Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) Yeah, Franzen's 22 goals this season is worth just as much as Flipulla's assists. Franzen is better defensively, offensively and physically. Plus he's making a third of what Flipulla is making. Franzen for 3.75 mill, or Flipulla for the same. No one, not even the hater that you are, would pick Flipulla. Franzen is a much better player in every area of the game. Franzen has a ton of highlight worthy goals. And if all Franzen's goals are just tip ins, how come Homer, or Cleary don't have 22 goals already? They play on the top lines as well. It's about goals. 10 assists isn't as good as 10 goals. Franzen is highly under-rated. Do you read? Where did I say ALL his goals are tip ins? I said half of his goals in the playoffs were tip ins against an avalanche team that couldn't win a game against my old high school's team. And I'm talking about the past 20 games (which is why I said in the past 20 games) not the entire season. Tell pavel datsyuk 10 assists isn't as good as 10 goals. Anyone remember who that guy is? You obviously don't. Do you really think Franzen is going to make only a third of what Flip is making next year? Why even bring that up... And did I seriously just get called a hater by someone who says these things? http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1539863 http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1539854 http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1534705 I mean, really? Edited February 12, 2009 by Z and D for the C Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) http://hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=64511 Filppula has hands of stone only slightly better than Draper. He completely misses the net more often than not Did you watch ANY videos I linked? Hands of STONE? I don't like saying things like this, but that really is the dumbest thing I've ever read on this website. Flip's hands are better than even hudlers. And why do you keep bringing up his stats as though it's some end all be all? This is flip's third full season as a wing, his first season as better than franzen's first, his second was better than franzen's second, and his third looks like it's going to be better than franzen's third. Edited February 12, 2009 by Z and D for the C Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveyzerman 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 ? Are you serious? Drake wasn't on the books for this year, regardless of whether or not he planned to retire. Of course that wasn't serious, goofball. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveyzerman 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 Who's going to Center the 2nd line if we don't have Flip, and we have Z and Pav on the 1st? Franzen? Yes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ms_Hockey 0 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 I don't think Ken Holland would give Nick more than a 2 year contract at this stage. & I'm sure Nick would playout his contract. You're probably right about that. All signs point to Lidstrom bring in this for the remainder of his contract. I don't think we have to worry about the salary cap rule in regards to contracts. I'm all for keeping Franzen & Hossa. What I don't understand is why we'd choose to keep Flip over Hudler. I'm not going to sit here and say that Flip is a bad player - but Hudler is, admittedly, better. This whole thing seems to make no sense to me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheOwl 77 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 Do you read? Where did I say ALL his goals are tip ins? I said half of his goals in the playoffs were tip ins against an avalanche team that couldn't win a game against my old high school's team. And I'm talking about the past 20 games (which is why I said in the past 20 games) not the entire season. Tell pavel datsyuk 10 assists isn't as good as 10 goals. Anyone remember who that guy is? You obviously don't. Do you really think Franzen is going to make only a third of what Flip is making next year? Why even bring that up... And did I seriously just get called a hater by someone who says these things? http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1539863 http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1539854 http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/index.ph...p;#entry1534705 I mean, really? Listen junior, your the one who said Flipulla was better (or will be better) then Franzen. And you haven't defended that position at all, with facts, stats or anything. Franzen is the better player now by miles, it's like comparing Dustin Penner to Malkin or something. The avalanche did beat a pretty good team in the Wild in the first round also. And their is a huge difference between assists and goals. And not all assists are even equal. A lot of people get assists from just happening to be on the ice. Datysuk is an excellent play maker, when do you see Flipulla making an outstanding pass? Comparing Datysuk's play making ability and Flipulla's has nothing to do with Franzen. What stat shows that Flipulla is better, in any area of the game, then Franzen? Go home. And I hate on Ozzie because he sucks this season. Your hating on Franzen for no reason. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
