Duhatschek: Wings will successfully re-sign Hossa

[MannyK 16]

maybe if we lose, Hossa will go back to the Pens

Edited May 28, 2009 by MannyK

[puertoricanWingsfan 5]

If we resign Hossa, and we have him along with Z and Dats for a long time, how is that bad? "a lot of money tied up in old players" later down the road? how about "a lot of money tied up in great players"

[TheOwl 77]

The Wings have 5 million of cap space open for next season, assuming the cap doesn't change. They need a goalie (Howard at 0.7) and 4 forwards. If Hossa took 4 million like Franzen did, the Wings will have no room to sign anyone else, and won't be able to fill a roster. That means Helm, Leino, Hudler, Sammy and Kopetsky all will be let go. It's impossible without a significant trade. The books open a lot though for the 2010-2011 season with Lidstrom, Homer, and Maltby all possibly retiring. The Wings are in good shape long-term, but I don't see how Hossa will stay since trading Flipulla, Cleary or anyone signed for a significant amount of money is out of the question. Getting rid of Rafalski is really the only way to keep Hossa.

[Theophany 110]

If we resign Hossa, and we have him along with Z and Dats for a long time, how is that bad? "a lot of money tied up in old players" later down the road? how about "a lot of money tied up in great players"

Because we'll lose some of the depth, as I can't see signing Hudler, Sammy, and Kopecky under what they're going for right now, especially with how Hudler and Sammy have stepped up in the playoffs.

Hossa is great, but...

[YoungGuns1340 1]

The Wings have 5 million of cap space open for next season, assuming the cap doesn't change. They need a goalie (Howard at 0.7) and 4 forwards. If Hossa took 4 million like Franzen did, the Wings will have no room to sign anyone else, and won't be able to fill a roster. That means Helm, Leino, Hudler, Sammy and Kopetsky all will be let go. It's impossible without a significant trade. The books open a lot though for the 2010-2011 season with Lidstrom, Homer, and Maltby all possibly retiring. The Wings are in good shape long-term, but I don't see how Hossa will stay since trading Flipulla, Cleary or anyone signed for a significant amount of money is out of the question. Getting rid of Rafalski is really the only way to keep Hossa.

And Rafalski has an NTC. So does Cleary. And so does Stuart.

[egroen 384]

Flip would have to be traded - Samuelsson let go - Hudler would be a maybe.

And then there's the crazy idea -- that Hossa signs another one year deal (for pretty low), with the expectation that when Lidstrom is done with his $7.4 at the end of next year, Hossa gets some of what is saved by Lidstrom signing for less.

[stevie for president 42]

this is the 2008 offer sheet breakdown. it should be similar to 2009s since the cap should be about the same.

_,863,156 or less ......... none

_,863,157 - 1,307,811 ..... 3rd round pick

1,307,812 - 2,615,623 ..... 2nd round pick

2,615,624 - 3,923,434 ..... 1st and 3rd etc.

3,923,435 - 5,231,246 ..... 1st, 2nd and 3rd

5,231,247 - 6,539,061 ..... 1st x2, 2nd & 3rd

6,539,062 or more ......... 1st x4

where does hudler fall? 1.3-2.6 range?

if he signs for 1.7 or less, match it. anything more and take the 2nd rounder and keep hossa.

[Armyrulez 0]

Good Luck Wing fans, Hossa led us Pens fans on until June 30th last season and showed that he was not a man of his words, for your sakes, I hope he signs with you, but don't get your hopes up, looks like the Wings only have about 5 million in cap space available for next season, and I'm pretty sure that Mr. Hossa will not take that kind of discount for anyone.

[drwscc 212]

My feeling is, Hossa shoudl win his Cup this year (if the Hockey Gods will it) and then move on to a huge deal with the Kings or Oilers, the deals he passed up to sign here.

