Niedermayer cheap shot and brawl

[kidish 0]

Is this the first serious post-game scrum Detroit has been in? I'm real surprised by the reactions here. Maybe I've been watching too much Iginla in recent years, but...Hossa bumping Getz like he wants to start something, only to turtle when Getz comes after him...what did anyone expect?

I didn't like Niedermayer's elbow whatsoever, but it didn't seem "intentional" any more than Holmstrom's on Wis earlier in the series. And I give massive props to Datsyuk for going with him afterward. Neither of them are fighters, but it was good for both teams that their main leaders stepped up.

I have a hard time feeling bad for Raf though. Had it been any other game, he would have handed Perry his ass. But although nobody here will give any respect to Perry, he'll at least drop his gloves with anyone after one of his cheap shots. (Unlike an Ott or an Avery.)

The way I see it, this makes game seven between these two teams way more awesome. But I'm pretty surprised people here are claiming it was all Anaheim goonery--I don't know, hockey 10 years ago was this after practically every game. It's just hockey.

[IceMunkee 15]

We're lucky the Ducks don't send out their toughest guys to fight us.

We can't even beat up Niedermayer and Perry of all people.

Where are all those brave punches Datsyuk threw at Gary Roberts last year in the Finals when the refs were holding him?

FAIL

[hail2ducks 0]

wow, that was a dirty elbow for sure, payback is a ***** tho, should be a great game 7, and i have no idea who the hell is going to win.

[egroen 384]

We're lucky the Ducks don't send out their toughest guys to fight us.

We can't even beat up Niedermayer and Perry of all people.

Where are all those brave punches Datsyuk threw at Gary Roberts last year in the Finals when the refs were holding him?

Who the hell is going to be on the ice in the final minute of a 1-2 playoff game?

Would you prefer the Wings tank a few years, and trade away their assets in order to stockpile 1st round picks?

Because that is when north american players with size and skill are drafted. (Getzlaf, Perry and Ryan -- all 1st round picks)

Datsyuk was drafted in the 6th round and 171st overall and is now a Hart, Pearson and Selke finalist, and there is a certain element on this board that holds it against him that he is not a fighter???? Give me a break!

The Wings have stayed competitive for over 15 years, and unfortunately the price of doing so included trading away 1st round picks, and having to uncover gems late in the draft.

[T.Low 1,011]

Yeahhhh- Wiz's lung contusion wasn't the mitigating factor in his injury- it was the elbow from Holmstrom that he sees at least once a game during the regular season/playoffs.

Yeah, that was kinda obvious I thought, even to the worst of a Homer fan, but I guess I was mistaken. Wiznewski was out of commission before Holmer even got close to him.

ANd Holmstrom takes more f***in s*** (because they can't get him to leave his post infront of the crease) than any single player in the league, how 'bout a call once every couple of seasons, thats all I ask.

[hak 21]

Is this the first serious post-game scrum Detroit has been in? I'm real surprised by the reactions here. Maybe I've been watching too much Iginla in recent years, but...Hossa bumping Getz like he wants to start something, only to turtle when Getz comes after him...what did anyone expect?

I didn't like Niedermayer's elbow whatsoever, but it didn't seem "intentional" any more than Holmstrom's on Wis earlier in the series. And I give massive props to Datsyuk for going with him afterward. Neither of them are fighters, but it was good for both teams that their main leaders stepped up.

I have a hard time feeling bad for Raf though. Had it been any other game, he would have handed Perry his ass. But although nobody here will give any respect to Perry, he'll at least drop his gloves with anyone after one of his cheap shots. (Unlike an Ott or an Avery.)

The way I see it, this makes game seven between these two teams way more awesome. But I'm pretty surprised people here are claiming it was all Anaheim goonery--I don't know, hockey 10 years ago was this after practically every game. It's just hockey.

i'm not sure how much you have seen of perry but i have the exact opposite opinion of him..

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

If Niedermayer likes elbows so much, then he must have enjoyed the one Tie Domi gave him in the 2001 playoffs.

Too bad his career didn't end that night. Then we wouldn't have to see this s*** acting all tough now.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Is this the first serious post-game scrum Detroit has been in? I'm real surprised by the reactions here. Maybe I've been watching too much Iginla in recent years, but...Hossa bumping Getz like he wants to start something, only to turtle when Getz comes after him...what did anyone expect?

I didn't like Niedermayer's elbow whatsoever, but it didn't seem "intentional" any more than Holmstrom's on Wis earlier in the series. And I give massive props to Datsyuk for going with him afterward. Neither of them are fighters, but it was good for both teams that their main leaders stepped up.

I have a hard time feeling bad for Raf though. Had it been any other game, he would have handed Perry his ass. But although nobody here will give any respect to Perry, he'll at least drop his gloves with anyone after one of his cheap shots. (Unlike an Ott or an Avery.)

