History Repeats

[Holmstrom96Screens 0]

lol

some of those things are straw men, others just plain ridiculous (mustaches? Dogsledding? Wtf)

Draper has already been considered both here and other wing forums.

I think some people should be considered on the basis of their own specific skill and how it has been a benefit to the whole wings organization. You've got the most valuable role player in the whole NH freakin L. and yet it seems that you guys will name almost anybody ahead of him. I mean come on. Lilja? Kronwall? Gimmie a king size break. I can name many guys who have played the role better than they do. But nobody who has played the screener role better than Homer.

and yes I really do know that Homer enhances Dats and Zetty. They wouldnt be as effective without them. The wings organization knew this thats why they built all these power scorers around with Homer. Dats. Zetty. Liddy. Rafalski. Cleary. The PP group. With these and homer crashing slots this group is an NHL powerhouse.

I saw how the wings played in game 5 of the stanley cup finals without homer and then how they played in game 6 with homer. In game 5 Fleury was an animal. But even accounting for the goal scored while Cleary was screening, the wings could hardly get a shot past him.

Now take game 6. Homer comes back and the DRW strike right away. Rafalski scores and quickly too, do to my Demolition Man crashing the slot. Fleury was not nearly as effective when Homer was playing. and you know it.

Edited July 10, 2008 by Holmstrom96Screens

[BlakChamber 8]

lol

some of those things are straw men, others just plain ridiculous (mustaches? Dogsledding? Wtf)

Draper has already been considered both here and other wing forums.

I think some people should be considered on the basis of their own specific skill and how it has been a benefit to the whole wings organization. You've got the most valuable role player in the whole NH freakin L. and yet it seems that you guys will name almost anybody ahead of him. I mean come on. Lilja? Kronwall? Gimmie a king size break. I can name many guys who have played the role better than they do. But nobody who has played the screener role better than Homer.

and yes I really do know that Homer enhances Dats and Zetty. They wouldnt be as effective without them. The wings organization knew this thats why they built all these power scorers around with Homer. Dats. Zetty. Liddy. Rafalski. Cleary. The PP group. With these and homer crashing slots this group is an NHL powerhouse.

I saw how the wings played in game 5 of the stanley cup finals without homer and then how they played in game 6 with homer. In game 5 Fleury was an animal. But even accounting for the goal scored while Cleary was screening, the wings could hardly get a shot past him.

Now take game 6. Homer comes back and the DRW strike right away. Rafalski scores and quickly too, do to my Demolition Man crashing the slot. Fleury was not nearly as effective when Homer was playing. and you know it.

Homer is the best at what he does, no doubt about it. But its easier to get into the hockey hall of fame (which Homer isn't going to do) than it is to get your number retired by the Wings. That honor is reserved for the very best of the best.

Look at who the Wings have retired. Sawchuk, Lindsay, Howe, Delvecchio, Abel, and Yzerman. Six players in the 80 some years the Red Wings have been around. Lidstrom will obviously join those players when that sad day comes when he decides to hang up his skates. Can you really sit here and tell me with a straight face that you think Holmstrom is at the same level as the above listed players?

I like Homer, not as much as you obviously, he's one of the few guys on the Wings I'd have a problem with trading. Great player, apparently a great teammate and a great guy. But not a player who gets his number retired.

[stevie for president 42]

1 Terry Sawchuk, G, 1949–55, 1957–64 & 1968–69, number retired March 6, 1994

7 Ted Lindsay, LW, 1944–57 & 1964–65, number retired November 10, 1991

9 Gordie Howe, RW, 1946–71, number retired March 12, 1972

10 Alex Delvecchio, C, 1950–73, number retired November 10, 1991

12 Sid Abel, LW, 1938–52, number retired April 29, 1995

19 Steve Yzerman, C, 1983–2006, number retired January 2, 2007 (the banner features the captain "C" to honor his tenure as the longest serving captain in NHL history)

99 Wayne Gretzky, Although he was never a member of the Red Wings, his number was retired league-wide February 6, 2000

Wayne shouldnt be retired. If 99 is retired, 4 and 66 should be too IMO. maybe not 66. or they could retire it and unretire like 3 times. but Number 4 should be retired league wide if 99 is.

