Quincey or Meech...

[egroen 384]

Let's assume Holland is able to sign Stuart --

Now you choose between Lilja and Chelios:

Lilja wants a raise (currently making $1 million), was made an offer during the season and held out -- probably wants to test free agency.

Chelios would probably come back for close to the league minimum.

I'll also assume Holland signs Chelios.

Assuming Ericsson stays in the AHL for one more year, subject to call ups.

And finally assuming Lebda is not traded, you have:

Meech -- Similar game to Lebda: fast, puck moving smallish defender. Can also play forward. Showed a lot of promise throughout sporadic play during season. Much improved over previous call ups to the NHL.

Quincey -- Slightly smaller Lilja. Fights. Showed to be a consistent stay-at-home defender last year during the playoffs.

One of these guys will be lost to waivers, or needs to be traded (what value would they have?).

Ok, that's a lot of assumptions... but here is what I would do:

Sign Stuart and Chelios.

Let Lilja walk.

Lebda's trade value is probably about as high as it ever will be - I would look into trading him for a draft pick, or even in an attempt to move up in the first round this year.

Keep both Quincey and Meech.

Give Ericsson one more year to develop, calling him up as needed.

Thoughts?

Edited June 9, 2008 by egroen

[Kp-Wings 3]

Quincey. He has all the tools to be a great all around defenseman. His best asset is his physical play, something that we could always use more of back on the blueline.

Meech is basically another Lebda, but slower. He played decent when he got his chance last season, but really, I'm not a big fan of him. I'd rather see Quincey get a shot first.

[ManLove4Homer 0]

I was impressed by the way Quincey play last year in the conference finals. He stepped up his game. With him, Stuart and Kronwall, we have a pretty physical defense.

I haven't seen Meech play enough to make a good assement of him.

[Hank 0]

Definitely Quincy.

[Hank Dats 'N Homer 81]

i like lebda and i really dont want to see him traded. I would make a terrible GM i guess because if there are guys that i like on my team, i would never think about trading or letting them go haha. But i like Lebs. Hes got great speed when he has open ice. In 06-07 he made a few end to end skates with the puck all by himself and i believe two or three of them ended with him getting past all defenseman and beating the goaltender. I didnt see that as much this year and i dont know if it was because he has lost a step from his rookie campaign or if he was told to be more of a stay at home defender. Although playing with Cheli and Lebda slowed him down a bit im sure. Anyways, i love his speed if he were allowed to jump up into the play a little more often i think he would be a good offensive contributor as well. I like Stuart alot, but im not convinced he likes Detroit enough to stay. His wife and family are still back on the coast and i have a bad feeling thats where he will end up again playing for some West coast team. Which makes me belieive we will be giving lilja a little raise and taking him to 1.5 million, which i dont know if he deserves or not, but he adds good shot blocking to the mix which is kinda what we need. If Eriksson has another year that he can be put back down to the Griffs than i say do it. Hes got a power shot, but i think he has a bit more to learn when it comes to the NHL. Hes almost there though! I like Meech but he plays the same game that Lebda plays and since i have grown to like Lebda id say let go of Meech before we let go of Brett. I like Quincey and what he brought to playoffs in 07, big build and a decent defensemen. Id keep him around for a bench role if not than put him back down with GR if we can.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Youve got four choices here: Lebda, Quincey, and Meech. Ericsson is untouchable.

If I'm GM, I let the buyers do the talking here. There are a number of teams in the NHL who will be looking for young, quality Dmen who'll come cheap.

Ive heard rumors of Vancouver wanting to trade one of their Dmen for a good top sixer, but Ive heard they have reservations about that because of Bourdon passing away and Bieksa not being the same after that ankle/tendon injury. So it may be a great prelude to a big Vancouver trade if we sent one of our guys to Vancouver at the draft.

Also, a great choice would be Tampa Bay. They have a TERRIBLE farm, and some of the worst scouting/drafting in the league. It would be a smart move to market any of those three to Tampa Bay for their 2nd rounder, which sits at 31st. It would pretty sweet to have the 30th AND 31st pick, although thats doubtful

Although it would never happen, it would be to Detroits advantage to trade with Carolina, who is gonna be desperate for Dmen now that it appears both Wesley and Hedican are retiring, and they dont have any young Dmen in stock outside of Gleason, who hasnt been anything special.

I can also think of about 10 other teams off the top of my head that would interested in one of our guys. Ultimately, I would love to see Detroit make a move at the draft and move up in that 1st round, if only by 5 or 6 spots.

Basically, If Im Holland, ill trade whichever player garners the best offer. With the D depth we have, I cant see us hurting from trading any of Lebda, Quincey, or Meech.

Edited June 9, 2008 by YoungGuns1340

[egroen 384]

I just hope Holland is able to gain something for one of them...

It certainly seems like they have value, and as deep as Detroit's D is, these guys should easily make the bottom pairing on most teams in the NHL.

But Detroit has a history of losing these borderline players for nothing, through the waiver, as other GMs seem reluctant to give an inch for Holland.

