OFFICIAL: Niedermayer returns to Ducks

[Guest DetroitIan]

I wonder how much this is gonna effect Selanne's retirement decision.

[kylee 727]

no respect for niedermayer, no respect for th ducks.

no offense to any of them personally,

but i hope they collectively (continue to) crash and burn.

[Grittzkey 1]

Iam interested in who is going to be the person or persons who are being dumped to make room for niedermayer

[VM1138 1,921]

Wasn't Neids under contract still? They wouldn't have to move anyone then, would they?

This could go either way. Either he sparks a resurgence in the Ducks, or else it falls flat. They weren't missing his skill, they were lacking energy from all their players. Either he can give them energy and make them a playoff team again, or else they just continue to suck, but with a high scoring defenseman.

[Louisville 112]

i say dump bert if he comes back you guys can have him back... oh and u can take Beauchemin also...

Seriously, It has to be joke that Sergei Zubov has 47,344 votes for the all-star game to Beauchemin's 85,517...

[Rice 42]

Wasn't Neids under contract still? They wouldn't have to move anyone then, would they?

Ducks ownership has a self-imposed cap.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Wasn't Neids under contract still? They wouldn't have to move anyone then, would they?

This could go either way. Either he sparks a resurgence in the Ducks, or else it falls flat. They weren't missing his skill, they were lacking energy from all their players. Either he can give them energy and make them a playoff team again, or else they just continue to suck, but with a high scoring defenseman.

He was/is under contract, however he was suspended for not reporting to camp. Since he was suspended by the team, his salary didn't count against the cap. Even with the teams self-imposed cap, the addition of Niedermayer will put them over the CBA imposed cap NEXT season. I'm not sure about the boring details, but from what I've read, the Ducks will have to move someone who is under contract for next season to clear enough cap space.

From Spector's.....

"Bob McKenzie tonight reports defenceman Scott Niedermayer could be returning to the Anaheim Ducks soon, but that could create a potential salary problem for the team. McKenzie writes that, while the Ducks have the cap room to absorb the remainder of Niedermayer's salary for this season, his return means they must free up cap space for next season. "In the new CBA, it's called 'tagging' room and the Ducks don't have enough of it next season to allow Niedermayer back on the roster this season – unless they move a player who is under contract for next season", reports McKenzie, who goes on to say sources claim the Ducks have been very active in trade talks this week, hoping to move a defenceman other than Chris Pronger. That means Mathieu Schneider (ironically signed to potentially replace Niedermayer), Francois Beachemin or Sean O'Donnell might be available. McKenzie also claims Niedermayer might only return for the balance of this season and retire."

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Niedermayer has never done anything close to this, that's why I'm surprised that he's behaving this way.

Like I said, even if it is all above board, even if he hasn't given advance word to Burke where they've planned on him coming back, then I'm still extremely disapointed in Niedermayer. Like I said, I really liked the guy. And of course it's a difficult decision, but by dragging it out this long, he has put his team in a tough position. You don't think this uncertainty has been a distraction and a handicap for the Ducks? For the management in planning for their future?

It's almost worse if Niedermayer really was this wishy washy and was keeping everyone waiting on his decision, his family, his team. It's why I could only guess he's already given word to all parties involved. That makes the situation easier on his family and team, but it's still a manipulation of the situation and dishonest to the NHL in my opinion.

And it also is worse to me because he is the captain of the team. His indecision has hurt this team. That's even worse when you're supposed to be the leader.

And honestly I'm fine with all of this really, except that I think the Ducks should have to pay his full salary for the year. He is under contract to the Ducks. He is medically cleared to play. He's not holding out for a new contract, he's not a player with some substance abuse problem. He's the former captain of the team who just doesn't feel like playing right now. Fine. But when he does come back, the Ducks should still have to pay that contract they signed with him. If he didn't feel like playing for half the year, that's their problem with Scotty, not the league's.

we'll have to agree to disagree I guess. But I think it's incredibly naive to think he didn't give Burke a heads up on this one. Or that this whole situation hasn't been a distraction for the team, at the very least. Plus the financial ramifications of whether or not they bring Scotty back. Honestly I'm beginning to feel like I'm discussing this with a Ducks homer.

I just think you're making a big to do about nothing is all.

I just don't see what the big deal is here. I hardly feel a wrong is being committed. And in our earlier example of maybe Datsyuk or Lids or one of the Wings doing this your reply was still centered around the idea that anybody doing this is doing something wrong. You've made up your mind that Niedermayer and Burke are doing something shady and that if Dats or another wing did something like this it too would be shady. Is there no plausible way a human being could not decide upon his future prior to the season only to come to a decision to return later on? Why is that so unbelievable? Why must something sinister HAVE TO be happening?

