Jimmy Howard

[interminded 1]

Let me start by saying I think Jimmy has been playing well, and I think he should be starting over Osgood until he shows otherwise.

BUT I think it's an exaggeration to say he's stealing games for us. He's been giving the team a chance to win (when they score friggin goals). He still needs to work on his rebound control, and he really needs to work on his decision-making about playing the puck. But considering he's a rookie, he's looking good.

It's hard to show for him if he doesn't get any playing time.

Even if Ozzie was playing well, he wouldn't let Howard sit this many games out.

Sometimes stinks here..

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Can we agree that goaltending is the least of the Wings problems? I have been quite surprised by Howard, I thought he would be good but I wasn't expecting this. And he seemes to improve just about every game, sure he takes a stumble every once in awhile but he comes back the next game like it didn't happen. He will steal games for this team, it's only a matter of time and experience.

absolutely. Jimmy spent so much time in the minors I didn't know what to expect when he finally got his shot with the Wings. He's proving why he was picked in the first place.

[Reis710 3]

Howard is getting the job done, He has played less games then Nabokov, and Broduer, but the fact that he is even close to them means something. We got a great kid in net. Everyone says Detroit doesn't have a goalie. Well they are wrong. We got exactly what we need, a goalie getting the job done in the regular season, and another that flips the switch in the playoffs. In my opinion with the injuries this team has right now Jimmy Howard has done great, and really I don't have a doubt that if the Wings didn't have all these injuries that Howard could be top 5 in the league right now in goalie standings. We are playing much better defensively because the team knows that Howard can handle it. Now imagine how well he would play with Ericsson, Kronwall, and even Lilja at the back instead of Meech, Lebda and Janik. He was raw early on in the season which is why he didn't do that great when Kronwall and Ericsson were not injured, but now he has the confidence.

I believe in this kid, hes going to have a good number of NHL games under his belt this year, and hopefully get something in the playoffs, depending on how Ozzie feels during playoffs. This team may be struggling this year. But next year we will be right back at the top. With a Solid goalie in net.

[Mickeyisms Rule! 0]

It's hard to show for him if he doesn't get any playing time.

Even if Ozzie was playing well, he wouldn't let Howard sit this many games out.

Sometimes stinks here..

Life sometimes does stink. You know we are all getting older. Having just turned 40 recently, I have had to come to terms with the fact that I will never be a sports star, no matter how hard I try.

Ozzie has been a star, but the doubts that he placed on us last year during his struggles have come back to haunt him this year. As long as Howard is playing like he is, Ozzie will only get starts on back-to-back games. The starting job was really Ozzie's to lose, even though he had a GAA of of 3 last year (3.09).

This season he started 18 games. In those 18 games he has posted a .901 Sv% and a 2.72 GAA. It isn't like he hasn't played at all this season.

Howard has posted a 2.25 GAA and a .925 Sv% in 24 games this season.

If Howard loses his edge, I fully expect Ozzie to begin starting regularly again. But for as long as Howard has the hot hand, he won't.

I'm not an Ozzie-hater. I am not a Howard lover. I am a Red Wings fan, and all I want is for the person that starts in goal to be the person that best gives the Wings a chance to win. This season so far, it has been Howard.

[Broken 16 381]

Ever gone fishing? There is a thing called casting out a fishing line and TROLLING to get a fish to bite.

BAITING is another term for the same concept.

But my entire point is it isn't necessary to gush over a specific player over and over and over and over again, just as it isn't necessary to bash a specific player over and over and over again. I'm happy for Howard just like I am happy for Bertuzzi but I don't think we need to reiterate that he is doing a good job every week.

Osgood made those idiotic comments only a couple days ago. I have no guilt bashing him for it.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Osgood made those idiotic comments only a couple days ago. I have no guilt bashing him for it.

You bashed him for what he said before you even actually read what he said. You had your mind made up before you even knew what the hell you were talking about.

You hate Osgood. That's fine. But in goalie discussions it make you no better than the Ozzy apologists here.

EDIT: Here's the posts I'm referring to. Your reply is a couple below it.

Edited January 2, 2010 by haroldsnepsts

[cmonster 11]

Is Jimmy Howard playing lights out, world class goaltending? No. Is he doing enough to get this team some wins, yes.

For the most part we need solid goaltending. Not spectacular goaltending. And it isn't about the number of saves or gaa, its about making the saves we need him to make at crucial times.