up2here 41 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 Flipulla over Franzen? You're crazy man. Franzen is worth a lot more then Flipulla. Did you even watch last seasons play-offs? Who scored the most goals per game? Franzen? Yeah, real over-rated. Stop the bs. Once again we seem to have the issue of verbally assaulting people who give their opinion on this site. I happen to agree that Franzen is more valuable but the argument can certainly be made that Filpulla who is 5 years younger and gets very little PP time could end up being better and more valuable. Please be mature in your responses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hockeytown_Ryan 122 Report post Posted February 12, 2009 Then trade him for a bag of pucks, but don't lose that amount of depth for one player. and a skate lace!!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted February 13, 2009 Listen junior, your the one who said Flipulla was better (or will be better) then Franzen. And you haven't defended that position at all, with facts, stats or anything. Franzen is the better player now by miles, it's like comparing Dustin Penner to Malkin or something. The avalanche did beat a pretty good team in the Wild in the first round also. And their is a huge difference between assists and goals. And not all assists are even equal. A lot of people get assists from just happening to be on the ice. Datysuk is an excellent play maker, when do you see Flipulla making an outstanding pass? Comparing Datysuk's play making ability and Flipulla's has nothing to do with Franzen. What stat shows that Flipulla is better, in any area of the game, then Franzen? Go home. And I hate on Ozzie because he sucks this season. Your hating on Franzen for no reason. Wow, you're able to belittle someone you're arguing against. That's like- so totally impressive!! Apart from a goal, when is the last time franzen made some amazing play? Like I've said, franzen is an above average goal scorer who had a very impressive playoffs last year. That's it. He doesn't make plays, and he doesn't kill penalties. I think I've left something relatively big out from my opinion of Franzen. He's a great player absolutely, and I would hate to lose him and I'm not saying he sucks, he'd just be misplaced if we had both him and hossa. If we could have a top six of: Zetterberg Datsyuk Franzen Leino Flip Hossa That would be awesome, I just think Hossa and Franzen on the same line suck because I just see Franzen as a waste of a line slot as he doesn't do very much in terms of playmaking. He would work great with Z&D because he wouldn't HAVE to do very much but stand in front of the net but on the second line I think all three players would need to be able to make plays, franzen finishes plays, he doesn't MAKE plays. Hossa does both, so if he have hossa I think franzen is a waste on that line. If we can't get Hossa, then I'd love to be able to keep franzen. Hate on filppula all you want, but no one can deny that he holds on to the puck extremely well in the zone. He has a great hands (as good as hudler's at least), he just needs to gain a bit of confidence. You see quite a few opportunities where he could of and should have shot the puck but makes the pass instead, it was the same with hudler last year. That's why I say Flip has a great toolset, he just needs to gain the experience of how to use them, something he'll gain in time and he'll be an amazing investment. As for my defense of my view that flip WILL, IN TIME be better than franzen, read my other post: This is flip's third full season as a wing, his first season as better than franzen's first, his second was better than franzen's second, and his third looks like it's going to be better than franzen's third. Also, he's a much better playmaker with 20 assists to Franzen's 12. Is that an an area of the game? (<- passing) Flip has more even strength points than franzen, and is better defensively, represented by the fact that he has more than twice as much PK time as Franzen. And here is a nice little factoid: Filppula is behind only Z, Pav and Hossa in even strength scoring I wasn't comparing datsyuk to flip, no idea where you got that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steveyzerman 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Pst, Hossa. Looks like you picked the right team. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadaBoy 151 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 You know what they say. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RedWingedKitten 9 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 OBSTRUCTION! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
going_top_shelf 6 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 (edited) I've done a lot of hard thinking about this situation and I would SO MUCH rather sign Marian Hossa than Johan Franzen. Franzen is a good player but Marian is just so passionate about winning. I mean he sat there on June 4, 2008 and watched the Wings lift Stanley. Then he chooses to sign with that very team just under a month later. He really is committed to winning and he knows he'll get it in Hockeytown. He's one of my favorite players and I hope he stays for his career. BTW, someone needs to change the picture on his Wikipedia page. I'd do it but I don't know how. Edited February 17, 2009 by going_top_shelf Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Copenhagen848 58 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Hossa is the f-in man! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Blueliner 69 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Pst, Hossa. Looks like you picked the right team. Pens fans think so too. http://www.letsgopens.com/scripts/phpBB3/v...f=1&t=32742 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,153 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Hossa made the right choice. Even if he signs long term, of course that doesn't guarantee a Cup. How about this perspective, years of losing in Ottawa (a couple almost seasons) and years of losing in Atlanta. Got whipped in the finals by Detroit. He hopes to win a Cup (or two if he re-signs long term) but if he never does, at least every year he will be here, he will be at or near the top of the league in wins, almost always be a favorite to win the Cup, and more times than not, make it at least to the conference finals if SCF's. Bottom line, he made the right choice because from now until the end of his career (if he stays) he won't have to worry about a re-build process every other year and he will have fun playing year after year. Not saying he hasn't enjoyed his career up until now, but I am sure having the best or second best record most of the time makes it a lot more enjoyable coming to the rink everyday! Best Franxhise in the NHL, best franchise in Sports, best franchise in the World. Noone can argue ANY team against that statement. I dare you too... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/20...no_proving.html Contract talks continue Red Wings general manager Ken Holland said he has had contract talks with the agents for Johan Franzen and Hossa in the past week, but no deal is imminent. He has had more discussions with Franzen's agent and said there is a possibility of a deal. But he wants to continue talks with Hossa. He can sign only one before the end of the season. "If I have any chance to sign two, I got to get their cap number as low as possible," Holland said. "There's a lot at stake for the players and the club. I'm trying to figure out ways to keep as many players as possible. "If I get close with one, I'm going to sit tight and see where I get with the other." Poster's comment: Kind of a buzzkill in comparison to a couple weeks ago when Hossa said he'd take less. It's still a long and uncertain process it seems. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ms_Hockey 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Pens fans think so too. http://www.letsgopens.com/scripts/phpBB3/v...f=1&t=32742 It's cute how some of them are so reluctant to admit that it was a good move. Instead, it's the coach's fault. Hahaha. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest CaliWingsNut Report post Posted February 17, 2009 am I the only one that thought "please send tell" ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SDavis35 140 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 You know what they say. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em! rumour has it that as hossa left the ice that night, his jersey magically turned white and a winged wheel replaced the penguin. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T.Low 1,011 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Nice thread. There are some great quotes in there: " I can't be the only one who remembers it took over 130 minutes of hockey for the Penguins to score a goal in the Finals?" The playoffs are going to be a battle. I need some government bailout money so I can go buy a new flatscreen! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
96warrior 11 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 http://blog.mlive.com/snapshots/2009/02/pu..._the_table.html The Detroit Free Press's Helene St. James reports that the Red Wings' brass had their pre-trade deadline powwow this past weekend in Naples (you know, the sunny Florida locale where all the hockey mucky-mucks meet). Holland remained in information-sharing mode in his conversation with St. James, stating that he and Johan Franzen's agent, Marc Levine, have made good progress...But Holland has one more big meeting to make before he can pursue negotiations with Marian Hossa's camp in earnest: February 17, Detroit Free Press: "I think we're in the ballpark, but we don't have a deal done," Holland said Monday. "They know I want to talk to Ritch Winter regarding Marian Hossa. Franzen's camp hasn't moved the extra mile, and neither have I. I haven't gotten quite as far along with Hossa, and I do want to explore that and then sit down with our owner and make a decision on what to do. I think we have a chance to keep both players, but that does mean other players have to move." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Holmstrom96 347 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 I haven't been overly impressed with Franzen or Sammy this season. I'd rather keep Flip and Hudler, who are young and much more consistent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NomadFromKazoo 42 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Once again we seem to have the issue of verbally assaulting people who give their opinion on this site. I happen to agree that Franzen is more valuable but the argument can certainly be made that Filpulla who is 5 years younger and gets very little PP time could end up being better and more valuable. Please be mature in your responses. You consider this a "verbal assault?" You must be a charm to know. Grow a pair, Nancy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mindfly Report post Posted February 17, 2009 http://blog.mlive.com/snapshots/2009/02/pu..._the_table.html The Detroit Free Press's Helene St. James reports that the Red Wings' brass had their pre-trade deadline powwow this past weekend in Naples (you know, the sunny Florida locale where all the hockey mucky-mucks meet). Holland remained in information-sharing mode in his conversation with St. James, stating that he and Johan Franzen's agent, Marc Levine, have made good progress...But Holland has one more big meeting to make before he can pursue negotiations with Marian Hossa's camp in earnest: February 17, Detroit Free Press: "I think we're in the ballpark, but we don't have a deal done," Holland said Monday. "They know I want to talk to Ritch Winter regarding Marian Hossa. Franzen's camp hasn't moved the extra mile, and neither have I. I haven't gotten quite as far along with Hossa, and I do want to explore that and then sit down with our owner and make a decision on what to do. I think we have a chance to keep both players, but that does mean other players have to move." I got connection with Naples but had no idea on that, do you know why they choose Naples? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
