LGW is Pro-Enforcer: The Results are In.

[Doc Holiday 0]

For what it's worth; last night Moen was on the ice for 17:57, 1 assist, +2 rating, and no penalty...To me it seems as though the Wings could've used his abrasive play more than Williams scoring potential at the point - Ericsson, or Stuart are both capable of playing with Kronwall on the 2nd pp unit...Oh well.

It's been three games.

If we judged each player by their first couple games, Moen this year would be considered a better option than Hossa last year.

[Guest mindfly]

Btw what happend to that black dude not named Laraque or Brashear... hmm Peter Worrell... ? Quit after the lockout?

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Btw what happend to that black dude not named Laraque or Brashear... hmm Peter Worrell... ? Quit after the lockout?

I mentioned him earlier in the thread. He's currently coaching some minor league team.

He's Lilja's friend, so maybe PAIN TRAIN can convince him to come out of retirement. He'd be another big body in front of the net. About 6'7, 250 pounds that is.

He'd be a great fit in the "new NHL", since just about every team has an enforcer now.

Edited October 7, 2009 by GMRwings1983

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

For what it's worth; last night Moen was on the ice for 17:57, 1 assist, +2 rating, and no penalty...To me it seems as though the Wings could've used his abrasive play more than Williams scoring potential at the point - Ericsson, or Stuart are both capable of playing with Kronwall on the 2nd pp unit...Oh well.

Dude, haven't you heard? Because Moen is an enforcer, that means that he can't play in today's NHL. He's probably slow and takes many stupid penalties. That's why we acquired Eaves and Williams instead.

Basically, we could have gotten grittier with a Grier, Neil or Moen, yet Holland went the Eaves and Williams route, giving us 2 players that we didn't need. Not a very good mix of style if you ask me. Any of those 3 players I mentioned would have made this a more well rounded team. Either Holland is afraid of adding grit, or the gritty players don't want to play here as much as other places.

[Chunkylover 26]

Either Holland is afraid of adding grit, or the gritty players don't want to play here as much as other places.

Brilliant deduction, Holmes!

Of course by that logic you are either a pompous chump who actually believes he'd be a better GM than Ken Holland, or you're a thirteen-year-old pip-squeak who thinks he's the Tie Domi of the internet.

Again, no one here is anti-fighter, or anti-enforcer. Well, except your straw-man.

Holland made the decisions he thought would best position the team for success. Maybe he overstated Samuelsson's contribution to the powerplay, maybe he swallowed the "Eaves-is-the-next-Cleary" Kool-Aid, but that cannot possibly be known after only two games. The Wings aren't in the position they are for the lack of an enforcer.

Do the players he signed have a downside? Certainly, but so would Moen, Grier, Malhotra, Odjick....

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Brilliant deduction, Holmes!

Of course by that logic you are either a pompous chump who actually believes he'd be a better GM than Ken Holland, or you're a thirteen-year-old pip-squeak who thinks he's the Tie Domi of the internet.

Again, no one here is anti-fighter, or anti-enforcer. Well, except your straw-man.

Holland made the decisions he thought would best position the team for success. Maybe he overstated Samuelsson's contribution to the powerplay, maybe he swallowed the "Eaves-is-the-next-Cleary" Kool-Aid, but that cannot possibly be known after only two games. The Wings aren't in the position they are for the lack of an enforcer.

Do the players he signed have a downside? Certainly, but so would Moen, Grier, Malhotra, Odjick....

If you like me so much, why don't you just come out and ask for my phone number?

Edited October 7, 2009 by GMRwings1983

[Chunkylover 26]

If you like me so much, why don't you just come out and ask for my phone number?

Just because I disagree with your comments about Holland doesn't mean I have anything against you personally. I was being intentionally absurd to call your attention to your poorly-reasoned argument.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Just because I disagree with your comments about Holland doesn't mean I have anything against you personally. I was being intentionally absurd to call your attention to your poorly-reasoned argument.

In that case, thanks for the absurdity. Now I'm starting to pay attention to my argument.

[esteef 2,679]

For the record, NO ONE HERE IS A GENERAL MANAGER.

Now, can we stop using that as a retort to every idea or comment that might question a Holland decision? That's like saying no one can comment on the games unless they're a professional hockey player.

Carry on...

esteef

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Ladies and Gentlemen... For those of you that wonder why you have an enforcer, it is to make a player think twice about doing such an action as a dirty hit in the future. Please take exhibit A from last night's game.

Watch Shelley's hit that hurt the opposing player. See Shelley lose fight immediately against Ivanans. Momentum change, retribution, and a statement made within 1 minute 40 seconds.

Edited October 7, 2009 by E_S_A_D

[Broken 16 381]

I'm not 1 to bash Holland, but the bolded area above is spot on.

It's not spot on because he doesn't know s*** about anything Holland does or who he talks to. Holland made it pretty clear that he wasn't handing out multi-year deals to 4th line players. I know that Red Wing fans love to pretend that every player in the league is just clamoring to be on the Wings and will agree to any deal Holland throws at them just for the sake of being here. There is a reason why Moen isn't here and neither you nor GMR have an inkling of a clue as to why.

Jesus... get over it already.

[Chunkylover 26]

Ladies and Gentlemen... For those of you that wonder why you have an enforcer, it is to make a player think twice about doing such an action as a dirty hit in the future. Please take exhibit A from last night's game.

Watch Shelley's hit that hurt the opposing player. See Shelley lose fight immediately against Ivanans. Momentum change, retribution, and a statement made within 1 minute 40 seconds.

I still disagree with your premise that a fight sends the message that dirty hits are unacceptable. This is not the first of either for Shelley.