Edited June 9, 2008 by egroen

[skacore 2]

Go with Quincey full time, Meech can always step in if one of the top 3 go down, he did a great job stepping in this year

[stud_defenseman 1]

Here is what I would do...

Sign Stuart, let Lilja go, keep Lebda, let Chelios go, trade Meech, sign Quincey, sign Ericsson.

Roster would be...

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Stuart - Kronwall

Lebda - Quincey - Ericsson

One question though...can you send Quincey or Ericsson back down to the AHL without them having to clear waivers?

[McCartyFanForLife 17]

From all the things I've read, it looks like Chelios is staying

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article...031/1048/sports

[JeeSpot82 10]

I like where some of these sentiments are coming from (see which of the three garners the biggest offer), but Quincey isn't signed at present... The Wings would have to sign him, to trade him a few days later before/at the draft (for these scenarios to work), or risk losing him via RFA for kinda crappy compensation.

It won't make me popular, and I wouldn't particularly love the move either, but I think Brett Lebda is most movable defenseman. He's a surefire NHLer, still young, obviously fast and confident with the puck, and is under contract for a very reasonable salary. If I'm a GM of one of the other 29 teams, that's probably the guy I target for immediate insertion into the lineup.

Quincey probably won't sign unless he's told he won't be traded (he's not stupid), and it seems like the organization likes Derek Meech. That's not to say that either COULDN'T be traded, but if I'm the Hurricanes (or whoever)... do I trade for another potential roster player when a for real roster player is (supposedly) "available"?

If you're asking me personally, I think I'd rather have Meech than Quincey, but trading Quincey will prove to be a task. But like I said in another thread - you can have both, if neither Lilja nor Stuart are re-signed (one because he didn't like the deal he was offered earlier in the season and the other because he's anxious to get back to the West Coast).

[JeeSpot82 10]

Here is what I would do...

Sign Stuart, let Lilja go, keep Lebda, let Chelios go, trade Meech, sign Quincey, sign Ericsson.

Roster would be...

Lidstrom - Rafalski

Stuart - Kronwall

Lebda - Quincey - Ericsson

One question though...can you send Quincey or Ericsson back down to the AHL without them having to clear waivers?

Ericsson has one more year of waiver exemption - meaning he CAN be sent down without being subjected to waivers.

Kyle Quincey is in the same situation as Meech last season: attempt to send him down and you risk losing him to waivers. It's NHL or bust for Quincey and the Red Wings. Also, like I mentioned earlier, he is an RFA - so he needs to be signed first.

[egroen 384]

One question though...can you send Quincey or Ericsson back down to the AHL without them having to clear waivers?

Only Ericsson is waiver-exempt -- which I thinks forces them to keep him in GR next year.

Quincey would have to clear waivers (which is why Meech was the 7th defenseman on the Red Wings this past year).

[stud_defenseman 1]

Ericsson has one more year of waiver exemption - meaning he CAN be sent down without being subjected to waivers.

Kyle Quincey is in the same situation as Meech last season: attempt to send him down and you risk losing him to waivers. It's NHL or bust for Quincey and the Red Wings. Also, like I mentioned earlier, he is an RFA - so he needs to be signed first.

thanks for the info...in that case I would probably trade Meech then, get whatever you can for him. Sign Quincey for the 6th spot and let Ericsson play in the AHL again for a year inputting him in the lineup wherever possible.

by the way, where did you find this info for whether a player still has waiver exemption status?

[JeeSpot82 10]

For these guys, it was just me paying attention over the last few off-seasons and committed it to memory. However, there is a chart to determine when a player because waiver eligible.

I was reading the Waiver Rules last night actually (NERD ALERT!), and it's Article 13 under the new CBA. You can read it here: http://www.nhlfa.com/CBA/cba_agreement13.asp

Or, for a quicker, much less wordy chart, here ya go:

GOALIES SKATERS

AGE YRS GP YRS GP

18 6 80 5 160

19 5 80 4 160

20 4 80 3 160

21 4 60 3 80

22 4 60 3 70

23 3 60 3 60

24 2 60 2 60

25+ 1 1

So that's the age at the time of signing the first contract, years since that contract was signed, and games played at the NHL level. Enjoy.

If my math and contract reading skills are up to par, the only Red Wings players that are subject to waivers (aside from the NHL regulars, of course), are:

Randall Gelech (RFA 2009) signed at 20 (with PHX), played four full seasons in AHL

Ryan Oulahen (RFA) signed at 20, played three full seasons in Grand Rapids

Kyle Quincey (RFA) signed at 20, played three full seasons in Grand Rapids

Jimmy Howard is exempt for another year because he's a goaltender and they get an additional year of waiver exemption.

Edited June 9, 2008 by JeeSpot82

[SnipeShow 0]

let cheli,lilja and stuart walk. play the young guys all year and beef up the blueline at the deadline

[Drake_Marcus 890]

There's no other option but to trade someone if any two of Chelios, Stewart or Lilja comes back.

We have 4 defensemen already signed. Meech and Quincey have no minior league options left. Meech can't sit around for another season as the 7th defenseman and expect him to develop at all.

