RedFX 48 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Trade Rafalski and sign a top 6 forward. No trade clause or not. Rafalski isn't worth 6 million, and the Wings don't need 8 top 6 D-men. Wrong Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest blueadams Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Our 4th line is going to be bad, no matter who's on it. I'd rather it be Holmstrom with Draper and Maltby to give the others a chance to prove themselves, we know what we're getting in those three. I cant believe I'd ever get to the point that having them is really hurting the Wings from being a tough team, they take up cap space and room on the roster for more effective players, it wouldnt be so bad if they provided some offence, but they just dont. i agree whole-heartedly with that statement, but does babcock!? I mean, he had Huds on the 4th line with Drapes and Malts last season, while Homer was on the 3rd line with Helmer and Sammy. I know we all seem to be in LOVE with leino right now, but its hard to see him being much better next year than huds was last year, right? Am I alone here? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Our 4th line is going to be bad, no matter who's on it. I'd rather it be Holmstrom with Draper and Maltby to give the others a chance to prove themselves, we know what we're getting in those three. I cant believe I'd ever get to the point that having them is really hurting the Wings from being a tough team, they take up cap space and room on the roster for more effective players, it wouldnt be so bad if they provided some offence, but they just dont. My God what a joke of a 4th line. I mean, there will be some balance so that the Wings can roll four lines, which means that you'll have guys on the 3rd and 4th lines that deserve better. As much as I hate to admit, it's very likely Babs will start out with these lines. Cleary-Zetterberg-Franzen Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Williams Leino-Filppula-Eaves Helm-Draper-Maltby Even though it changes every day, this is what I would like to see. Big difference, but I'm just a fan. Filppula-Datsyuk-Holmstrom Leino-Zetterberg-Franzen Cleary-Helm-Williams Maltby-Draper-Eaves Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RedFX 48 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 If you want those two together... take a look at our FINAL playoff lines last season: Datsyuk-Zetterberg-Cleary Franzen-Filppula-HOSSA Holmstrom-Helm-SAMUELSSON HUDLER-Draper-Maltby so, hows about these lines next season: Datsyuk-Zetterberg-Cleary Franzen-Filppula-WILLIAMS Holmstrom-Helm-EAVES LEINO-Draper-Maltby williams replaces hossa; eaves replaces samuelsson; and leino replaces hudler. i know that a lot of people have high expectations for leino, but lets wait and see... To start the year, I think Leino will be on the 2nd or 3rd line, while Eaves will be on the 4th with Malts and Draper. We saw a couple of different combos with the front 2 the past few years. And I have a feeling we'll be seeing alot of different ones when the season starts. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tommingthepuck96 1 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 I can't see helm and draper being put on the same line.. But then again im not coaching team canada next year.. So we'll see what babcock does.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest blueadams Report post Posted August 7, 2009 I think that we finally had our best lines put together in the SCF once pav returned... Pav-Hank-Clears Mule-Flip-Hoss Homer-Helm-Sammy Huds-Drapes-Malts thats why i think we'll start out with: Pav-Hank-Clears Mule-Flip-WILLIAMS Homer-Helm-EAVES LEINO-Drapes-Malts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 I kind of hope this year will be all about pairings instead of lines. Kind of like the 97 team. You had Fedorov-Kozlov... and then Doug Brown; Larionov-Shanahan... and then Marty Lapointe, etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Manoir 70 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Trade Rafalski and sign a top 6 forward. No trade clause or not. Rafalski isn't worth 6 million, and the Wings don't need 8 top 6 D-men. That contract is really starting to hurt. Rafalski was never worth 6 mil but it is really magnified now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newfy 695 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 All this talk about a 13th forward and some grit has me thinking. Since Williams(Jeremy) is a scorer they probably won't want him as their 13th forward. Why not bring some speed and an edge with the 13th forward with Kris Newbury. He's really fast, gets in on the forecheck and will scrap occasionally. He scores alot in the AHL so who knows maybe he and Oulahen duke it out in camp for that final spot? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest blueadams Report post Posted August 7, 2009 (edited) THIS IS THE BIGGEST QUESTION - Do we, or do we not, split up Hank and Pav? Filppula is, no doubt, at his best when he is centering a line. Many people are going to say that he could flank pav or hank on the 1st or 2nd line, but this man is a center. In addition to being a great faceoff man and distributor, he's simply TOO good of a two-way player not to be centering a line in this system. Helm is a great center as well. He's a better center than draper not only offensively (due to his energy), but also defensively (due to his speed...and drapers declining speed). If you're going to be rolling 4 lines, and you're going to have flip centering the third line, helms got to be centering the 4th. Many people have been calling for a homer-drapes-malts 4th line...which is fine...IF YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO PLAY THE 4TH LINE. But this is babcock. He's going to roll all 4. And all four need to be good/balanced. If you've got a 4th line of drapes-helm-malts...then you're definitely not going to be giving up any goals (homers become terrible defensively)...and you might even score a few with helmers hustle. If you get abby in for malts at some point, you'll score more than a few. Here's another thing: Williams and Eaves were both brought in here to play RIGHT WING. Quit putting them at left-wing, or god forbid, CENTER. They were brought in to replace right wingers hossa and samuellson. Williams has been more consistent throughout his career, so he's probably going to start off on the second line. Eaves is a better defensive player, so he's probably going to start off on the third line. And as we all know, Cleary is the top dog here when it comes to right-wingers. That brings us to the left-wingers. Mule is obviously the #1 guy. People seem to be quick to dismiss Homer after a bad-injury plagued post-season...and people seem to be quick to proclaim Leino as the next great thing after a great 13 games in the regular season. I'm going to go ahead and guess that Babs gives Homer the nod, at least to start the season. Besides, Pav and Williams don't need another puck-handler/shooter/scorer/etc...they need a net presence. I'm guessing these are the lines going into the season: Franzen-Zetterberg-Cleary Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Williams Leino-Filppula-Eaves Draper-Helm-Maltby ...there could be quite a bit of shifting here, obviously, but i think that i've got a good deal of the math right here. the 4th line is probably set. eaves as our third rw, and williams as our 2nd is probably right. hank centering the 1st line, and pav centering the second is probably right (babs really does seem to hate not splitting these two...for defensive purposes, really). Mule, Homer and Leino, however, could be interchangable. I could see a first line of leino-hank-cleary...as cleary still gives u a net presence there. mule-pav-williams as the second. and homer-flip-eaves as the third. though its nice to have homer with a guy that can really handle/move with the puck like pav. the homer-helm-sammy 3rd line in the playoffs wasnt that great last year. Edited August 7, 2009 by blueadams Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drake_Marcus 890 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 First of all, Hudler being on the 4th line at the end of the playoffs wasn't an indication of where he should be used, it was an indication of Babcock's displeasure with Hudler at the time (for one of thousands of reasons Babcock didn't like Huddles ). Babs was good at making Hudler work, though, because usually when he put him on a doghouse line Hudler would play with a vengeance. It's kind of like an in-game benching that Babs used with good effect on Hudler. Hudler still scored in the top six in the playoffs, all while playing from the doghouse. Back on topic, I don't see why the OP likes putting Leino on the 4th line. In his short call-up, Leino came close to matching Eaves season numbers. If you're scoring at nearly the same pace in less than 15 games that a guy did over a full season I don't see why you'd be playing on a lower line. Putting that part aside, there's still the fact of how Leino plays. Leino plays like a pure top six guy. Putting him on a line with Draper and Maltby is like handcuffing his left arm to his hockey pants. Eaves would be better used on the fourth than Leino-- at least Eaves is used to playing that role. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rage 24 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 That contract is really starting to hurt. Rafalski was never worth 6 mil but it is really magnified now. Ummmm...........We Signed him, We WON THE CUP!!!!! think about it..... He helped bring us a Cup in his first year here. I think it was worth it. We signed him, he was our big signing that year and he helped bring us another Stanley Cup!!!! How people seem to forget that or just assume we would have won the Cup w/o Brian is BEYOND ME!!!!!!!!!! Yeah, his last 3 years of that contract suck because the SALARY CAP didn't go up like many (WINGS BRASS INCLUDED) thought it would, but you still have a great player for that cap hit. And believe me, we are going to need him once Lidstrom retires. BAD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pockets 9 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 The year we signed Ralfs we had offered Schneids 5 mil a year if i remember correctly Leino wont be on the fourth line and i think Flip starts as our number 2 center and the center for the 2nd pp unit they need to give him time to prove hes worth what he is being paid Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie_Wing 354 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 (edited) Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom The usual suspects, provides a huge scoring threat as well as tremendous defence and shut down ability. Holmstrom might be declining but if healthy putting on a line with Dats and Hank could do wonders for him again. Franzen - Filppula - Cleary Filppula gets the chance to centre the 2nd line and for once he has pretty good line-mates who can certainly score. A nice blend of speed and toughness, with scoring ability of course. Leino - Helm - Williams I really like this line, Leino's craftyness, Helm's speed and physicality and Williams' scoring touch. A really young line also which could surprise. The only concern is defensively and they might take some time to gel. Eaves - Draper - Maltby I'm confident Eaves will eventually move up but he'll probably start on the 4th line while seeing occasional time on the PK. Edited August 7, 2009 by Aussie_Wing Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Finnish Wing 110 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom The usual suspects, provides a huge scoring threat as well as tremendous defence and shut down ability. Holmstrom might be declining but if healthy putting on a line with Dats and Hank could do wonders for him again. Franzen - Filppula - Cleary Filppula gets the chance to centre the 2nd line and for once he has pretty good line-mates who can certainly score. A nice blend of speed and toughness, with scoring ability of course. Leino - Helm - Williams I really like this line, Leino's craftyness, Helm's speed and physicality and Williams' scoring touch. A really young line also which could surprise. The only concern is defensively and they might take some time to gel. Eaves - Draper - Maltby I'm confident Eaves will eventually move up but he'll probably start on the 4th line while seeing occasional time on the PK. 100% agreed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingsownnhl43 14 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom The usual suspects, provides a huge scoring threat as well as tremendous defence and shut down ability. Holmstrom might be declining but if healthy putting on a line with Dats and Hank could do wonders for him again. Franzen - Filppula - Cleary Filppula gets the chance to centre the 2nd line and for once he has pretty good line-mates who can certainly score. A nice blend of speed and toughness, with scoring ability of course. Leino - Helm - Williams I really like this line, Leino's craftyness, Helm's speed and physicality and Williams' scoring touch. A really young line also which could surprise. The only concern is defensively and they might take some time to gel. Eaves - Draper - Maltby I'm confident Eaves will eventually move up but he'll probably start on the 4th line while seeing occasional time on the PK. Yeah, this is what I want. As much as I hate the Williams signing, he will work best on that third line. Also, I have no confidence in Homer, so Im still hoping for another addition at the deadline for a top 6 forward. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Yeah, this is what I want. As much as I hate the Williams signing, he will work best on that third line. Also, I have no confidence in Homer, so Im still hoping for another addition at the deadline for a top 6 forward. Yeah I can think we can pencil in Cleary for 23-27 games in Homer's normal spot when he's injured. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StevieY9802 6 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom The usual suspects, provides a huge scoring threat as well as tremendous defence and shut down ability. Holmstrom might be declining but if healthy putting on a line with Dats and Hank could do wonders for him again. Franzen - Filppula - Cleary Filppula gets the chance to centre the 2nd line and for once he has pretty good line-mates who can certainly score. A nice blend of speed and toughness, with scoring ability of course. Leino - Helm - Williams I really like this line, Leino's craftyness, Helm's speed and physicality and Williams' scoring touch. A really young line also which could surprise. The only concern is defensively and they might take some time to gel. Eaves - Draper - Maltby I'm confident Eaves will eventually move up but he'll probably start on the 4th line while seeing occasional time on the PK. 100% agreed. Me too. Even though I put Eaves on the right but that doesn't matter. And since