clutchngrab 12 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) Most of you are ******* dillusional. There is absolutely no way we get beyond the Conf final w/ Osgood in net. I'm sorry, I've watched this team for a long time and understand that we have never won cups on goaltending. That's fine, but the difference between the guys on the ice and the goaltender has never been greater. There's still time for Osgood to prove me wrong. But Gaaak, we may waste one of the top 3 or 4 on ice teams over the last 12 years due to the s*** for goalie tandem. This game should have been a shutout after one and a blowout after that. Edited March 18, 2009 by clutchngrab Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taosuntzu 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Not to get into a huge Ozzie debate with you, because, believe it or not, I'm as sick of it as you probably are. BUT... Ozzie has strung together 2 highly solid games and a decent game (tonight). Not exactly conclusive proof that he is 'back'. He's had an awful season on a personal level (stats wise anyway), was effectively benched recently, and let in two (arguably) soft goals tonight. It's going to take a lot more than a three game winning streak to comfort most people. If the defense is going to be lax, we need a goalie that's up to the task. Osgood has shown that, so far, he's not. Is every goal Ozzy's fault? Of course not. Would it be comforting to witness him steal ONE game this season? Hell ya... This is what I'm talking about. BLIND!!!! 2 of the 3 goals scores tonight were identical to the 2 Ozzie let in. I have waited my whole life (it seems) for this game. To say Ozzie let in 2 soft goals, is the same as saying Dats and Zetts goals were flukes! It is the mentality in DET to say a goal against is all the goalies fault. While a goal for was an amazing play by <insert player here>. The Flyers dominated this game from start to finish. The only apreciable stat is the score. For god sakes Biron was so good that the Wings couldn't score on 3 empty netters from 90 ft. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Most of you are ******* dillusional. There is absolutely no way we get beyond the Conf final w/ Osgood in net. I'm sorry, I've watched this team for a long time and understand that we have never won cups on goaltending. That's fine, but the difference between the guys on the ice and the goaltender has never been greater. There's still time for Osgood to prove me wrong. But Gaaak, we may waste one of the top 3 or 4 on ice teams over the last 12 years due to the s*** for goalie tandem. This game should have been a shutout after one and a blowout after that. Hope the bandwagon passes you by. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Electrophile 3,554 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Hope the bandwagon passes you by. People like that give me headaches. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 *snip* OZZIE, OZZIE, OZZIE!!!!!!! <--- Not snipped SV% is an interesting stat. GAA is a blend between the goaltender's performance and the team's. SV%.. is more like the +/- of goaltender stats. It's useful in context to the team's performance, but not necessarily for comparative analysis, because it fails to take too many impotant factors into consideration. Like +/-, it can be used to point out a clear standout (such as Hasek in Buffalo) but isn't necessarily the end-all be-all of judging goalie performance. The only way to do that, really, is through analysis of scoring chances, shot quality, situational play, and observation. SV% wise, Osgood has been terrible this season, but situationally, he's been pretty average, with some steals and some off nights. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
clutchngrab 12 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Ozzie made numerous saves that could be described as game stealing. They wouldn't make the reel for "highlights of the year", but flashing a glove save on a close slapshot and stealing one through a screen are definitely ones that, if going in, would certainly not be his fault. He may not be back to last year's form, and never will, statistically, but people shouldn't even worry about that. They should be concerned about the offense/defense giving up extremely good scoring chances to the other team, because no goalie is going to look good the way the defense has hung their goalie out to dry from time to time. Just have to hope the defense steps it up for the playoffs and Ozzie does his magic again. Babs has enough confidence in Ozzie to go forward, and if he f***s up we have Conklin. I'm confident, personally, in this team's goaltending come playoff time. Would like a smiley face to go with that happy meal? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Electrophile 3,554 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Would like a smiley face to go with that happy meal? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kylee 727 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 great to see the Wings come back and win this one. Ozzie lets in two goals, neither of which were soft, then he recovers very nicely and played well and got the win. very happy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
