Should Valtteri Filppula be traded?

[dallas27 7]

The worst thing Filppula did was score his infamous "Bobby Orr" goal. Vaulted him to unjustified superstar status to many here. After you read that don't jump right into his playoff performance. That to come later.

But no more of this potential talk. I had a ton of potential, played Junior A, probably could have went pro if I get a break here or there. But alas, I'm sitting here at work typing this message. Potential only gets you so far.

It is what it is, he's a 3rd line center on this team. And that's not a knock to him. I've always considered him a jack-of-all trades guy. Does nothing excpetional but does everything well, he's an excellent depth player. And that's perfectly fine with me. But I'm growing tired of him looking like a deer caught in headlights when he gets a scoring oppurtunity. I cut him a break on the open net vs Pittsburgh because as a left handed shot and at the spot he was in it was an akward angle to put in. But still, that's something you have to bury. He won't be a 60 point player on this team, most definitely not on the third line. He hasn't proven himself to be a top two line center either. Even so, I don't think he can get 60 period. 50 sounds more realistic. Maybe a 15 goal 35 assist guy. He doesn't have the scoring touch to get to 60, and that's something you can't teach. Yes, he's an awesome playoff performer. Well worth his steep (imo) price tag in the playoffs. But at this point if the Wings don't start putting the puck in the net they are in danger of not even making the playoffs.

Bottom line for me is I'd be content with Filppula on the team but ecstatic if the Wings brass could move him to get someone who can put the puck in the net night in and night out.

[RedWingAbner 13]

So he just IS 3rd liner because you say so? No matter how he produces, your word is the fact. Okay, then.

There are basically 74 top6 forwards producing less than Filppula and somehow Filppula isn't a top6 forward. Marian Gaborik was a 4th liner last year? Okay, I see.

I think your hate towards Filppula is much much bigger than my bias.

Is there someone who takes care of you during the day? I hope so.

No, he's not a 3rd liner because I say so. He's a 3rd liner because he typically plays on the 3rd line and produces third line point totals.

Marian Gaborik, on the other hand, is a proven commodity. And no, stupid, Cam Neely wasn't a third liner the year he played 13 games. You are arguing apples and oranges.

Fact: Filppula plays on the 3rd line, occasionally on the 2nd, but on EVERY depth chart (except yours) he is listed as our 3rd line center.

Fact: Filppula has only put up a high of 40 points with 3 full seasons under his belt. Marian Gaborik only played in 17 games last year but still managed 23 points. Rather than say "that projects to this," his previous game/point totals were 77/83, 48/57, 65/66, 65/40, 81/65, 78/67, and 71/36. That's in ascending order to his first season, so by year two, he had topped 60 points. Not a third liner.

Fact: Black bears are the superior bear.

Fact: Bears eat beets.

[wings7 62]

My point is, arguing about someone being 106th in ppg is so stupid it doesn't need to be discussed. Your ranking is subject to your opinion. Filppula is not a 2nd liner because our top 2 centers are Datsyuk and Zetterberg, our top 4 wingers are Franzen, Bertuzzi, Cleary, and Holmstrom. Is he a 2nd liner somewhere else? Maybe. But he's not here, and if we are paying him like we are, we shouldn't be playing him on the 3rd line (which, on a healthy Wings team, he'd be on).

Calling something ridiculous when it is ridiculous is not a cop out. It's just not worth the time to go down your little bunny trails. It'd be like me trying to say that statistically, it is better for Super Bowl teams to play and beat the Buccaneers-- because up until this year, no team that lost to them in the regular season went on to win the Super Bowl. It is there, on paper, but it's not much to base an argument on. Bunny trail-- as in, so and so is 106th in ppg among forwards. It's a waste of time.

Zing!

The worst thing Filppula did was score his infamous "Bobby Orr" goal. Vaulted him to unjustified superstar status to many here. After you read that don't jump right into his playoff performance. That to come later.

