chances14

I agree.  Costs went up, but so did profits, so that's something to take into account as well.

Remeber though that revenue and profits are 2 different things and is something a lot of people are not understanding here. people see $3.3 billion and automatically assume that is all profit but it's not.

another issue is that for the big market teams like toronto, detroit,etc.. profits have gone up but for the smaller market teams profits have not gone up, but you can bet that the costs of running a team have gone up across the board.

but i do agree with the players in that the owners should have to honor all exisiting contracts with no rollbacks. it's the owners who gave them the contracts in the first place.

?

The owners are demanding a higher percentage of revenue and salary rollbacks and the players are saying no. How is that a demand on the players part?

you are right in that the owners are demanding salary rollbacks. but the players are demanding that there be no salary rollbacks and refuse to negotiate economic issues until that demand is met.

You can argue who's demands are more reasonable but to say that the players aren't demanding anything is false imo. the fact is both sides have demands that right now aren't being met by either side and is why we are at a stalemate with these economic issues

Possibly.

But the owners were the ones who outvoted Bettman in '95 to end the lockout and save the season, back when they only needed the majority to overrule him.

The depressing part is it would take 24 out of 30 owners to vote for Bettman to be fired.

the problem is that those same owners allowed bettman to become virtually untouchable.

i have to agree that i think the players should keep their mouths shut, just like the owners should and have.

nothing good comes from either the players or owners bashing each other through the public. i don't know about anyone else but i am tired of going to mlive and every day it seems there's a new article with zetterberg quotes criticzing the league and the owners. we get it, you don't like or agree with the owners. repeating it dozens of times to the media isn't going to solve anything.

this video was brought up in the old lockout thread. i think it speaks to boyle's quotes about how the owners are not all on the same page.

Lest we also forget, all 30 owners voted in favor of a lockout...

i think the owners that are against the lockout didn't want to appear to the union as not being unified, so they voted for it knowing that since only 8 are needed to approve lockout, their vote would be useless

I saw the headline and assumed it's an old article.  It's not.  When the two sides meet later this week, they once again won't be discussing the central issue that is holding up the season.



Fehr insists it's good the two sides are still talking even if it's not about the main issue.  I guess it is better than nothing, but still seems kind of absurd.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=407017

I figured that since both sides urged each other to produce new proposals at last weeks meetings that they would have begin talking about economics this week but I guess not. Ridiculous.

So I assume that neither side is willing to move even a little bit so that they can even being to talk about economic issues. And this is where both sides are at fault.  No urgency to get this deal done

Remember how most people kept saying the initial offer was just an usual lowball one? Well looks like the players saw it as an invitation for war.

This time it is not just about money it is also about staying up to your principles. Some guys girls might believe, the PA hasn't learned from the last lockout, I disagree.

Look at their comments and how everyone mentioned that they are prepared for MULTI year long lockout. They do have leverage here the midget does risk the future of teams like Anaheim here. You know teams with a small fanbase which need the casual fan in droves.

I am pretty sure the players are as sick as the fans of this 6 years and no they don't owe me anything.

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you have only been hearing that from the players that have already accumulated millions of dollars throughout their career and can afford to sit out. what about those 3rd and 4th liners?

just like i believe that the owners aren't unified on this lockout, i also think the union isn't as unified as they want you to believe, judging by some of the recent comments i have been reading by players

Nobody cares about the fans.  They all want money.  They want as much as they can get, both sides.  If it was Bettman or Selig or Shanny up there, it'd be the same story.  But keep believing that if Bettman magically disappeared that Jeremy Jacobs and Mike Illitch would stop caring about money.

exactly. if either side cared about the fans, this lockout would have already been over

Any player that wants Bettman fired is a fool.  The current lockout is based on the fact that the players want to retain a high percentage of the revenue that Bettman is largely responsible for creating.  No reasonable player has any intention of going back to the "good" old days.

Edit:  As evidenced by the fact that the players' whole position in these negotiations has been to keep everything exactly the way it is right now.

it is quite ironic how the players are fighting tooth and nail to keep a system that they lost a whole season trying to fight against 8 years ago.

All I see on ESPN 3 is soccer. The game should be on now, is anyone watching it?

just go to this site to watch the KHL games http://www.laola1.tv...ideo/224--.html

saw this posted on hfboards so i figure i would post it here as well.

fsd is is letting people decide what to show in replace of red wings games if regular season games are cancelled

Vote for the griffins!

http://www.foxsports...ges/viewerform/

The longer this goes, the more pressure it is on the owners, and the players know it.

The players want to believe it does but in reality, the owners will win once again, just like every time we see a lockout in professional sports. Fehr has done a good job on convincing players that sitting out for a year or more will make the owners cave (Cleary's recent quotes are a good example of that) but it will not happen.

The owners have the upper hand because:
-majority of them have money coming in on other things besides hockey. they can afford to sit out longer than the players because the players income comes solely from playing hockey.

- the owners know that the fans will come back, just like last time. I remember in the last lockout, everyone said they were done with hockey for good. Guess what? the nhl had record attendance the year after the lockout. the same thing will happen this time. Hockey fans are by far the most diehard and loyal fans in professional sports and the owners know it. you guys can huff and puff all you want about abandoning the nhl if an entire season is lost  but i gurantee all of you will be back.

I think the players are banking on the winter classic being the reason that the owners give in, but they will be in for a rude awakening when bettman pulls the plug in november. that's when the real negotiations will begin.

just my 2 cents

The attempt to argue that the lockout contrvenes Quebec labour laws failed, but there is another attempt by the PA; from CBC:

a waste of legal resources. there is no chance that the pa will win on this issue.

their time would be better spent on trying to get the owners and themselves to the bargaining table

Did anyone Catch this in the interview?

ISN: Last thing Jimmy, any thoughts on players moving on and playing for the KHL or other European Leagues during the lockout?

"The players are doing what they have to do, but it's funny, you talk about solidarity and a handful have already bolted. You know who they are...like they need the money...yeah right! But I would caution them to be very careful not to get hurt because as of two days ago, we pulled all their league insurance (dental, medical, player) and all the benefits for each player, so if they get hurt, the NHL will not pay them one dime until they are cleared by league doctors and to the owner's satisfaction that the player is 100% fit and able to perform."

He seems to be throwing his own players under the bus including the best player on the team in Datsyuk


Maybe jimmy d was in a really bad mood the day he gave this interview. This just seems so unredwing like

Yet, millions of people are paying a good amount of money to see them play, watch them, buy jerseys and other merchandise stuff.

Yup. I don't really care that they are overpaid but I do get annoyed when people try to justify entertainers/pro athletes getting paid millions of dollars. There is none