Miller Brew 0 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 No, that wasn't the question. The question was 'would you take Franzen over anyone on Chicago's top line'. And my answer is of course I would take Hossa over Franzen. You'd have to be an idiot not to. Maybe I wrote it wrong. But you misunderstood the message I was trying to write. Wings top 3 as a whole > Hawks top 3 as a whole. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tommy_Like_Wingy 25 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 But the question was... would you take Hossa over Zetterberg. No doubt Hossa is a super star. But Zetterberg is a super-star killer. I'm laughing at the poster (Trapt1307) who said they'd take Kane over Franzen. Glad you're not General Manager of the Red Wings... if so, they'd probably sign Hudler to Ovechkin-type-contract. Franzen > Kane because I like Wings going deep in the playoffs. Why are we even comparing Kane and Franzen again? These guys play two completely different roles on their teams with entirely different skill sets. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miller Brew 0 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 They won the West in '92, FYI. Lol. That's HUGE! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sureWhyNot 19 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Five years is not a long-term deal these days, smart guy. 100% correct. Why do Hawks fans keep telling us we are scared? I don't know about the rest of you, but I sure as hell am not scared of Chicago. The fact of the matter is that a healthy Detroit team is better than a healthy Chicago team. Go ahead, try and dispute that. Do Chicago fans not realize that our current injury list includes: Johan Franzen (goal scoring galore), Valtteri Filppula (top six forward and great defensive forward), Andreas Lilja (arguably one of our best PK'ers), Jason Williams (right handed shot on the PP), and Niklas Kronwall (top four defenseman and if you can't remember who he is, he is the one who knocked one of your boys out on one of the best CLEAN open-ice hits I have ever seen. The Problem with you Hawks fans is for one year you think you have a shot, so you all come out from under the rock you've been hiding under since idk, 1961? You don't seem to realize that right now all your team has is talent. Congratulations you are San Jose plus what Kopecky? Theres some depth right there. What do you think you will get to the cup by scoring 6 goals a game, just wait until the playoffs and we'll see how many goals a game you guys put up, but I guess that isn't the end of the ice I would be worried about if I were you. Solid goaltending is the key to winning cups. If you think Huet is going to get you there then you might have bigger problems than slight delusion. But, go ahead and talk all the s*** you want about the Blackhawks, because we all know what sport you're going to be playing in mid-spring, and it isn't hockey I don't know about scared, but any Wing fan who knows the slightest bit about the game of hockey realizes that Chicago is going to be a very tough opponent for years to come. It's either a cap problem or a depth problem....and yes, the Blackhawks will have one or the other next year. Not really. Truth be told, the Hawks are f*cking stacked and I hate it. I loathe Hawks fans (mostly bc two years ago they thought the United Center was where the Bulls played and nothing else), but it is hard to deny that they are as solid as any team in the league. Patrick Sharp: $4.2 million (cap hit: $3.9 million) Dave Bolland: $3.375 million Kris Versteeg: $3.083 million Dustin Byfuglien: $3.0 million Tomas Kopecky: $1.2 million Brian Campbell: $7.140 million Brent Sopel: $2.0 million (cap hit: $2.33 million) If they can find someone to take Campbell (which they probably won't) it will be him and another guy in bold gone. If Campbell stays 3 of the guys in bold will be gone. Most likely out of Bolland, Sharp, Versteeg, Sopel, Byfuglien 2-3 will be gone, but with Which is not really the biggest problem when you have Hossa, Kane, Toews, Keith, Barker, Seabrook and any 2 of those 5 you have a great core. You then fill the openings with the Bertuzzi's and Eave's of the league as well as bring up some of the guys you have been grooming in the AHL much like we did with Abdelkater, Leino, etc. We can try our hardest to play down what they are putting together, but the fact of the matter is that they are going to be good - real good from now through the foreseeable future. So weird too - I mean 2 years ago I would have laughed if someone told me the Hawks would become a powerhouse - I knew Toews Kane and co. would mature some and they would be better, but never would I have imagined them becoming a powerhouse. They got a 7 million a year player in Hossa for 5.2, two of the best offensive forwards in the West (and the league for that matter) in Kane and Toews, and a sick good blue-line with Seabrook and Keith. Nothing short term about the Hawks fellas. It kills me to say it, but it really is impossible to deny. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trapt1307 81 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 But the question was... would you take Hossa over Zetterberg. No doubt Hossa is a super star. But Zetterberg is a super-star killer. I'm laughing at the poster (Trapt1307) who said they'd take Kane over Franzen. Glad you're not General Manager of the Red Wings... if so, they'd probably sign Hudler to Ovechkin-type-contract. Franzen > Kane because I like Wings going deep in the playoffs. Are you effing kidding me? Kane is 21 years old. Franzen is 30. Take your red and white glasses off for a second. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Konnan511 1,736 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 I thought rivalries only happen when two teams play each other often in the playoffs and it's a coin flip on who will come out on top each time ala Avs vs. Wings the past decade. Now it's that way with DET v PIT and DET v ANA...not with DET v CHI Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