But no more of this potential talk. I had a ton of potential, played Junior A, probably could have went pro if I get a break here or there. But alas, I'm sitting here at work typing this message. Potential only gets you so far.

It is what it is, he's a 3rd line center on this team. And that's not a knock to him. I've always considered him a jack-of-all trades guy. Does nothing excpetional but does everything well, he's an excellent depth player. And that's perfectly fine with me. But I'm growing tired of him looking like a deer caught in headlights when he gets a scoring oppurtunity. I cut him a break on the open net vs Pittsburgh because as a left handed shot and at the spot he was in it was an akward angle to put in. But still, that's something you have to bury. He won't be a 60 point player on this team, most definitely not on the third line. He hasn't proven himself to be a top two line center either. Even so, I don't think he can get 60 period. 50 sounds more realistic. Maybe a 15 goal 35 assist guy. He doesn't have the scoring touch to get to 60, and that's something you can't teach. Yes, he's an awesome playoff performer. Well worth his steep (imo) price tag in the playoffs. But at this point if the Wings don't start putting the puck in the net they are in danger of not even making the playoffs.

Bottom line for me is I'd be content with Filppula on the team but ecstatic if the Wings brass could move him to get someone who can put the puck in the net night in and night out.

Bam!

[Finnish Wing 110]

Is there someone who takes care of you during the day? I hope so.

No, he's not a 3rd liner because I say so. He's a 3rd liner because he typically plays on the 3rd line and produces third line point totals.

Marian Gaborik, on the other hand, is a proven commodity. And no, stupid, Cam Neely wasn't a third liner the year he played 13 games. You are arguing apples and oranges.

Fact: Filppula plays on the 3rd line, occasionally on the 2nd, but on EVERY depth chart (except yours) he is listed as our 3rd line center.

Fact: Filppula has only put up a high of 40 points with 3 full seasons under his belt. Marian Gaborik only played in 17 games last year but still managed 23 points. Rather than say "that projects to this," his previous game/point totals were 77/83, 48/57, 65/66, 65/40, 81/65, 78/67, and 71/36. That's in ascending order to his first season, so by year two, he had topped 60 points. Not a third liner.

Fact: Black bears are the superior bear.

Fact: Bears eat beets.

Fact: Filppula plays on the thrid line in this team when Babcock splits up Zetterberg and Datsyuk.

Fact: Filppula is a 2nd liner if you compare him with every forward in the league.

Fact: You don't get NHL-level 2nd liners to this team cheap, just because they're possibly 3rd liners here. That's like saying that Kopitar would be a 3rd liner if he were to be traded to Pittsburgh and couldn't fit centering the top6 because there already is two better centers.

[Guest Crymson]

Calling something ridiculous when it is ridiculous is not a cop out. It's just not worth the time to go down your little bunny trails.

Hahaha.... well, I guess you'd rather have this be the "RedWingAbner Announcement Board" than a discussion board. What you have done since re-appearing recently has basically been to just make oft-absurd statements and ignore anything that anyone says that disagrees with those statements.

P.S.: You have no argument.

[Shaman 713]

Fact: Filppula plays on the thrid line in this team when Babcock splits up Zetterberg and Datsyuk.

Fact: Filppula is a 2nd liner if you compare him with every forward in the league.

Fact: You don't get NHL-level 2nd liners to this team cheap, just because they're possibly 3rd liners here. That's like saying that Kopitar would be a 3rd liner if he were to be traded to Pittsburgh and couldn't fit centering the top6 because there already is two better centers.

I respectfully disagree, hes definitely more of a Jordan Staal third line center, not a classic 2nd line center. He will be a career 3rd line center on any good team, he doesn't have game breaking (note that term) play making or goal scoring ability that would make him fit the model of a true second line center. Flip has a lot of great tools, but he does lack that game breaking ability that separates a scoring line center from an energy/shut down line center. Flip is a offensively talented defensive center, not a defensively sound offensive center.

