joesuffP 1,746 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) Playing solid defensively and finishing with 40ish points is pretty good for a dman @ 7M nowadays What about Richards? He's paid to score and not known for defense. Is he a failure if he doesn't hit 10 goals? We're not a high flying team. If Green played for Winnepeg he'd be racking up points Edited December 22, 2015 by joesuffP Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,794 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Playing solid defensively and finishing with 40ish points is pretty good for a dman @ 7M nowadays What about Richards? He's paid to score and not known for defense. Is he a failure if he doesn't hit 10 goals? We're not a high flying team. If Green played for Winnepeg he'd be racking up points Maybe we should be. Not like we're one of the best defensive teams in the league. We sure as hell can't protect leads very well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Internet.Unknown 422 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Isn't scoring points important to winning games? Green wasn't brought in to play physical or kill penalties (things he doesn't really do). I was a big fan of the signing, but I don't see how you can ignore that the offensive output has been somewhat disappointing. I think his production will improve just like his overall game has since coming back from the injury. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill Berzeench 310 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Maybe we should be. Not like we're one of the best defensive teams in the league. We sure as hell can't protect leads very well. This is what I dont get. How is Green "playing solid defensively"?? He's a minus player. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Bill, you read WAY too much into +/-... It's probably one of, if not the worst stats to go by, but yet it seems to be your go to in every argument for or against a player. Green has been much better defensively than any of us could have expected. He's actually been quite good, especially considering he is an "offensive" minded defenseman. Sure, his point totals could be a little higher, but he is leading the defense in points per game. He's also just coming off an injury, and has been playing better every game since coming back. He's been great at jumping up in the rush, timely pinches and very solid in his own zone. Green is not an issue with this team whatsoever... 2 TheXym and Internet.Unknown reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DatsyukianDekes 2,428 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Isn't scoring points important to winning games? Green wasn't brought in to play physical or kill penalties (things he doesn't really do). I was a big fan of the signing, but I don't see how you can ignore that the offensive output has been somewhat disappointing. The whole team sucks on offense right now it has nothing to do with Green. He has the same amount of points as Kronwall and has played 6 less games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DatsyukianDekes 2,428 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 This is what I dont get. How is Green "playing solid defensively"?? He's a minus player. Dumbest argument ever. +/- is a team stat. In 2013 Pascal Dupuis led all players in +/-, he must be elite. With all the other advanced stats these days why do people still look at +/- I will never know. Shea Weber is a -5 btw, guess he is the 2nd worst defense men in the game now by your standards. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill Berzeench 310 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 So Dylan Larkin being a +20 is meaningless? B.S. If it was a bad stat, they'd get rid of it. Green's corsi For % is a tad over 54. Thats not too bad. Smith averages about 55% and Kindl 56%. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 No one is saying that +/- is completely meaningless, just that you seem to put way too much stock into it. I think Larkin being +20 as a 19 year old rookie is very indicative of the kind of player he is, but even if he were a mere +4, I would still be just as impressed with his play. Sheahan hasn't been as good as he can be, but he also hasn't been our worst player, yet he's sporting the worst +/- on the team at -8. The constant hate from everyone on Ericsson, but yet he has the best +/- of all our defenseman at +7. Do you really think he's been our best defenseman?... 1 Bill Berzeench reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill Berzeench 310 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 No one is saying that +/- is completely meaningless, just that you seem to put way too much stock into it. I think Larkin being +20 as a 19 year old rookie is very indicative of the kind of player he is, but even if he were a mere +4, I would still be just as impressed with his play. Sheahan hasn't been as good as he can be, but he also hasn't been our worst player, yet he's sporting the worst +/- on the team at -8. The constant hate from everyone on Ericsson, but yet he has the best +/- of all our defenseman at +7. Do you really think he's been our best defenseman?... I will agree with you that it doesnt tell the whole story. But you cant say "He's been good defensively" if he's sporting a minus 6 rating. That's silly. He may have been good offensively, but good defense would imply the other team doesnt score while he's on the ice. This is not the case. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Sheahan, Glendening, Miller and Helm are all defensively sound players, but yet they are -8, -7, -5 and -4 respectively... Marchenko has been one of our better defensemen in his own end but yet he's a -2... Shea Weber and Alex Pietrangelo are both -4. Are they terrible defensively? Brent Burns is -14. He must be the worst defenseman in the league, other than Ian Cole of course, who is -17... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mckinley25 678 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Lidstrom won the Norris with a -2. 3 canadian wings fan, krsmith17 and TheXym reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Internet.Unknown 422 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Lidstrom won the Norris with a -2. mic drop? 2 Wheelchairsuperhero and canadian wings fan reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bill Berzeench 310 Report post Posted December 22, 2015 Sheahan, Glendening, Miller and Helm are all defensively sound players, but yet they are -8, -7, -5 and -4 respectively... Marchenko has been one of our better defensemen in his own end but yet he's a -2... Shea Weber and Alex Pietrangelo are both -4. Are they terrible defensively? Brent Burns is -14. He must be the worst defenseman in the league, other than Ian Cole of course, who is -17... Why can't you compromise? I said it wasn't the only indicator of a player's worth. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