10 Minute Misconduct 104 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Shouldn't it be: Zetterberg > Hossa Datsyuk > Kane Toews > Franzen Whoever said they'd rather have Franzen over Kane, or even Toews is out to lunch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropkickshanahans 463 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Are you effing kidding me? Kane is 21 years old. Franzen is 30. Take your red and white glasses off for a second. Not to mention Franzen's glass legs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Konnan511 1,736 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Forgot to add: The Wings and Hawks WERE rivals in the 80s and mid 90s, when we played each other 5 times in the playoffs during a 10 year period. The Hawks won 3 of those while the Wings won twice. This is the reason why were are not a rival, at this moment, because since 94-95 season when the Wings beat the Hawks 4 games to 1, we played them only once...which was last year when we routed them 4-1. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sureWhyNot 19 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) Maybe I wrote it wrong. But you misunderstood the message I was trying to write. Wings top 3 as a whole > Hawks top 3 as a whole. By last years numbers the Wings top three is definitely better (and alot better defensively indicated by the +/-) Dats (97 pts, +34) Zetterberg (73 pts, +13) Franzen (59 pts, +21) Total= 229 pts, +68 Hossa (71 pts, +27) Kane (70 prs, -2) Toews (69 pts, +12) Total= 210 pts, +37 Now, what would have been the best is Dats, Zetterberg and Hossa in the Winged Wheel, but that's neither here nor there. Kane and Toews are still crazy young so I wouldnt be suprised if they catch up rather quickly (like this year) in total output. But who knows. I would take any of Chicago's top 3 over Franzen. Just thought I would throw it in there. Edited December 3, 2009 by sureWhyNot Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miller Brew 0 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Are you effing kidding me? Kane is 21 years old. Franzen is 30. Take your red and white glasses off for a second. And Kane's contract expires when he's 26 (before his prime). So what's your point? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropkickshanahans 463 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 And Kane's contract expires when he's 26 (before his prime). So what's your point? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Blackhawkdown Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Wow, I leave for an hour and the trolls must have just come a-flooding in. Where were all the 'Hawks fans for the last 20 years or so? I'm in Milwaukee, WI, so there are 'Hawks bandwagoners abound. I hate how a team could seem to have no fans at one point and have one good season and all of a sudden everyone has always believed in them and banged the drum for the mighty Blackhawks, you just couldn't hear them. Why would us Hawk fans come around bragging about our team when they were bad? What could we possibly say? I have been a Hawks fan since 1995, and I have supported them the entire time, but that doesnt mean I am going to run around talking about how great they are, when they werent. Im pretty sure if the Wings hadnt been so good for so long then your fans would be doing the same thing. Fortunately for you guys you havent had to deal with losing in quite awile. And for those who are saying we are "trolls", its not like we are coming over here making threads about how good the Hawks are. We simply comment in threads that DETROIT fans make about the Hawks. Thats not trolling. Are we not allowed to comment in these threads? Do you have to be a Red Wings fan to post on this board? The only reason I posted in this thread is because of all the jealous Red Wing fans having to bring up the past to make them feel better about the future. This thread is about the future of the Hawks, not about how dominate the Red Wings have been. We sign our core group of players and most Red Wing fans here get all pissy about it and start bashing the Hawks, talking about how bad we have been. It just shows how much these signings bother some of you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropkickshanahans 463 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Why would us Hawk fans come around bragging about our team when they were bad? What could we possibly say? I have been a Hawks fan since 1995, and I have supported them the entire time, but that doesnt mean I am going to run around talking about how great they are, when they werent. Im pretty sure if the Wings hadnt been so good for so long then your fans would be doing the same thing. Fortunately for you guys you havent had to deal with losing in quite awile. And for those who are saying we are "trolls", its not like we are coming over here making threads about how good the Hawks are. We simply comment in threads that DETROIT fans make about the Hawks. Thats not trolling. Are we not allowed to comment in these threads? Do you have to be a Red Wings fan to post on this board? The only reason I posted in this thread is because of all the jealous Red Wing fans having to bring up the past to make them feel better about the future. This thread is about the future of the Hawks, not about how dominate the Red Wings have been. We sign our core group of players and most Red Wing fans here get all pissy about it and start bashing the Hawks, talking about how bad we have been. It just shows how much these signings bother some of you. Well don't take it to heart since some of them cover their fear with bias *cough*millerbrew*cough* The rest of us are mainly stumped at how this is going to work out per the cap and are curious to see how this unfolds. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FIBS 35 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Why would us Hawk fans come around bragging about our team when they were bad? What could we possibly say? I have been a Hawks fan since 1995, and I have supported them the entire time, but that doesnt mean I am going to run around talking about how great they are, when they werent. Im pretty sure if the Wings hadnt been so good for so long then your fans would be doing the same thing. Fortunately for you guys you havent had to deal with losing in quite awile. And for those who are saying we are "trolls", its not like we are coming over here making threads about how good the Hawks are. We simply comment in threads that DETROIT fans make about the Hawks. Thats not trolling. Are we not allowed to comment in these threads? Do you have to be a Red Wings fan to post on this board? The only reason I posted in this thread is because of all the jealous Red Wing fans having to bring up the past to make them feel better about the future. This thread is about the future of the Hawks, not about how dominate the Red Wings have been. We sign our core group of players and most Red Wing fans here get all pissy about it and start bashing the Hawks, talking about how bad we have been. It just shows how much these signings bother some of you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
russianswede919293 95 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 The Hawks and Wings are set up similarly except we dont pay 5 million dollars on a mediocore goaltender...and our 7 million dollar defenceman is actually well rounded... Lidstrom>Campbell but Keith>Rafalski Really the only difference in set up is the terrible contracts to Campbell and Huet... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miller Brew 0 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 The Hawks and Wings are set up similarly except we dont pay 5 million dollars on a mediocore goaltender...and our 7 million dollar defenceman is actually well rounded... Lidstrom>Campbell but Keith>Rafalski Really the only difference in set up is the terrible contracts to Campbell and Huet... And add to the fact that our $7 million dollar defenceman's contract will be going down significantly next year and they're stuck with their $7mil dman's contract til 2016. By which time Wings should have another 2 Stanley cup victories under their belt. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FIBS 35 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) And add to the fact that our $7 million dollar defenceman's contract will be going down significantly next year and they're stuck with their $7mil dman's contract til 2016. By which time Wings should have another 2 Stanley cup victories under their belt. Don't hold your breath. Actually, go ahead and hold your breath. Edited December 3, 2009 by FIBS Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AtomicPunk 296 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 Hawks fans are just all excited because they can FINALLY WATCH THEIR TEAM ON TELEVISION. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adubs 8 Report post Posted December 3, 2009 (edited) They're do like the Pens. Have a "core" of 3 guys and change all the others every year. Then they will make it into the playoffs, beat a couple of weak teams in 7 games, have all the good teams in the conference lose and play the defneding champs when the champs #1 and #2 D men are injured; their #1 forward misses most of the series, their #4 d-man misses the entire series get excused from an automatic suspension and from all this they will win the cup. Simple. Yeah the Flyers and Caps are so weak... The Penguins will win the cup again within the next five or six years. Maybe not this year, but next year or the year after. The Hawks aren't very screwed at all. I'm sure worst case scenario a team will take Campbell. I can only hope the Flames can get there hands on Bolland or Sharp, but with a major raise going to Bourque they won't have very much money. Edited December 3, 2009 by adubs Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shaman 713 Report post Posted December 4, 2009 Yeah the Flyers and Caps are so weak... The Penguins will win the cup again within the next five or six years. Maybe not this year, but next year or the year after. The Hawks aren't very screwed at all. I'm sure worst case scenario a team will take Campbell. I can only hope the Flames can get there hands on Bolland or Sharp, but with a major raise going to Bourque they won't have very much money. No one will take campbell, worst case is they have to buy him out and are stuck with his contract at 60% forever. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropkickshanahans 463 Report post Posted December 4, 2009 (edited) No one will take campbell, worst case is they have to buy him out and are stuck with his contract at 60% forever. I'm sure Campbell will get moved. I think he's more likely to than Huet. EDIT: Wait, doesn't Campbell have a NTC? Edited December 4, 2009 by dropkickshanahans Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tommy_Like_Wingy 25 Report post Posted December 4, 2009 Hawks fans are just all excited because they can FINALLY WATCH THEIR TEAM ON TELEVISION. I still can't believe an owner would do that. I'm baffled how they still had a fan base at all when he was around because I'm not completely sure I'd still support the Wings if Ilitch pulled the same s***. It's just a slap in the face to the fans and the players alike. Maybe it's just me but I'm glad to see an Original 6 team from the West that's actually competitive again. It's been a while. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thedisappearer 291 Report post Posted December 4, 2009 I still can't believe an owner would do that. I'm baffled how they still had a fan base at all when he was around because I'm not completely sure I'd still support the Wings if Ilitch pulled the same s***. It's not as much about him (though it's clearly a factor) as it is they pulled a Penguins, bulked up with a bunch of high drafts picks, and got better. When they started winning, people came back. This isn't a s light on the fans, it's liek this everywhere. You win, and people show up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Statts 4 Report post Posted December 4, 2009 I'm sure Campbell will get moved. I think he's more likely to than Huet. EDIT: Wait, doesn't Campbell have a NTC? Yes he does. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