Yzerman and Howe are obvious retired numbers

Sawchuk is one of the all-time greatest goalies. His number deserves to be up there.

Lindsay and Abel were both part of the Production Line and the wings dynasty, and they both held front office jobs. Ted was a great GM and Sid was a coach and an analyst.

Delvecchio was a class act on and off the ice. he won the lady byng 3 times, has an NHL record for most games with his only team for a career, and retired second in games played, assists and points on the all-time list. he also was a GM for the wings.

Steve Yzerman and Gordie Howe are the only players to have their numbers retired before helping the wings win off the ice. Ozzie is no Gordie or Stevie. and for that matter, he has never been and will never been talked about in the same echelon as the other retired numbers. Unless he gets 40+ wins three times, 3 vezinas, 3 jennings, and another cup or two, AND comes on as goalie coach or NA goalie scout or something and does a lot of charity work, i dont see his number getting retired, just based on the other retired jerseys.

[Doc Holiday 0]

1 Terry Sawchuk, G, 1949–55, 1957–64 & 1968–69, number retired March 6, 1994

7 Ted Lindsay, LW, 1944–57 & 1964–65, number retired November 10, 1991

9 Gordie Howe, RW, 1946–71, number retired March 12, 1972

10 Alex Delvecchio, C, 1950–73, number retired November 10, 1991

12 Sid Abel, LW, 1938–52, number retired April 29, 1995

19 Steve Yzerman, C, 1983–2006, number retired January 2, 2007 (the banner features the captain "C" to honor his tenure as the longest serving captain in NHL history)

99 Wayne Gretzky, Although he was never a member of the Red Wings, his number was retired league-wide February 6, 2000

Wayne shouldnt be retired. If 99 is retired, 4 and 66 should be too IMO. maybe not 66. or they could retire it and unretire like 3 times. but Number 4 should be retired league wide if 99 is.

Yzerman and Howe are obvious retired numbers

Sawchuk is one of the all-time greatest goalies. His number deserves to be up there.

Lindsay and Abel were both part of the Production Line and the wings dynasty, and they both held front office jobs. Ted was a great GM and Sid was a coach and an analyst.

Delvecchio was a class act on and off the ice. he won the lady byng 3 times, has an NHL record for most games with his only team for a career, and retired second in games played, assists and points on the all-time list. he also was a GM for the wings.

Steve Yzerman and Gordie Howe are the only players to have their numbers retired before helping the wings win off the ice. Ozzie is no Gordie or Stevie. and for that matter, he has never been and will never been talked about in the same echelon as the other retired numbers. Unless he gets 40+ wins three times, 3 vezinas, 3 jennings, and another cup or two, AND comes on as goalie coach or NA goalie scout or something and does a lot of charity work, i dont see his number getting retired, just based on the other retired jerseys.

Man I read this and just fumed up in rage because it just looked at first glance like a total knock on Ozzie. I wish there could be a disclaimer saying "Despite not believe Osgood should be retired he is a great goalie and deserves a lot of credit for his accomplishments"

[rage 24]

That's as good of a reason as any I have heard -- there really has never been a reason given and the family is pissed - and they never received a reason.

I think it is rather rotten, but admittedly one of the few slights against Illitch I can think of. How many players in the NHL have been unretired?

Bobby Hull's was unretired so Brett Hull could wear it in Phoenix. In a craptacular move Messier forced Vancouver to let him wear Wayne Maki's out of circulation #11 -- for comparison's sake, this would be worse than Hossa demanding Vladdie's #16, as Maki died of brain cancer at the age of 29, and like Vladdie, his number was unofficially retired.