[RedWingsRox 614]

Another JH convert here. The kid has earned my respect, he is a bright spot for the Wings this season. I am pleasantly surprised by his play and statistically, he is doing very well for a kid and gives us a chance to win on most nights. Honestly, you can't ask for anything more than that.

[Broken 16 381]

You bashed him for what he said before you even actually read what he said. You had your mind made up before you even knew what the hell you were talking about.

You hate Osgood. That's fine. But in goalie discussions it make you no better than the Ozzy apologists here.

EDIT: Here's the posts I'm referring to. Your reply is a couple below it.

It wasn't hard to gauge the post responses. I think I learned that in second grade. It was fairly obvious that Osgood was whining. Lo and behold... I read the article and it was true. Osgood was whining to the press. Failure on his part imo.

I've never said I hate Osgood. I hate his approach to the regular season though. And I don't appreciate him undermining Babcock. And I definitely don't appreciate the sense of entitlement he conveys in that article. As if Babcock is just supposed to ignore Jimmy's progress and the teams immediate needs because 'He Is Chris Osgood'. f*** him.

[King Crane 289]

Please don't feed the trolls.

Win

--------------------------

Jimmy has been doing well lately. He has come a long way and has really improved as a player. This said, however, I do not think he will ever be "Ryan-Miller-Great"

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

It wasn't hard to gauge the post responses. I think I learned that in second grade. It was fairly obvious that Osgood was whining. Lo and behold... I read the article and it was true. Osgood was whining to the press. Failure on his part imo.

I've never said I hate Osgood. I hate his approach to the regular season though. And I don't appreciate him undermining Babcock. And I definitely don't appreciate the sense of entitlement he conveys in that article. As if Babcock is just supposed to ignore Jimmy's progress and the teams immediate needs because 'He Is Chris Osgood'. f*** him.

And this right here pretty much sums up your ignorance on the subject.

[Broken 16 381]

And this right here pretty much sums up your ignorance on the subject.

Enlighten me

[FedorovGurl 2]

Maybe you shouldn't watch then. I think the Pistons are on, go watch them.

Jimmy has a .921 save percentage, tied with that Brodeur guy for 8th and a 2.25 GAA which is also 8th just ahead od Nabokov. What exactly can't you watch?

Oh I see ... someone states an opinion different than yours so they should switch sports right? Take a break from your throne, crown, and scepter sometime and look up the definition of "forum"?

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

Enlighten me

Osgood never said he wanted playing time simply because he is Chris Osgood.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

It wasn't hard to gauge the post responses. I think I learned that in second grade. It was fairly obvious that Osgood was whining. Lo and behold... I read the article and it was true. Osgood was whining to the press. Failure on his part imo.

I've never said I hate Osgood. I hate his approach to the regular season though. And I don't appreciate him undermining Babcock. And I definitely don't appreciate the sense of entitlement he conveys in that article. As if Babcock is just supposed to ignore Jimmy's progress and the teams immediate needs because 'He Is Chris Osgood'. f*** him.

You don't have to say it. You had your mind made up before you even knew what you were talking about, then you focused on the tiny art of that article and made it fit your preconceived notion.

You don't have to say you hate Osgood. It's obvious from what you've posted and the conclusions you've jumped to.

[Broken 16 381]

You don't have to say it. You had your mind made up before you even knew what you were talking about, then you focused on the tiny art of that article and made it fit your preconceived notion.

You don't have to say you hate Osgood. It's obvious from what you've posted and the conclusions you've jumped to.

At least do a little research on my feelings about Osgood before you tell ME what I think about him and when I felt this way. You accuse me of pre-judging Osgood while you pre-judge me. Brilliant. Search my posts before these threads and show me where I ever implied that I hate Osgood. You guys throw that word around too much.

It's always black and white with you guys. You either hate Osgood or you love him. Well, the world don't work that way beyond a message board bro. Right now I'm pissed at Osgood for his nonchalant approach to the regular season, because he undermined Babcock to the press and because he questioned Babcocks authority as head coach. Telling the press that he knows more about goaltending than Babcock. Might be true but you sure as f*** don't tell the press that. Long story short, Osgood f***ed up and looks like a whiny *****. Get over it.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

At least do a little research on my feelings about Osgood before you tell ME what I think about him and when I felt this way. You accuse me of pre-judging Osgood while you pre-judge me. Brilliant. Search my posts before these threads and show me where I ever implied that I hate Osgood. You guys throw that word around too much.

