Why isn't Downey playing every night?

[Guest Jeremy88]

I want to know. The guy obviously isn't gonna score goals for us, but neither are Hudler, Kopecky, Drake, etc... Downey plays with more passion than anyone out there it seems like. He's great at getting our team going, he's great at getting the other team overly aggressive to where they mess up, he's great at all of those things. Even if he's out there less than 5 minutes a night, he's still doing more than Drake or Hudler are doing with their 10 minutes a night.

[eva unit zero 271]

Hmm...

Games Hudler has played 12+ minutes (Top-six forward) : 44GP, 7-20-27, +8, 12 PIM

82 game pace: 13-37-50, +15, 22 PIM

Games Hudler has played 9-12 minutes (Third liner): 14 GP, 2-4-6, +4, 4 PIM

82 game pace: 12-23-35, +23, 24 PIM

Games Hudler has played less than 9 minutes (Fourth liner): 7 GP, 2-0-2, -1, 2 PIM

82 game pace: 23-12-37, -12, 24 PIM

Hudler's recent lack of production couldn't be linked to the sudden and unexpected ice time slash he received in the middle of January, could it?

Put the kid back on the second line, I bet he starts scoring again. While the numbers show that Hudler has been most prolific scoring goals as a fourth liner, this is due to one simple fact: If he's on the fourth line, Hudler has nobody to pass the puck to and must create his own opportunities. If he's on a top line, he can use his talents to open space for a linemate and set them up; which he clearly isquite capable of.

I just don't understand why people don't want him in the top six when he shows time and time again that he's capable NOW of being either a finisher or a playmaker on a top-two line.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

The fact that Downey has played at all is a miracle considering how pussified this team has been in recent memory. As for Hudler, he shouldn't be in the regular lineup period. He's fallen off the face of the earth, and I'd rather see both Downey and McCarty in the lineup rather than him.

[NEEDMOREGRIT 12]

The fact that Downey has played at all is a miracle considering how pussified this team has been in recent memory. As for Hudler, he shouldn't be in the regular lineup period. He's fallen off the face of the earth, and I'd rather see both Downey and McCarty in the lineup rather than him.

I agree.I was hoping we could have ditched Hudler at the trade deadline.Now we are stuck with the smallest and softest player in the NHL.Can't score lately either, hes like a tiny Boyd Devereaux.

Would be great to see a Downey-McCarty-Drake line. Fun to watch atleast.

[eva unit zero 271]

The fact that Downey has played at all is a miracle considering how pussified this team has been in recent memory. As for Hudler, he shouldn't be in the regular lineup period. He's fallen off the face of the earth, and I'd rather see both Downey and McCarty in the lineup rather than him.

Hudler has fallen off the face of the earth because Babcock for whatever reason suddenly slashed his ice time in mid January and moved him to the second or third line for basically every game since.

Hasn't anyone else found it odd that a guy who, through mid-January, was one of our top six basically every game, but since the, even though Cleary is out, he's generally been played on the third or fourth line.

I know someone will say 'when did he score a goal last...the answer is mid-January. In the five games immediately before Babcock moved Hudler to the bottom six, Hudler scored a 1-3-4, +1. That works out to about 15 goals and 50 assists over a full season. What about that gets him moved off the scoring line?

[vangvace 12]

I want to know. The guy obviously isn't gonna score goals for us, but neither are Hudler, Kopecky, Drake, etc... Downey plays with more passion than anyone out there it seems like. He's great at getting our team going, he's great at getting the other team overly aggressive to where they mess up, he's great at all of those things. Even if he's out there less than 5 minutes a night, he's still doing more than Drake or Hudler are doing with their 10 minutes a night.

Downey's having a career year. Most NHL games in a season and tied his best for PIM.

However, He's always been a semi-regular and I happy he's gotten the playing time he has.

[Elshupacabra 0]

He isn't playing because he isn't that great.

Yeah, he can fight, but what else?

Detroit isn't a team known for having one dimensional players.

[RyanBarnes! 293]

He isn't playing because he isn't that great.

Yeah, he can fight, but what else?

Detroit isn't a team known for having one dimensional players.

Speaking of one dimensional players. Downey > Hudler for reasons already stated.

[Kp-Wings 3]

I'm surprised Downey has played as long as he has. It's about time someone in this organization realizes the importance that tough guys/enforcers bring to the lineup.

Hopefully Babcock deciding to keep up Mark Hartigan isn't an indication he'll be taking minutes from Downey, because Hartigan is exactly what this team doesn't need. He's a career AHL'er, and brings no special element to the game at all. Downey may have terrible hockey skills, but he brings grit, passion, and the ability to fight, something very few guys on this team have.

