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Osgood may retire following this season


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#121 Doc Holliday

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 12:38 PM

Actually I argued Howard needed the experience and has been brought along to be put in this position and our head coach thought he was ready, went for it, and he was right. You're arguing he was wrong, even though he was in fact right. Howard working out wasn't a random event, it was the assessment of our head coach. Our head coach was right, that's not just a lucky occurrence.


I didn't say it was random, but I said that putting Detroit's playoff hopes on giving your rookie goaltender every game and keeping your backup completely cold was incredibly risky.


Well, the most specific statement I saw is we are putting our eggs in one basket. Realistically when teams goalie's flop they're usually toast in the playoffs and you win by having your guy ready, not having your backup guy ready.


I'm not talking playoffs.

Howard needed the experience and is a young guy.


Yes.

Babcock was obviously focusing on preparing him, it was the right call.


That is incorrect, as Babcock stated numerous times his goal was to make the playoffs, which was what his decision was based on.

To get Ozzie ready as well was completely impractical.


That wasn't what I said at all.

A couple of starts would have made little difference and if Howard flopped we'd already be in a deep hole. So what if he had a couple more starts? No way we do that if Babcock thinks Howard needs the starts. I thought you had to be looking for more then that, but if you're saying that's as deep as your argument went, if Howard flopped Ozzie wasn't ready, then sure, but you didn't solve that problem either.


I'm not talking playoffs. I'm talking if Howard simply was on a hot streak, got cold and then we had nothing else to go for. Howard was not an established goaltender and did not impress until this year. It is a huge gamble to give him Marty Brodeur type playing time in his first real season when that didn't need to be the case.

I think you aren't grasping my position correctly, here.

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#122 NomadFromKazoo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 01:29 PM

I'm not talking playoffs. I'm talking if Howard simply was on a hot streak, got cold and then we had nothing else to go for. Howard was not an established goaltender and did not impress until this year. It is a huge gamble to give him Marty Brodeur type playing time in his first real season when that didn't need to be the case.

I think you aren't grasping my position correctly, here.

OK, but I don't see how it mattered that much between Ozzie playing a few games and barely playing at all in terms of Ozzie really being ready to play. With huge chunks of our team out huge chunks of the season we were in playoff win now or go home mode anyway. If Howard had gone cold and we lost even more games, even Ozzie playing a little was going to have a tough time making the playoffs anyway. Our eggs were really in the Howard basket at that point anyway.

When we had two vets, like Hasek and Ozzie, what you're saying makes perfect sense. But with Howard it really made sense to just play him and sink or swim rather then taking starts away so there is the remotest of chances that at that point Ozzie could pull it out.
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#123 Doc Holliday

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 01:40 PM

OK, but I don't see how it mattered that much between Ozzie playing a few games and barely playing at all in terms of Ozzie really being ready to play. With huge chunks of our team out huge chunks of the season we were in playoff win now or go home mode anyway. If Howard had gone cold and we lost even more games, even Ozzie playing a little was going to have a tough time making the playoffs anyway. Our eggs were really in the Howard basket at that point anyway.

When we had two vets, like Hasek and Ozzie, what you're saying makes perfect sense. But with Howard it really made sense to just play him and sink or swim rather then taking starts away so there is the remotest of chances that at that point Ozzie could pull it out.


My main gripe was with how Babcock started things, which progressively caused him to keep Osgood on the pine and keep Howard in net.

Basically I think he caused the problem to snowball on himself. Would a few starts here and there make a big difference? Not likely, no. But I believe that Osgood should have at least had a start between his win in Nashville and his loss in Chicago. And I think that if Osgood really wasn't as up to snuff as Babcock thought, then Howard should have been given the away start against Chicago and Osgood the Dallas and Chicago home start.

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#124 NomadFromKazoo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 01:56 PM

Basically I think he caused the problem to snowball on himself

I still don't see there was a "problem" at all

And I think that if Osgood really wasn't as up to snuff as Babcock thought, then Howard should have been given the away start against Chicago and Osgood the Dallas and Chicago home start.

I don't see any evidence Babcock thought Ozzie "wasn't up to snuff." Howard needed the work and was playing well. He's young and could handle the load and needed to keep gaining experience. We brought Howard along plenty slowly, it's his time now. Ozzie's sun is setting. That fully explains everything that happened.
Frank Herbert: Fear is the mind-killer

Groucho Marx: Sincerity is the key to success. If you can fake that, you've got it made

George Patton: If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking

Doctor Who: Don't turn your back, don't look away, and don't blink

#125 Doc Holliday

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 02:12 PM

I still don't see there was a "problem" at all


This is where we are going to have to agree to disagree.


