Number Retirement

[rage 24]

Lidstrom= Of Course

Fedorov=No

Osgood=Yes, if we win another cup with him

I say no to fedorov because a lot of the time he gave half an effort on the ice, when he played to his potential, he was on fire, but then the next game he was just taking up ice space for other players.

Osgood I say yes because how many wins he has and the way he has been playing in the playoffs the last couple years and the other year(98') we won with him in goalie

[Buppy 1,720]

Jersey retirement is about the biggest honor a team can bestow on a player. If we retired the numbers of every good, popular, or long-time player we'd eventually be down to Qs and ampersands.

Nick - Of course

Sergei - Borderline even if he had stayed, as it is no way

Vladdy - Tragic accident, deserves a memorial, but no

Ozzie, Chelios, Draper, Maltby, McCarty, Probert, Kocur, Shanny, Homer, Fischer, etc...no

Edited October 10, 2009 by Buppy

[eva unit zero 271]

No.

No Osgood, Draper, Maltby, Chelios or Holmstrom. Just Lids and Fedorov imho.

Osgood already owns about half of all Wings goaltending records. He has career playoff numbers that are comparable to Patrick Roy and Martin Brodeur, two guys universally considered among the best playoff goalies ever.

Also of note: Patrick Roy has his number retired with the Colorado Avalanche. In both the regular season and playoffs Roy played a comparable number of games played, and has a worse record, about equal shutouts, and the same number of Cups. Osgood with Detroit has more finals appearances, and was second in Conn Smythe voting in all three appearances.

Does Roy deserve to have his number retired in Colorado?

And guess what? Osgood with Detroit has better numbers than Roy posted in Montreal in those same categories I listed above. So does Roy deserve it in either location? If you argue yes, you are arguing in favor of Osgood.

Interesting, isn't it?

[Hockeytown0001 7,652]

Osgood already owns about half of all Wings goaltending records. He has career playoff numbers that are comparable to Patrick Roy and Martin Brodeur, two guys universally considered among the best playoff goalies ever.

Also of note: Patrick Roy has his number retired with the Colorado Avalanche. In both the regular season and playoffs Roy played a comparable number of games played, and has a worse record, about equal shutouts, and the same number of Cups. Osgood with Detroit has more finals appearances, and was second in Conn Smythe voting in all three appearances.

Does Roy deserve to have his number retired in Colorado?

And guess what? Osgood with Detroit has better numbers than Roy posted in Montreal in those same categories I listed above. So does Roy deserve it in either location? If you argue yes, you are arguing in favor of Osgood.

Interesting, isn't it?

This is also the same club that retired Ray Bourque's 77 despite him playing all of 1 1/2 seasons with them.

[Lidstrom for Norris 0]

you can only retire so many numbers before it gets out of hand. Lidstrom's #5 should be the only number retired in the next 5 years

[eva unit zero 271]

This is also the same club that retired Ray Bourque's 77 despite him playing all of 1 1/2 seasons with them.

So you're saying Roy's number doesn't deserve to be retired then? Because his Av numbers were comparable to his Hab numbers. Which would then suggest you don't feel he deserved to be retired as a Hab either.

How do you plea?

[Buppy 1,720]

Roy is a little unusual as he had a great run with two different teams. Taking his career as a whole and of course he deserves his number retired, but for either team he's borderline. He's also perhaps one of the top 5 goalies ever. Numbers aren't the only thing.

Ozzie has been great at times, and also had some struggles. Remember, we got rid of him because we didn't think he was good enough for the playoffs. Though his numbers are fantastic, he wouldn't even make a top 20 all-time list. Perhaps if he had been with the Wings his entire career I'd give him more consideration, but right no I still think he's a no. Hall of fame, yes, Rafters, no. Of course he still has time to change my mind.

[Richard88 0]

Its becoming laughable that people suggest Fedorov won't have his number retired..

13 seasons..

400 goals

954 points

Three Stanley Cups

Two Selke trophies

and an MVP in a Pearson tree.

Yzerman in that same time period:

369 goals

970 points

Three Stanley Cups

One Selke trophy

and a Conn Smythe trophy.

Fedorov accomplished everything possible that a player in the NHL could hope to do and he wanted to see if he could do it on his own, so he took a deal to go to Anahiem. He didn't leave for the money(he took less) and the team and Illitch still maintain a great relationship with the guy.

He will absolutely get his number retired.

[HenryMalredo 2]

It will probably take a while, but Federov's number will be retired at some point.