I just don't see that Holland would sacrifice our depth and the future of this team for one player. Since Conklin has already priced himself out of range, it looks like we're going with Ozzie/Howard as the tandem next year, barring any changes. So say we sign Hossa, and lose Hudler, Sammy, Leino, Kopay, etc, and are still right up against the cap. The Ozzie gets hurt right before the trade deadline, and is out for the season. Are we really comfortable hitting the playoffs with a Howard/Larsson tandem?

The cap wiggle room is necessary, and I don't think Holland is going to make any move that would jeopardize the team. Hossa, it's been real, but good luck in your future endeavors.

[Opie 308]

I just don't see how it will work, but I also never saw Hossa in the winged wheel to begin with.

I have no problems with one season and done, NONE, zero, zilc, nada. Marian Hossa was exactly as advertised for this one year!

If Holland and Hossa and Rich Winter get this done it would be an amazing feat and Hossa should get many many props for not taking the money and valuing winning and happiness over money.

Having said that, he would basically have to come out and say, I loved winning the cup/western conf with this team so much I will sign for a 3 mil cap hit. Other than that I really don't see Holland sacrificing depth for talent, especially the way this team finds diamonds in the rough.

But never rule anything out with Holland and Illitches at the forefront.

Best Org in the world since the 1980's easily, Most winning team since the 80's, org closest to a family in I don't know how long. Hossa seems to like those facts, can he live with 3-4 mil is the question

[Hockeymom1960 5,107]

Good Luck Wing fans, Hossa led us Pens fans on until June 30th last season and showed that he was not a man of his words, for your sakes, I hope he signs with you, but don't get your hopes up, looks like the Wings only have about 5 million in cap space available for next season, and I'm pretty sure that Mr. Hossa will not take that kind of discount for anyone.

He was with you, what, a total of 3 months??? Why do you think he owed you guys anything? He doesn't even owe the Wings anything. I guess we're different, we don't have high expectations and have enjoyed what we've had. I, for one, hope we can re-sign him.

[Armyrulez 0]

He was with you, what, a total of 3 months??? Why do you think he owed you guys anything? He doesn't even owe the Wings anything. I guess we're different, we don't have high expectations and have enjoyed what we've had. I, for one, hope we can re-sign him.

I never said, nor did I say that he owed the Pens anything. The fact is that behind closed doors, he told the Pens and Shero that he wanted to sign, which led us to pass on several free agents, including Ryan Malone, who could have and could still be helping this team right now. He stabbed Ray Shero in the back by taking the 1 year deal, when he had no intentions of re-signing, do I blame him? NO, he wanted to win a championship, and he was honest about that.......after the fact.

[WorkingOvertime 536]

If we resign Hossa, and we have him along with Z and Dats for a long time, how is that bad? "a lot of money tied up in old players" later down the road? how about "a lot of money tied up in great players"

Because we will have ~20 million tied up in four players that will be approaching 40 years old. If the cap is around 60 million in 2018 and you give the offense 40 million, there are only 20 million left to sign the other 8 forwards. The will leave an average of 2.5 million per player. While that doesn't sound bad now, we will need some (younger) players that can produce like Dats, Hossa, Z, and Franzen are doing right now. I don't think we can expect them to continue to lead the team in scoring as they approach 40. If we hope to develop and retain players like Flip, Leino, Helm, etc we will need the cap space to give them raises as they progress, or we will face losing the majority of our good prospects due to the salary cap. To me, a 32 year old Leino is better than a 37 year old Hossa. He would also (likely) be cheaper on the books. While Hossa would be great for making us competitive during the next 5 years, I fear that the team would deteriorate at our long tern players pass their prime.

[Opie 308]

Are you serious, Leino in no way shape or form can Hold Hossa's jock right now, he may not ever make this team, and yet you are sure he will be better than Hossa in 7 years, really I think a lot of people probably thought they would be better than a 37 year old Sundin too.

If you had gone with say Hudler, flip or you know another guy who has proven anything in the league your argument may have been stronger but as it is, Abdelkader has the same chance as Leino at being better than Hossa in 7 years, very little.