Yes, but was he on a Lays commercial, ever? LOL.I agree with the other posters in that it should be the Stevie Y award. That guy is a natural leader.He should've got some sort of MESSIER LAYS award for most unfit player... Betcha can't eat just one :roll: - stupid commercial

Edited July 10, 2008 by rage

[Holmstrom96Screens 0]

for the fellow who asked me can I really sit here and type on my keyboard yes....

I can, and I do.

Like Doc Holiday and his Ozzie fuming I too fumed up in rage cause even wings fans give Homer less credit than what he actually deserve.

Doc Holiday is right about Ozzie btw.

Another underrated goalie that he is

Edited July 10, 2008 by Holmstrom96Screens

[stevie for president 42]

Man I read this and just fumed up in rage because it just looked at first glance like a total knock on Ozzie. I wish there could be a disclaimer saying "Despite not believe Osgood should be retired he is a great goalie and deserves a lot of credit for his accomplishments"

haha sorry. I think ozzie does deserve to have his number retired, but based on the other retired numbers and how dominant they were on the ice and how much they did for the wings after their playing careers were over, i cant make an argument for osgood. Also, putting him in the HHOF is being debating (i dont know why, if he had any other name hed be a 1st ballot lock) but i just think if a case has to be made for the HHOF, a case can't be made for the wings to retire your jersey. I hope im wrong.

[octopusonice 0]

He has never won any awards nor been on an all star team. well I know that. But if there was ever an award for his particular role in the NHL, (something like a norris for liddy's job or a selke for Pasha Datsyuk) Homer would win it hands down. Of that I have no doubt.

Scoring goals - his talent does not lie in scoring goals though he certainly does his best to try to score. He is a supporter for the real goal scorers mostly like his linemates Dats and Zett. You think Dats and Zett would put up the numbers they do if they did not have Homer on their line? Their job would be more difficult. Im wondering if Dats would have even joined the ranks of being one out of only 4 red wings in history to lead the team three seasons running in scoring without a guy like homer to help him.

I really wish people would stop talking about the goals. Homer is a different kind of forward. not the kind you would build a team around but a really good supporting asset. He is not a goal scoring forward though he tries to score. I really dont think Homer should be judged based on the number of goals he can score. He basically revolutionizing the role of forward playing a different job than most forwards do.

I still believe he should be in there with the rest of the red wings you all talk about who helped to bring the team out of its 42 year drought.

Anyone who has faced the Red Wings for any length of time knows the grief that Homer causes in front of the net. Unfortunately, the people who have any say on whether a person goes to the HHOF are going to look at stats.

It's kind of like the middle reliver in baseball. Many games are won or lost because of them, but because there's no glamour in their job, they rarely if ever get voted to the HOF.

[hak 21]

lol

some of those things are straw men, others just plain ridiculous (mustaches? Dogsledding? Wtf)

Draper has already been considered both here and other wing forums.

I think some people should be considered on the basis of their own specific skill and how it has been a benefit to the whole wings organization. You've got the most valuable role player in the whole NH freakin L. and yet it seems that you guys will name almost anybody ahead of him. I mean come on. Lilja? Kronwall? Gimmie a king size break. I can name many guys who have played the role better than they do. But nobody who has played the screener role better than Homer.

and yes I really do know that Homer enhances Dats and Zetty. They wouldnt be as effective without them. The wings organization knew this thats why they built all these power scorers around with Homer. Dats. Zetty. Liddy. Rafalski. Cleary. The PP group. With these and homer crashing slots this group is an NHL powerhouse.

I saw how the wings played in game 5 of the stanley cup finals without homer and then how they played in game 6 with homer. In game 5 Fleury was an animal. But even accounting for the goal scored while Cleary was screening, the wings could hardly get a shot past him.