[redwingfan19 293]

Fillpula won't be traded. He will continue to play on the third line and miss open nets..

[Z and D for the C 712]

But no more of this potential talk. I had a ton of potential, played Junior A, probably could have went pro if I get a break here or there. But alas, I'm sitting here at work typing this message. Potential only gets you so far.

LOL, what a worthless comparison. You "showed potential" in some nothing league compared to the NHL, Filppula show's potential and gets better every game he plays...in the NHL. He is also putting up the points, but that means nothing right?

Filppula has the talent to play on any second line in the NHL. If there are situations on teams which preclude him from playing on the second line, it doesn't change what he is capable of.

[Finnish Wing 110]

I respectfully disagree, hes definitely more of a Jordan Staal third line center, not a classic 2nd line center. He will be a career 3rd line center on any good team, he doesn't have game breaking (note that term) play making or goal scoring ability that would make him fit the model of a true second line center. Flip has a lot of great tools, but he does lack that game breaking ability that separates a scoring line center from an energy/shut down line center. Flip is a offensively talented defensive center, not a defensively sound offensive center.

I don't really care what "type" he is, as long as he keeps producing like a top6 player.

[Konnan511 1,736]

I said no. He may not be the best regular season player, but he is one of the very rare players that actually steps up his play during the playoffs. Also, if you're playing on the first line of your Olympic national and your team isn't Belarus or Italy, you must be a damn good player that everyone would love to have.

[Z and D for the C 712]

I don't really care what "type" he is, as long as he keeps producing like a top6 player.

60 points from an offensive forward who excels at defense is MUCH better than 60 points from a defensive forward who excels at offense.

I mean, according to RedWingsAbner, 40 points from an "in-your-face-foward" is better than 60 points from a defensive forward who excels at defense.

Edited February 13, 2010 by Z and D for the C

[Guest Crymson]

Fillpula won't be traded. He will continue to play on the third line and miss open nets..

All one of them, with that one having been a tough-angle shot. Oh, and let's completely ignore the impossible-angle shot he made in game two of the Cup finals last season. Oh, and the Penguins should definitely trade Jordan Staal too. He missed an open net in the game earlier this season, and he's sometimes a third-liner.

Brilliant.

Edited February 13, 2010 by Crymson

[redwingfan19 293]

LOL, what a worthless comparison. You "showed potential" in some nothing league compared to the NHL, Filppula show's potential and gets better every game he plays...in the NHL. He is also putting up the points, but that means nothing right?

Filppula has the talent to play on any second line in the NHL. If there are situations on teams which preclude him from playing on the second line, it doesn't change what he is capable of.

wouldn't call junior A " a nothing league " considering many players play there before they get drafted to NHL... I agree with what else you said though. Although I think fillpula should be the centerpiece to get Nathan Horton in a Wings uniform

[Shaman 713]

I don't really care what "type" he is, as long as he keeps producing like a top6 player.

Hes not playing like a top 6 player, Staal would be the archetype for a 3rd line center and he definitely a better offensive player as compared to flip. Flip is an above average 3rd line center, and a sub par 2nd line center.

[redwingfan19 293]

All one of them, with that one having been a tough-angle shot. Oh, and let's completely ignore the impossible-angle shot he made in game two of the Cup finals last season. Oh, and the Penguins should definitely trade Jordan Staal too. He missed an open net in the game earlier this season, and he's sometimes a third-liner.

Brilliant.

dude, I was obviously being sarcastic. I think Fillpula is a good player and he's one of my favs on this team.

[Z and D for the C 712]

Hes not playing like a top 6 player, Staal would be the archetype for a 3rd line center and he definitely a better offensive player as compared to flip. Flip is an above average 3rd line center, and a sub par 2nd line center.

So if 16 points in the last 21 games isn't playing like a top 6 player, what is?