It sounds like to me, since you say you don't have it in for the Ducks, which I believe, that you think the league should change the rules to prohibit this, no? Personally, I wouldn't mind if there were some rule in place. And to be quite honest, I wouldn't mind if the Ducks were on the hook for his full salary, or any team for that matter.

I guess my rub here is that what they're doing is allowed, its not prohibited and for whatever reason, call me American, I don't believe in persecuting people or painting them in a bad light or accusing them of foul play when prior history has no precedent for it, the person involved has always been of good character and even if they had manipulated the situation, the rules enable them to do so. I don't begrudge the guy who makes off with a few extra millions because his tax attorney can find ways to get around this or that. I hate the RFA offer sheet and think its poison but the rules allow it. I don't think of GM's who utilize it of being of bad morale character or that they're doing something shady. Hell, the exhorbitant prices they pay could be argued to be far more detrimental to the spirit of the CBA and the NHL than what Niedermayer is going through right now.

I'm not sure we disagree on all of this stuff but moreso on I don't think they're bad people for what they're doing. I haven't made up my mind that they planned something sinister already. What benefit did the Ducks get by having Niedermayer sit out? Overpaying for Schnieds and Bertuzzi? Losing Selanne and Penner? I don't see how the Ducks could have planned this thing beforehand and thought any scenario they could conjure up would be better than just icing Scott Niedermayer. You don't replace Scott Niedermayer. Why would the Ducks knowingly screw themselves over. They may get Scott back but have to move a key player like Beauchemin. I don't see how they're pulling one over on the league or anyone else. It just doesn't add up. Why would you take 10 steps backwards to go 1 step forward? Burke said they had no choice but to suspend Scott because he couldn't come to a decision. I believe him and I believe Scott Niedermayer. People have changes of heart.

[lfd250 1]

I just think you're making a big to do about nothing is all.

I just don't see what the big deal is here. I hardly feel a wrong is being committed. And in our earlier example of maybe Datsyuk or Lids or one of the Wings doing this your reply was still centered around the idea that anybody doing this is doing something wrong. You've made up your mind that Niedermayer and Burke are doing something shady and that if Dats or another wing did something like this it too would be shady. Is there no plausible way a human being could not decide upon his future prior to the season only to come to a decision to return later on? Why is that so unbelievable? Why must something sinister HAVE TO be happening?

It sounds like to me, since you say you don't have it in for the Ducks, which I believe, that you think the league should change the rules to prohibit this, no? Personally, I wouldn't mind if there were some rule in place. And to be quite honest, I wouldn't mind if the Ducks were on the hook for his full salary, or any team for that matter.

I guess my rub here is that what they're doing is allowed, its not prohibited and for whatever reason, call me American, I don't believe in persecuting people or painting them in a bad light or accusing them of foul play when prior history has no precedent for it, the person involved has always been of good character and even if they had manipulated the situation, the rules enable them to do so. I don't begrudge the guy who makes off with a few extra millions because his tax attorney can find ways to get around this or that. I hate the RFA offer sheet and think its poison but the rules allow it. I don't think of GM's who utilize it of being of bad morale character or that they're doing something shady. Hell, the exhorbitant prices they pay could be argued to be far more detrimental to the spirit of the CBA and the NHL than what Niedermayer is going through right now.

I'm not sure we disagree on all of this stuff but moreso on I don't think they're bad people for what they're doing. I haven't made up my mind that they planned something sinister already. What benefit did the Ducks get by having Niedermayer sit out? Overpaying for Schnieds and Bertuzzi? Losing Selanne and Penner? I don't see how the Ducks could have planned this thing beforehand and thought any scenario they could conjure up would be better than just icing Scott Niedermayer. You don't replace Scott Niedermayer. Why would the Ducks knowingly screw themselves over. They may get Scott back but have to move a key player like Beauchemin. I don't see how they're pulling one over on the league or anyone else. It just doesn't add up. Why would you take 10 steps backwards to go 1 step forward? Burke said they had no choice but to suspend Scott because he couldn't come to a decision. I believe him and I believe Scott Niedermayer. People have changes of heart.