It's always black and white with you guys. You either hate Osgood or you love him. Well, the world don't work that way beyond a message board bro. Right now I'm pissed at Osgood for his nonchalant approach to the regular season, because he undermined Babcock to the press and because he questioned Babcocks authority as head coach. Telling the press that he knows more about goaltending than Babcock. Might be true but you sure as f*** don't tell the press that. Long story short, Osgood f***ed up and looks like a whiny *****. Get over it.

you're hilarious. How about you try reading my posts. I think he's a good goalie, but I don't love Ozzy. I've said in multiple threads Jimmy should be starting over him, and that Ozzy has let in backbreaking goals, and that stats don't tell the whole story as to why Jimmy should be starting.

The difference is that my posts have to do with how I think the two goalies are actually playing on the ice. You're bashing Osgood for something you imagine he thinks and feels. Aside from that being a little crazy, it also reveals how your feelings about Osgood extend beyond how he's played on the ice.

How do you know his approach is nonchalant? He could be busting his ass every day. He could be obsessing about it every minute. It could be keeping him up nights. All we know is he isn't playing well. That doesn't necessarily mean he's being nonchalant. It doesn't necessarily mean he's not trying. We don't know. But since you dont like him, to you that must mean that he's half assing it. That's what gets me. I understand being pissed at him for the goals he lets in, or not playing well, but inventing stuff about his mindset and life off the ice?? how could we know?

If you don't like Ozzy, it's going to sound like whining. If you love Ozzy, it'll probably sound like a guy who's competitive and really wants to play. The truth is it's only a few quotes used in an article with very little context.

[Broken 16 381]

you're hilarious. How about you try reading my posts. I think he's a good goalie, but I don't love Ozzy. I've said in multiple threads Jimmy should be starting over him, and that Ozzy has let in backbreaking goals, and that stats don't tell the whole story as to why Jimmy should be starting.

The difference is that my posts have to do with how I think the two goalies are actually playing on the ice. You're bashing Osgood for something you imagine he thinks and feels. Aside from that being a little crazy, it also reveals how your feelings about Osgood extend beyond how he's played on the ice.

How do you know his approach is nonchalant? He could be busting his ass every day. He could be obsessing about it every minute. It could be keeping him up nights. All we know is he isn't playing well. That doesn't necessarily mean he's being nonchalant. It doesn't necessarily mean he's not trying. We don't know. But since you dont like him, to you that must mean that he's half assing it. That's what gets me. I understand being pissed at him for the goals he lets in, or not playing well, but inventing stuff about his mindset and life off the ice?? how could we know?

If you don't like Ozzy, it's going to sound like whining. If you love Ozzy, it'll probably sound like a guy who's competitive and really wants to play. The truth is it's only a few quotes used in an article with very little context.

So, he's either busting his ass and isn't good enough or he isn't busting his ass and Babcock is punishing him. Whatever. Take your pick.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

So, he's either busting his ass and isn't good enough or he isn't busting his ass and Babcock is punishing him. Whatever. Take your pick.

I don't know which and dont' care. I just know if he expects to start, he needs to play better.

You're apparently the one who's the expert on his mindset.

[Broken 16 381]

I don't know which and dont' care. I just know if he expects to start, he needs to play better.

You're apparently the one who's the expert on his mindset.

Ok... so we agree that Osgood needs to earn his starts like everyone else and he shouldn't be spouting off to the press about it. Right?

So what's the problem? Babcock says all the time: "Each season is a new start and guys have to earn their spots all over again"... or something to that effect.

[Outsider 42]

Ok... so we agree that Osgood needs to earn his starts like everyone else and he shouldn't be spouting off to the press about it. Right?

So what's the problem? Babcock says all the time: "Each season is a new start and guys have to earn their spots all over again"... or something to that effect.

He "earned" another Start after the Nashville Game. He didn't get it.

Had he gotten it, he would have faced Phoenix. Had he won that Game, he might have "earned" a shot at Tampa Bay. As his record against the Lightning is 17-0, I'd say there's a good chance he would've Won that Game. Had he done so, might have "earned" the Start against Dallas. Considering Osgood's very good record against Dallas, and Turco's s***ty record against Detroit, and the fact that that Game had "Win" written all over it had Howard NOT crapped the bed that night, I'd say there's a pretty good chance that Oz could've Won that Game, too. That may have "earned" him the Start against Chicago.