I don't see any evidence Babcock thought Ozzie "wasn't up to snuff." Howard needed the work and was playing well. He's young and could handle the load and needed to keep gaining experience. We brought Howard along plenty slowly, it's his time now. Ozzie's sun is setting. That fully explains everything that happened.


Once again, agree to disagree.

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#126 Broken 16

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 03:27 PM

A lot of users on LGW are like that. Don't know if that's a good or bad thing.



Heh... I'm kinda like that sometimes. Though Doc definitely takes it to all new levels. I think it stems from boredom. At least in my case it does. :)

Plus a good debate does a mind good once in a while, even if it's about black tape or white tape.

Edited by Broken 16, 25 July 2010 - 03:31 PM.


#127 NomadFromKazoo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 03:41 PM

This is where we are going to have to agree to disagree.




Once again, agree to disagree.

Yep, no where to go from here. I'd have had no problem if Babcock had followed your view either. I'm not arguing Ozzie should have been shut out of starting as he was. I'm just not seeing an issue with Howard getting all the turns since Babcock felt he was ready and now he's all the more experienced going into this year. I think the Junes were catching up to us and a young goalie who hasn't played that many games has us better positioned for this year. So I don't just see it working out in that Howard went the distance, but we're that much better off in October as well. But I got no where new to go. Cheers!
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#128 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 08:22 PM

That is incorrect, as Babcock stated numerous times his goal was to make the playoffs, which was what his decision was based on.


Considering the circumstances, he had no choice but to go with the hot hand.

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#129 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 11:56 AM

As the season progresses, I have a feeling that this is indeed his last year.

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#130 edicius

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 12:01 PM

As the season progresses, I have a feeling that this is indeed his last year.


I'm thinking that too. I'm hoping he gets a chance to pass Fuhr on the all-time wins list.

And you just know that the Wings will keep him in the organization in some capacity. Unless Stevie Y snatches him up to be a goaltending coach.

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#131 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 12:03 PM

I'd like to see that. He just didn't look right in New York or St. Louis.

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#132 WizardOfOz30

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 12:53 PM

I really was hoping he'd have a good season and before his injury it looked like he might have had a chance at it. Sadly, I have a feeling he'll be in the same boat as last year, lucky to get in and play. I'd like him to at least get his 400 wins.

I agree about the Wings keeping him here, hope it happens. He'd be a great coach someday.

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"If I could sum up my career in Detroit, I was a perfect goalie for the team at the perfect time. I just wanted to be a Red Wing, that's it." Chris Osgood, July 19, 2011

#133 Broken 16

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:02 PM

I'm not a basher. I actually have a lot of respect for Osgood and appreciate his time here. But he has worn on my nerves bad the past couple seasons. I'll be glad to see him gone.

#134 Dimaline312000

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:38 PM

No offense to Ozzie but I hope he does Retire. He has been my favorite goalie for years and I'm very happy and thankful he is on this roster and what he has done with this team. However, when it's your time to hang it up it's just that time. I wish him all the best and no matter what he decides I'll be happy for him.

#135 mindfly

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:51 PM

As the season progresses, I have a feeling that this is indeed his last year.

Let's all hope so...

#136 hooon

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 01:53 PM

I still believe in you Ozzie!!!

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#137 VM1138

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 02:09 PM

I think he'll retire, not because he can't play the game, but who wants to play backup forever? I think his heart is with Detroit, so he won't request a trade or sign somewhere else even though he still has talent. Aside from Yzerman, Osgood is the other player I most associate with Detroit from this most recent generation or so. The man has the Winged Wheel tatooed on his heart.
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#138 Hockeytown0001

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 04:21 PM

It won't be retired, but nobody will wear 30 in Detroit for a long time after Ozzie hangs 'em up.

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#139 55fan

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 05:02 PM

As long as he goes out with a Cup over his head.

I'd love to see him get one last Hurrah, but given that him starting would mean that either Howard gets injured or is playing badly (neither of which is good), I hope he at least finishes the season as a great back-up.

I think he's good in the capacity of being a back-up if he doesn't go too long between starts, and he has been doing a great job of mentoring Jimmy.

I'm not ready for the Old Guard to move on, but it has started (several years ago), and there are so few of them left that I'm clinging to the ones who still contribute, even if it is contributing as a back-up.

#140 Vladifan

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Posted 09 November 2010 - 05:31 PM

Babcock needs to do whatever is necessary to see that Ozzie gets his 400th, and he's got plenty of time to get it done. Whoever the coach would have been at this point in time, it's now a mandate. This team owes him that.

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