisely for the time being and our best bet is to move Samuelsson down to the third line as soon as Franzen is ready to go (Tomorrow). The most potent line for a good deal of the playoffs last season was Franzen-Flip-Sammy, and trust me, Sammy was the least of the reason. Hank and Val have been creating nicely and Franzen has chemistry with both, tho I have my doubts Babcock will do it (given his history of Sammy-love), a Franzen-Zetterberg-Filppula line seems to be the better 2nd line option.

Next season we will see at least 3 new players in Helm, Abdelkader, and Ericcson, add Leino if he stays (which is a big IF considering his skill and the Wings lack of dough). See Samuelsson, Chelios, Mac, Maltby gone. After that, as others have said, its going to most likely come down to Franzen+Hudler+capspace vs. Hossa. Tough decisions, but if there is anyone in the league that could make 2+2=5 and produce another cup-contender its Ken Holland...

Maltby is still under contract and has almost no trade value. Also, the Wings will not trade him out of loyalty. Unfortunately, we are stuck with him until his contract runs out or he retires.

[Gutierrez 7]

Does anyone have a rough estimation of what the cap numbers would be if sammy, mac, Franzen and maybe even hudler left and we re-signed Hossa? If their was some money left over we could sign someone to help replace the loss Franzen if we indeed decided to take Hossa over Franzen.

[Guest mindfly]

According to swedish newspaper "Expressen" (who uses ESPN as source, not very good source is it?) they're talking about 10years and in the 7.8M$ per season range.

http://www.hockeyexpressen.se/nhl/1.136604...er-640-miljoner

[Grim 5]

wow. it would be a huge windfall if Zatta could be had at or near those terms!

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

For a good portion of players it is risky, but Z has already stated he wants nothing more than to finish his career with the Red Wings. He's about to get married and his fiance just moved over from Sweden to support him. He's found a home in Detroit and he's not going to split over some team offering him $9 million per as opposed to the $7.5-$8 he'll get from the Wings.

I love Z and take his word at face value. However, I was tainted by thinking Fedorov would stay forever and I took his word for it (well in so many words). Risking FA would make me ultra nervous. I don't think it will happen. But I have to see the John Hancocks on the dotted line before I can breathe a sigh of relief.

As for Hossa, if we don't win the Cup I see him bolting for the cash. (Alot of pressure I know). If he gets a Cup I could see him sticking around long term (hopefully).

I surely hope Franzen goes nowhere. He's an integral part of this team now - who knows this guy could become even better. The only thing that worries me is he seems to attract strange injuries. However, I worried about his with Kronwall for several years and that seemingly passed (knock on wood).

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Holland is not going to move Filppula. What people are forgetting is that Hossa was already good and signed and Holland already knew the salary cap situation when he signed Filppula for 5 years.

In the last two games we have seen what we should have seen a while ago: Filppula moved to wing with Zetterberg on the second line, and he has looked great, giving Hank a more creative and all-around more skilled forward in Val. The money is being spent wisely for the time being and our best bet is to move Samuelsson down to the third line as soon as Franzen is ready to go (Tomorrow). The most potent line for a good deal of the playoffs last season was Franzen-Flip-Sammy, and trust me, Sammy was the least of the reason. Hank and Val have been creating nicely and Franzen has chemistry with both, tho I have my doubts Babcock will do it (given his history of Sammy-love), a Franzen-Zetterberg-Filppula line seems to be the better 2nd line option.

Next season we will see at least 3 new players in Helm, Abdelkader, and Ericcson, add Leino if he stays (which is a big IF considering his skill and the Wings lack of dough). See Samuelsson, Chelios, Mac, Maltby gone. After that, as others have said, its going to most likely come down to Franzen+Hudler+capspace vs. Hossa. Tough decisions, but if there is anyone in the league that could make 2+2=5 and produce another cup-contender its Ken Holland...

Filppula has not yet entered the realm of immovability for a variety of reasons. First of all, any limelight that wasn't being shed on Hank and Datsyuk up front went to Franzen and Hossa. Now, with the stats to back things up, even Hudler and Sammy are statistically outshining Filppula. The first and foremost way to get yourself into that circle of immunity is to build a strong rapport with the fans. With Hossa and Franzen winning their way into the hearts of fans where Datsyuk and Zetterberg are already present, the space for that rapport is decreasing. Like it or not - and I'm guessing not by the way you describe Filppula as some legitimate 2nd line offensive palyer when he has yet to prove anything of the sort - Filppula is inching further and further away from immunity as the season goes along. His defensive play is nothing that stands out more than that of Datsuyk, Hank and Hossa. And his offensive stats are nothing to write home about - especially with Samuelsson and Hudler doing significantly better than Filppula while offering defensive statistics no worse.

