Which teams could you live without

[HenryMalredo 2]

The movement and/or the expansion of hockey teams has little to do with whether the region has "hockey weather" or not, despite what narrow-minded hockey fans say. I mind it hilarious when people suggest that the NHL put teams in third tier areas like Saskatoon, Hartford, Regina, Maine, Halifax, etc. It will never happen. These areas could probably support minor league teams (and some of them do), but they can't support NHL teams. Thats just the way it is. I know sometimes people point to the example of the Green Bay Packers as an example of this working on the Pro level, but Green Bay is an exception to the rule for pro sports. Even with the rising Canadian dollar, if another Canadian team is added, it will be in Ontario, and nowhere else.

[miller76 463]

I am having a hard time understanding people who want to have a team in Vegas. Me I am all for it. But they want to move a team from Phoenix, which actually has a decent fan base. The people in that desert love their teams, and they love hockey. So the people on here that believe to have a quality franchise, you need weather to be s***ty and the temperatures cold, get a reality check! Were not playing pond hockey here!

And if you want to talk about arenas with s***ty ice, then you need to put MSG at the top of your list. I have never known PHX to have anything but a well kept ice surface.

edit:clarity

Edited July 4, 2008 by miller76

[eva unit zero 271]

Re-locate Nashville, Florida, Carolina and Atlanta to;

Winnipeg

Regina or Saskatoon

Halifax or Fredricton

cuz either way in a major Canadian city games will sell out

in the U.S, maybe Milwaukee, Seattle, Somewhere in Maine, Hartford, at least make it places that know hockey and they have weather for it.

Every team in the NHL averages better attendance than the Winnipeg Jets ever did.

Hartford is a worse choice for an NHL team than Ann Arbor would be; the only reason there was ever a team there is that the WHA had to compete for Boston Bruin fans.

Regina, Saskatoon, Halifax, and Fredericton are all too small to support an NHL team. Even if they are in Canada.

The NHL is likely to expand by at most two teams in the foreseeable future. Additional teams may move. Seattle/Portland, Milwaukee/Madison, Houston, Las Vegas, Kansas City, Indianapolis, and Hamilton are by far the most likely destinations for new or relocated teams. Any other suggestions (such as Hartford or Winnipeg) are based on nostalgia, bigotry, or both.

Please note; only one WHA team has survived without relocation. It's also the one that won five Stanley Cups. If the Oilers had never won the Cup, do you think Edmonton has a team right now? No way in hell would there still be a team there given that they almost lost it with all that success.

[Yak19 303]

I said they should have hockey weather year round meaning alot of ppl play it or they just know hockey, either or would do, thats why i didnt mention Phoenix as a team to relocate cuz they have a good fanbase, i agree on Hamilton, Winnipeg would sell out every game now. As for Saskatoon, Regina and Halifax, a guy can dream cant he?

[Yak19 303]

Speaking of Phoenix, McGratten just signed with them, 1-year i believe, the Coyotes are making a goon squad.

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

I would vote for Florida and Atlanta gone also - if this were a poll - gauging from the responses they would be voted off the island first. Although there are several others on the list that would come close....

Two teams in Fla is ridiculous. Atlanta is just a terrible sports market. In fact, save for the Caps I cannot stand the whole SE division. But Tampa and Carolina have somewhat of a fanbase by virtue of their winning Cups (Bettman conspiracy ).

I disagree with the hate for the California teams. Huge population, lots of transplants, hey even tons of Wings fans in Cali. Plus for those of us out West, it means games at reasonable times in the evening.

I am certainly against the expansion idea floating around - moving franchises should be the first solution to having an NHL team in a new city....

[Majsheppard 203]

Nashville to Oklahoma or Kansas city, who cares anywhere is better then Nashville, and Florida to Seattle. Wings to the east, me happy.

[Hiei 192]

Places I could see:

Houston TX - Natural rivalry with Dallas, 4th largest city in the US, Good fanbase in the AHL.

Kansas City MO - Natural rivalry with St. Louis, Sports-oriented society, Arena willing to throw in the kitchen sink for free.

Hamilton/Kitchener ON - After the Turnout with Balsille's stunt, i have no doubt they could support a team. Especially with the Leafs in the ownership/GM/on ice turmoil, this would be a good opportunity to add a playoff-capable team to Hamilton, such as the Predators.

Places that are a bit of a stretch:

Las Vegas NV - Growing city, but their largest arena is about 10,000 seats. Need new arena.

Halifax NS - City about the size of St Louis MO, but their arena is about 10,000.

Seattle WA - Of course proximity to Vancouver would start a rivalry a'la Sonics/Grizzlies, but KeyArena is an issue.

Milwaukee WI - Fanbase loves Badger Hockey, but AHL fanbase low, Arena of good size, but something still lacking.

Portland OR - Not much hockey past to talk of, but the Rose Garden would make an inviting home.

