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[Retired] Official Lockout Thread


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#2101 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 08:59 PM

owners statementon cba talks



i believe this is what pissed the owners and bettman off the most

That's what I don't get. According to TSN:

Fehr said the two sides had agreed on the significant money issues, that includes accepting the NHL's Make Whole offer.
The owner-player only dynamic was terminated earlier in the day as the players insisted the negotiations once again be opened up to anyone they want to bring in.


That makes it sound like it came from the players themselves, not some unilateral decision by the Fehrs.


There's just so much misinformation out there right now as each side blames the other.

#2102 Nightfall

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:03 PM

owners statementon cba talks



i believe this is what pissed the owners and bettman off the most

I believe that both sides have pissed on each other many times through the course of this negotiation. The players and owners both have a right to be furious. That being said, their dislike for each other is going to result in the season being cancelled. At this point, I am glad there are other hockey alternatives. The NHL owners and players aren't getting any of my money for a long time. Greedy f***s.
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#2103 rrasco

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:05 PM

The fans have a right to be furious.

I'm just about done with this gong show. I'm going to see the Rampage and Barons play on Sunday. Screw the NHL. I'll find other ways to fill my time and empty my wallet.

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#2104 Nightfall

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:06 PM

That's what I don't get. According to TSN:

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That makes it sound like it came from the players themselves, not some unilateral decision by the Fehrs.


There's just so much misinformation out there right now as each side blames the other.

Fehr and Bettman are just spokespeople. They are going to take all the blame, but you can look at the 700 players and 30 owners as the real people at fault. They are the ones who want their cake and eat it too. Bettman and Fehr should both be fired just to get new people who are hopefully not complete asshats. There needs to be cooperation. Watching these negotiations is like watching republicans vrs democrats and the fiscal cliff. No resolution, and a lot of pontificating to the media on why they are right and the other side is wrong.

Yes, I did read why we shouldn't respond to each other's posts, but I have my anger issues under control. No personal attacks.

The fans have a right to be furious.

I'm just about done with this gong show. I'm going to see the Rampage and Barons play on Sunday. Screw the NHL. I'll find other ways to fill my time and empty my wallet.

Already there dude. I will watch AHL and college hockey.
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#2105 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:11 PM

Bettman and Fehr are re-joining negotiations today.....worries me big time.


Your worries were not unfounded.

#2106 frankgrimes

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:30 PM

Sometimes I wonder why these two clowns can't meet half way?!

The NHL has their damn split, show some concessions at contract lenght and get this relationship done!



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#2107 vladdy16

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:38 PM

Players thought they were negotiating, owners were in the "my way or the highway" frame of mind. Hard to know who to make voodoo dolls of without seeing the actual proposals.
Can't wait to read the "Phoenix: I still think it's a hockey market" chapter of Gary Bettman's autobiography. I'm guessing it's going to be chapter 11.

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#2108 rrasco

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:42 PM

Here you go. Bettman's presser. I'm trying to get through it. Hard to watch.

http://video.nhl.com...id=53&id=190607

Edited by rrasco, 06 December 2012 - 09:43 PM.

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#2109 rrasco

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:53 PM

Daly on contract term limits: The hill we will die on. They also insisted on CBA length. I didn't hear the third thing and the player wouldn't let me rewind. Long presser so I'm not watching it again.

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MONEY ON THE BOARD: $10/Kronwalling (1), $1/goal by: Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, Sheahan, disney.com (1), Andersson, Dekeyser, Pulkinnen, Ouellet, or Sproul.  2X MULTIPLIER: disney.com.  CONSOLATION PRIZE: $5/goal by: Datsyuk (3), $3/goal by: Z (1). MOTB TOTAL: $30


#2110 chances14

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:57 PM

very interesting

adater@adater
From deep inside players side: "We were ready to play again. But Don came in (Wed.) and told us we could get more and to hold out

That depth player was not on the Avalanche, FYI. That's all I have on this

Fehr did not hold a player-wide conference call in saying that, important to note. Came from top down, trickle-down

Bottom line here: Players say they are unified, but not what I'm hearing from this depth player. They'll deny that publicly, but..

.privately, they are feeling powerless as the Ryan Millers and Brad Richards of the world pretend this is a sacrifice for them

This depth player is wicked smart though. May put his name to comments soon. Sorry for anonymous tilt to this. not my style



#2111 amato

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 10:07 PM

very interesting


just saw this and went to post it.. if holding out ends up getting them a better deal within the next few days, cool. but if it doesn't and the season doesn't happen, fehr needs to go.

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#2112 Euro_Twins

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 10:35 PM

This is complete and utter bulls*&^!!!! I left for work earlier thinking that we were so close to a season starting (but not getting my hopes up yet) and I knew somehow things could get screwed up because it IS the nhl were talking about. I come home from work, grab a beer and expect to read all about how wonderful it is they finally agreed to a deal and once again I feel like the owners and the PA have taken a huge dump on me! Thanks owners for making your offer non negotiable, and thanks Fehr for cnstantly instilling false hope in your players.

#2113 kipwinger

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 10:42 PM

So if I'm reading this right, the owners don't want long front loaded contracts, and they want a longer CBA, and they've met in the middle on the make whole, and they (and the players) agreed on a 50/50 split. How is anybody not in favor of this from a fan's perspective?

