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Red Wings popularity in Detroit/Michigan


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#41 Playmaker

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 11:16 AM

Not really sure why people feel the need to disparage other sports, but to each their own.

 

As far as 97.1 goes,  what makes good radio is conversation and controversy.  You can only take so many "the Wings need a big tough defenseman/tough power forward" calls.  Other than that, really, what is there to talk about?  Winning is boring and if there's nothing to complain about, it doesn't leave much room to discuss anything.  I know that's been my own personal experience.  Still a fan and love the Red Wings, but it's just hard to get too worked up over anything after winning 4 Cups, especially when you thought you'd never see one.  A regular season loss used to leave me seething for days.  Now losing in the playoffs leaves me only slightly disappointed until the next day.

 

I do think the foreign players do play a role in it.  It's hard to get to "know" them and let's be honest, watching paint dry is more exciting than listening to an interview with Nick Lidstrom or Henrik Zetterberg.  I think the fact that many of the foreign players don't live here year round plays a part in it as well. 



#42 evilmrt

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 02:50 PM

 

 

I do think the foreign players do play a role in it.  It's hard to get to "know" them and let's be honest, watching paint dry is more exciting than listening to an interview with Nick Lidstrom or Henrik Zetterberg.  I think the fact that many of the foreign players don't live here year round plays a part in it as well. 

 

Good point. Many or all of the NA old crew made the Detroit area their home, and got involved in the community. Drapes, Cheli, Kocur, Malts, Stevie, etc. None of these guys were even from Michigan, but they adopted it as home. Holmer isn't NA but he basically bought right into that as well. 

 

The new crew...almost everyone goes home for the summer. Even Jimmy Howard spends the offseason at his home in Maine.



#43 StormJH1

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Posted 19 July 2013 - 04:09 PM

Here's some reading material for you on a very similar topic I started 2 months ago:

 

http://www.letsgowin...hocketown-dead/

 

It is an interesting topic to me, though, especially now as an out-of-market fan.

 

Detroit is a good sports town, all-around, but I think it's a very balanced sports town.  I'm almost 32 now, so I grew up through a very unique period where the Wings really were the biggest and best thing in town from maybe 1997 to 2002.  The NFL is the biggest and most popular professional sport, whether you're talking about New York, Detroit, or some market that doesn't even have a team.  On that basis, you could always say that the NFL is king.  But I've never bought that the Lions have EVER been the most beloved local sports team in Metro Detroit.  There's a lot of schadenfreude going on with Lions viewership.  Even here with the Minnesota Vikings (which has its own painful history of losing and disappointment), it's still undeniably cool to be a Vikings fan and wear Vikings stuff.  When I grew up in Detroit, you literally got made fun of in school if you wore Lions stuff.  That's definitely changed nowadays, but the stink of hilarious failure will stick with that team until they take a knee to close out a Super Bowl win, IF that ever happens.

 

I disagree that the Tigers have "always" been the favorite, but since 2006 (or perhaps the NHL lockout), the passion that the average Detroit sports fan used to have for the Red Wings has shifted to Comerica Park.  I moved away in 2003, so it's been bizarre for me ever since to see all this love for the Tigers on Facebook for people that I know could have cared less about the team when Buddy Bell managed them.

 

But sports fans are all frontrunners.  You could argue that the Pistons "owned" 2002 to 2004, also.  The Wings popularity in the late 90's was great, but it was also an anomaly.  Just like Rangers in '94, the true fans will stay, but you can't recapture the magic of a really good rivalry (in their case, NJ), coupled with killing a 40-year Cup drought. 


Edited by StormJH1, 19 July 2013 - 04:10 PM.


#44 joshy207

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Posted 22 July 2013 - 04:51 PM

Had this question been asked in 1980, the Wings would have been dead last.

 

Every team has its ups and downs, which correlates to its popularity.  The Lions are the most popular, despite being horrendous for almost 60 years, because football IS the most popular sport in the US.  The Tigers rank (probably a close) second, between baseball's historic popularity in the US and the Tigers' recent success.  The Wings have lost some of their luster because they haven't been quite as good the last few years, and as some of you have said, the fans have almost become numb to their success.  The Pistons are in another doldrums and their embarrassing attendance figures last year showed the fans' apathy.

