Ms_Hockey 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 The two best posts on that Pens forum. In reference to someone saying the Red Wings cup time has passed them by and they won't repeat: "I don't know about that one... chances are the wings are going to repeat." And in reply: "I'd be almost shocked if they didn't repeat." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vladifan 680 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/20...no_proving.html Contract talks continue Red Wings general manager Ken Holland said he has had contract talks with the agents for Johan Franzen and Hossa in the past week, but no deal is imminent. He has had more discussions with Franzen's agent and said there is a possibility of a deal. But he wants to continue talks with Hossa. He can sign only one before the end of the season. "If I have any chance to sign two, I got to get their cap number as low as possible," Holland said. "There's a lot at stake for the players and the club. I'm trying to figure out ways to keep as many players as possible. "If I get close with one, I'm going to sit tight and see where I get with the other." Poster's comment: Kind of a buzzkill in comparison to a couple weeks ago when Hossa said he'd take less. It's still a long and uncertain process it seems. Thanks for the input and I agree. Looks a little stickier than it did. At least one of them is still not willing to take less - for what it's going to take to sign 'em both. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alienanxiety 23 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 (edited) i don't see Samuelsson, Hudler, Chelios, Meech, Kopecky, Conklin and perhaps Draper on this team next year. i really feel that if draper has a terrible playoffs that he may retire (take a job in the wings organization), cheli and mccarty will retire, meech will be moved, conklin, kopecky will move on, hudler will sign elsewhere and get us picks Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Franzen Hossa-Zetterberg-Cleary Helm-Fippula-Leino Maltby-Abdelkader-Downey Lidstrom-Kronwall Rafalski-Ericcson Staurt-Lebda Osgood Larsson/Howard Edited February 17, 2009 by alienanxiety Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hank 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 (edited) i don't see Samuelsson, Hudler, Chelios, Meech, Kopecky, Conklin and perhaps Draper on this team next year. i really feel that if draper has a terrible playoffs that he may retire (take a job in the wings organization), cheli and mccarty will retire, meech will be moved, conklin, kopecky will move on, hudler will sign elsewhere and get us picks Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Franzen Hossa-Zetterberg-Cleary Helm-Fippula-Leino Maltby-Abdelkader-Downey Lidstrom-Kronwall Rafalski-Ericcson Staurt-Lebda Osgood Larsson/Howard Nice lines. But I think it's nearly certain that Leino is going to be a top-6 forward next year. Edited February 17, 2009 by Hank Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vladifan 680 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Take it for what its worth, but it just builds my anticipation to see if they both will be here next year. The article mentions that Sammy would be the odd man out. also hints at this years trade deadline, with Holland stating there more then likely to stay put. I just hope to see Hossa signed up long term and in the wings orginization for years to come! heres the link as well. http://www.thefourthperiod.com/news/det090217.html I really appreciate Holland's candor about trying to make sure both Hossa and Franzen understand what's going on with the other guy. And I really appreciate your input on this. Thanks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alienanxiety 23 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 you could swap cleary and leino but i thought they might try to keep the two Fins together. maybe not, though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vladifan 680 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 i don't see Samuelsson, Hudler, Chelios, Meech, Kopecky, Conklin and perhaps Draper on this team next year. i really feel that if draper has a terrible playoffs that he may retire (take a job in the wings organization), cheli and mccarty will retire, meech will be moved, conklin, kopecky will move on, hudler will sign elsewhere and get us picks Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Franzen Hossa-Zetterberg-Cleary Helm-Fippula-Leino Maltby-Abdelkader-Downey Lidstrom-Kronwall Rafalski-Ericcson Staurt-Lebda Osgood Larsson/Howard I think you're right about Chelios and I think Mac will end up doing something in tv or radio. At least I like the idea because I think he'd be great at it, especially with the Wings. I have nothing to base it on, but I think Stuart won't make it back. I don't like Filppula on any line other than where Hossa isand I'm not sure I like him there. He is not secure enought within himself to be aggressive without knowing his ass will be covered by someone as adept as Hossa. And I dearly hope if he stays on Hossa's line he stays focused. He drives me nuttier than any other player out there...And I still liked Malts, Drapes and Leino together, but you're right, methinks. Leino will move up. He and Hossa are SO much fun to watch!