Winnipeg MB - The MTS Centre is well within NHL guidelines, with room to expand. 2 Words: Corporate Support.

Places that are just head-shakers, aka NO.

Hartford CT - Proximity to Boston, plus arena is getting dated. I'd actually prefer Providence over Hartford. RI's first pro franchise.

Quebec PQ - Their arena is getting dated. Plus the corporate support. There has been talk of a new arena being built.

Oklahoma City OK - Corporate Support, plus an NBA team would already stress the city's fanbase. Possible Alternative of TULSA OKLAHOMA (was a potential site for the Penguins) with the new BOK Center (18,000+ for hockey). Fanbase with no major league, Corporate support (Sunoco and Sinclair, among others) and a spanking new arena.

Regina SK - No arena, No corporate. Smaller than Saskatoon.

Saskatoon SK - Arena seats 11,300 for hockey, total metro area 230,000, no corporate.

[FireCaptain 563]

Wow, this theme took a break of about a month and a half. Whew!

Glad we could dredge it up again.

[Guest Shoreline]

I would go with Regina or Saskatoon as well. I'm sure people all over SK would be coming to see it.

Also, I may well be moving there soon so I want to see NHL teams.

The teams that should go are:

Nashhell

Florida

Phoenix

Anaheim (people in Socal only temporarily care about them, until there's an NFL team in LA again, and the Kings would win the fight)

Then there'd be 14 teams East, 12 teams West. Detroit would move to the East, making it 13/13.

Two more teams could come in, one in Saskatoon/Regina/PA, the other Seattle.

Edited July 4, 2008 by Shoreline

[clutchngrab 12]

Nashville to Regina - Just because some half-assed American sportscaster will make the obvious slip.

[Spinner 6]

I can live without Florida, Atlanta and Columbus. I would add Phoenix but I like watching Wayne getting pissed too much. Would still like to see the Wings in the eastern conference tho

[C-TownWing 0]

Hockey is coming along in Northern Ohio. Bowling Green has a good program, and OSU is slowly building a decent team. My kid plays for a Cleveland Youth Hockey Association travel team and the enthusiasm for the sport is encouraging.

One thing I am proud of is that for the most part it seems to be a good experience for the kids and the parents. Most of the teams stress teamwork, positive attitude, etc. Not a lot of t-ball / soccer / hyper-suburban win at all costs attitudes.

Yes, we lost the Lumberjacks / Barons. The Lake Erie Monsters (Avs AHL team) played their first season in Cleveland last year. I went to a couple of games last year that were VERY entertaining with a good turn out. They just need to learn to promote themselves a little more. They did well with their grass roots movement (we got a bunch of discount tickets for the team and lots of t-shirts). The word is getting out there slowly but surely.

Second all this...the Jacks were well supported but just had problems at the top. The Barons were a train wreck from day 1. And now with the Monsters (well-run, knows a couple things about marketing), they had a solid first season at the gate despite a crap team that was killed all year by the Avs' injuries. It'll take a while to undo the Barons' attempts to murder hockey here, but it'll get there.

As for the NHL, probably not right now. It might have worked 10 years ago, it might work 10 years from now, just not at this moment. Cleveland can support 3 major teams, not 4. So basically, an NHL team would have to come in when the Cavs are weak and back to drawing 8K per in the post-LeBron era and would have to be successful early (Cleveland's a good sports city generally, but the lack of championships has made it very bandwagon-ish in a lot of ways).

[C-TownWing 0]

Forgot to add my 2 cents to the topic:

Phoenix and Florida SUCK. So I'm going to give their fans a little bit of a pass. I believe in supporting your team no matter what, but in reality, it usually doesn't work like that unless you're in Toronto or Montreal. Besides, we have to grow the game, right?

I'm surprised nobody's called out the Devils yet. Until this Cup, they were basically co-most successful over the last 15 years with us. And nobody cares about them. It's one thing for a crappy team to not draw, but when it's a team with 3 Cups since 1995? Ouchie.

[BlakChamber 8]

So, according to this thread, the only qualification for having a team is cold weather?

[2probert4 8]

So, according to this thread, the only qualification for having a team is cold weather?

Im going to vote for Nashville again, because I just took a chewing out from one of their dumb fans. This hick said that the Wings bought Hossa because they were scared of the Predators, I asked him why Nashville didnt buy anyone and he said they didnt need anyone, they dont buy free agents. I guess Dumont, Arnott, Ellis, Gelinas, DeVries, Bonk dont count, I suppose. Dumbest fans in hockey without a doubt. Wings are bad for the sport because they are driving up the Cap to where it was before. Sometimes comments dont deserve a comment in return.

[Wings_Toledo 233]

Hockey is coming along in Northern Ohio. Bowling Green has a good program, and OSU is slowly building a decent team. My kid plays for a Cleveland Youth Hockey Association travel team and the enthusiasm for the sport is encouraging.