Ultimately, Filppula being immovable is one thing without condition. But when you take into account that decisions are going to have to be made surrounding players that are significantly better than Filppula offensively, and not much different defensively, while there are players not much different defensively, but significantly cheaper than Filppula, then yeah, hes not untouchable.

As for the situation prior to August, of course Holland wasn't going to move an uncontracted Filppula when he was still an unknown commodity in terms of offense (or lose him to an offer sheet for so-so pick compensation when the offer would be only a few 100k more than what Holland was willing to spend). The situation then at hand offered the Wings a lot of security in terms of secondary scoring should they lose the likes of Hossa, Franzen, Sammy and possibly even Hudler under certain circumstances in the coming offense. The security of Filppula's finances is seurity for the team. But that security could easily turn into a route of flexibility for the Wings.

Would people be sad to see Filppula leave? Sure. And while I'm not saying Filppula IS going to be traded, you could just as easily draw a parallel between what Filppula is to this team and what Kozlov was to this team prior to being traded. Kozlov probably wasn't going to be traded if a guy like Hasek hadn't been available. I wouldn't trade Filppula for the hell of it, but when you consider it directly affects the retention of guys like Franzen and Hossa, the situation becomes an entirely different beast.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

I love Z and take his word at face value. However, I was tainted by thinking Fedorov would stay forever and I took his word for it (well in so many words). Risking FA would make me ultra nervous. I don't think it will happen. But I have to see the John Hancocks on the dotted line before I can breathe a sigh of relief.

Fedorov also had ego issues, a love-hate relationship with our coaches, and was constantly dissatisfied with ice time. Zetterberg has never voiced a displeasure with the Wings organization and its never been alluded to. I wouldn't be too worried..

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

I love Z and take his word at face value. However, I was tainted by thinking Fedorov would stay forever and I took his word for it (well in so many words). Risking FA would make me ultra nervous. I don't think it will happen. But I have to see the John Hancocks on the dotted line before I can breathe a sigh of relief.

As for Hossa, if we don't win the Cup I see him bolting for the cash. (Alot of pressure I know). If he gets a Cup I could see him sticking around long term (hopefully).

I surely hope Franzen goes nowhere. He's an integral part of this team now - who knows this guy could become even better. The only thing that worries me is he seems to attract strange injuries. However, I worried about his with Kronwall for several years and that seemingly passed (knock on wood).

As YG stated, you're comparing apples to oranges in regards to Z and Fedorov. Fedorov's ego didn't allow him to fit through the door at times and Z has been nothing short of a team player and zero maintenance. It'd be like comparing Lidstrom to a NBA player.

[b.shanafan14 733]

Filppula has not yet entered the realm of immovability for a variety of reasons. First of all, any limelight that wasn't being shed on Hank and Datsyuk up front went to Franzen and Hossa. Now, with the stats to back things up, even Hudler and Sammy are statistically outshining Filppula. The first and foremost way to get yourself into that circle of immunity is to build a strong rapport with the fans. With Hossa and Franzen winning their way into the hearts of fans where Datsyuk and Zetterberg are already present, the space for that rapport is decreasing. Like it or not - and I'm guessing not by the way you describe Filppula as some legitimate 2nd line offensive palyer when he has yet to prove anything of the sort - Filppula is inching further and further away from immunity as the season goes along. His defensive play is nothing that stands out more than that of Datsuyk, Hank and Hossa. And his offensive stats are nothing to write home about - especially with Samuelsson and Hudler doing significantly better than Filppula while offering defensive statistics no worse.

Ultimately, Filppula being immovable is one thing without condition. But when you take into account that decisions are going to have to be made surrounding players that are significantly better than Filppula offensively, and not much different defensively, while there are players not much different defensively, but significantly cheaper than Filppula, then yeah, hes not untouchable.

As for the situation prior to August, of course Holland wasn't going to move an uncontracted Filppula when he was still an unknown commodity in terms of offense (or lose him to an offer sheet for so-so pick compensation when the offer would be only a few 100k more than what Holland was willing to spend). The situation then at hand offered the Wings a lot of security in terms of secondary scoring should they lose the likes of Hossa, Franzen, Sammy and possibly even Hudler under certain circumstances in the coming offense. The security of Filppula's finances is seurity for the team. But that security could easily turn into a route of flexibility for the Wings.