[Finnish Wing 110]

Hes not playing like a top 6 player, Staal would be the archetype for a 3rd line center and he definitely a better offensive player as compared to flip. Flip is an above average 3rd line center, and a sub par 2nd line center.

I LOL'D HARD!

Where do you come up with this stuff? Jesus. :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDd

Above average 3rd liner and a sub par 2nd liner? WTF.

He's not playing like a top6 player? I don't care how he plays, as long as he keeps that top6 point pace up. He can jump on his head if he wants to. Although that may cause some problems to his great defensive abilities

[Shaman 713]

So if 16 points in the last 21 games isn't playing like a top 6 player, what is?

Thats not a great sample size, throughout his career hes never shown the skill set needed for a true 2nd line center, hes a good passer, but his play making ability isn't what people here keep saying it is. He can't score a goal to save his life, and unless he gets a winger that is one of those 'lift everyone up around him' type players, he will never put up more than 55 points. Now you will quote at me 'PPG for the season would give him X number of points' which is a cop out because, as we all know players this year love to slump at the worst possible moments and hes has had a few slumps in his career that have been frustrating to watch. I am not arguing that hes a worthless player, but, on these boards hes just badly overrated, I am just fine with the idea that hes going to be a career very talented 3rd liner and never make it as a full time 2nd line center, some people believe those words are blasphemy.

[Guest Crymson]

Hes not playing like a top 6 player, Staal would be the archetype for a 3rd line center and he definitely a better offensive player as compared to flip. Flip is an above average 3rd line center, and a sub par 2nd line center.

Filppula's offensive production during the last three regular seasons has been comparable to that of Staal, and his offensive production in the playoffs has been significantly better.

[Z and D for the C 712]

Thats not a great sample size, throughout his career hes never shown the skill set needed for a true 2nd line center, hes a good passer, but his play making ability isn't what people here keep saying it is. He can't score a goal to save his life, and unless he gets a winger that is one of those 'lift everyone up around him' type players, he will never put up more than 55 points. Now you will quote at me 'PPG for the season would give him X number of points' which is a cop out because, as we all know players this year love to slump at the worst possible moments and hes has had a few slumps in his career that have been frustrating to watch. I am not arguing that hes a worthless player, but, on these boards hes just badly overrated, I am just fine with the idea that hes going to be a career very talented 3rd liner and never make it as a full time 2nd line center, some people believe those words are blasphemy.

You said he isn't playing like a second line center (that's present tense). Presently, the way Filppula is playing, he has 16 points in 21 games. If that isn't playing like a second line center, tell me, explicitly, what is.

Those points totals are also from playing with Cleary, Williams, Bertuzzi, Miller. Put Franzen on his line and see what happens.

Edited February 13, 2010 by Z and D for the C

[Shaman 713]

I LOL'D HARD!

Where do you come up with this stuff? Jesus. :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDd

Above average 3rd liner and a sub par 2nd liner? WTF.

He's not playing like a top6 player? I don't care how he plays, as long as he keeps that top6 point pace up. He can jump on his head if he wants to. Although that may cause some problems to his great defensive abilities

Hes not on a top 6 pace first off, you pollute the sample by including all forwards, hes not a winger, hes a Center, there are 30 teams, so 60 top 2 line centers, hes 81st in the league among all centers. That would almost put him at the bottom of the 3rd tier of centers. Now you will probably counter by saying hes at a .64 ppg rate, now since the sample size is too low for it to be accurate to reflect where he would be i took it down to .54 which is where i believe he would be had he not been injured, as per progression over that last few years, that would be a more realistic PPG he would have around 30 points that would put him good for 61. So as an offensive center, hes really not in the 'top 6' in the league, he is in the area a good 3rd line center would be.