digitaljohn88 4 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) Didn't get to see the game, but I came back and read the WHOLE GDT. LOLZ @ Osgood bashers when it was 0-2 (because I already knew it ended 3-2 ) Sounded like a solid game after we cracked Biron. Going to watch highlights. Edited March 18, 2009 by digitaljohn88 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nicholonio 9 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Osgood should've had the first, but the second goal was quite the ripper. Never doubt the Wings though, such a fantastic comeback. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Taosuntzu 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) SV% is an interesting stat. GAA is a blend between the goaltender's performance and the team's. SV%.. is more like the +/- of goaltender stats. It's useful in context to the team's performance, but not necessarily for comparative analysis, because it fails to take too many impotant factors into consideration. Like +/-, it can be used to point out a clear standout (such as Hasek in Buffalo) but isn't necessarily the end-all be-all of judging goalie performance. The only way to do that, really, is through analysis of scoring chances, shot quality, situational play, and observation. SV% wise, Osgood has been terrible this season, but situationally, he's been pretty average, with some steals and some off nights. Your right his save% is down. But is his play? You can't simply say that it is by a stat sheet. It is not how the stat is calculated. To see if he is allowing goals that sould be stopped you would have to remove all scoring chances on all goalies through-out the league, whether they blocked the shot or not. Even then Zetts 5 hole shot tonight wasn't actually a scoring chance even though there isn't a goalie in the world that could have stopped it consistently. It is okay to appreciate goalies for their stats, but unless you walk a mile in their shoes.... The only way to truely grade a goalie is to watch them. See how well they keep themselves between the puck and shooter. Watch their movement side to side. Watch their stick and see if it stays flat on the ice and centered on the 5 hole on along the ice shots. But if you do that you'll miss the game. What I like to do is +/- their great saves, and goals into minuses. Still subjective but, it tells me what I want to know. By the way I just watched the NHL vid recap. I sugget you watch it, it really tells the story of tonight's game. Usually it's just a high light reel. But, tonights really captures the story. In fact I'll try to link it! Invalid Video Link Can't do it but it's at NHL.com in game recap. Edited March 18, 2009 by Taosuntzu Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holiday 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Most of you are ******* dillusional. There is absolutely no way we get beyond the Conf final w/ Osgood in net. I'm sorry, I've watched this team for a long time and understand that we have never won cups on goaltending. That's fine, but the difference between the guys on the ice and the goaltender has never been greater. There's still time for Osgood to prove me wrong. But Gaaak, we may waste one of the top 3 or 4 on ice teams over the last 12 years due to the s*** for goalie tandem. This game should have been a shutout after one and a blowout after that. If you could cry some more, that would be great. Thanks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
russianswede919293 95 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Most of you are ******* dillusional. There is absolutely no way we get beyond the Conf final w/ Osgood in net. I'm sorry, I've watched this team for a long time and understand that we have never won cups on goaltending. That's fine, but the difference between the guys on the ice and the goaltender has never been greater. There's still time for Osgood to prove me wrong. But Gaaak, we may waste one of the top 3 or 4 on ice teams over the last 12 years due to the s*** for goalie tandem. This game should have been a shutout after one and a blowout after that. Like hell it should have been. Until about half way through the second period the Wings were turning the puck over at the blue line and in the offensive zone giving Philadelphia quite a few quick out of nowhere odd man rushses which were the only things Ozzie let goals in on. Kronwall had the worst game he has had in a long time last night. He was caught out of position more than a few times, he was pinching without his spot being covered (thats not his fault) but then turning the puck over when there was only one man back in Stuart. Ozzie played a great game and anyone who thinks otherwise is dillusional. The Wings played a great game offensively from start to finish and tightened up defensively with 1/2 the game left and played shut down defense after that. Ozzie played a great game in net. Period. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cusimano_brothers 1,655 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Great win and a great team effort. Sixteen games unbeaten at home vs. Philadelphia and counting, longest current unbstk in the NHL. The last time the Flyers won in Detroit: Jacques Demers was the Head Coach and the Joe Louis Arena was just finishing up it's 9th season. Wow! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