As long as Downey plays 5-9 minutes a night, there shouldn't be any problem with him in the lineup. He hasn't been a detriment to the team or cost the Wings any games with one single play, and has helped a lot, in my opinion. I hope the Wings re-sign him in the offseason.

Edited March 1, 2008 by Kp-Wings

[eva unit zero 271]

Speaking of one dimensional players. Downey > Hudler for reasons already stated.

I know you like pluggers who fight but don't have NHL-level skill...

But that is a SEVERELY incorrect assessment as far as what the two players bring to the team.

That's like saying McCarty was more important to the 90s Cup teams than Kozlov or Larionov. Just not true.

[Mors 201]

You can't rely on statistics to constantly to justify Hudler's sudden drop off...the fact that he shows absolutely no grit or determination, on top of the fact that he's tiny, isn't helping his game at all.

I'm not saying Downey should be playing 15 minutes a night, but he should remain in the lineup, because right now he's proving more useful than Hudler. And while we're at it, just because Samuelsson finally took a shot that hit the net, don't expect him to be off the chopping block around here either...

[Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204]

I'm just glad Downey got his chance here.

He should be playing more, but Mike Babcock doesnt know how to use an enforcer, so if he ever gets over 5 minutes in a game, that's alot.

I dont know why Hudler is still in the line-up, at the very least Sammy gets points/goals from time to time, Hudler hasnt had a goal in FOREVER.

[Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204]

I know you like pluggers who fight but don't have NHL-level skill...

But that is a SEVERELY incorrect assessment as far as what the two players bring to the team.

That's like saying McCarty was more important to the 90s Cup teams than Kozlov or Larionov. Just not true.

If I dont understand you correctly, feel free to tell me. But, if your comparing Hudler to Kozlov and Igor.... no soup for you.

[Kp-Wings 3]

I'm just glad Downey got his chance here.

He should be playing more, but Mike Babcock doesnt know how to use an enforcer, so if he ever gets over 5 minutes in a game, that's alot.

I dont know why Hudler is still in the line-up, at the very least Sammy gets points/goals from time to time, Hudler hasnt had a goal in FOREVER.

But... BUT... he's on the 4th line!!!! According to people here, if he was on the 2nd line, he'd be a 30 goal scorer, so then it must be true!

I was so extremely mad when the Wings didn't use their oppurtunity to get rid of Hudler, and I'm getting even more frustrated about it with each passing game. He f***ing sucks. He's never going to do anything productive here, and I'll bet he never does anything productive in his entire NHL career.

It's just too bad the Griffins suck so badly that they don't have anyone they could bring up to replace Hudler and bring some offense. And no, I don't mean Mark Hartigan either.

Edited March 1, 2008 by Kp-Wings

[Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204]

But... BUT... he's on the 4th line!!!! According to people here, if he was on the 2nd line, he'd be a 30 goal scorer, so then it must be true!

I was so extremely mad when the Wings didn't use their oppurtunity to get rid of Hudler, and I'm getting even more frustrated about it with each passing game. He f***ing sucks. He's never going to do anything productive here, and I'll bet he never does anything productive in his entire NHL career.

It's just too bad the Griffins suck so badly that they don't have anyone they could bring up to replace Hudler and bring some offense. And no, I mean Mark Hartigan either.

Honestly... Hartigan brings a bit of energy, Hudler brings..... nothing?

[Kp-Wings 3]

Honestly... Hartigan brings a bit of energy, Hudler brings..... nothing?

I guess if you're looking at it that way...

[Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204]

I guess if you're looking at it that way...

I mean, in the last 20 games, they both bring the same amount of offence (NO GOALS)

[Superman54 91]

Huds is struggling, that is true, But so is the whole team...

Once things begin rolling again, Hudler will start being productive soon enough

As for Downey, I love the guy and wish he got a spot over Kopeckey and Drake, but I doubt that will ever happen... I have hated Kops the most on this team so if Cory Cross were to replace him id still be happy....

[Kp-Wings 3]

I mean, in the last 20 games, they both bring the same amount of offence (NO GOALS)

Yeah, I guess so. It just goes to show the Wings have no secondary scoring at all.

I really can't believe the people who still think Hudler will have a great NHL career. I mean, what is it based off of? AHL numbers? For God sakes, Darryl Bootland scored 27 goals in the AHL, and he is by no means an NHL player. Don MacLean had 56 goals and 88 points that same year, and he's off toiling in Austria!