 

Hockey does rank higher in Detroit than in almost any other US city (Boston and Minneapols/St Paul could challenge) but is still a distant third to football and baseball.

 

The one type of "fan" who pisses me off is the "I only watch hockey in the playoffs.  I don't watch the regular season."  You know what, guy?  Don't watch the playoffs either!  You are no hockey fan!  It's impossible to truly appreciate the game if you only watch it for 2 months.



#45 Marty Barry

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Posted 22 July 2013 - 05:34 PM

This thread is full of s***.  Everytime I come to this site all you guys do is talk about Red Wings this, Red Wings that.  Hockey must be pretty f'ing popular.  Nobody talks about how Angelina Jolie is too skinny, how Oprah is too fat, just hockey, hockey, hockey.  LOL.

 

Here in columbus, my friends think it's odd that where I grew up in MI every driveway had a goalie net in it like the driveways here have basketball nets.  Our Gordie is their Archie.  Strange since we are so close to eachother.  Like a previous poster stated outside of MI and Min hockey is down the chain.



#46 Z Winged Dangler

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Posted 22 July 2013 - 10:03 PM

 

 

Don't knock Westminster.  I love it, and watch it every year.

 

But I agree with you.  Football and basketball, to me, are egos and paychecks fighting to see which one gets bigger first.  Baseball is so boring, I can read an entire book between pitches (and have actually done so).

 

I love hockey, and I have since I was a kid.  Of course growing up near Canada  and being able to watch CBC might have had something to do with that, I don't know.  That might also explain why I love curling.  And please don't say that sport is a bore.  It's really a cerebral sport, encompassing geometry, physics and psychology.  Maybe that's why people don't like it - it makes them think.  That might explain why they like a stupid non-thinking game like football instead.

Personally I think that football has strategy, as long as the dummies on the field listen to their coach.  Some teams D is really good and you need some trick plays to break the line which makes it interesting sometimes.  The only kinda boring sport I watch on occasion is golf, but that's not very often anymore.  Curling i'm not really big on.  All the "hurry hard" grinds on you pretty quick.  It does require skill, I'll give you that, but not my kind of sport.  There's just something about hockey that seems so much more pure compared to everything else.  You can be successful as so many different kinds of player.  You can be a bull in a china shop like Lucic, a dirty dangler like Datsyuk that has more moves than Michael Jackson, a hard nosed little s*** disturber like Brad Marchand or a militant like sniper in Stamkos and you can all be successful in your own way.  And then when you get duos like Dats-Z, Stamkos-St. Louis, Backstrom-Ovechkin and so on, you see some real magic on the ice.  There's nothing better than hockey, getting to OT in the playoffs, game 7 with everything on the line.  Seeing that 3rd or 4th line player being a hero for just one night....   Now that's a sport.


This thread is full of s***.  Everytime I come to this site all you guys do is talk about Red Wings this, Red Wings that.  Hockey must be pretty f'ing popular.  Nobody talks about how Angelina Jolie is too skinny, how Oprah is too fat, just hockey, hockey, hockey.  LOL.

 

Here in columbus, my friends think it's odd that where I grew up in MI every driveway had a goalie net in it like the driveways here have basketball nets.  Our Gordie is their Archie.  Strange since we are so close to eachother.  Like a previous poster stated outside of MI and Min hockey is down the chain.

Aren't the best college hockey programs in Michigan, Minnesota and North Dakota?


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#47 The Axe

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Posted 22 July 2013 - 11:08 PM

Personally I think that football has strategy, as long as the dummies on the field listen to their coach.  Some teams D is really good and you need some trick plays to break the line which makes it interesting sometimes.  The only kinda boring sport I watch on occasion is golf, but that's not very often anymore.  Curling i'm not really big on.  All the "hurry hard" grinds on you pretty quick.  It does require skill, I'll give you that, but not my kind of sport.  There's just something about hockey that seems so much more pure compared to everything else.  You can be successful as so many different kinds of player.  You can be a bull in a china shop like Lucic, a dirty dangler like Datsyuk that has more moves than Michael Jackson, a hard nosed little s*** disturber like Brad Marchand or a militant like sniper in Stamkos and you can all be successful in your own way.  And then when you get duos like Dats-Z, Stamkos-St. Louis, Backstrom-Ovechkin and so on, you see some real magic on the ice.  There's nothing better than hockey, getting to OT in the playoffs, game 7 with everything on the line.  Seeing that 3rd or 4th line player being a hero for just one night....   Now that's a sport.