Now take game 6. Homer comes back and the DRW strike right away. Rafalski scores and quickly too, do to my Demolition Man crashing the slot. Fleury was not nearly as effective when Homer was playing. and you know it.

you seem a bit off to me honestly.. but i think that your man love for homer has clouded your mind a bit or something

I'm not even sure what you are arguing and who you are arguing with. We all love homer and appreciate what he has done for this organization. But do you honestly thinks his jersey should hang aside with yzermans howes etc? ?

Also.. The guy who said Lilja was joking. The guy who said kronwall - well he said that kronner had the potential if he develop to no1 defenceman on this team and leads wings to another cup after lids are retired and wins a couple of norrises on the way. So you took it a bit out of context

uhm.. yeah

[Holmstrom96Screens 0]

you seem a bit off to me honestly.. but i think that your man love for homer has clouded your mind a bit or something

no. i can definitely say no to that one.

I know you're all right and it'll never happen. I know what it's like there. I know how it works. I never grew up with a father who's been an NHL fan for 50 years and me being one for nearly 20 for to let fave players of mine cloud my judgement.

But homer has been very valuable to the new era and in getting the 42 years with no cups ended. dont see any reason why he shouldnt be included with those particular red wings he was with and they all helped...they all should get recognized in my opinion.

I'll go with the opinions of some other people who posted here and say yes to a wings hall of fame or something of that nature.

after all, if Illitch wont even formally recognize larry aurie (part of the red wings first real power line in the 1930's just after they were renamed the red wings) for crying out loud what chance does homer have.

[Barrie 900]

To have your jersey retired as a Wing, it is generally accepted that there are a few considerations that must be met.

1) You must have, as a Red Wing, been considered among the top players in the world at your position, and therefore have been a key player for the team for at least a few years. Awards, trophies, and All-Star selections help with this consideration.

Based on that criterion, the following players are 'eligible' for consideration:

#2 "Black" Jack Stewart

#3 Marcel Pronovost

#4 Red Kelly

#5 Nicklas Lidstrom

#5 Ebbie Goodfellow

#6 Larry Aurie

#7 Norm Ullman

#8 Syd Howe

#13 Pavel Datsyuk

#14 Brendan Shanahan

#16 Vladimir Konstantinov

#30 Chris Osgood

#40 Henrik Zetterberg

#91 Sergei Fedorov

However, this list is pared down a bit when you consider the next criterion:

2) You must have started with Detroit and spent the majority of your career with the Wings

Thereby removed from the list are Shanahan and Syd Howe. Yet more players are removed when you further with the next criterion:

3) You must be a Hall of Famer.

HHOF eligible players removed from the list include Larry Aurie and Vladimir Konstantinov. Nicklas Lidstrom and Sergei Fedorov are active players and considered HHOF locks. Chris Osgood, Henrik Zetterberg, and Pavel Datsyuk are active players with a strong likelihood of ending their career at HHOF level.

Finally, there is the fourth, and most subjective consideration.

4) The player and organization must have a positive relationship, and there usually must be an 'afterglow' or 'nostalgia' feel regarding the player; players who leave on bad terms and/or aren't remembered fondly are less likely to receive the honor. Typically a long, successful career ending in Detroit is the best way to foster this feeling. Leaving town after one's prime tends to have a small negative effect, and leaving at the top of your game and/or while the team is having considerable success tends to have a significant negative effect. Sometimes the 'nostalgia' of a player's success can outweigh a negative departure, depending on how well the player performed and how much time has passed.

So the five most likely players to have their jersey hung in the future, in order:

1) #5 Nicklas Lidstrom

2) #30 Chris Osgood*

3) #91 Sergei Fedorov

4) #40 Henrik Zetterberg*

5) #13 Pavel Datsyuk*

*- Pending HHOF induction likelihood

Other players who could potentially have banners hung, but will likely never see another player wear their number:

#5 Ebbie Goodfellow

#6 Larry Aurie

#7 Norm Ullman

#16 Vladimir Konstantinov

Excellent post eva. I don't think Aurie's #6 should be in the rafters because he isn't in the Hall of Fame. No disrespect to Aurie, but having him up with Stevie, Howe, Lindsay, Delvecchio, Abel, and Sawchuck could lower the bar.