So you get your dream job, settle in and get to know the people, get into a grove of what's to be expected of you, and come tomorrow you're out because the guy who left so you could be hired, decides eh, I'm board and miss my old job I think I'll go back to work. He's got nothing to prove, nothing to work for becuase he's done all he can at that job, but hey may be you can get your old job back. You remember it, you hated it.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

So you get your dream job, settle in and get to know the people, get into a grove of what's to be expected of you, and come tomorrow you're out because the guy who left so you could be hired, decides eh, I'm board and miss my old job I think I'll go back to work. He's got nothing to prove, nothing to work for becuase he's done all he can at that job, but hey may be you can get your old job back. You remember it, you hated it.

Well, if anybody watched the Burke press conference, he sure sounded convincing to me that he had about as much clue to Scotty's plans as we did.

I found it interesting that he called Scotty out on the floor for not letting him know his possible plans before letting the beat writers up in Canada know.

Either that was the best acting job ever by Burke or Scott Niedermayer really didn't decide what he wanted to do until recently.

I think it also interesting that they aren't transfering the Captaincy back to Scott and are leaving it with Chris Pronger.

Everything Burke said was fine in my opinion. I didn't see a liar sitting up their in front of me. Maybe some of you did. But if it was a lie, then that was an academy award winning performance. And if so, then not giving the captaincy back and all that is just part of some grand conspiracy the Ducks have masterminded from day one, with Scotty's help.

Personally, I think that's absurd. Nothing shady was going on here. Never was. Of course that's just my opinion.

[edicius 3,269]

Would you feel the same way if it were a few years ago and Stevie wanted to come out of retirement mid-season?

I think we all know that Yzerman wouldn't pull that garbage.

What if a player were in a serious accident and had to announce his retirement, but through some miracle and physical therapy came back, would you begrudge him the opportunity of employment?

Completely different situation. Burke and Niedermayer colluded to bypass the salary cap. Unless you're saying that all this time, Niedermayer was seriously injured and no one knew about it?

I have no problem with this. This has nothing to do with league rules, salary structures or fair play. The only thing people have a problem with here is that its the Ducks and Niedermayer and not the Wings. We don't like the Ducks. We don't like Niedermayer. They are the defending champs. They are one of our Western rivals. Any complaining about the Ducks doing this is so much sour grapes. We wouldn't care if Niedermayer wanted to join our team and all we had to do was cough up Lilja and Samuellson for cap space next season.

I would. I wouldn't want a piece of garbage like Niedermayer on the Wings. He clearly doesn't think about the team.

If Niedermayer puts the Ducks over the top and we can't beat them, then we can't beat them. They aren't breaking any rules. Currently, I don't believe anybody, a fan or the league has the right to deny a player the chance to earn a living if he decides to unretire.

Bogus "suspension" to save a few bucks, ridiculous press conferences to state that, "Der, I dunno yet" and relinquishing the captaincy to one of the biggest goons in the league. Nope, I don't see a problem there.

We already knew that Burke is a piece of garbage. Stands to reason that it rubbed off on ol' Scotty.

Am I bitter? Yeah. Because I know that if ANY other team in the league pulled this garbage, Burke would be pissing and moaning all over the place how even though it's "technically within the rules, it's still not fair". Hell, we already saw how he did that with Lowe.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

I guess my rub here is that what they're doing is allowed, its not prohibited and for whatever reason, call me American, I don't believe in persecuting people or painting them in a bad light or accusing them of foul play when prior history has no precedent for it, the person involved has always been of good character and even if they had manipulated the situation, the rules enable them to do so. I don't begrudge the guy who makes off with a few extra millions because his tax attorney can find ways to get around this or that. I hate the RFA offer sheet and think its poison but the rules allow it. I don't think of GM's who utilize it of being of bad morale character or that they're doing something shady. Hell, the exhorbitant prices they pay could be argued to be far more detrimental to the spirit of the CBA and the NHL than what Niedermayer is going through right now.

I disagree with your idea that a rule should be in place to discourage or even disallow this. I don't see how it harms the game at all. In fact, as you pointed out, it creates more problems for the Ducks than it solves. If anything, it makes things more interesting for the rest of the league knowing that someone is going to have to be moved. It doesn't necessarially mean someone will be traded, but that is the way it is looking.

Regardless, how often does something like this happen? I seems a bit foolish to me to institute a rule preventing this when it isn't something the NHL sees with any sort of regularity.

Completely different situation. Burke and Niedermayer colluded to bypass the salary cap. Unless you're saying that all this time, Niedermayer was seriously injured and no one knew about it?

Please explain to everyone exactly how this helped the Ducks at all. I sure would like to know.

