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Dabura

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If you think Vanek is a power forward, you need a new definition of power forward.

I see them both hitting about 55-60 points regularly when they're establilshed. Tatar will score more goals, Nyquist will have more assists and be better defensively. Tatar is more dynamic and emotional, Nyquist steadier and more cerebral.

Very good description. 100% bang on.

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Edit: That being said, Dabura ur good with this type of thing. Gimme a list of power forwards we could trade for/acquire! GO!

lolz, gimme a few minutes, I'm making lunch.

RedWang likes this

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With Ericsson back tomorrow, I'm looking forward to Kindl being scratched. He had a horrible horrible game last night against the Blues.

Hes regressed in nearly every facet of his game, im ready for him to be packaged and shipped out in a trade.

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The point of my saying to trade Nyquist was not to say that he's a bad player, he's not. But contrary to what most of LGW believes, you can't get a top six winger for Cleary, Kindl, and a 3rd. You need to give up something valuable. Nyquist has value, he's good, but not what we really need right now. The margin of victory for the Red Wings does not rest on Nyquist's defensive upside (I don't see that he's particularly good at it right now) or assist totals. We need someone with 25-30 goal potential and size...Nyquist and a 1st would be the starting price for a piece like that.

rick zombo and RedWang like this

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The point of my saying to trade Nyquist was not to say that he's a bad player, he's not. But contrary to what most of LGW believes, you can't get a top six winger for Cleary, Kindl, and a 3rd. You need to give up something valuable. Nyquist has value, he's good, but not what we really need right now. The margin of victory for the Red Wings does not rest on Nyquist's defensive upside (I don't see that he's particularly good at it right now) or assist totals. We need someone with 25-30 goal potential and size...Nyquist and a 1st would be the starting price for a piece like that.

Nyquist is already 24 and hasn't done anything mind blowing yet(stat wise) you wanna get a 30 goal guy there gonna want a younger player with higher upside Mantha/jurco type prospect

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Nyquist is already 24 and hasn't done anything mind blowing yet(stat wise) you wanna get a 30 goal guy there gonna want a younger player with higher upside Mantha/jurco type prospect

Not necessarily true. Bobby Ryan was traded for a guy with Nyquist-like NHL numbers, a boom or bust prospect (like Frk for us), and a first. There are a ton of variables at play in the trade market, but Nyquist and a 1st would definitely be a really good starting point (as I said before) for a quality trade.

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If I was Holland this would be my roster next October

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Franzen
Nyquist - Weiss - Tatar
Sheahan - Helm - Abdelkader
Miller - Andersson - Glendening
Callahan

Kronwall - Ericsson
Smith - DeKeyser
Kindl - Lashoff
Almqvist

Howard
Gustavsson

1st line - Veteran scoring core
2nd line - Youth scoring core
3rd line - Everything line, speed, scoring, grit
4th line - Shutdown line, speed, grit

Alfredsson - He'll be 42 next season. I'm assuming he'll retire.

Jurco - He has another year on his entry level contract. Let him play one more year as the #1 call-up. This clears roster space for us to sign others who need to make the Wings next year, and it gives him less NHL stats so his agent will have less ammo when negotiating a new contract after that year.

Mrazek - Also has another year on his entry level contract. Let him play one more year as the #1 starter in Grand Rapids. With the goalie injuries we've seen this year I think it would be unwise to let Gustavsson go so soon. We don't have enough depth at G to let him go. If we didn't have Monster and Howard got hurt, who would be Mrazek's back up? Coreau? Paterson? That would be scary.

Tootoo - Whether we like it or not, he's not destined to be on this team. If he's not traded, he'll be bought out, or remain buried.

Sheahan, Glendening, Callahan, and Almqvist - All are out of waiver options next season. Instead of overpaying for FA's I say give these kids spots, and let them work for bigger roles.

Bertuzzi, Cleary, Quincey, Eaves, Samuelsson - Bye Bye


When it comes down to it, I think, no matter what happens, this offseason will be about shedding contracts instead of adding FA pieces. Our prospect pool is bursting at the seams, and adding any (overpaid) FA's will mean losing some of them. Getting rid of our overpaid washed-up vets and going with this small youth influx will also leave us with around 10 - 13 million in cap space (with this roster).

Edited by number9

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I completely agree with everything you said, number 9, except I wouldn't hate having Alfie back for one more year. My roster would be pretty similar but my lineup would look a little different. I'd like to see something like this...