detroitrocks 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 VS Preview- Flyers at Red Wings Recap- Red Wings 3, Flyers 2 Philadelphia: 37-21-10, 16-11-6 Road Record, 84 pts; 2nd in Atlantic Division, 4th Overall in Eastern Conference Last Game: Lost to NYR 4-1 Recap Detroit: 46-15-9, 25-5-4 Home Record, 101 pts; 1st in Central Division, 1st Overall in Western Conference Last Game: Defeated CBJ 4-0 Recap Last PHI-DET meeting: 2/12/07, DET 1 at PHI 6 Recap NHL STANDINGS WATCH UPDATED 1. Boston 71 GP, 45-17-9, 99 pts 2. New Jersey 68 GP, 45-20-3, 93 pts 3. Washington 71 GP, 42-22-6, 92 pts 4. Philadelphia 68 GP, 37-21-10, 84 pts 5. Pittsburgh 71 GP, 37-26-8, 82 pts 6. Montreal 69 GP, 35-25-8, 80 pts 7. NY Rangers 70 GP, 36-26-8, 80 pts 8. Carolina 71 GP, 36-28-7, 79 pts ---------------------------------------------- 9. Florida 69 GP, 34-25-10, 78 pts 10. Buffalo 69 GP, 34-27-8, 76 pts 11. Toronto 70 GP, 28-29-13, 69 pts 12. Ottawa 68 GP, 28-30-10, 66 pts 13. Atlanta 70 GP, 29-35-6, 64 pts 14. Tampa Bay 69 GP, 23-32-14, 60 pts 15. NY Islanders 70 GP, 24-38-8, 56 pts 1. DETROIT 70 GP, 46-15-9, 101 pts 2. San Jose 68 GP, 45-13-10, 100 pts 3. Calgary 69 GP, 40-23-6, 86 pts 4. Chicago 67 GP, 37-21-9, 83 pts 5. Vancouver 66 GP, 36-23-9, 81 pts 6. Columbus 70 GP, 36-28-6, 78 pts 7. Nashville 70 GP, 35-30-5, 75 pts 8. Dallas 69 GP, 33-28-8, 74 pts ------------------------------------------- 9. Edmonton 68 GP, 32-27-9, 73 pts 10. St. Louis 69 GP, 32-29-8, 72 pts 11. Minnesota 69 GP, 32-29-8, 72 pts 12. Anaheim 69 GP, 32-31-6, 70 pts 13. Los Angeles 69 GP, 29-30-10, 68 pts 14. Colorado 70 GP, 31-38-1, 63 pts 15. Phoenix 69 GP, 28-35-6, 62 pts Goals PHI Jeff Carter: 38 DET Marian Hossa: 35 Assists PHI Mike Richards: 44 DET Pavel Datsyuk: 58 Plus/Minus PHI Mike Richards: +25 DET Pavel Datsyuk: +29 ---- PHI Andreas Nodl: -12 DET Derek Meech: -12 PIM PHI Riley Cote: 160 DET Andreas Lilja: 66 Forthcoming PHI Martin Biron 22-14-5, 2.73 GAA, .914 SV %, 2 SO DET Chris Osgood 22-6-7, 3.17 GAA, .883 SV %, 2 SO PHI Derian Hatcher (knee) out DET Valtteri Filppula (back spasms) questionable, Andreas Lilja (concussion) out OLD SCHOOL Despite Ozzie's terrible save percentage(2nd worst in the entire NHL) and horrible GAA(39th in the NHL) he has played 3 solid games now..let's keep our fingers crossed for the rest of the year and into the playoffs.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
detroitrocks 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Osgood should've had the first, but the second goal was quite the ripper. Never doubt the Wings though, such a fantastic comeback. Ozzie just needs to keep getting better and getting back his confidence.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingfan1991 221 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 ozzie seems back to his old self, my confidence is back in him after seeing the last 3 games.. he's seeing all the bounces, something he wasnt handling before. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VM1138 1,921 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 I'm finally confident about our goaltending situation, but our defense is still scaring the crap out of me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z and D for the C 712 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Despite Ozzie's terrible save percentage(2nd worst in the entire NHL) and horrible GAA(39th in the NHL) he has played 3 solid games now..let's keep our fingers crossed for the rest of the year and into the playoffs.. Did you really have to quote the entire first post? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Turretin 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 DISCLAIMER: This entire review is based solely off of the NHL.com highlights. Osgood appeared to be "fighting" the puck quite a bit. My view is that long, uncontrolled rebounds, and timid position in regard to the net are two indicators of less confidence. For example, the first save you'll see on the NHL highlights is a shot that should have been controlled. Instead, Osgood responded a bit late and threw a rebound out in the center of the ice. Rebounds should be going to the corners (watch Hiller in Anaheim as a good example of this). On the first goal, Osgood sits wayyy back in the net and doesn't make any aggressive moves. Hartnell should have been poke checked, but Osgood was responding instead of initiating. It seems like he learned his lesson on that second breakaway, and poke checked, forcing the shooter to react. He is definitely not where he was last year. However, I think these are confidence issues, NOT skill issues. If Osgood is able to string 4-5 solid games together, he will probably be able to come on strong for the playoffs. HOWEVER, struggles this late in the season make him more vulnerable to a collapse after one bad game in the playoffs. That being said, Pavel Datsyuk is the best player on our team. Better than Zetterberg, better than Hossa, better than Lidstrom. There, I said it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hockeytown9321 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Ozzie has really been fine since coming back from the 10 day break. The Columbus game can hardly be counted against him. Our defense was ECHL level that night. It always amazes me how each and every goal Osgood gives up is scrutinized and analyzed more than the Zapruder film. Goalies let in goals. They all do. Sometimes you just get beat. Sure, he *could* have made saves on both goals last night. That doesn't make them bad goals. They're just goals. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