[nc19 0]

Its becoming laughable that people suggest Fedorov won't have his number retired..

13 seasons..

400 goals

954 points

Three Stanley Cups

Two Selke trophies

and an MVP in a Pearson tree.

Yzerman in that same time period:

369 goals

970 points

Three Stanley Cups

One Selke trophy

and a Conn Smythe trophy.

Fedorov accomplished everything possible that a player in the NHL could hope to do and he wanted to see if he could do it on his own, so he took a deal to go to Anahiem. He didn't leave for the money(he took less) and the team and Illitch still maintain a great relationship with the guy.

He will absolutely get his number retired.

THANK YOU!

Im not sure about the good relationship part though (not saying you're wrong) i was just unaware of that.

And to those who say he wont have his number retired for detroit because of his "bad" relationship, be reminded that ted lindsey left on bad terms (if i recall correctly) too.

[BeeRYCE 2]

Chelios, no... He's one of, if not the most successful American born hockey player to ever play, but his prime was in Montreal and Chicago, mostly Chicago. Konstantinov didn't play long enough, but he was still really good... Due to respect, his number should remain unofficially retired for a long time, just not up in the rafters.

Fedorov on the other hand, I don't see why his number shouldn't be up in the rafters... He had amazing success in Detroit, won 3 cups, a Hart, Selke, and was the Wings best player for a good 10 year period.

[Electrophile 3,554]

No to Chelios, no to Fedorov, no to Vladdy - his number is already out of circulation. The next Red Wing getting his # retired will be Nick and that'll be it for a long while, I believe.

[Rivalred 630]

No to all... #16 will never be worn again in my eyes.

Next numbers to be retired, Osgood and Lidstrom.

[KATIEBARTHEDOOR24 426]

When I think of Probert... I see him in a hawks jersey.... :S

That's just not right.(To me anyway)

[Jake Ryan 1]

They should make Hockey Hall of Fame induction levels so teams could tell what numbers to retire. Immediate induction (Yzerman/Lidstrom type players)= team should retire the number immediately. One year wait (Fedorov type players) - team should retire number most of the time. Standard waiting period (Shanahan type players) = team should retire number rarely.

[shoe 165]

5 should be the next # to be retired

If something else happened id be very surprised

for the names mentioned in this thread i would put hasek and larinov before Fedorov, having said that I dont think the professor will get his # retired and i think the sabers should retire hasek not Detroit) Chelios is a hard one I think his heart is still in Chicago I think that is the building he would like to be in and the way chicago is treating their past stars an hall of famers i could see them wanting to retire Chelios more so than Detroit.

[Buppy 1,720]

They should make Hockey Hall of Fame induction levels so teams could tell what numbers to retire. Immediate induction (Yzerman/Lidstrom type players)= team should retire the number immediately. One year wait (Fedorov type players) - team should retire number most of the time. Standard waiting period (Shanahan type players) = team should retire number rarely.

While Fedorov was a better player than Shanny, I'd say Shanny has a better chance at making the Hall on the first ballot. Better goal scorer and North American; that's just how it goes. Hopefully, they'll go in together in 3 years, along with Chelios if he doesn't find a gig this year.

Also, while Fedorov was better than Yzerman while they were both here, the fact is Fedorov's leaving justifiably hurt his chances of getting his jersey in the rafters. The Captain was something special. The face and heart of this team for over two decades. Sergei was a great player here, but never reached that iconic status. Even in Stevie's waning years, it was Lidstrom that emerged as the team's soul. Maybe, like Abel, Fedorov will get his jersey up there 40-odd years from now.

In response to Shoe's comment about Larionov and Hasek before Fedorov...that's ridiculous. Neither player is even close to deserving consideration for their time with the Wings.

[Richard88 0]

THANK YOU!

Im not sure about the good relationship part though (not saying you're wrong) i was just unaware of that.

And to those who say he wont have his number retired for detroit because of his "bad" relationship, be reminded that ted lindsey left on bad terms (if i recall correctly) too.

Ive read numerous articles that point to Fedorov still attending training camp or coming to games and even visiting Illitch on several occasions.

Fedorov never really left this team and for anyone to suggest that from 1989 till 2003 that Yzerman was the better player is just rewriting history.

Yzerman brought some respect back to the franchise and Fedorov put it over the top.

[Guest ZetterbergFourty]

24, 91 nor 16 should be retired.

16 I agree with the op that it should be set aside but not officially retired.

Of the current Red Wing numbers to retire, 5. That's all.