And while he DID eventually get that Start, had he been "rewarded" for his great Game against Nashville, (as you insist Babcock is wont to do with those who "earn" playing time by a good performance), he might have come into that Chicago Game with 4 additional Games under his belt, and on a potential 4 Game Winning streak, and with his confidence riding high.

Rather than being thrown in there, absolutely cold, on the second night of back-to-back Games.

Edited January 2, 2010 by Outsider

[Broken 16 381]

He "earned" another Start after the Nashville Game. He didn't get it.

Had he gotten it, he would have faced Phoenix. Had he won that Game, he might have "earned" a shot at Tampa Bay. As his record against the Lightning is 17-0, I'd say there's a good chance he would've Won that Game. Had he done so, might have "earned" the Start against Dallas. Considering Osgood's very good record against Dallas, and Turco's s***ty record against Detroit, and the fact that that Game had "Win" written all over it had Howard NOT crapped the bed that night, I'd say there's a pretty good chance that Oz could've Won that Game, too. That may have "earned" him the Start against Chicago.

And while he DID eventually get that Start, had he been "rewarded" for his great Game against Nashville, (as you insist Babcock is wont to do with those who "earn" playing time by a good performance), he might have come into that Chicago Game with 4 additional Games under his belt, and on a potential 4 Game Winning streak, and with his confidence riding high.

Rather than being thrown in there, absolutely cold, on the second night of back-to-back Games.

Unlike you, I don't presume to know what it takes to earn a spot on a team run by Mike Babcock. I just assume that in some fashion... Chris Osgood is failing. That's HIS problem. Not ours and, surely, not Mike Babcock's.

[Outsider 42]

Unlike you, I don't presume to know what it takes to earn a spot on a team run by Mike Babcock. I just assume that in some fashion... Chris Osgood is failing. That's HIS problem. Not ours and, surely, not Mike Babcock's.

Or, as I, (and a few others), have been stating, it could have something to do with this:

Babcock regarding Osgood being benched - From MLive

"Sometimes when things are taken away from you that you really value, and that's competing......."

Or when Babs was recently quoted as saying that Osgood needs to be "at his best", and concluded the statement with '.....no one likes to watch the other guy playing."

Again....jabjab.....pokepoke. Just as with Conklin last year.

Now...HERE'S an interesting Quote from Babcock:

From MLive

From the 2007-2008 Season, the year Osgood was an "All-Star",:

Said Babcock: "Ozzie's playing good, but I need to get Dom back in there and get him rolling, too."

Now.....

Bear in mind that this was during a period of time where Osgood was posting a record of 9-1, with a GAA of 1.70, and a SVP of .935.

Wow. Interesting that, although Osgood was performing like a Vezina Candidate, Babcock still felt the "need", (his words), to get Dom "back in there" and "rolling".

For the record, Dom got the next FOUR Starts after that Game. Regardless of how well Osgood was playing.

Edited January 2, 2010 by Outsider

[Broken 16 381]

Or, as I, (and a few others), have been stating, it could have something to do with this:

Babcock regarding Osgood being benched - From MLive

"Sometimes when things are taken away from you that you really value, and that's competing......."

Or when Babs was recently quoted as saying that Osgood needs to be "at his best", and concluded the statement with '.....no one likes to watch the other guy playing."

Again....jabjab.....pokepoke. Just as with Conklin last year.

Now...HERE'S an interesting Quote from Babcock:

From MLive

From the 2007-2008 Season, the year Osgood was an "All-Star",:

Now.....

Bear in mind that this was during a period of time where Osgood was posting a record of 9-1, with a GAA of 1.70, and a SVP of .935.

Wow. Interesting that, although Osgood was performing like a Vezina Candidate, Babcock still felt the "need", (his words), to get Dom "back in there" and "rolling".

For the record, Dom got the next FOUR Starts after that Game. Regardless of how well Osgood was playing.

Does any of this validate Osgood's choice to whine and undermine Babcock to the press?

[Outsider 42]

Does any of this validate Osgood's choice to whine and undermine Babcock to the press?

Firstly, I don't consider Osgood to be whining. He's pissed.

Secondly, had you actually read the thread, you'd have noted my EARLIER POST, wherein I stated that although I agree with what Osgood had to say, I disagree with the fact that he popped off about it in the Press, and that I further think that it is definitely not the best way to go about rectifying the situation.

You did read the thread, right? Or are you simply a s***-stirrer, too?