[Z and D for the C 712]

Hes not on a top 6 pace first off, you pollute the sample by including all forwards, hes not a winger, hes a Center, there are 30 teams, so 60 top 2 line centers, hes 81st in the league among all centers. That would almost put him at the bottom of the 3rd tier of centers. Now you will probably counter by saying hes at a .64 ppg rate, now since the sample size is too low for it to be accurate to reflect where he would be i took it down to .54 which is where i believe he would be had he not been injured, as per progression over that last few years, that would be a more realistic PPG he would have around 30 points that would put him good for 61. So as an offensive center, hes really not in the 'top 6' in the league, he is in the area a good 3rd line center would be.

LOL @ randomly making his ppg .54 because you feel like it. That's ridiculous. Of 4 1/2 months and 3/4 of a season his ppg is .65. That's 51st. Stop replacing numbers that prove you wrong with numbers that seemingly make you right.

Why on earth would his PPG be WORSE if he didn't get injured? I'm guess you think it's a good thing the wings have been injured to hell this year or they might be last in the conference.

Edited February 13, 2010 by Z and D for the C

[Finnish Wing 110]

Hes not on a top 6 pace first off, you pollute the sample by including all forwards, hes not a winger, hes a Center, there are 30 teams, so 60 top 2 line centers, hes 81st in the league among all centers. That would almost put him at the bottom of the 3rd tier of centers. Now you will probably counter by saying hes at a .64 ppg rate, now since the sample size is too low for it to be accurate to reflect where he would be i took it down to .54 which is where i believe he would be had he not been injured, as per progression over that last few years, that would be a more realistic PPG he would have around 30 points that would put him good for 61. So as an offensive center, hes really not in the 'top 6' in the league, he is in the area a good 3rd line center would be.

No he's not. He's 53rd among all centers in the league (not counting those who've played less than 10 games, about 5 of them). http://espn.go.com/nhl/statistics/player/_...oints/count/121

I really don't know where you're getting your "facts".

[Shaman 713]

No he's not. He's 53rd among all centers in the league (not counting those who've played less than 10 games, about 5 of them). http://espn.go.com/nhl/statistics/player/_...oints/count/121

I really don't know where you're getting your "facts".

Points, not PPG hes 81st

LOL @ randomly making his ppg .54 because you feel like it. That's ridiculous. Of 4 1/2 months and 3/4 of a season his ppg is .65. That's 51st. Stop replacing numbers that prove you wrong with numbers that seemingly make you right.

Why on earth would his PPG be WORSE if he didn't get injured? I'm guess you think it's a good thing the wings have been injured to hell this year or they might be last in the conference.

Its simple theres no way he goes up .14 pts per game if hes played all the games, in the last 2 seasons hes improved by .4 and thats with increasingly better linemates and more ice time, this year he has about the same ice time and s***tier line mates, there is NO way his production jumps 28% when wings production has drop by 1/3 this season, superstars would be hard pressed to have such a large jump in production on even good teams, Flip would NEVER have that PPG rate if he was healthy the whole season, and he wont end the season that high, he will cool off. If you believe that Flip can magically increase his production over a season by 28% while the team as the whole have drop by over 30% then you really are dumb and shouldnt be debating.

[dallas27 7]

LOL, what a worthless comparison. You "showed potential" in some nothing league compared to the NHL, Filppula show's potential and gets better every game he plays...in the NHL. He is also putting up the points, but that means nothing right?

No crap it is, glad you could figure that toughie out. But the point remain the same; potential only takes you so far before you actually use it. Worthless comparison or not, potential is potential. I have it, you have it, everyone has it. Filppula has shown no potential for finding the back of the net, or shooting for that matter. For the past 3-4 years it's been "oh, just wait, Datsyuk never shot the puck when he first came into the NHL. Filppula will be fine." Well...we're still waiting. And it has to happen soon.

If you bothered to read further down you would have seen that I was not ragging on him at all. Take your Filppula blinders off because for God's sake should someone have constructive criticism about him.

Filppula has the talent to play on any second line in the NHL. If there are situations on teams which preclude him from playing on the second line, it doesn't change what he is capable of.

Except the Red Wings