Tatar - Datsyuk - Franzen

Nyquist - Zetterberg - Alfredsson

Helm - Weiss - Abdelkader

Miller - Sheahan - Callahan

Glendenning - Ferraro

Kronwall - Ericsson

DeKeyser - Smith

Kindl - Almquist

Lashoff

Howard

Gustavsson

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If I was Holland this would be my roster next October

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Franzen

Nyquist - Weiss - Tatar

Sheahan - Helm - Abdelkader

Miller - Andersson - Glendening

Callahan

Kronwall - Ericsson

Smith - DeKeyser

Kindl - Lashoff

Almqvist

Howard

Gustavsson

I was all set to dismiss this as relying too much on young talent, but it actually looks like a good starting point. Of course we'll have some new players signed that will shuffle things around a bit, but overall it doesn't look bad. That second line is probably too small to be truly effective, but as long as we have Top 6 players in top 6 roles I'm cool without however they're combined.

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Hi, I'm back. Longest. Lunch. Ever.

Haven't really read what's been posted in this thread since my lunch break, but I caught some bits and pieces while scrolling. Firstly, I totally agree with kip's Nyquist angle. If we're gonna land that big scoring winger we so desperately need, it'll cost us at least a first-round pick and one of Nyquist/Tatar/Jurco. The reason why you'd even consider putting together such a package is our absurd lack of size and physicality up front, especially in the top six - whereas we have at least one prospect who projects as, basically, a Nyquist clone (that would be Calle Jarnkrok, who hasn't exactly been setting the world on fire this season, mostly because he's very small, especially for a center). I was gonna talk about power forwards (and, more broadly, our lack of size up front) before I disappeared, but I'm thinking I'll address it in that new trade thread rather than do it here, because I haven't quite organized my thoughts yet.

The other thing I wanted to say: I've given it some good objective thought, but, I'm sorry, I just can't get behind DeKeyser-Smith being our second pairing, especially if we're in full-on Cup-or-bust-(because-our-core-is-only-getting-older) mode. Even if it were to work well for us, you know there'd be at least one key injury in the playoffs.

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Hi, I'm back. Longest. Lunch. Ever.

Haven't really read what's been posted in this thread since my lunch break, but I caught some bits and pieces while scrolling. Firstly, I totally agree with kip's Nyquist angle. If we're gonna land that big scoring winger we so desperately need, it'll cost us at least a first-round pick and one of Nyquist/Tatar/Jurco. The reason why you'd even consider putting together such a package is our absurd lack of size and physicality up front, especially in the top six - whereas we have at least one prospect who projects as, basically, a Nyquist clone (that would be Calle Jarnkrok, who hasn't exactly been setting the world on fire this season, mostly because he's very small, especially for a center). I was gonna talk about power forwards (and, more broadly, our lack of size up front) before I disappeared, but I'm thinking I'll address it in that new trade thread rather than do it here, because I haven't quite organized my thoughts yet.

The other thing I wanted to say: I've given it some good objective thought, but, I'm sorry, I just can't get behind DeKeyser-Smith being our second pairing, especially if we're in full-on Cup-or-bust-(because-our-core-is-only-getting-older) mode. Even if it were to work well for us, you know there'd be at least one key injury in the playoffs.

I thought you made the last lunch you'll ever make.

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So assuming pav and alf come back friday like im hearing.

What do you expect we do?

Cuz the fourth line of miller glendenning

Eaves is an amazing grind line.

Miller could be replaced, but who would you move without disrupting the chemistry

Were building.

The line sheahan jurco and Tatar was awesome.

Keep them together as long as possible let them build as much chemistry as possible because it could be a future second line.

Helm needs more effective wingers.

But could you play helm at wing with pav. And Alfie.

Cuz that would be a good line.

Speed and grit.

Smart.

Smart.

Smart.

With skill scoring touch and a shot.

I'm just trying to improvise because I dont wanna get rid of sheahan or glendenning

As for nyq z and Abby

They're building chemistry.

That's a beautiful second line.

Or should we throw z d and Alf together for a secondary line(or third line) of Nyquist helm and Abby.

Thoughts?

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So assuming pav and alf come back friday like im hearing.

What do you expect we do?

Cuz the fourth line of miller glendenning

Eaves is an amazing grind line.

Miller could be replaced, but who would you move without disrupting the chemistry

Were building.

The line sheahan jurco and Tatar was awesome.

Keep them together as long as possible let them build as much chemistry as possible because it could be a future second line.

Helm needs more effective wingers.

But could you play helm at wing with pav. And Alfie.

