achildr1 255 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 If this in any way turns into a situation where Nabokov is actually a Wing, what I'm hearing is that the Wings are not happy with Howard and he's unlikely to get much of a raise next year if even he returns at all. It would be a bit of a bulls*** move if you ask me. I know Jimmy hasn't been playing well this year, but I think that's largely due to mismanagement of his development over the last year. It just seems lame to set him up to fall apart and then to seemingly give up on him when he does indeed fall apart. It's one thing with Osgood as there's a relationship and support system installed already whereas it's clear that Nabokov would be coming in because we've got a mess on our hands right now. Even if it's just to try and push Howard, it just seems like a dumb move. Granted, who knows what's really going on, but something about this whole thing is fishy to me. Slow down, bud. We're not there yet. I really don't think the Wings are giving up on Howard yet at all. I really like Jimmy as a goalie, but after the last month plus and Osgood's injury, I'd be in the market for the next best option available for the playoffs/insurance. Which Nabby is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjm502 165 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 (edited) Or team x trades with the Wings knowing they'll get him anyway and have better trade bait. esteef If that happened Nabby would be exposed to waivers again and likely to be claimed by another team. And this is all only possible if he gets claimed by another team which I'm not sure will even happen. If a team claims Nabby they pretty much have to keep him on their team and give him a shot at being a starter, and I can't see many teams doing that. At the end of the day I think the chances of Nabby being with us are very good. Edited January 21, 2011 by cjm502 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CenterIce 83 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 He cannot be placed on the waiver wire until Friday at noon, according to Mickey Redmon. So, their is no shortening of the waiver period. We will not know until Saturday at noon, if he has been picked up. 1 dobbles reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miss Wing Queen 154 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 (edited) Actually, I don't think the Wings are looking for circumvention. The conditions are rules are very specific and all the GM's know and understand the rules. I think the points that we are overlooking here specifically was how the Wings structured the deal, and what Meehan publicly stated to all the of NHL teams. The Wings specifically placed in a No Movement Clause so once a team acquires Nabokov, he cannot be moved, waived, traded, etc. without his approval. Additionally, he is ineligible for the AHL. So when a team makes a claim, they are stuck with him on their 23-man roster for the remainder of the season. Additionally, Meehan specifically laid out of warning to all of the other NHL franchises and I'm sure his wording was very careful - "wants to compete as a starter". So the question at this point would be, do you take a swing at a goaltender with the potential pitfalls: 1) You haven't seen him play in over 8 months 2) There is a chance he may not report at all if he disagrees with the situation 3) If claimed, he must be on the roster and we cannot move him at all 4) He explicitly states he expects to "compete with the starter" meaning, if we bury him in the press box he will be disgruntled and could prove to be a point of contention/distraction/etc. The Wings did all they could contractually and politically to make him less attractive. They waited till late Thursday night to shorten the claim period. They put in a No Move to prevent other teams from expelling or moving him off of the 23 man roster. The agent of the player made a veiled threat. I'm not sure if this is the right course of action but it is apparent that it isn't as simple as "Someone will screw the Wings", because the run the risk of acquiring an asset they don't need and potentially bring in a unpredictable variable into the locker room. [/Quote] ^^^This sounds more on target. But IF we keep Nabby through Saturday, do we keep him for the rest of the season or does Kenny work on a good trade deal tailored to what Nabby wants and one that will benefit us greatly after Ozzie comes back and is healthy enough to play? Edited January 21, 2011 by Miss Wing Queen Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CenterIce 83 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 So... in this scenario, should we end up with Nabby, he simply gets waived if Ozzie gets healthy? That sounds like a no-lose situation especially with that cheap contract. No, Nabokov stays on the roster. We would have 3 goalies for the playoffs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
achildr1 255 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 "Actually, I don't think the Wings are looking for circumvention. The conditions are rules are very specific and all the GM's know and understand the rules. I think the points that we are overlooking here specifically was how the Wings structured the deal, and what Meehan publicly stated to all the of NHL teams. The Wings specifically placed in a No Movement Clause so once a team acquires Nabokov, he cannot be moved, waived, traded, etc. without his approval. Additionally, he is ineligible for the AHL. So when a team makes a claim, they are stuck with him on their 23-man roster for the remainder of the season. Additionally, Meehan specifically laid out of warning to all of the other NHL franchises and I'm sure his wording was very careful - "wants to compete as a starter". So the question at this point would be, do you take a swing at a goaltender with the potential pitfalls: 1) You haven't seen him play in over 8 months 2) There is a chance he may not report at all if he disagrees with the situation 3) If claimed, he must be on the roster and we cannot move him at all 4) He explicitly states he expects to "compete with the starter" meaning, if we bury him in the press box he will be disgruntled and could prove to be a point of contention/distraction/etc. The Wings did all they could contractually and politically to make him less attractive. They waited till late Thursday night to shorten the claim period. They put in a No Move to prevent other teams from expelling or moving him off of the 23 man roster. The agent of the player made a veiled threat. I'm not sure if this is the right course of action but it is apparent that it isn't as simple as "Someone will screw the Wings", because they run the risk of acquiring an asset they don't need and potentially bringing in an unpredictable variable into the locker room. " esteef Oh my. One of my favorite posts in awhile. Well said. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 (edited) If that happened Nabby would be exposed to waivers again and likely to be claimed by another team. And this is all only possible if he gets claimed by another team which I'm not sure will even happen. Detroit has first crack after the initial waiver claim. So either trade with the Wings or they get him once he hits waivers if the first team tries to move him. That's what I'm saying. The contract language has made the second waiver obsolete and damn near making the first claim useless as Nabby can just decline to go back to the wire. esteef Edited January 21, 2011 by esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CenterIce 83 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 If this in any way turns into a situation where Nabokov is actually a Wing, what I'm hearing is that the Wings are not happy with Howard and he's unlikely to get much of a raise next year if even he returns at all. It would be a bit of a bulls*** move if you ask me. I know Jimmy hasn't been playing well this year, but I think that's largely due to mismanagement of his development over the last year. It just seems lame to set him up to fall apart and then to seemingly give up on him when he does indeed fall apart. It's one thing with Osgood as there's a relationship and support system installed already whereas it's clear that Nabokov would be coming in because we've got a mess on our hands right now. Even if it's just to try and push Howard, it just seems like a dumb move. Granted, who knows what's really going on, but something about this whole thing is fishy to me. Holland has stated that he likes Howard and Osgood, when healthy. This is not a knock on them. This is a depth move, which the Wings do all the time. People complain all the time why the Wings keep guys around forever. They want as much depth going into the playoffs as they can. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Oh my. One of my favorite posts in awhile. Well said. For the record I just reposted that, I'm not that smart! esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropkickshanahans 463 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 I'd love me a Jhoww and Nooky tandem. Sidney Sweetheart must be feeling a little intimidated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shady Ultima 40 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 If that happened Nabby would be exposed to waivers again and likely to be claimed by another team. And this is all only possible if he gets claimed by another team which I'm not sure will even happen. If a team claims Nabby they pretty much have to keep him on their team and give him a shot at being a starter, and I can't see many teams doing that. At the end of the day I think the chances of Nabby being with us are very good. Pretty sure, if Nabby gets claimed, and that team tries to trade/waive him, we get first pick. So, even if NJ claims him, and then waive him, we're instantly #1 in the cue, before all the other crappy teams, like the islanders. At least, that's what I took from the most recent report. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjm502 165 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Detroit has first crack after the initial waiver claim. So either trade with the Wings or they get him once he hits waivers if the first team tries to move him. That's what I'm saying. The contract language hal made the second waiver obsolete and damn near making the first claim useless as Nabby can just decline to go back to the wire. esteef The problem is if another team tries trading him to us we don't get first crack at him and he could end up with another team who actually wants him but he originally got claimed before that team could claim him. Oh my, that's worded poorly. The only way we get first dibs is if he is traded to a team besides the wings. The only way I see us ending up with Nabby if he doesn't clear is the situation I posted a page back or so. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mjtm77 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Pretty sure, if Nabby gets claimed, and that team tries to trade/waive him, we get first pick. So, even if NJ claims him, and then waive him, we're instantly #1 in the cue, before all the other crappy teams, like the islanders. At least, that's what I took from the most recent report. from what i understand waiving him is a no. and tradeing him? he has a no movement clause. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjm502 165 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 from what i understand waiving him is a no. and tradeing him? he has a no movement clause. I believe so. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Barrie 900 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Yeah, what about all this from the player's point of view? How much clout and input does he get, if any? Yea you'd have to think Nabokov has some kind of say in all this, he did sign as a Free Agent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shady Ultima 40 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 The problem is if another team tries trading him to us we don't get first crack at him and he could end up with another team who actually wants him but he originally got claimed before that team could claim him. Oh my, that's worded poorly. The only way we get first dibs is if he is traded to a team besides the wings. The only way I see us ending up with Nabby if he doesn't clear is the situation I posted a page back or so. That really makes no sense. We get first dibs on Nabby if he's traded to anyone else, but if he's traded to us, he goes back to waivers? from what i understand waiving him is a no. and tradeing him? he has a no movement clause. I'm pretty sure that a player can waive the no movement clause at any time, and he can be put on waivers IF he agrees to it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 The problem is if another team tries trading him to us we don't get first crack at him and he could end up with another team who actually wants him but he originally got claimed before that team could claim him. Oh my, that's worded poorly. The only way we get first dibs is if he is traded to a team besides the wings. The only way I see us ending up with Nabby if he doesn't clear is the situation I posted a page back or so. Basically the Wings will get him if the first team doesn't keep him. Call it a trade, call it a waive, call it a burrito. esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjm502 165 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Either way I think Nabby is going to be ours and if he isn't his agent owes us a favor. It's a win-win. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brett 1,029 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 jimmy gotta feel a little worried if nabby comes over. nothing better than 2 goalies trying their absolute best to get the starter Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shady Ultima 40 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 I wouldn't blame Jimmy for being upset, but I don't think this is because of him. I think, Ozzie is most likely done for the year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjm502 165 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Basically the Wings will get him if the first team doesn't keep him. Call it a trade, call it a waive, call it a burrito. esteef Yeah, that's pretty much how it goes. It can get complicated but this is the simplest way to put it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
10 Minute Misconduct 104 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 Waiver rules more complicated than I knew. If more than 1 team were to claim, DET could lose its priority status to re-claim on 2nd waivers. http://twitter.com/tsnbobmckenzie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Barrie 900 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 I'm not sure if this is the right course of action but it is apparent that it isn't as simple as "Someone will screw the Wings", because they run the risk of acquiring an asset they don't need and potentially bringing in an unpredictable variable into the locker room." Sounds to me if a team claims him, the Wings screwed them! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cjm502 165 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 That really makes no sense. We get first dibs on Nabby if he's traded to anyone else, but if he's traded to us, he goes back to waivers? I'm pretty sure. It's stupid but rules are rules. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Barrie 900 Report post Posted January 21, 2011 I wouldn't blame Jimmy for being upset, but I don't think this is because of him. I think, Ozzie is most likely done for the year. With the no movement clause, I too am thinking Ozzie's season, and career, is over. If that's the case, thanks Ozzie ! Next stop the Hall of Fame. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