Hossa, Z, and Mule at age 37 big deal, the cap will have gone up by then or the league will be dispanded, or the cap will have gone down some where in the middle and player would have to (like after the lock out) restructure deals.

[NomadFromKazoo 42]

Because we will have ~20 million tied up in four players that will be approaching 40 years old. If the cap is around 60 million in 2018 and you give the offense 40 million, there are only 20 million left to sign the other 8 forwards

The salary cap is $56.7M. Your argument is predicated on it basically not going up for NINE years? So I agree on your arguments, "IF" what you say it true. What's preposterous is the assumption there is any chance it will be. Conservatively it will double in nine years. If we double your $40M assumption for forwards, we have $80M they still take up roughly $20M leaving $60M to sign the rest. This is in fact Holland's plan and not an accident.

Edited May 28, 2009 by NomadFromKazoo

[Mors 201]

Keep in mind that Hossa has already made over $40 million in his career, and he's 30 years old now. Maybe he's willing to take less just to retire with a solid team that has a legit shot at the cup year after year...we'll just have to see what happens.

[therock48880 14]

The Wings have 5 million of cap space open for next season, assuming the cap doesn't change. They need a goalie (Howard at 0.7) and 4 forwards. If Hossa took 4 million like Franzen did, the Wings will have no room to sign anyone else, and won't be able to fill a roster. That means Helm, Leino, Hudler, Sammy and Kopetsky all will be let go. It's impossible without a significant trade. The books open a lot though for the 2010-2011 season with Lidstrom, Homer, and Maltby all possibly retiring. The Wings are in good shape long-term, but I don't see how Hossa will stay since trading Flipulla, Cleary or anyone signed for a significant amount of money is out of the question. Getting rid of Rafalski is really the only way to keep Hossa.

Hossa's agent has already stated that the salary cap will not prevent him from re-signing in Detroit. None of us have ANY idea what's going on in Holland's office. All I know is, these "rumors" keep resurfacing. Where's there's smoke there's fire and personally, I think there is some substance to these rumors.

Edit: By the way, Holland has already stated that he's expecting the cap to go up by 2 million.

Edited May 28, 2009 by therock48880

[Armyrulez 0]

http://www.nj.com/devils/index.ssf/2009/05..._preparing.html

The cap could drop by as much as $2.5 million for the 2009-10 season from its current $56.7 million figure, according to NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly. Although Daly couldn't say, it is not inconceivable that the figure could fall to $50 million for the 2010-11 season.

Some cutting and belt tightening will have to be done by some, if not all. Hossa will not play for $2M/year.

[Konnan511 1,736]

Would be nice. He's still a rental until it's official.

This. I won't believe it until it actually happens. In my mind, If he doesn't take a cap hit of 4 mil or below Holland won't re-sign him plain and simple.

[Konnan511 1,736]

Hossa's agent has already stated that the salary cap will not prevent him from re-signing in Detroit. None of us have ANY idea what's going on in Holland's office. All I know is, these "rumors" keep resurfacing. Where's there's smoke there's fire and personally, I think there is some substance to these rumors.

Edit: By the way, Holland has already stated that he's expecting the cap to go up by 2 million.

What about all those rumors about Roy and the Avs? Rumors are simply that, rumors. Hossa has stated he'd like to sign long term here, which opened the flood-gates for the rumors to begin.

[WorkingOvertime 536]

From what I have read, there is talk of the cap slightly going down during the net few years. If that does happen, an increase in latter years may not mean a large increase in the cap from where it is now. I doubt we will se a 40+ million dollar increae in the salary cap over the next 8 years. If Holland plans on this, he is a lot less intellegnt than we thought.

Opie, I think you misinterpreted what I said. I did not say that Leino will ever be better than Hossa. A younger, lower paid skill player, is better to me than a ~40 year old star player being paid twice as much. Flip would have probbaly been a better example though.