Cuz that would be a good line.

Speed and grit.

Smart.

Smart.

Smart.

With skill scoring touch and a shot.

I'm just trying to improvise because I dont wanna get rid of sheahan or glendenning

As for nyq z and Abby

They're building chemistry.

That's a beautiful second line.

Or should we throw z d and Alf together for a secondary line(or third line) of Nyquist helm and Abby.

Thoughts?

Maybe something like this?

Nyquist Pav Bert

Hank Helm Alfie

Jurco Sheahan Tatar

Eaves Glendenning Miller

Cleary & Sammy-> selling game programs

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Maybe something like this?

Nyquist Pav Bert

Hank Helm Alfie

Jurco Sheahan Tatar

Eaves Glendenning Miller

Cleary & Sammy-> selling game programs

Abdelkader?

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Abdelkader?

That's where i hit a snag.

You gotta keep him.

And i like him and helm together.

So we have to lose sheahan or glendenning.

And I love the sheahan line.

But glendenning mixes it up more.

It's tough.

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Maybe something like this?

Nyquist Pav Bert

Hank Helm Alfie

Jurco Sheahan Tatar

Eaves Glendenning Miller

Cleary & sammy-> selling game programs

Z pav bert

Nyq helm alfie

Jurco sheahan Tatar

Abby glendenning eaves

But who do we send down.

Cuz Cleary, Sammy, and miller can't all be on the roster yet.

I mean do they wanna risk losing any of them in case we need em.

And if we recall them after the roster limit is lifted does their salary go right back on the books with no penalty?

We need to do something.

Cuz the kids on my stated lineup have been too valuable to send back, without a noticeable drop off in effective play.

If nothing happens before sochi I fear sheahan and jurco will be gone to make room for Weiss and one of those three.

Not to mention what they'll do when Anderssons back, cuz hes great on the pk, unless theyre just ir-ing him to make space for one of the other guys.

Our rosters so crowded.

Its crazy to try to think what theyll do.

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Knowing Babs, jurco will go down. Hes still a baby and must refine his game a little more. Which we all know would happen faster at the NHL level. But with our logjam of forwards i doubt theyll send down eaves before him, especially after last night. Jurco, sheahan, glendening will all go back down when weiss, andy, mule come back unfortunately.

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We have too many forwards and not enough space. Youd think z dats mule alfie bert weiss abby helm tatar nyquist andy are guaranteed spots.

Thats 11/12 spots taken.

Leaving cleary miller eaves jurco sheahan glendening sammy to fight for one available spot.

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We have too many forwards and not enough space. Youd think z dats mule alfie bert weiss abby helm tatar nyquist andy are guaranteed spots.

Thats 11/12 spots taken.

Leaving cleary miller eaves jurco sheahan glendening sammy to fight for one available spot.[/quote

More like 2-3 spots as we will have more than 12 forwards on the roster. But if it was my choice, sheahan, jurco, and glendening should be on the roster

We have too many forwards and not enough space. Youd think z dats mule alfie bert weiss abby helm tatar nyquist andy are guaranteed spots.

Thats 11/12 spots taken.

Leaving cleary miller eaves jurco sheahan glendening sammy to fight for one available spot.[/quote

More like 2-3 spots as we will have more than 12 forwards on the roster. But if it was my choice, sheahan, jurco, and glendening should be on the roster

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Abdelkader?

Wow can't believe I forgot him. Must have been too late for me. I'd like a roster like this:

Nyquist Pav Alfie

Hank Helm Abs

Jurco Sheahan Tatar

Eaves Glendenning Bert

Cleary Sammy Miller (I'd rather keep Eaves and trade Miller, just my preference of the two). Problem is when Franzen and Weiss come back they gotta make room for them too. Not sure how to go about doing that.

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If it were my choice. If i got to pick 14 forwards.

Z dats mule

Nyquist weiss alfie

Tatar helm abby

Jurco andy sheahan

Glendening eaves (only if he plays like he did last night) otherwise miller.

That bottom 6 listed above, is the easily one of the best in the league. Skill speed size and DEPTH.

Sammy cleary bert miller are all slow and easily replacable by one of those listed above. We need speed and size to succeed. These guys bring no speed and the kids play bigger.

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Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Alfredsson

Nyquist - Weiss - Franzen

Tatar - Helm - Abdelkader

Miller - Sheahan - Glendening

Ferraro Callahan

Trade Andersson for whatever - he is expendable.

After next year Alfie retires and Jurco takes his roster spot

Edited by dirtydangles

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