A retired #6 would open the door to debates about all the players you mentioned in the 1st criteria, and with a team's history as old as the Red Wings, available numbers would be limited. I'm the first person who thinks the Yankees and Canadiens, despite all their championships, have retired to many numbers. We don't want the same thing to happen here.

Having #6 taken down, but still out of circulation, was the correct thing for Ilitch to do.

[betterREDthandead 58]

Other players who could potentially have banners hung, but will likely never see another player wear their number:

#5 Ebbie Goodfellow

#6 Larry Aurie

#7 Norm Ullman

#16 Vladimir Konstantinov

I agree. Nobody will ever wear #7 for the Wings again. Never. Ever.

eva, as usual a scientific approach to the problem, but this is not one that needs a scientific approach.

It's simple. To raise a number to the rafters, it must be plainly obvious when the player retires that the number will soon follow. There was never any question about Stevie and there is no question now about Lidstrom.

In other words, any debate, and the answer is NO. If you have to "make the case", the answer is NO.

Nobody should ever look at the rafters and wonder if every number there truly belongs. Ozzie is the perfect example. I love Ozzie. A very, very strong case can be made for HoF induction and I think he'll get it. He's as loyal to the Wings as anyone ever was, including Stevie. He's endured a lot of criticism but he's arrived as a beloved Hockeytown figure. As a huge Ozzie fan I would love to watch his number go up. But it doesn't belong.

[Opie 308]

EVA, how can you use how the player left the wings as a criteria for taking them off of the list and then leave Feds on your list.

If anyone exemplifies the leaving on bad terms it would be him, yet he manages to stay on your list of possibles?

[egroen 384]

I am still amazed at how bad a decision it was for Fedorov to leave the Red Wings. Things really did not work out that well for him, asides from making boatloads of money playing a sport, but you get what I mean.

[Opie 308]

egroen,

Look at the players that left via Free agency (their decision or team) for money look at their careers:

Lapointe big bucks in Beantown, he became the crappiest 5 million dollar player ever!!!

Feds we all know the story

Kozlov granted he wasn't as bad as say Lapointe but he never really got much better after leaving, and I thought he was going to be great!

There are others, but I think some one else mentioned it in another thread, the way this team is structured it tends to make some players look better than they are, some it makes them look really bad because they can't play puck possession (Hatcher anyone) not because they are bad players just a bad fit. But it tends to mask their bad play because everyone is working together, thus making players look better, and then you have guys like Lids who look like mere mortals unless you really watch what they are doing, I mean the guy looks like he is out for a Sunday Stroll half the time, but he is playing his ass off!

[eva unit zero 271]

egroen,

Look at the players that left via Free agency (their decision or team) for money look at their careers:

Lapointe big bucks in Beantown, he became the crappiest 5 million dollar player ever!!!

Feds we all know the story

Kozlov granted he wasn't as bad as say Lapointe but he never really got much better after leaving, and I thought he was going to be great!

There are others, but I think some one else mentioned it in another thread, the way this team is structured it tends to make some players look better than they are, some it makes them look really bad because they can't play puck possession (Hatcher anyone) not because they are bad players just a bad fit. But it tends to mask their bad play because everyone is working together, thus making players look better, and then you have guys like Lids who look like mere mortals unless you really watch what they are doing, I mean the guy looks like he is out for a Sunday Stroll half the time, but he is playing his ass off!