holland said there might still be one more person added depending on a number of different situations they could rotate in for Malts. It's very possible Eaves moves up too depending on how he does and how Williams does. While I would have liked someone else I'm really gonna be routing for Williams to have the year he had in 06 or really even last years numbers in Atl./CBJ will be ok. I've said it 100 times now this team just needs to be better defensively and with the goaltending. That will help so much. You can't give up 240 goals again. I can't imagine what this team could have done last season if they gave up less goals. Then just some guys having better years and the addition of some of these guys should replace enough offense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StevieY9802 6 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Yeah I can think we can pencil in Cleary for 23-27 games in Homer's normal spot when he's injured. I think with just more playing time which he'll get with Hossa gone will get him more goals. He was pace for 25-30 in 08 before he got hurt in Toronto in February. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zata20 4 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom The usual suspects, provides a huge scoring threat as well as tremendous defence and shut down ability. Holmstrom might be declining but if healthy putting on a line with Dats and Hank could do wonders for him again. Franzen - Filppula - Cleary Filppula gets the chance to centre the 2nd line and for once he has pretty good line-mates who can certainly score. A nice blend of speed and toughness, with scoring ability of course. Leino - Helm - Williams I really like this line, Leino's craftyness, Helm's speed and physicality and Williams' scoring touch. A really young line also which could surprise. The only concern is defensively and they might take some time to gel. Eaves - Draper - Maltby I'm confident Eaves will eventually move up but he'll probably start on the 4th line while seeing occasional time on the PK. I like them, but I'm tempted to switch Cleary with Leino to help the third line be more defense oriented. Although, I hate to do it because I believe Cleary should get a shot at full-time top six minutes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 I like them, but I'm tempted to switch Cleary with Leino to help the third line be more defense oriented. Although, I hate to do it because I believe Cleary should get a shot at full-time top six minutes. Agreed, especially on Cleary. Why can't they just play Willy on the 4th line? That way they'll have scoring touch from all 4 lines. Might as well. That 4th line isn't going provide energy or physical toughness anyways. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingnut1719 0 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 some of these posts sound kind negative to me. i think the team is about the same minus marion hossa. hense i haven't followed the game very closly for the last 5 years. thats about the last time i posted too. i've noticed that when a big star leaves another player seems to step up a notch in points. holmstrom seemed to have produced more before hossa came into the picture. am i right? my concern is the backup for ozzie. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BigTex 1 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 Datsyuk-Zetterberg-Cleary Franzen-Filpula-Leino Eaves-Helm-Williams Maltby-Draper-Holmstrom Tough Guy/Oulahan/Meech/FA signing Lidstrom-Rafalski Kronwall-Stuart Ericssson-Lilja/Lebda Meech/Delmore/Janik Osgood Howard I'm interested to see how "Tough Guy" does in camp. I want to see more of him Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 I'm interested to see how "Tough Guy" does in camp. I want to see more of him You know... What are we looking for when we want a "tough guy"? (No jokes, please). Obviously Kenny wants a verstaile tough guy; a guy who can play a good two-way game; perhaps hold his own in a fight. I'm thinking this supposed player would be a 2nd/3rd line tweener who can rack up let's say... 28 points in a year. In all seriousness, who fits this description? Perhaps someone who is going to be a free agent soon. I'm just curious. What players are out there who resemble the middle ground between pro-enforcer and pro-skill? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sputman 1,268 Report post Posted August 7, 2009 You know... What are we looking for when we want a "tough guy"? (No jokes, please). Obviously Kenny wants a verstaile tough guy; a guy who can play a good two-way game; perhaps hold his own in a fight. I'm thinking this supposed player would be a 2nd/3rd line tweener who can rack up let's say... 28 points in a year. In all seriousness, who fits this description? Perhaps someone who is going to be a free agent soon. I'm just curious. What players are out there who resemble the middle ground between pro-enforcer and pro-skill? milan lucic Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