And going a bit further back, for those who remember, Stacy Roest was one of the Adirondack Red Wings top scorers in the mid-90's, and eclipsed 92 points one year. Yet, where did his NHL career take him? A whopping 244 games between the Wings and Minnesota Wild. So yeah, AHL numbers are certainly an indication of a lenghty NHL career.

Hudler may have skills, but that doesn't mean s***. He's too small, and he's a bad skater. And, unlike other small players in the NHL who are successful, he doesn't play with the passion that those guys do.

I have nothing against small players. Though they are not exactly what the Wings need, I'd take a Marty St. Louis or a Brian Gionta any day of the week, and twice on Sunday's. The reason I don't like Hudler is not because he's small, but that plays a big part into it. I don't like him because he's an extremely one-dimesional hockey player, and if he's not scoring, he's probably the most useless player in the lineup (and that's really embarassing, since Samuelsson also plays on this team).

I can't stand Hudler. If he was producing, I wouldn't say anything about him, but he's not. He may be getting decreased ice time, but he still get's PP time, a lot of it for that matter, as Babcock has seemingly taken a liking to that awful 2nd unit. Maybe if he made the most of those opportunities, Babcock might give him more ice time... *gasp*

[Steve Sample 31]

I find it hard to single out any player right now, they ALL are playing like crap. Hudler can sometimes put the puck in the net but he is way too small to be valuable come playoff time regaurdless of what line he is on. Downey is not a good hockey player and not much better as an enforcer, I have yet to see him win a fight hands down. Other then the top line, Flip, Cleary, and the defence the rest have done nothing for us all year just look at the numbers.

[Guest Jeremy88]

How many times has Downey spurred our team on with his shenanigans??? A bunch. He's awesome for putting energy in the rest of the team. Every time we're struggling, and Downey is in the game...every time he's trying to get something going. He's always trying to spur the team on...and lately, i think that's what we need. If Downey had been in every game this past month, I'm sure we would have won more than 2

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

I find it hard to single out any player right now, they ALL are playing like crap. Hudler can sometimes put the puck in the net but he is way too small to be valuable come playoff time regaurdless of what line he is on. Downey is not a good hockey player and not much better as an enforcer, I have yet to see him win a fight hands down. Other then the top line, Flip, Cleary, and the defence the rest have done nothing for us all year just look at the numbers.

He pounded Slappy to the ice and made him turtle. What else did you want to see him do? Punch someone's head off like Popeye in the cartoons? That was a win hands down in my book.

[esteef 2,679]

He pounded Slappy to the ice and made him turtle. What else did you want to see him do? Punch someone's head off like Popeye in the cartoons? That was a win hands down in my book.

He also smacked Parros around pretty good too.

[sticknmove 0]

The fact that Downey has played at all is a miracle considering how pussified this team has been in recent memory. As for Hudler, he shouldn't be in the regular lineup period. He's fallen off the face of the earth, and I'd rather see both Downey and McCarty in the lineup rather than him.

Agreed and he can take Kopecky with him too. As much as I like both of them they are virtually worthless.

[sticknmove 0]

I find it hard to single out any player right now, they ALL are playing like crap. Hudler can sometimes put the puck in the net but he is way too small to be valuable come playoff time regaurdless of what line he is on. Downey is not a good hockey player and not much better as an enforcer, I have yet to see him win a fight hands down. Other then the top line, Flip, Cleary, and the defence the rest have done nothing for us all year just look at the numbers.

You on dah crack? It could be argues that Downey is the "most improved" heavyweight in the league (rational dissent coming from his below average FM's). You say he hasn't won a fight hands down? Do you watch hockey, it isn't bro. Where there is going to be a tko or ko 60% of the time. Downey has, as you put it, won the majority of his fights "hands down".

Name Ht+/- Wt+/- Outcome

1 Sep 24 NHL Det-TBL Andre Roy -3 -10 Draw

2 Oct 18 NHL Det-SJS Kyle McLaren -3 -10 Win

3 Oct 26 NHL SJS-Det Rob Davison -2 -5 Draw

4 Nov 24 NHL Det-CBJ Jody Shelley -3 -15 Draw

5 Nov 24 NHL Det-CBJ Jared Boll -1 +25 Win

6 Dec 7 NHL Min-Det Todd Fedoruk -1 -25 Draw

7 Dec 31 NHL StL-Det Matt Walker -2 -21 Win

8 Jan 23 NHL Det-Ana Sean O'Donnell -2 -19 Draw

9 Feb 10 NHL Ana-Det George Parros -4 -14 Win

10 Feb 18 NHL Det-Col Ian Laperriere EVEN +15 Win

Totals 5-0-5 118 97-59 47-26