Lapointe was an unrestricted free agent via Group 6 because he was a ten-year veteran making less than the league average. Aside from his contract year, which he had played receiving sweet feeds from Fedorov, he was a reliable 15-goal grinder. and Boston offered him a deal worth about twice what he was worth. He wanted to stay, and offered the Wings the opportunity to counter-offer because at his age he would normally have been an RFA and he wanted to stay. Holland basically told him the Wings couldn't pay him anywhere near that amount, and Lapointe took the money. It had nothing to do with Lapointe thinking he deserved that kind of coin; rather it was Boston's owner feuding with Mike Ilitch and taking who he thought was a budding star.

Fedorov, most people don't know the story. Most people say 'Greedy Russian left for more money' which is WRONG. Fedorov left because he had verbally agreed to a five-year deal worth 50m; which was the first offer made by the Wings; and when he showed up to sign the fifth year was gone. It was never put back on the table by the Wings. Fedorov probably would have signed a five year deal worth 35m had it been offered to him. The problem was that the Wings originally offered a five-year deal Fedorov accepted, and then he was never given the opportunity to sign a contract with a fifth year until Bryan Murray called him. Admittedly, he did not leave on the best terms, but he is right now more likely to have his number retired than Datsyuk or Zetterberg are. Ten years from now, that may or may not be true.

Kozlov was traded for Hasek in the summer of 2001. He did not sign away as a UFA.

All of these players WANTED to stay.

[Opie 308]

Eva I got the details just didn't want to get into them because the point was that after they left their careers were not what they were in Detroit.

Also you caps WANTED was that suppose to be some sort of contradiction to what I posted? I put in parenthesis (their decision or team) because some left some were traded, the point to the post was that their careers were not what they were in Detroit.

Sometimes I think you spend way too much time caught up in the details of a post or the stats that you forget the big picture and miss it entirely!

But can you respond to my post asking you to explain how your criteria should have eliminated Feds yet you still have him on your list, or are you going to defer it and point out how the details of this post were wrong?

[eva unit zero 271]

Eva I got the details just didn't want to get into them because the point was that after they left their careers were not what they were in Detroit.

Also you caps WANTED was that suppose to be some sort of contradiction to what I posted? I put in parenthesis (their decision or team) because some left some were traded, the point to the post was that their careers were not what they were in Detroit.

Sometimes I think you spend way too much time caught up in the details of a post or the stats that you forget the big picture and miss it entirely!

But can you respond to my post asking you to explain how your criteria should have eliminated Feds yet you still have him on your list, or are you going to defer it and point out how the details of this post were wrong?

I said he was the third most likely to have his number hung from the rafters at this point.

That does not say he actually should.

[Opie 308]

So you are saying that some of the criteria don't really hold value? Or hold less value than others? I know they are not your criteria they are the widely perceived criteria of the wings.

But if he doesn't fit them all, as you stated they should meet all criteria, yet he is still a possibility, how is Shanny any less of a possibility? Konstantinov only misses one of the criteria, yet he is eliminated?

I understand the reasons that the players I just mentioned won't make it (more than likely) just wondering how Feds skates by?

So that everyone knows I am not a feds basher, I don't want him back on the Wings because his game is a shadow of what it once was.

I doubt he makes the HHOF unless he goes off the next 2 seasons, he had some fantastic years in Detroit and had he played like that for his entire career, then without a doubt he is HHOF.

But he had 2 phenomenal years with Detroit in which he scored 120 pts and 107 then he had a bunch of years where he was right around a PPG, not a knock I would take a ppg on my team any day of the week.

But if you compare his numbers to Jagr, fair they entered the league at the same time, Jagr smokes Feds by all standards, 5 years with over 100 pts, once reaching 140, 4 seasons with at least 90 pts.

My point Jagr is HHOF no doubt, first ballot, Feds is not first Ballot and may not be HHOF! Less than 500g, could reach that this year if he has a throw back year or he will reach it next season, 1146 points, could reach 1200 this year.

Again his stats are not flooring they don't make you stand up and go wow, so Feds doesn't match the Leaving criteria and I doubt he makes the HHOF, and if he does it will not be a stone cold lock.