Would people be sad to see Filppula leave? Sure. And while I'm not saying Filppula IS going to be traded, you could just as easily draw a parallel between what Filppula is to this team and what Kozlov was to this team prior to being traded. Kozlov probably wasn't going to be traded if a guy like Hasek hadn't been available. I wouldn't trade Filppula for the hell of it, but when you consider it directly affects the retention of guys like Franzen and Hossa, the situation becomes an entirely different beast.

Good points. But my argument remains the same. Filppula is a player who when given second-line time in the playoffs last season played great on a second line with Franzen and Samuelsson (was Filppula the weakest link?), and many would argue the stats on Samuelsson are misleading much like the stats on Lang and Markov were. Samuelsson wouldn't produce on the third line where Filppula and Hudler have been stuck for years, and yet he has kept his job on the second line. This season its much worse to play on the third line given the potency of the first two lines and their getting even more bulk of the ice time. Lets face it, of the three (Filppula,Samuelsson,Hudler), Samuelsson has benefited the most, Hudler has produced the most with less ice-time and Filppula has the most raw skill.

Also, because of Samuelsson's inflated stats, next season he is going to be looking for a Filppula-like contract, maybe even more dough, and thats something he isn't going to get. Samuelsson is a player that has benefited greatly by the players in Detroit and only his size is an asset on the second-line, being that he has much less raw skill and less accurate/useful shot than Filppula or Hudler.

Personally, I think that Filppula's contract was more for next season than this season and I would much rather have Filppula get a full-time second line job then Samuelsson, and I know I'm not alone. Fact of the matter is: players like Filppula are a commodity (much like Kozlov, and I've always compared those two), whereas Samuelsson is a player whose been elsewhere and was never great, but put him on a line with great players and he's bound to get at least half the secondary assists available.

The difference between Kozlov and Filppula is that unlike before when money wasn't an object, skill was, the issue is moving Filppula's pay check and there is next to no chance the Wings get a decent return for similiar or less cap hit. Filppula isn't going anywhere, and I'd bank neither is Hudler.

[South Dakota wings fan 7]

Good points. But my argument remains the same. Filppula is a player who when given second-line time in the playoffs last season played great on a second line with Franzen and Samuelsson (was Filppula the weakest link?), and many would argue the stats on Samuelsson are misleading much like the stats on Lang and Markov were. Samuelsson wouldn't produce on the third line where Filppula and Hudler have been stuck for years, and yet he has kept his job on the second line. This season its much worse to play on the third line given the potency of the first two lines and their getting even more bulk of the ice time. Lets face it, of the three (Filppula,Samuelsson,Hudler), Samuelsson has benefited the most, Hudler has produced the most with less ice-time and Filppula has the most raw skill.

Also, because of Samuelsson's inflated stats, next season he is going to be looking for a Filppula-like contract, maybe even more dough, and thats something he isn't going to get. Samuelsson is a player that has benefited greatly by the players in Detroit and only his size is an asset on the second-line, being that he has much less raw skill and less accurate/useful shot than Filppula or Hudler.

Personally, I think that Filppula's contract was more for next season than this season and I would much rather have Filppula get a full-time second line job then Samuelsson, and I know I'm not alone. Fact of the matter is: players like Filppula are a commodity (much like Kozlov, and I've always compared those two), whereas Samuelsson is a player whose been elsewhere and was never great, but put him on a line with great players and he's bound to get at least half the secondary assists available.

The difference between Kozlov and Filppula is that unlike before when money wasn't an object, skill was, the issue is moving Filppula's pay check and there is next to no chance the Wings get a decent return for similiar or less cap hit. Filppula isn't going anywhere, and I'd bank neither is Hudler.

I have gone back into the depths of the threads to retrieve this because I have been plugging some numbers into a spreadsheet to check possible contract amounts for next year and beyond. (Yes, I am extremely bored tonight) When looking at all of the free agents after this season, there is not a lot of $ to go around with the cap going down to an estimated $55 mil.

The following are FA: Z, Hossa, Mule, Sammy, Huds, Kopy, Mac, Downey, Cheli, Leino, & Conks. If you move Helm & Abdel up from GR, that makes 8 forwards under contract.

If you put Z in for 7 mill, Mule in for 4 (very likely low), Sammy for 1.5, Leino for 1 and throw in Meech who will still be under contract as a useful part who can play D and forward. Even these conservative numbers, when adding Ericsson to the D puts them around $2.75 mil OVER the cap. I see no way Hossa is back, unless we fill the rest of the roster with minor leaguers.