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wingsallwin 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 I just do not understand why people here keep saying we have to sign both Franzen and Hossa. Both players are really good but if we sign both, that means we cannot sign majority of our FA: Huds,Sammy,Leino, and some other players. Seriously, we just look to sign with only offenses right now. If we suppose the salary cap will be changed in next year, or at least in the future, we do not have to sign with all 2 players. I can take Hossa but if Franzen asks 4 million, that is an overpayment. If Hossa can take 6 million, then Huds for 2.0, Sammy for 1, Leino for whatever amount of money. Besides, we have to fix the problem on the goaltending. If we see Conks will leave this team next year, then can we stick up with Osgood? I meant, even though he bounces back to his game, that is not what I am concerning. After contract is done for Osgood after 3 years, he will be around 38 years old. We have to get a goalie who can be back up. Pepple say Howard and Larsson are not ready for the NHL, yeah.. then who do we have to put on the goaltending? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vladifan 680 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Hudler will gone... Somebody like the Canucks will offer him 4 million. It's a hard choice but you can't have it both ways... C'est la vie... Agreed. He plays his little buttola off and he seems to be coming into his own. ...sniff... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wingsallwin 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 I've gotta be honest - I've been far more impressed by Sammy than by Flip this season. Why do some people here bash Sammy? Sammy has been way better than Filp this season. However, I think we have to see the long way. Now, Sammy is 31 years old and Filp is still young. Personally, I do not see we can resign Sammy next season. And if Filp is still playing bad next season, then yeah.. that is pretty much a trade deal Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vladifan 680 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 If Hudler accepts arbitration with no intention of going to it, that blocks the ability for teams to offer him an offer. That is what Filppula did last season. He accepted arbitration and negotiated with Holland in order to not go to arbitration. It was his way of saying check this out, I don't want to go anywhere. If Hudler wants to stay here I think you will see him do the same. I am expecting Huds to accept arbitration and then sign a 2-3 year contract around 3 million per season. ...From your mouth to Hudler's ears!... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Um, if we keep Hossa and Franzen, Filppula is gone too. Leino - .975k at best Filppula - 3 Hank - 6.08 Datsyuk - 6.7 Homer - 2.25 Helm - .6 Maltby - .88 Draper - 1.58 Kopecky - he stays if Hossa stays - .7 Cleary - 2.85 Osgood - 1.4 Howard - .71 Lidstrom - 7.45 Raffi - 6 Kronwall - 3 Stuart - 3.75 Lilja - 1.2 Ericsson - .9 Meech - .65 Total = 50.675 without Hossa, Franzen, or a 13th forward Please tell me how we are going to get Hossa and Franzen to take a combined 6M to play on this team. And before you post the ridiculous suggestions, Cleary, Stuart, Rafalski, and Draper cannot be moved. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeverForgetMac25 483 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Just an FYI to those starting new threads regarding the re-signing of Hossa and Franzen....we already have one. Unless something new and definitive comes up (in the form of a signing) please post your information/thoughts in here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Frozen-Man 144 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 I think the theory is with our main players signed up forever that eventually the economy improves, the cap goes up, and that's how we keep them. We lose Sammy, Huds, or some short term and fill them in with the farm which we can pay because the cost of our best players won't go up anymore. Understand and agree but the real problem is likely to be 2010-2011 if like many are projecting the cap drops more than 10% (I'm not sure it will but it still has to be a concern because it might and some smart people think it will) then the Wings have to figure out how to shed close to 10% of their contracts because they will be running so close to the cap. That is when a $1.2-1.5M player who produces like Sammy will be missed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 i don't see Samuelsson, Hudler, Chelios, Meech, Kopecky, Conklin and perhaps Draper on this team next year. i really feel that if draper has a terrible playoffs that he may retire (take a job in the wings organization), cheli and mccarty will retire, meech will be moved, conklin, kopecky will move on, hudler will sign elsewhere and get us picks Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Franzen Hossa-Zetterberg-Cleary Helm-Fippula-Leino Maltby-Abdelkader-Downey Lidstrom-Kronwall Rafalski-Ericcson Staurt-Lebda Osgood Larsson/Howard Lilja? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alienanxiety 23 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Lilja? he and lebda will split time in and out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Lilja? No kidding. I would put Lilja in Lebda's place, personally. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 he and lebda will split time in and out. No. Lilja is our 2nd best PKer. And with the way Lidstrom has fallen off, if he continues to next year, he'll be our best PKer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,131 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 all the screaming about who is better, Huds, Flip, Franzen. Lets just sign Hossa long term, finish the season and see where we get in the playoffs! We do not need to make a decision on Flip, Huds or Franz until July 1. Most important, if Hossa is willing to sign here for a avergage of $6M then get him under contract, see where you stand AFTER the playoffs and make decisions then. This is a lot of distractions, even if we signed Hossa to a $10M contract today, Franzen to $6M and Huds to $7M, it wouldn't effect the Cap until next season! Most Important, GET HOSSA SIGNED! Let the rest fall where they may! Who knows, maybe Holland trades Kronwall to free up some cap space? Similar contract to Flip's, free's up $3M. If Ericsson is the ready for the NHL, then bring him on! Give him 2nd line minutes! Now you can bring up Kindl as well if you trade Kronner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 No. Lilja is our 2nd best PKer. And with the way Lidstrom has fallen off, if he continues to next year, he'll be our best PKer. Ah, another member of the "Lidstrom made a mistake or two this year and isn't putting up quite as many points, so he's only 50th or so among d-men now" club. That said, yes, Lilja is a very valuable PKer and I'd keep him over Lebda any day. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,131 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 (edited) how about this food for thought? Hossa could get top dollar as a UFA, right? As could Z, Dats, Lids. So all Holland does is look at his FA's (Huds, Franz, Sammy and Leino) and say, look. I understand you can get more somewhere else, but so could've these 4 superstars. You make the choice. Now, these guys, Huds and Franz especially, should take a que from the stars and sign for LESS as well! If Hossa is worth $8.5M and he signs for $6M, then Huds and Franz, who could fetch $4M should maybe not get more than $2.8M. Sure that still is more than the Cap, but that should be the max they should be looking for to stay here. Realistically they should accept whatever would keep the Wings under the Cap after signing Hossa, bringing up Ericsson and Howard. But, we are probably gonna lose two of them (Franzen, Hudler, Leino or Filppula(trade)) Edited February 17, 2009 by LeftWinger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Ah, another member of the "Lidstrom made a mistake or two this year and isn't putting up quite as many points, so he's only 50th or so among d-men now" club. That said, yes, Lilja is a very valuable PKer and I'd keep him over Lebda any day. Yes, thats it. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that Lilja is in his prime, and is having a career year, while Lidstrom will be in his 40s next year, and is having a "non-Lidstromesque" year already. If anyone recalls, the difference in 2 years from Chelios being nominated for the Norris to 2 years later was a world of difference. And Lilja has been an elite PKer this season. Thats not to say anything of the rest of his play. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 all the screaming about who is better, Huds, Flip, Franzen. Lets just sign Hossa long term, finish the season and see where we get in the playoffs! We do not need to make a decision on Flip, Huds or Franz until July 1. Most important, if Hossa is willing to sign here for a avergage of $6M then get him under contract, see where you stand AFTER the playoffs and make decisions then. This is a lot of distractions, even if we signed Hossa to a $10M contract today, Franzen to $6M and Huds to $7M, it wouldn't effect the Cap until next season! Most Important, GET HOSSA SIGNED! Let the rest fall where they may! Who knows, maybe Holland trades Kronwall to free up some cap space? Similar contract to Flip's, free's up $3M. If Ericsson is the ready for the NHL, then bring him on! Give him 2nd line minutes! Now you can bring up Kindl as well if you trade Kronner. I haven't looked through the other pages of this thread, but the Wings can't re-sign both Hossa and Franzen if they make a combined 9.4M - otherwise, we're over the cap for next year, and the tagging rule would force us to cut/move salary otherwise. So, essentially, if the Wings are looking at Hossa for 6 and Franzen for 3.5, they will make a trade by the deadline - they'd have to if they want them signed before the playoffs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mindfly Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Hossa 6M, Franzen 3M.. done kk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mark B 0 Report post Posted February 17, 2009 Hossa 6M, Franzen 3M.. done kk I don't think Hossa will sign for 6M, it would be nice but I think it will need to be more between 6.5 & 7M. Unless he gives us a big Hometown discount, lets hope. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