[Icer 0]

it certainly looks like the "teamates" idea is proving that history repeats itself.

The "teammates" idea is a given. Howe played for the Red Wings for 25 seasons. Yzerman 22. That's about 2/3 of the time the Red Wings have been in existence. It would be pretty hard to find a player who didn't play with one of those guys, but still played with the Wings long enough to get their jersey retired.

[Icer 0]

it certainly looks like the "teamates" idea is proving that history repeats itself.

The "teammates" idea is a given. Howe played for the Red Wings for 25 seasons. Yzerman 22. That's about 2/3 of the time the Red Wings have been in existence. It would be pretty hard to find a player who didn't play with one of those guys, but still played with the Wings long enough to get their jersey retired.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Fedorov will easily make the HOF. Too many team trophies and individual trophies for him, besides he's one of the best playoff performers the league has ever seen averaging over a point per game.

He was also very consistent in his prime.

I don't know how this can even be debated.

[Opie 308]

So GMR all the consistent players in their prime get into the HHOF now?

It is not the Hall of Consistency, He had 2 great years that were HHOF quality, other than that he was better than average, by quite a bit, but other than his two really big years he was not spectacular, plus for the years he was great in the post season there are years he was relied on and the team went no where, his fault or not.

Plus team awards mean nothing, not having a Stanley cup could be a detering factor, however it is not going to be automatic because he has 3 Cups, how many players from the Oil's streak beyond the top line and pairings are in the HHOF, and that team was LEGENDARY!!! As much of a wings fan as I am, the Wings were not as dominant as that team was.

Again he was ppg guy, no doubt I would always want a PPG guy on my team not denying his skill, however PPG does not get you into the HHOF, especially if he keeps having years where he plays 75+ games and scores 40pts that will drop his average.

Again for 5-9 this guy was a great player, was the best wing for a period of about 3-5 years (Raw skill wise) but the drop off makes it like the goalie argument, the team around him obviously is partly responsible for his numbers, otherwise why when he left did his numbers drop, his first year in ANA was the only year where he put up Fedorov type numbers.

Look at the comparison I made, Jagr and Feds came into the league the same year:

Jagr Career stats

1273gp 646g 953a 1599pts

Fedorov Career Stats

1213gp 472g 674a 1146pts

Jagr without a doubt sure fire HHOFer, Feds I am not so sure.

Again my opinion. But this is definitely a debatable topic.

Edited July 11, 2008 by Opie

[egroen 384]

Fedorov's peak was so high, and he was consistently "good" for enough years for me to consider him a lock for the HHOF and definitely a top 100 player of all time. 120 points, winning the Hart, Pearson and the Selke in one year is one of the best individual seasons ever as well as 3 consecutive 20+ point playoff performances.

[Opie 308]

Fedorov's peak was so high, and he was consistently "good" for enough years for me to consider him a lock for the HHOF and definitely a top 100 player of all time. 120 points, winning the Hart, Pearson and the Selke in one year is one of the best individual seasons ever as well as 3 consecutive 20+ point playoff performances.

There is a list 50 miles long (depending on font ) of players that had unbelievable single seasons, yes that is one of the best single seasons in history and he deserved all of the accolades he received that year.

I say look at it this way

Feds #'s

1213 472 674 1146

Dino C's #'s

1232 608 592 1200

Is Dino in the Hall, no! The argument made for him is that he is the only 600 goal scorer not in the HHOF, Feds would need at least 3 more seasons at his current rate to get to 600 goals. I am not saying Feds couldn't or won't make it in, I am saying he is not a lock! And IMO he is not HHOF, again when he was a wing he was one of my favorites, if that was one of the HHOF criteria there would be more Wing's in there and less from other teams, but unfortunately my opinion means jacks*** with the HHOF!

Edited July 11, 2008 by Opie