The way I see it, this makes game seven between these two teams way more awesome. But I'm pretty surprised people here are claiming it was all Anaheim goonery--I don't know, hockey 10 years ago was this after practically every game. It's just hockey.

The part in bold is the key point. This is not hockey 10 years ago it is hockey now. Like it or not (and there is good and bad about both) the rules are not the same. If it were 10 years ago there would have been a lot of calls for 2 line passes but those weren't called last night either. The rules have changed, and basically all of your descriptions of the events last night are incorrect.

[WingNutt 12]

Well this might be a blessing in disguise guys, They done pissed off Pavel, Marian, and pretty much the rest of our team, I wouldn't be surprised if Pavel got a few goals and 2-3 assist next game. We need to come out strong in game 7 and destroy the Ducks not just beat them, We need to DESTROY them, I'm thinking something along the lines of Game 7 against he Avs in 2002, when we took them out 7-0

Lets go Wings it all or nothing time

[ducks4cup 0]

I hated the gooning, but saw nothing coming from it, cause the NHL is spineless. But when Neidermeyer throws a ficious and intentional elbow to an unsuspecting Datsyuk after play has finished and its on film and nothing comes from it, the league's handling of the gooning Ducks yet again makes me want to puke.

Don't feel so spited. Nothing came out of the obvious Homer elbow either.

Obviously I don't like the elbow Nieds threw, but if you ask me the Homer elbow was worse. I know most wings fans don't thin it was intentional but I for sure think it was. Granted Nieds elbow looked harder Pav & Nieds had already engaged in a fight and Homer threw an elbow to an injured player.

[Guest micah]

what was Pav supposed to do, keep punching him in the visor and injure one of his hands?

Nope - peel Nieds' helmet off and let his breaking facial bones cushion the blows to Pavel's hands.

[Heaton 1]

Send a PM to a Mod if you have something you want to discuss about board rules or things of that nature.

[b.shanafan14 733]

OK, here's where the pro-"toughness" mass is completely and utterly in the wrong. There is a difference between being weak and being your team's "Gretzky". And there is a definitely a difference between being a good, tough hockey player, and being a cheap-shotting goon.

Only one player on the ice for the Wings have ever been in a fight (Hossa). Rafalski is a smaller defenseman who just returned from 2+ weeks of injury. Datsyuk is a Lady Byng perennial.

Getzlaf is a cartoonish bully, who goons it up every play and lives to play tough guy to those smaller than him especially (Hudler last game, Filppula near the bench last night). Perry is the biggest ***** I've ever seen wear the big girl pants, he has made a living out of hiding behind his windshield and only scrapping with those smaller than him, cause when he fights a Dallas Drake or John Ericsson he is exposed for the coward he is. And Neidermeyer, while without a technical track record, has a definitely tendency to get away with murder (as do all Ducks), ala the play on Holmstrom's head with Pronger two years ago and the mugging of Holmstrom which was allowed after the whistle in the game last night.

So lets see what transpired:

-Getzlaf throws serious gloved punches at the head of Hossa after the whistle because his outward bravado is so fragile that if you bump him he goes into a rage.

-Perry, in usual gutless fashion, starts throwing punches at a much smaller, skilled defenseman fresh from injury.

- Neidermeyer throws a vicious and no question intentional elbow to the head of Datsyuk, so that if it was an inch or two over, we're talking broken orbital bone and Datsyuk out.

Put your tough guy goggles away for a minute, stop hugging your McSorley plush doll, and realize that there is a huge difference between tough hockey, and no-balls goonery after realizing who you are on the ice against. And even better, this is coming from the same team that villified Holmstrom's inadvertent elbow on a guy who was crouched down behind his elbow, but the goonery of Game 6 is completely legit.

[ducks4cup 0]

Just watched it on my DVR this entire brawl started from a sucker punch to the side of Getzlaf's head by Hossa.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Don't feel so spited. Nothing came out of the obvious Homer elbow either.

Obviously I don't like the elbow Nieds threw, but if you ask me the Homer elbow was worse. I know most wings fans don't thin it was intentional but I for sure think it was. Granted Nieds elbow looked harder Pav & Nieds had already engaged in a fight and Homer threw an elbow to an injured player.

Incorrect on several counts, watch the video again Nieds and Pav were not engaged in a fight they were kind of holding each other back as is often done when there is a scrum with no intent to fight. It is debatable whether Homer's elbow was intentional, I happen to not think it was but I can see an argument that it was, there is no such argument regarding Nieds elbow. Additionally, you have that gutless wonder Perry going after a little guy who never fights and is just back from a multiple week injury. Not the Ducks finest moment - not that they have many.

[ducks4cup 0]

-Getzlaf throws serious gloved punches at the head of Hossa after the whistle because his outward bravado is so fragile that if you bump him he goes into a rage.

Hossa threw the first punch, a sucker punch to the side of Getz head. Nice try though man.