[Duck Guy 86]

I wonder how much this is gonna effect Selanne's retirement decision.

i personnaly think this will impact his desicion like he said it would... he may have changed his mind though,

Edited December 6, 2007 by Duck Guy

[Dabura 12,232]

Please explain to everyone exactly how this helped the Ducks at all.

Niedermayer, though under contract, is bypassing playing, while the Ducks are bypassing paying him. Which is all well and good on the surface -- but sinister underneath.

Scott's a top defenseman, but he's old and he needed to rest after the Cup run. What would any shrewd GM want to do in that situation? Obvious: keep him contractually tied to your team, but get yourself off the hook for his pay by dealing him a mean ol' "suspension." Then, when he's fully rested and restored, lift that "suspension," put him right back there in the lineup, and watch him tear s*** up like he never left.

But that's more than a little disingenuous, and I'm glad no GM has tried pulling it off.

Oh, wait, never mind.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

Niedermayer, though under contract, is bypassing playing, while the Ducks are bypassing paying him. Which is all well and good on the surface -- but sinister underneath.

Scott's a top defenseman, but he's old and he needed to rest after the Cup run. What would any shrewd GM want to do in that situation? Obvious: keep him contractually tied to your team, but get yourself off the hook for his pay by dealing him a mean ol' "suspension." Then, when he's fully rested and restored, lift that "suspension," put him right back there in the lineup, and watch him tear s*** up like he never left.

But that's more than a little disingenuous, and I'm glad no GM has tried pulling it off.

Oh, wait, never mind.

So what it actually Burke on the grassy nole?

Again, how does this benefit the Ducks? They signed Matty to replace Scotty. In all likelyhood they will move Matty. Matty is making about $1.25 less than Scotty this season. So we are talking about a few hundred thousand dollars that, in your senario, the Ducks would have saved. All this drama for such little savings? Doesn't add up.

What does add up is that Scotty wasn't 100% about retiring, so the Ducks gave him all the time he wanted to come back, but prepared as if he wasn't. Now, if anything, the Ducks are screwed with trying to move Matty to make room for Scotty.

[Bannedforlife 403]

In the end you either think Burke and Niedermayer are bad, unethical people or you don't. Since there is zero evidence to prove they did anything in bad faith, I can't bring myself to point my finger at them. And yes, there's nothing to prove they didn't act unethically. But the burden of proof is on those that would accuse them of wrongdoing not the other way around.

We've plenty of hearsay and conjecture. Those are kinds of evidence.

[Hockeytown0001 7,652]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_ylt=AjBz...p&type=lgns

What do you guys think about this? i personally think that its a crock of s***. I mean, what better way to return then to come back almost halfway through the season while your team is in a slump. That doesn't seem very leader-like to me. To sit around and jack-off for a few months pondering retirement is absurd. A real captain would be with their team from the beginning to the end or he wouldn't be with them at all. And Niedermayer seems to be caught in the middle, and come back when he feels like it. It will be a confidence boost for the Ducks, but in the same way all the players must be thinking "Why so long? Why couldn't you lead us from the start?"

Oh well, at least that dirtbag Pronger will no longer be wearing that "C"

Actually, Burke had said when Pronger was named captain that he would stay captain even if/when Neidermayer returned.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

So what it actually Burke on the grassy nole?

Again, how does this benefit the Ducks? They signed Matty to replace Scotty. In all likelyhood they will move Matty. Matty is making about $1.25 less than Scotty this season. So we are talking about a few hundred thousand dollars that, in your senario, the Ducks would have saved. All this drama for such little savings? Doesn't add up.

What does add up is that Scotty wasn't 100% about retiring, so the Ducks gave him all the time he wanted to come back, but prepared as if he wasn't. Now, if anything, the Ducks are screwed with trying to move Matty to make room for Scotty.

WOW. Bringhome, this may be the first time in history we are in complete agreement on something. If you read through my posts I've constantly defended Burke and Niedermayer as I don't beleive they conspired to do any of this. The press conference only solidified it for me. Burke seemed sincere in stating he had no idea what Scott was doing.

All the whining and bitching around here is because people are sour that the Ducks just improved their team. Some people are so threatened by the Ducks they've conjured up these conspiracy theories with absolutely ZERO FACTUAL BASIS.

Every single person whining about this has only voiced an opinion that they THINK that Burke and Niedermeyer colluded to do this intentionally. I love Edicius thought that because of the Cup run Niedermayer needed time off and that was part of the basis for all this.