Before this whole negotiation mess everybody on this discussion board was against front loaded contracts. Everyone favored a longer CBA. 50/50 is even and 300 million in the make whole is pretty much exactly between the owners 211 million, and the players 393 million. I honestly don't get what's not to like about this.

GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

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#2114 Euro_Twins

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 10:54 PM

So if I'm reading this right, the owners don't want long front loaded contracts, and they want a longer CBA, and they've met in the middle on the make whole, and they (and the players) agreed on a 50/50 split. How is anybody not in favor of this from a fan's perspective?

Before this whole negotiation mess everybody on this discussion board was against front loaded contracts. Everyone favored a longer CBA. 50/50 is even and 300 million in the make whole is pretty much exactly between the owners 211 million, and the players 393 million. I honestly don't get what's not to like about this.


Nor does anyone else, the players agreed to the owners 300million make whole, the pension plan, the 50/50. The problem is the players chose to NEGOTIATE off the owners last proposal and ask for 8 year contract limits instead of 5, and an 8 year cba with an opt out option after 6 years instead of 10 year cba with a opt out at 8 years.

#2115 chances14

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 10:56 PM

fehr really messed up today and it may cost the players a ton of money.

owners made it clear that they didn't want him in the room today but he insisted on being in there and he wanted mediators there as well. all this despite the fact that significant progress was made the last 2 days without him and bettman in there (i don't think that's a coincidence). then 2 hrs later fehr proclaims to the media that this lockout is essentially over, only to have it blow up in his face a few minutes later on live tv. All indications pointed to a lot of players wanting to put the deal that the owners tabled to the entire pa for a vote but fehr advised against it.

that said the owners are being equally stupid with their take it or leave it approach to negotiating. there was no reason bettman had to come out and take everything off the table today. does anyone truly believe it's off the table anyways? I also don't like how the owners and bettman appear to have refused to start up negotiations again. i guess they are still too busy having their little hissy fits

Helene St. James@HeleneStJames
NHL has told PA there will be no meetings Friday. #NHLLockout


my fear now is what cherry brought up

Don Cherry@CoachsCornerCBC
Your way and the doves put an extra 100 million on the table and when the association said ok but... The doves turned into hawks themselves

I believe the hardliners said to the doves ok we did it your way and the association thinks we are weak.. Now we'll do it our way.


if that's the case and jacobs is back in control, this season is toast.

but the bottom line is both sides hate each other with a burning passion and both sides are acting like morons and until that changes, no season will be played

#2116 chances14

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 11:02 PM

So if I'm reading this right, the owners don't want long front loaded contracts, and they want a longer CBA, and they've met in the middle on the make whole, and they (and the players) agreed on a 50/50 split. How is anybody not in favor of this from a fan's perspective?

Before this whole negotiation mess everybody on this discussion board was against front loaded contracts. Everyone favored a longer CBA. 50/50 is even and 300 million in the make whole is pretty much exactly between the owners 211 million, and the players 393 million. I honestly don't get what's not to like about this.


both sides refuse to budge on the contract term length and variance, which is infuriating to me because it only affects a small minority of the players. both sides should want the longest cba term possible especially the players. the longer they can go without being forced to make more concessions in another lockout, the better. it's mind boggling how they don't want the longest cba term possible.

Edited by chances14, 06 December 2012 - 11:19 PM.


#2117 GoWings1905

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 11:03 PM

US Congress and these clowns should all get together and have a contest on who can get less accomplished.
 
 
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#2118 kipwinger

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 11:04 PM

Nor does anyone else, the players agreed to the owners 300million make whole, the pension plan, the 50/50. The problem is the players chose to NEGOTIATE off the owners last proposal and ask for 8 year contract limits instead of 5, and an 8 year cba with an opt out option after 6 years instead of 10 year cba with a opt out at 8 years.


Wait so I"m lost, you're in favor of the players negotiating off the contract term limits and the cba length? If so, would you also be in favor of the owners agreeing to 8 year contracts and an 8 year cba but for only 275 million in make whole, since we're NEGOTIATING off the first proposal?

GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#2119 chances14

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 11:17 PM

Ryan Rishaug@TSNRyanRishaug
Daly reaction to Hainsey saying owners told players that adding D. Fehr back in room could be a deal breaker.. “it was a reaction to the…

…to players unilaterally terminating the players/owners-only dynamic, and telling us (2 or 3 times) that their decision was non-negotiable..

..totally within their rights to do, but response of our owners was “if that’s the case, don’t expect us to stay involved.”

#2120 kipwinger

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 11:17 PM

both sides refuse to budge on the contracting issues, which is infuriating to me because it only affects a small minority of the players. both sides should want the longest cba term possible especially the players. the longer they can go without being forced to make more concessions in another lockout, the better. it's mind boggling how they don't want the longest cba term possible.


That's not true, the owners budged on the arbitration issue and the free agency age. The players are not budging on front loaded contracts and cba length. Two things that pretty much all fans think should happen.

Edited by kipwinger, 06 December 2012 - 11:18 PM.

GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 






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