puckloo39 5,686 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) Ozzie has really been fine since coming back from the 10 day break. The Columbus game can hardly be counted against him. Our defense was ECHL level that night. It always amazes me how each and every goal Osgood gives up is scrutinized and analyzed more than the Zapruder film. Goalies let in goals. They all do. Sometimes you just get beat. Sure, he *could* have made saves on both goals last night. That doesn't make them bad goals. They're just goals. I used to make this exact same point last season, just change the name of the 'tender. It didn't seem to have much effect then, either. Edited March 18, 2009 by puckloo39 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holiday 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 DISCLAIMER: This entire review is based solely off of the NHL.com highlights. Osgood appeared to be "fighting" the puck quite a bit. My view is that long, uncontrolled rebounds, and timid position in regard to the net are two indicators of less confidence. For example, the first save you'll see on the NHL highlights is a shot that should have been controlled. Instead, Osgood responded a bit late and threw a rebound out in the center of the ice. Rebounds should be going to the corners (watch Hiller in Anaheim as a good example of this). On the first goal, Osgood sits wayyy back in the net and doesn't make any aggressive moves. Hartnell should have been poke checked, but Osgood was responding instead of initiating. It seems like he learned his lesson on that second breakaway, and poke checked, forcing the shooter to react. He is definitely not where he was last year. However, I think these are confidence issues, NOT skill issues. If Osgood is able to string 4-5 solid games together, he will probably be able to come on strong for the playoffs. HOWEVER, struggles this late in the season make him more vulnerable to a collapse after one bad game in the playoffs. That being said, Pavel Datsyuk is the best player on our team. Better than Zetterberg, better than Hossa, better than Lidstrom. There, I said it. Osgood played the second breakaway pretty much the same way as the first. If Osgood comes out and is beat, he is way out of position. If he stays back and gets beat he is too timid. I think he played very solid tonight. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
selkie 10 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 It always amazes me how each and every goal Osgood gives up is scrutinized and analyzed more than the Zapruder film. Goalies let in goals. They all do. Sometimes you just get beat. Sure, he *could* have made saves on both goals last night. That doesn't make them bad goals. They're just goals. It's Detroit. (shrug) Some people won't be happy unless a voodoo priest figures out how to get the reanimated corpse of Terry Sawchuck propped up in net and making saves again, and then we'd still complain because his zombie-like state made it hard for him to give coherent interviews. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vladifan 680 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) Most of you are ******* dillusional. There is absolutely no way we get beyond the Conf final w/ Osgood in net. I'm sorry, I've watched this team for a long time and understand that we have never won cups on goaltending. That's fine, but the difference between the guys on the ice and the goaltender has never been greater. There's still time for Osgood to prove me wrong. But Gaaak, we may waste one of the top 3 or 4 on ice teams over the last 12 years due to the s*** for goalie tandem. This game should have been a shutout after one and a blowout after that. What the hell game were you watching? Meanwhile, my first question to you is when you use the word "most" that's a pretty big number of posters here. About what percentage of us do you think that applies to? I'm curious because even those of us who are pro-Oz have wide-ranging views on him and the team. It is indeed a helluva lot bigger range than you black-and-white Ozzie bashers have who think he should pretty much go back to GR and/or be hung at dawn. As for the differences never being greater I assume you're saying our goalies suck and the rest of the team has what it takes to get the Cup, given a really good goaltender. Now, who's delusional? Here's a repeat of a post I put on this thread during the game and it still applies to what you've written. (The rest of you who've already read it, feel free to skip to the bottom. ) < Amen. For months now, posters here have been saying that the Wings don't trust Ozzie. So where does it say that can't work the other way around? When does Oz get a consistent chance to trust his own frickin' teamates? Stuart and Kronwall especially have scared the crap out of me with their iffy play and have been absolutely spatially absent. None of the Wings are really passing well. And what's the blocked shot ratio at the end of two? 15-2?? Whaaat? Are the Wings too good to get down and block shots? Uh, wouldn't that HELP?? The only creatively aggressive Wings right now on the ice are Maltby and Datsyuk (and Hossa). The WHOLE team has to start playing as a unit or there's no chance they will beat the Flyers. > Lastly, I don't care how long you've been a fan or how many games you've watched. Oz doesn't have to prove jack to you. He has to prove it to himself, his teamates and Babcock. Edited March 18, 2009 by Vladifan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