Aren't the best college hockey programs in Michigan, Minnesota and North Dakota?


Yes.

#48 frankgrimes

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Posted 22 July 2013 - 11:52 PM

I may be in the minority but I also like watching Golf. For sure it is not as physical demanding as hockey, but you have to be SO focused for a long period of time and knowing the inns and outs of beautiful golf-courses. Although I agree nothing comes to close to hockey and like mentioned, I love the fact that hockey is not mainstream or as popular as soccer, baseball, basketball or football.


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#49 Rivalred

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 11:11 AM

Hockey or bust....
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#50 The Axe

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 11:27 AM

I may be in the minority but I also like watching Golf. For sure it is not as physical demanding as hockey, but you have to be SO focused for a long period of time and knowing the inns and outs of beautiful golf-courses. Although I agree nothing comes to close to hockey and like mentioned, I love the fact that hockey is not mainstream or as popular as soccer, baseball, basketball or football.


Basketball is the only sport I have a hard time watching. I like golf too!

#51 StormJH1

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 12:24 PM

This thread is full of s***.  Everytime I come to this site all you guys do is talk about Red Wings this, Red Wings that.  Hockey must be pretty f'ing popular.  Nobody talks about how Angelina Jolie is too skinny, how Oprah is too fat, just hockey, hockey, hockey.  LOL.

 

Here in columbus, my friends think it's odd that where I grew up in MI every driveway had a goalie net in it like the driveways here have basketball nets.  Our Gordie is their Archie.  Strange since we are so close to eachother.  Like a previous poster stated outside of MI and Min hockey is down the chain.

I think he was joking, but it's obvious selection bias to come to an internet forum for discussion of a particular NHL team and remark how popular hockey seems to be around these parts...

 

There IS a problem of waning popularity with the Red Wings in metro Detroit, however.  In the late 90's (when it was a very special time to be Red Wings fan), we could look to cities like Boston, Pittsburgh, Chicago, etc. and it was easy to feel like we were "Hockeytown".  Those cities have excellent fanbases now.

 

It will be interesting if moving to the East has any impact on the appeal of the team.  Detroit was already a fixture with the national media, but will be moreso now that we'll play and compete for position with the likes of NYR, TOR, MTL, BOS, etc.

 

The mid-2000's, unlike the 90's, had us playing a huge chunk of games against recent expansion teams in crappy markets, namely Nashville and Columbus.  Who was our biggest "rival" in the 2000's....the Ducks?  You could argue it the Hawks later, but they didn't get the upper hand on us until the decade was over.  The Penguins "rivalry" only applied to two consecutive finals.

 

Think about East Coast markets that have flourished recently, and all of them have several huge rivalries that seem to matter even when one or both of the teams aren't that great (PHI/PIT, NYR/NJ, NYR/WAS, PIT/WAS, MTL/TOR, etc.)  Detroit had nothing like that dating back to Colorado, and I think that really hurt the interest.



#52 LeftWinger

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 12:40 PM

First of all, listening to 97.1 is the first problem, especially Valenti and Foster.  Sencond, the NFL and MLB will always be #1 and #2 in the country and any state, because more kids pay it growing up, not because it is better, but it is easier to assemble a neighborhood cast of players and run around a field than it is to rent ice, gather enough players to offset the ungodly ice fee PLUS find ONE, let alone TWO goalies that actually know how to pay the position good enough to make shooting at him/her fun, PLUS hope that everyone has all the required equipment. 

 

That doesn't make playing baseball or football more fun, just easier to do as a kid growing up.  That is why the NHL is what it is in Canada, they have backyard rinks and most kids have the hand me down equipment from big brother or dad.  It's just easier to play football and baseball as a kid here. 