And yeah, whats up with the Av's and Bourqe? The guy played like half a season there? So what if they won the Cup, not like Ray did it single handedly.

[Buppy 1,720]

Ive read numerous articles that point to Fedorov still attending training camp or coming to games and even visiting Illitch on several occasions.

Fedorov never really left this team and for anyone to suggest that from 1989 till 2003 that Yzerman was the better player is just rewriting history.

Yzerman brought some respect back to the franchise and Fedorov put it over the top.

Stevie was definitely the better player in '89, heh. And it was Fedorov, Yzerman, Lidstrom, Konstantinov, Shannahan, Draper, Maltby, Larionov, Kozlov, Vernon, McCarty, and most importantly, Bowman, (and a few others) that put us over the top.

[Richard88 0]

Stevie was definitely the better player in '89, heh. And it was Fedorov, Yzerman, Lidstrom, Konstantinov, Shannahan, Draper, Maltby, Larionov, Kozlov, Vernon, McCarty, and most importantly, Bowman, (and a few others) that put us over the top.

That argument is only used AGAINST Fedorov. When discussing Yzerman people act as if he was a one man show that "Lead" the team to a cup. Yzerman was an offensive dynamo and nothing more. Fedorov came to town, played insane two way hockey and scored 140 points, THEN Yzerman changed his game.

If anything it was Fedorov's game that made even the discussion of trading away Yzerman possible.

No Fedorov, no cups.

[Reds4Life 51]

Osgood already owns about half of all Wings goaltending records. He has career playoff numbers that are comparable to Patrick Roy and Martin Brodeur, two guys universally considered among the best playoff goalies ever.

Also of note: Patrick Roy has his number retired with the Colorado Avalanche. In both the regular season and playoffs Roy played a comparable number of games played, and has a worse record, about equal shutouts, and the same number of Cups. Osgood with Detroit has more finals appearances, and was second in Conn Smythe voting in all three appearances.

Does Roy deserve to have his number retired in Colorado?

And guess what? Osgood with Detroit has better numbers than Roy posted in Montreal in those same categories I listed above. So does Roy deserve it in either location? If you argue yes, you are arguing in favor of Osgood.

Interesting, isn't it?

Habs would never win 93 Cup without Roy. He won Conn Smythe in Colorado too. As for Brodeur, I do not consider him great playoff goalie, his playoff performance without Scott Stevens is nothing special.

Roy is so much better than Osgood that it isn't even funny. You are trying to compare top3 goalie of all time and Osgood? Really? Osgood is solid goaltender, but he is not elite goalie, never was and never will be. It would be an insult to Howe, Lindsay, Yzerman, Sawchuk, Delvecchio, Abel and Lidstrom to see Osgood's number up there. He might have the most wins and whetver, but he never won Vezina or any other major individual award. Sawchuk is still MUCH better, no contest.

Edited October 11, 2009 by Reds4Life

[auxlepli 17]

None of those three numbers, for who they represent, should be retired in my opinion.

Chelios, Fedorov and Konstantinov did not make the same impact to the Red Wings organization that Yzerman, Howe, Sawchuk, Lindsay, Abel and Delvecchio did.

Frankly, this whole retirement of numbers thing shouldn't have even been brought up, again.

[Red Crazy 201]

I for one think that Chelios should have a jersey retired at some point and in some rink but I am not sure if it should be in Detroit's. Maybe Chicago? I do think that his 24 should not be worn yet though.... It is just too soon. It would be like someone wearing Shanny's 14 the year after he left. It just dosen't seem right.

[C-TownWing 0]

Ive read numerous articles that point to Fedorov still attending training camp or coming to games and even visiting Illitch on several occasions.

Fedorov never really left this team and for anyone to suggest that from 1989 till 2003 that Yzerman was the better player is just rewriting history.

Yzerman brought some respect back to the franchise and Fedorov put it over the top.

The numbers you posted are pretty comparable, don't act like it's all that cut-and-dried.

I won't suggest that Yzerman was the better player, but how about if I suggest that that's a horrible argument instead? Yzerman was putting up sick numbers pre-1989 and was still with the team after 2003, when Feds made his cash grab. Feds was in his prime at the time Yzerman was past his, at least statistically.

Hey! Brett Hull was a better player than Yzerman during his tenure with the Wings! Retire #17! Great plan.

Someone mentioned Ted Lindsay leaving, which is true, his union activities got him a bus ticket to Siberia (Chicago). But he did later come back for a season and was also GM. And that all happened under Norris ownership anyway.