Now more than ever, I believe we could see Flip traded, due to being replacable and making a fairly high amount of money.

[Guest DetroitBoy313]

Zetterberg will sign and Hossa is gone people.I mean I know im preaching to the choir but the only reason we even have Hossa is because Z and Franzen were already signed to deals well BELOW what they are really worth.I just say watch EVERY game POSSIBLE and enjoy this season because we have an awesome line up that most likely will look very different next year without Hossa.

[South Dakota wings fan 7]

Zetterberg will sign and Hossa is gone people.I mean I know im preaching to the choir but the only reason we even have Hossa is because Z and Franzen were already signed to deals well BELOW what they are really worth.I just say watch EVERY game POSSIBLE and enjoy this season because we have an awesome line up that most likely will look very different next year without Hossa.

I totally agree, enjoy it while it lasts. I just hope we are able to keep more than Z.

[Glubki 17]

I have gone back into the depths of the threads to retrieve this because I have been plugging some numbers into a spreadsheet to check possible contract amounts for next year and beyond. (Yes, I am extremely bored tonight) When looking at all of the free agents after this season, there is not a lot of $ to go around with the cap going down to an estimated $55 mil.

The following are FA: Z, Hossa, Mule, Sammy, Huds, Kopy, Mac, Downey, Cheli, Leino, & Conks. If you move Helm & Abdel up from GR, that makes 8 forwards under contract.

If you put Z in for 7 mill, Mule in for 4 (very likely low), Sammy for 1.5, Leino for 1 and throw in Meech who will still be under contract as a useful part who can play D and forward. Even these conservative numbers, when adding Ericsson to the D puts them around $2.75 mil OVER the cap. I see no way Hossa is back, unless we fill the rest of the roster with minor leaguers.

Now more than ever, I believe we could see Flip traded, due to being replacable and making a fairly high amount of money.

This is just my opinion but I think Chelios, Mac, Kopecky are done in a Wings uniform after this season. Kop's may be moved before the deadline or lost to F.A. Hossa is a goner and Conklin will most likely seek greener pastures. They should be able to move up some of the youngsters but if they bring Ericcson up someone else will either be let go or traded.

Edit: Poor Typing Skills

Edited December 4, 2008 by Glubki

[FunkedUp 29]

Flip isn't going anywhere. The people that are complaining about Flip's contract are the same people that were complaining about Datsyuk's contract.

[RWK23 0]

Flip isn't going anywhere. The people that are complaining about Flip's contract are the same people that were complaining about Datsyuk's contract.

And Kronwall's.

[FunkedUp 29]

And Kronwall's.

Precisely... It seems to be a custom around here for people to whine about a signing unless its a complete steal and even then sometimes complain.

[up2here 41]

Zetterberg wont earn more than Nick so I would say thats false.

[Opie 308]

Zetterberg wont earn more than Nick so I would say thats false.

So you know for a fact that Lids, Z, and Holland sat down and Lids said no, or that the 7.8 is a cap hit and would actually make 6.7 for the remainder of Lids career, or that Lids didn't say hey you know what this guy is part of this teams future and future 'C' let him earn more than me?

I ask because you seem pretty sure of your answer.

[egroen 384]

Flip isn't going anywhere. The people that are complaining about Flip's contract are the same people that were complaining about Datsyuk's contract.

It is unlikely Holland trades Filppula, but I honestly hope you are wrong -- because the way I see it, and I have been over the numbers many times, it is Filppula's contract that keeps us from signing Franzen.

[Nick137 0]

I don't know much about the CBA, and it's going to be tough to sign Z, Hossa and Mule, but if anyone can make it happen it's Kenny Holland.

AMEN to that!! I agree totally! If anyone CAN make it happen it will be Mr. Holland!

I'm hoping that Hank, Mule & Hossa love playing on the same team enough to do what they can to help make it work as well!

[Casey 145]

Zetterberg wont earn more than Nick so I would say thats false.

The "Lidstrom Cap" is unofficial at best. I'd lay a twenty on the table that says Lids would be just fine with giving Z what he wants, for the sake of the team.

[egroen 384]

AMEN to that!! I agree totally! If anyone CAN make it happen it will be Mr. Holland!

I'm hoping that Hank, Mule & Hossa love playing on the same team enough to do what they can to help make it work as well!

If you wish to keep you head in the clouds, do not click on the following link:

http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=54475