 

Now that being said, those of us who were fortunate enough to grow up playing hockey, for one reason or another, will ALWAYS rank the NHL #1 over the NFL or MLB, but don't get me wrong, I was very, VERY ecstatic in 1984 and for the Tigers the last two times they went to the Series.  I was the same way in 1989 and 1990 and 2004 for the Pistons and I am very excited every year to see if the Lions can actually become something.  I will never hold ANY of those Championships or future ones higher than ANY of our Cups, or future Cups, but for that one moment in time, when the Tigers/Pistons/Lions ever win a championship again, I will take my attention away from the Wings to celebrate and enjoy.  I feel the same about College sports as well.  Hockey #1, then the rest on a winning basis.  But the majority of the population, same with professional sports, would take Football, then basketball in the NCAA before College Hockey or even College Baseball.

 

That is what makes us NHL fans special.  We don't follow the crowd and do what everyone else does.  Sure, we all grew up playing Football and Baseball as well, but it was something about Hockey that we fell in love with and it shows to this day.  I love the NHL more than anything, I would chose the Winter Classic of ANY bowl game on January 1st.  Being honest though, if it came down to watching the Red Wings play a regular season game on Superbowl Sunday if the Lions were there, I'd have to watch the Lions...Same would go with the Tigers in the World Series...now the Pistons in a game 7 of the Finals would probably lose out to the Wings, but I would switch back and forth...


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#53 number9

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 01:05 PM

I think he was joking, but it's obvious selection bias to come to an internet forum for discussion of a particular NHL team and remark how popular hockey seems to be around these parts...
 
There IS a problem of waning popularity with the Red Wings in metro Detroit, however.  In the late 90's (when it was a very special time to be Red Wings fan), we could look to cities like Boston, Pittsburgh, Chicago, etc. and it was easy to feel like we were "Hockeytown".  Those cities have excellent fanbases now.
 
It will be interesting if moving to the East has any impact on the appeal of the team.  Detroit was already a fixture with the national media, but will be moreso now that we'll play and compete for position with the likes of NYR, TOR, MTL, BOS, etc.
 
The mid-2000's, unlike the 90's, had us playing a huge chunk of games against recent expansion teams in crappy markets, namely Nashville and Columbus.  Who was our biggest "rival" in the 2000's....the Ducks?  You could argue it the Hawks later, but they didn't get the upper hand on us until the decade was over.  The Penguins "rivalry" only applied to two consecutive finals.
 
Think about East Coast markets that have flourished recently, and all of them have several huge rivalries that seem to matter even when one or both of the teams aren't that great (PHI/PIT, NYR/NJ, NYR/WAS, PIT/WAS, MTL/TOR, etc.)  Detroit had nothing like that dating back to Colorado, and I think that really hurt the interest.


BOS/MTL

Edited by number9, 24 July 2013 - 01:06 PM.


#54 frankgrimes

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 04:45 PM

I really hope that the renewed rivalry with some of the original 6 especially Toronto will help increasing the appeal of this team again. Management needs to build this team with more of a top 6 bottom 6 thinking. Fans love hardworking hardnosed guys and are excited when a team has to offer other things than just skill.

I am still confident that the east will help the Wings when it comes to popularity. The Joe is going to be sold out more often, fans from Toronto, Montreal and whatnot like to travel

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#55 StormJH1

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 02:36 PM

I really hope that the renewed rivalry with some of the original 6 especially Toronto will help increasing the appeal of this team again. Management needs to build this team with more of a top 6 bottom 6 thinking. Fans love hardworking hardnosed guys and are excited when a team has to offer other things than just skill.

I am still confident that the east will help the Wings when it comes to popularity. The Joe is going to be sold out more often, fans from Toronto, Montreal and whatnot like to travel

That is a good point.  While Detroit isn't exactly a "destination", there are better fan bases in the East that will travel for games, and the allure of seeing their favorite team against an Original Six team could give a little additional attendance.



#56 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 05:22 AM

If the Lions were to ever win anything, you would see how huge football is here. Even with them sucking, they are still very very popular.

Completely agree.
I put hockey first, but only because i played for ten years and I happened to be good enough that my coaches didnt want me playing football. But the majority of the new generation of religious detroit sports fans had the pleasure of growing up watching Barry sanders, and Herman moore, who in my case I, idolized for the way they conducted themselves during the peak of their success.