Ericsson will be playing as one of the top 6 d-men in the 2009-2010 season. He's an AHL all-star d-man with enviable size (6'-4"), puck poise, and a >100 mph slapshot. He's arguably our second best prospect and most definitelty in the top three (I'd argue he's actually our top prospect simply because Howard's a goalie and goalies either sink or swim when they move up to the NHL- there's no real room for error). The Wings won't let his development stall in his first NHL year unless they absolutely have to.

All this means one thing- the Wings need to get a good look at Meech and Quincey this season.

Here's the realistic line-up:

Lidstrom Rafalski (1st pairing)

Kronwall Stewart (2nd pairing)

Chelios ______ (3rd pairing)

_______ (Depth d-man)

Inside those two blanks we have:

Lilja, Lebda, Quincey and Meech to chose from.

That means two of those players have to go. The Wings will sign Quincey because he's worth too much to let walk for free. If they sign Lilja they have 2 d-men they have to trade or give away via waivers. There's a definite market for d-men this summer and the Wings defensive system is highly respected so I think the Wings can get a good return on whoever they trade.

To top it off Lilja and Lebda played excellent hockey in the finals.

If it were up to me I'd trade Lebda and let Lilja go on his way. Let's say they rest Chelios eveyr other game. That leaves one spot always open and one spot open half the time. In other words- there are 123 games spots to split between two men. Give Meech 62 games and Quincey 61 games.

[Sergei Fedorov91 24]

Wow what a luxury that we have to have to decide on which of those guys we have to keep.

[Hocketownwest 11]

Quinceys 07/08 year end totals

G A PTS +/- S PIM PP SH FG GW

5 15 20 -6 144 149 2 - - 1

Ericsson's 07/08 year end totals

G A PTS +/- S PIM PP SH FG GW

10 24 34 4 124 83 6 - 5 -

Lilja

Season GP G A P +/- PIM PP SH GW S S%

2007-2008 79 2 10 12 -2 93 0 0 2 72 2.8

Lebda

Season GP G A P +/- PIM PP SH GW S S%

2007-2008 78 3 11 14 -1 48 0 0 1 110 2.7

Watching Quincy this year, it wasn't his best and he seemed very frustrated but then again it wasn't the Griffins best year either.

Even so Jonathan did really improve. Would love to see him move up but dead weight would have to be shed. He may have to stay in GR another year.

Meech hasn't had much of a chance to get his legs only playing 32 games with limited minutes. I prefer him over Quincy. May have to lose both.

I would rather keep Lebda than Lilja. He has better speed, commits fewer penalties and shoots more. Lilja over Lebda would be a mistake.

[marcaractac 3,963]

I'd say keep them all and see who impresses most after camp. Lilja is as good as gone. We don't need him anymore, and he probably wants to test the market anyway after holding out on the contract offer from Holland. But when it comes down to it, Ericsson can play in GR another season, one of Quincey/Lebda/Chelios can be a 7th Dman at any given time, and Meech can be a depth forward or defensemen.

But yes, I say keep them all. Once the trading can start druing the season, they can trade whoever is most expendable. He'll, they can trade 2 of them if they want Ericsson to be called up bad enough.

If one HAS to be traded, Meech it is I think. I wouldn't mind seeing Holland offer up one or two of them along with our first round pick to try and move up in the draft. There are a lot of teams desperate for good puck moving defensemen out there, and Meech has potential (Like how he stepped it up when Lids, Rafalski, and Kronwall were all out at once). There could be someone in the league willing enough to give up their first pick for our first pick and an NHL ready Dman with lots of potential. Its gonna be interesting to see what happens though. But if they really want to, they can keep everybody. I just don't expect many defense to be drafted this year though with Kindl AND Smith coming up down the road as well.

[miller76 463]

neither. I would rather roll the dice with new ones!

[Zata fan 40 6]

I like both,but love the physical play of Quincey more.

[Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204]

I want both, but would rather Quincey.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

let cheli,lilja and stuart walk. play the young guys all year and beef up the blueline at the deadline

Brad Stuart is only 28 years old, I wouldn't exactly call him an old-timer.

Chelios, as is the plan so far, will either be a 7th/8th d-man. Like it or not, he's coming back.

Lilja I'm indifferent on. His brainfarts annoy me, but as a 5th or 6th defenseman he still bring some good intangibles (decent PKer and solid shot blocker).

To the topic at hand, I think that Quincey might look to be more of a stay-at-home d-man (Grand Rapid fans please help me out and correct me if I am wrong, I don't follow minors at all), and Meech is more of the offensive-minded defenseman. I was very impressed with how Meech played with added responsibilities with all the injuries to the defensemen durin a chunk of the season.

If it were any other team, I'd say Quincey due to the fact that you can never have enough physical stay-at-home defensemen. But with Kronwall throwing big hits on occassion and Stuart hopefully coming back, the physical aspect has stepped up some and this is a team where puck possession and a good outlet pass out of your zone from defensemen are so important. I think Meech is well suited for that.

[CenterIce 83]

Lidstrom/Rafalski

Kronwall/Stuart

Lebda/Quincey and Ericsson rotation

Meech can be an extra defenseman and forward