[kidish 0]

The part in bold is the key point. This is not hockey 10 years ago it is hockey now. Like it or not (and there is good and bad about both) the rules are not the same. If it were 10 years ago there would have been a lot of calls for 2 line passes but those weren't called last night either. The rules have changed, and basically all of your descriptions of the events last night are incorrect.

Hockey has changed over the past 10 years, some things better and some worse. Frankly, I hate elbows thrown in the game in any capacity. To me, it should be automatic. That sucked, and that's why I gave props to Datsyuk for stepping up after.

But one thing about hockey that hasn't changed is that what the league doesn't take care of, the players do. Game seven sees a target on Scotty's back, and what's bad about that from a Wings perspective?

Hell, every year in the playoffs, s***'s let go. But teams have to police that themselves. That hasn't changed in 10 years.

[T.Low 1,011]

Is this the first serious post-game scrum Detroit has been in? I'm real surprised by the reactions here. Maybe I've been watching too much Iginla in recent years, but...Hossa bumping Getz like he wants to start something, only to turtle when Getz comes after him...what did anyone expect?

I didn't like Niedermayer's elbow whatsoever, but it didn't seem "intentional" any more than Holmstrom's on Wis earlier in the series. And I give massive props to Datsyuk for going with him afterward. Neither of them are fighters, but it was good for both teams that their main leaders stepped up.

I have a hard time feeling bad for Raf though. Had it been any other game, he would have handed Perry his ass. But although nobody here will give any respect to Perry, he'll at least drop his gloves with anyone after one of his cheap shots. (Unlike an Ott or an Avery.)

The way I see it, this makes game seven between these two teams way more awesome. But I'm pretty surprised people here are claiming it was all Anaheim goonery--I don't know, hockey 10 years ago was this after practically every game. It's just hockey.

Although your "join date" of May '09 makes you a little suspect, and you're spot "off" on Neids elbow not being intentional and Hossa turtling, I have to agree with the gist and spirit of your post. Scrum on, boys, scrum on.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Just watched it on my DVR this entire brawl started from a sucker punch to the side of Getzlaf's head by Hossa.

Wow, that is just pathetically incorrect. Maybe you should watch your DVR again it starts with Getz hooking Hossa, then the two kind of shoulder each other. I guess a magic dragon in a Red Wings jersey came down and started throwing fireballs too?

[ducks4cup 0]

Wow, that is just pathetically incorrect. Maybe you should watch your DVR again it starts with Getz hooking Hossa, then the two kind of shoulder each other. I guess a magic dragon in a Red Wings jersey came down and started throwing fireballs too?

Just watched it again. Getz hooks Hossa, Hossa flails like a bird, Hossa turns and throws his arm/ glove into the side of Getz head, getz starts punching.

[ducks4cup 0]

Incorrect on several counts, watch the video again Nieds and Pav were not engaged in a fight they were kind of holding each other back as is often done when there is a scrum with no intent to fight. It is debatable whether Homer's elbow was intentional, I happen to not think it was but I can see an argument that it was, there is no such argument regarding Nieds elbow. Additionally, you have that gutless wonder Perry going after a little guy who never fights and is just back from a multiple week injury. Not the Ducks finest moment - not that they have many.

I was wrong on ONE account. Pav & Nieds were not already fighting.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Hockey has changed over the past 10 years, some things better and some worse. Frankly, I hate elbows thrown in the game in any capacity. To me, it should be automatic. That sucked, and that's why I gave props to Datsyuk for stepping up after.

But one thing about hockey that hasn't changed is that what the league doesn't take care of, the players do. Game seven sees a target on Scotty's back, and what's bad about that from a Wings perspective?

Hell, every year in the playoffs, s***'s let go. But teams have to police that themselves. That hasn't changed in 10 years.

Agreed, but my point is your post saying that this would have been acceptable 10 years ago doesn't change the fact that according to today's rules and interpretations (especially the last 5 minutes rule) make this a different situation than 10 years ago.

[Frozen-Man 144]

I was wrong on ONE account. Pav & Nieds were not already fighting.

First that was a big account as it was the main point of your post. Second, I contend that you are wrong because you compare as equal an elbow that may or may not have been intentional with one that definitely was.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Just watched it again. Getz hooks Hossa, Hossa flails like a bird, Hossa turns and throws his arm/ glove into the side of Getz head, getz starts punching.

Amazing, none of Ducks players started or did anything wrong.

[egroen 384]

Just watched it again. Getz hooks Hossa, Hossa flails like a bird, Hossa turns and throws his arm/ glove into the side of Getz head, getz starts punching.

I don't recall many singling out Getzlaf for a suspension. Whatever Hossa did to Getzlaf, or Getzlaf did to Hossa is not a free pass for Neidermayer and Perry to go after Datsyuk and Rafalski.

I am fine with no suspensions, but it is contradictory to current NHL rules. It just would be nice if the refs and actual NHL rulebook were on the same page. Don't create stupid rules out of thin air and then not enforce them, or enforce them only once in a blue moon - and only when it involves fringe players and not star players.