Maybe Hossa will be producing in 8 years, maybe he won't. I would rather not take that chance since we will already have three other ~40 year old players (assuming we resign Dats), and have room to sign people in their peak. Do you really think that offense is the thing this team needs the most right now? I would rather keep our depth/younger players (Hudler, Leino, Helm), and have room for any needed toughness (Drake type) or another goalie (if Howard fails to preform) in the near future.

[talex 1]

I think to many assumptions are going on here, Holland is not a stupid man.

Everyone just assumes keeping Sammy, Leino, Hudler etc is even an option. If you listened to the announcers in the playoffs scouts were actively scouting Helm, Sammy will most certainly get a nice offer from somewhere else and IMO Hudler will probably get an offer that just will not make sense for the Wings to match. We are a season away from possibly dumping alot of cap space with Lids, Draper, Maltby and Homer possibly retiring and No. 5 heading to the rafters, at the very least I believe if Lids plays he will not demand nearly the same salary and it would not suprise me to see Z wearing the C sometime over the next 2 seasons.

Given these uncertainties with some of our depth UFA's and RFA's, it may make sense and does make sense to me to try and sign Hossa to a long term deal simular to the Mules and try your best for 1 season (It's not like with Hossa, Raf, Stuart, Big E, Lids, Z, Dats, Mule, Cleary, Kornner, Draper, Malts, Homer, Flip etc we would have a bad team, we would still have a top noth contending team with a definate shot at the cup) in order to have a solid team when the above mentioned retirements happen which will free up some money to fill in any gaps that may appear.

Some people will have to go, this has been made clear and guys like Sammy and Huds deserve their payday which we just may not be able to provide. I am perfectly fine with signing Hoss long term, next year we may loose a little depth sure, but it's not like we would not have a ligitimate shot at the cup and the year after barring a major drop in the cap we would be in great shape to fill gaps or tie down some depth guys.

Although I hate seeing some of our depth guys go, I feel it is inevitable and given that I am all for signing Hoss at this time with the team we could put on ice next year and the cap space freeing up the season after... future looks great either way, but I think it looks a little better with #81 around and a group of hungry youngsters...

Edited May 28, 2009 by talex

[stillwater 186]

No-trade clauses notwithstanding, trading one of Danny Cleary (who's trade value at the end of this playoff year will never be higher) or Brian Rafalski would easily free up room for Hossa.

Cleary and Rafalski are very good players, but Hossa is better than either ... and Cleary is a personal favorite.

There's also the possibilty of retirement from the likes of Draper, Holmstrom and/or Maltby ... all of whom are under contract for next season.

Don't want to see anyone leave, but a Hossa re-signing requires some collateral loss ... that's just the way it is.

Edited May 28, 2009 by stillwater

[Aussie_Wing 354]

Seriously, if we re-sign Hossa for Franzen money, who will we realistically have to let go?

I can't handle losing Hudler as he'll put up 70 points with someone next season. And Samuelsson comes to play every single time the playoffs roll around.

[talex 1]

No-trade clauses notwithstanding, trading one of Danny Cleary (who's trade value at the end of this playoff year will never be higher) or Brian Rafalski would easily free up room for Hossa.

Cleary and Rafalski are very good players, but Hossa is better than either ... and Cleary is a personal favorite.

There's also the possibilty of retirement from the likes of Draper, Holmstrom and/or Maltby ... all of whom are under contract for next season.

Don't want to see anyone leave, but a Hossa re-signing requires some collateral loss ... that's just the way it is.

I don't see them trading either. If anyone would be going it would probably be Flip which would free up 3.1 but he has been playing well as of the playoffs so I doubt that will happen. Again I do not see why anyone would have to go that will not probably go anyways. I think we field a good team next year no matter what happens, but with the timing of some players likely retiring next year or taking much smaller contracts I think you weather the storm next year with a still very competitive team and then fill gaps with the free'd up salary in 2011.