HA. that's so ridiculously stupid. Scott Niedermayer can play 30 minutes a night, since when has that guy needed a break. And as you point out, what benefit did this get the Ducks? Overpaying for Bertuzzi and Schnieder to the point they lost Dustin Penner and have a .500 record? What kind of plan were the Ducks going for here? If you listen to the whiners they'd have us believe the Ducks were intentionally trying to suck just so they could give Niedermayer a rest until he was ready to "tear it up again".

This whole thing is exactly what it sounds like, that Scott just made up his mind last month to start skating and officially told the Club the other day that he's coming back.

Until somebody can prove that something sinister was afoot, all I see are people whining because the Ducks just got better. I'm not skeered! Bring on the Ducks. You gotta beat the best and go through the defending Champs if you want the Cup.

[edicius 3,269]

We've plenty of hearsay and conjecture. Those are kinds of evidence.

:rotflmao:

Where is that from? I know I've heard it before...

[toby91_ca 620]

Scott's a top defenseman, but he's old and he needed to rest after the Cup run.

He was 33 years old at the end of last season.

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

WOW. Bringhome, this may be the first time in history we are in complete agreement on something. If you read through my posts I've constantly defended Burke and Niedermayer as I don't beleive they conspired to do any of this. The press conference only solidified it for me. Burke seemed sincere in stating he had no idea what Scott was doing.

All the whining and bitching around here is because people are sour that the Ducks just improved their team. Some people are so threatened by the Ducks they've conjured up these conspiracy theories with absolutely ZERO FACTUAL BASIS.

Every single person whining about this has only voiced an opinion that they THINK that Burke and Niedermeyer colluded to do this intentionally. I love Edicius thought that because of the Cup run Niedermayer needed time off and that was part of the basis for all this.

HA. that's so ridiculously stupid. Scott Niedermayer can play 30 minutes a night, since when has that guy needed a break. And as you point out, what benefit did this get the Ducks? Overpaying for Bertuzzi and Schnieder to the point they lost Dustin Penner and have a .500 record? What kind of plan were the Ducks going for here? If you listen to the whiners they'd have us believe the Ducks were intentionally trying to suck just so they could give Niedermayer a rest until he was ready to "tear it up again".

This whole thing is exactly what it sounds like, that Scott just made up his mind last month to start skating and officially told the Club the other day that he's coming back.

Until somebody can prove that something sinister was afoot, all I see are people whining because the Ducks just got better. I'm not skeered! Bring on the Ducks. You gotta beat the best and go through the defending Champs if you want the Cup.

It just may be the first time we have agreed. What's that sound? I think hell just froze over!

I really think this could end up hurting the Ducks in the long run more than it is going to help them now. Did anyone else catch how Burke sounded pissed off when someone asked what would happen is Scotty tried to pull this next season? That sounded like a guy who is tired of being left in the dark, and being toyed with.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

It just may be the first time we have agreed. What's that sound? I think hell just froze over!

I really think this could end up hurting the Ducks in the long run more than it is going to help them now. Did anyone else catch how Burke sounded pissed off when someone asked what would happen is Scotty tried to pull this next season? That sounded like a guy who is tired of being left in the dark, and being toyed with.

Agreed. When he was explaining about how he contacted Scott to voice his displeasure about not knowing his plans and having to find out about it through the Canadian media, he did not sound pleased. Now this is either the truth or another elaborate lie by Burke to cover up the whole thing. Sounds pretty far fetched IMO.

Burke seemed sincere to me with everything he said transpired and for the most part, it seemed that Scott really did leave the Ducks completely in the dark. Which of course would eliminate any conspiracy plot betwixt them.

If anything, I could understand how people don't like what Niedermayer did, sort of leaving his team in the lurch. But Burke explicitly said Scott had earned the right in their minds to take as much time as he wished. In the meantime he did what was necessary to protect the team by signing FA replacements and suspending Scott.

[Wings_Fan_In_Exile 3]

I'm bothered by this move too..

But for me, I admit, 90% of it bothering me is because it means the Ducks will be better.

I'm still bitter and I hate the Ducks.

[OsGOD 3]

He was 33 years old at the end of last season.

s*** really? he looked not a day under 68 with is beard... wow

...And the ducks still suck...

Edited December 6, 2007 by OsGOD

[handyandy_101 0]

My big problem with this....

Considering how pissy and moany Burke got with Lowe after the offer sheets that he signed -- an entirely legal maneuvre that some consider to be a loophole -- if this had been any other team in the league doing this, especially a legitimate contender, he'd get all pissed off again and start acting like the gigantic dick that he is. He might even run to his little ***** Bettman and try and find a way to make it illegal, but thats just a theory.

These comments, however, may be coloured by the fact that I hate Burke more than a kick in the balls.