Watching t.o. run to the center of the star in Dallas to spike the ball, compared to literally running out of a pile of 8 men using finger tips to keep him upright, then breaking three more tackles on his way to the end zone and celebrating by handing the ball to the ref and calmly walking to the sideline.
As a kid just starting to go through puberty,Barry had that confidence that you aspired to have.
He acted like he had scored before and cared about more then one good play.
We were pretty spoiled with him, and yzerman, and Lidstrom, and now Pavel and z.

Megatron brings my excitement back to football though.
Seeing someone that talented that humble, and clear headed is awesome.
But for every calvin there is three+ titus youngs.
Which is why the wings will always win in my mind.
But I'd be remissed to say, that I'm not a fan of the lions.

#57 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 05:48 AM

Here's some reading material for you on a very similar topic I started 2 months ago:
 
http://www.letsgowin...hocketown-dead/
 
It is an interesting topic to me, though, especially now as an out-of-market fan.
 
Detroit is a good sports town, all-around, but I think it's a very balanced sports town.  I'm almost 32 now, so I grew up through a very unique period where the Wings really were the biggest and best thing in town from maybe 1997 to 2002.  The NFL is the biggest and most popular professional sport, whether you're talking about New York, Detroit, or some market that doesn't even have a team.  On that basis, you could always say that the NFL is king.  But I've never bought that the Lions have EVER been the most beloved local sports team in Metro Detroit.  There's a lot of schadenfreude going on with Lions viewership.  Even here with the Minnesota Vikings (which has its own painful history of losing and disappointment), it's still undeniably cool to be a Vikings fan and wear Vikings stuff.  When I grew up in Detroit, you literally got made fun of in school if you wore Lions stuff.  That's definitely changed nowadays, but the stink of hilarious failure will stick with that team until they take a knee to close out a Super Bowl win, IF that ever happens.
 
I disagree that the Tigers have "always" been the favorite, but since 2006 (or perhaps the NHL lockout), the passion that the average Detroit sports fan used to have for the Red Wings has shifted to Comerica Park.  I moved away in 2003, so it's been bizarre for me ever since to see all this love for the Tigers on Facebook for people that I know could have cared less about the team when Buddy Bell managed them.
 
But sports fans are all frontrunners.  You could argue that the Pistons "owned" 2002 to 2004, also.  The Wings popularity in the late 90's was great, but it was also an anomaly.  Just like Rangers in '94, the true fans will stay, but you can't recapture the magic of a really good rivalry (in their case, NJ), coupled with killing a 40-year Cup drought. 

Your comment was tops man.
And you used shadenfreude, which although is technically not an English word, is literally the best explanation for the fascination of the lions(post 94')
Literally a full article couldn't describe it better then that one word.
So, kudos.

#58 DickieDunn

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 06:46 AM

I think football's popularity comes down to 2 things. First, a ton of people play it and in a lot I'd places it's THE sport for their high school. Second, there are so few games people don't get bored with them. Longer seasons have too many "meaningless" games, where in football, especially major college football, every game is important.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#59 jimmyemeryhunter

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 06:49 AM

I think football's popularity comes down to 2 things. First, a ton of people play it and in a lot I'd places it's THE sport for their high school. Second, there are so few games people don't get bored with them. Longer seasons have too many "meaningless" games, where in football, especially major college football, every game is important.



I think geography plays into it too, you have a better chance of selling salt water to a Hawaiian then getting ice hockey popular in the south.

#60 DickieDunn

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 07:54 AM

I think football's popularity comes down to 2 things. First, a ton of people play it and in a lot I'd places it's THE sport for their high school. Second, there are so few games people don't get bored with them. Longer seasons have too many "meaningless" games, where in football, especially major college football, every game is important.
I think geography plays into it too, you have a better chance of selling salt water to a Hawaiian then getting ice hockey popular in the south.


It does, but if the NHL puts some effort into getting kids playing and can change the perception that it's a "white sport" I think most of the southern markets could be solid. Last year 4 of the bottom teams in percentage of tickets sold were older markets, NJ, St. Louis, the Isles, and Avs. Colorado being down is hilarious the way they bragged about their attendance right after they got a ready made contending team from day 1.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!






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