This really isn't Exhibit "A" proving the necessity of enforcers either. It does prove that Ivanans can and will drop the mits, but it doesn't prove that Shelley is going to think twice about a dirty hit. As I said before that whole shift is the metric by which guys like Shelley measure their effectiveness.

Additionally, isn't Ivanans a wussy European?

[Broken 16 381]

I have never claimed to know the inner details of whom Holland may, or may not want to sign (and if you took the time to read another post that I made - you would've seen how a guy like Moen may not want to play in Detroit).

It's my personal opinion of another posters' opinion that I found "spot on"; who are you again to say otherwise?

Get over yourself pal...Try contributing something useful please...Otherwise the mods will be in here deleting needless posts such as yours (and soon to be mine).

Agreeing that Holland may be afraid to sign gritty players makes you look dumb. Sorry.

We all know that next season will be a big year contract wise. Is it really that hard to grasp that Holland and Co. are probably waiting to see how the contracts shake out before committing to multi-year deals for limited players? Oh yea... Moen is kicking ass two games in. Maybe we should dump Datsyuk and get him while we can. Lol.

Edited October 7, 2009 by Broken 16

[Broken 16 381]

It may not sway Shelley from making dirty hits, but there's always the possibility a future opponent seeing this, and thinking twice.

Agitators LOVE pissing people off. Even enforcers. That's what they do. If you think that the presence of some pseudo enforcer like Moen or Grier is going to make them think twice... guess again.

I can hear it now:

Coach: Hey, get in there and stir things up.

Player: No way! Moen is out there!

Hehe. Funny.

Use up a precious roster spot for a "future possibility"? Don't quit your day job.

Edited October 7, 2009 by Broken 16

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Use up a precious roster spot for a "future possibility"? Don't quit your day job.

None of us are going to be quitting our day jobs, we are all too busy being Assistant GM's.

[Broken 16 381]

None of us are going to be quitting our day jobs, we are all too busy being Assistant GM's.

I have no clue wether you or GMR or F.Mike have ever played a single shift of hockey, but NOBODY I have ever played with was ever afraid to take a few punches in order to get something done. This presumption that some random NHL'er is gonna see highlights of some Red Wing beating someone up on Sportscenter and decide that they better not not mess with the Wings is hilarious.

[Doc Holiday 0]

It may not sway Shelley from making dirty hits, but there's always the possibility a future opponent seeing this, and thinking twice.

You are kidding right?

A video is never going to scare some player into not making a hit that they aren't even thinking about anyways.

Shelley didn't think about enforcers when he made that hit.

Lappy didn't think about enforcers when he hit Lidstrom.

Moore didn't think about enforcers when he hit Naslund (was it Naslund?).

I mean you could consider that cheap hit momentum for the Sharks, because after the hit, the Sharks scored four straight goals. Four straight powerplay goals. Perhaps when people see video of that they will make a cheap hit then rely on their powerplay to win the game for them.

Edited October 7, 2009 by Doc Holiday

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

I have no clue wether you or GMR or F.Mike have ever played a single shift of hockey, but NOBODY I have ever played with was ever afraid to take a few punches in order to get something done. This presumption that some random NHL'er is gonna see highlights of some Red Wing beating someone up on Sportscenter and decide that they better not not mess with the Wings is hilarious.

Would you rather bully someone who has protection or someone who doesn't have protection?

It's a no brainer. Of course teams are going to act tougher against the Wings than against the Flyers or Maple Leafs. It's always easy to play rough when you don't have to answer to anyone for it. You never played hockey with this Wings team, so you don't know anything about it either.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Tomorrow night Kopecky will run our star players on every shift.

Then, the anti-enforcer posters will be clamoring for an enforcer to be inserted into the lineup. Now that would be hilarious.

[Doc Holiday 0]

Only Red Wing fans would come to this conclusion

Seriously though - not so much the video, but the action itself of opposing teammates ganging up on you to seek revenge for a dirty hit just might sway some (read not all) to refrain from certain actions on ice...Why else do these types of players (guys whom will drop the mitts) continue to hold onto roster spots on many teams throughout the NHL?...Just because you, and some other posters here feel differently - it won't exactly sway the opinion of many current GMs who feel differently.

Because fighting is prevelant in the NHL and GMs believe that having one is important in some instances, whether it be entertainment or because the team is based on grit. They have plenty of their reasons.

I never said that GMs think they are worthless, just that I do not see the importance in the big picture to an enforcer. GMs keeping them in the NHL doesn't make my point automatically incorrect. That is an argument from authority.

[uk_redwing 495]

Tomorrow night Kopecky will run our star players on every shift.

Then, the anti-enforcer posters will be clamoring for an enforcer to be inserted into the lineup. Now that would be hilarious.

Tomas Kopecky will turn on Detroit like he turned on Patrick Sharp and Scott May. There will be nowhere to hide.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Perhaps when people see video of that they will make a cheap hit then rely on their powerplay to win the game for them.

Doc, may I use this as my signature with your permission? With a side note that this was mentioned in an enforcer thread?

[Doc Holiday 0]

Doc, may I use this as my signature with your permission? With a side note that this was mentioned in an enforcer thread?

Under what context?

[C-TownWing 0]

I'd take our Cup teams from 97/98 over our 08 Cup team any day of the week

1997: 38-26-18, didn't win division

1998: 44-23-15, didn't win division

2008: 54-21-7, won President's Trophy

(all three won the Cup obviously)

Don't fall into the stereotype most of us have of you guys, that you'd rather beat 'em in an alley than on the ice. I'll take the team that wins more, thank you.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Under what context?

I can preface it as "Genius Doc Holiday Quote"?