One thing I am proud of is that for the most part it seems to be a good experience for the kids and the parents. Most of the teams stress teamwork, positive attitude, etc. Not a lot of t-ball / soccer / hyper-suburban win at all costs attitudes.

Yes, we lost the Lumberjacks / Barons. The Lake Erie Monsters (Avs AHL team) played their first season in Cleveland last year. I went to a couple of games last year that were VERY entertaining with a good turn out. They just need to learn to promote themselves a little more. They did well with their grass roots movement (we got a bunch of discount tickets for the team and lots of t-shirts). The word is getting out there slowly but surely.

Good point. I was sad to see the Storm go because I had fun at those games. Even during the pre-season games there was usually a pretty packed house. I've also gone to a few Blue Jackets games and they don't seem to be hurting all that bad with attendance, but they have got to get rid of that stupid cannon.

[betterREDthandead 58]

Regina? Saskatoon?

:lol:

How about Wausau, Wisconsin? DeKalb, Illinois? Ooh! Cedar Rapids! Marquette! Bemidji, Minnesota. And the worst part is, there's some of you who think I'm not joking.

Come on people. Saskatoon is a viable major league market like Peru is a hockey nation. Corporate support my ass.....the problem is NOBODY LIVES THERE!

Even Winnipeg. I can think of about 25 American markets off the top of my head that would make better choices than Winnipeg. Here I go: Milwaukee, Seattle, Houston, Las Vegas, Houston, New Orleans, Hartford, Albany, Grand Rapids, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Kansas City, Wichita, Omaha, Portland, Sacramento, Indianapolis, Louisville, Baltimore, Providence, Austin, Orlando, Jacksonville, Salt Lake City. There. 24 markets with literally hundreds of thousands more people than Winnipeg - in some cases over a million more - and far better corporate support than Winnipeg can offer. Winnipeg is NOT a viable NHL market and never was.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Regina? Saskatoon?

:lol:

How about Wausau, Wisconsin? DeKalb, Illinois? Ooh! Cedar Rapids! Marquette! Bemidji, Minnesota. And the worst part is, there's some of you who think I'm not joking.

Come on people. Saskatoon is a viable major league market like Peru is a hockey nation. Corporate support my ass.....the problem is NOBODY LIVES THERE!

Even Winnipeg. I can think of about 25 American markets off the top of my head that would make better choices than Winnipeg. Here I go: Milwaukee, Seattle, Houston, Las Vegas, Houston, New Orleans, Hartford, Albany, Grand Rapids, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Kansas City, Wichita, Omaha, Portland, Sacramento, Indianapolis, Louisville, Baltimore, Providence, Austin, Orlando, Jacksonville, Salt Lake City. There. 24 markets with literally hundreds of thousands more people than Winnipeg - in some cases over a million more - and far better corporate support than Winnipeg can offer. Winnipeg is NOT a viable NHL market and never was.

Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan is the place for an NHL team.

[Datsyerberger 279]

I'm actually fine with the majority of the southern and west coast teams, and I think moving them somewhere northern, while being easily successful short term, is a long (perhaps quite long, but long) term mistake. Yes, I realize they're not huge hockey markets and that there are larger markets elsewhere (which, by the way, already have teams to support). However, people complain about hockey being a 2nd tier sport and not getting the coverage of other sports, then come out with some elitist attitude where they think hockey shouldn't be around the lower half other continent. Believe it or not, there ARE some hockey fans down here, and some native. Its a small but slowly growing base. And it needs that chance to expand, even if slowly, rather than building upon pre-existing markets for short term gain. And, for the most part, the southern and southwestern teams have a good geographical spread.

Now, that said, there are a couple notable exceptions to this which need to be corrected.

1: Florida or TB. I pick Florida to go. Newer team, no cup, has consistently been a total failure. Also, TB is a fairly successful sports market and fairly centrally located in the peninsula. And there's enough snowbirds, Michigan transplants and so forth in that general area to make it a fairly successful market.

2: California. More specifically, southern California, and even more specifically, the LA area. Two teams in a still young market providing unnecessary competition for eachother. LA or Anaheim? I say ditch Anaheim. LA has more history beside them, and Anaheim's stolen cup be damned.. it's never going to get over that Disney stigma, especially since their logo is a ******* duck.. about the least intimidating critter you could use outside of a pygmy shrew. (Sorry, Duck Guy, by the way.. but I like you, so you can always hang with us Wings fans )

So, Florida and Anaheim. Where to move them to? Northwest coast for one, I'd say.. there's untapped market potential there. The other one to Canada somewhere, plenty of places to choose from there..

And, in the future, expand 2 final teams so it's a 32 team league, thus solving a lot of problems.

Edited July 5, 2008 by The Wheeled Winger

[Electrophile 3,554]

The Hurricanes can't go anywhere. That's the closest team to me and if the Wings play them, that's how I'll see them. However, the following teams can go:

Florida

Tampa Bay

Atlanta

Phoenix

Anaheim

Dallas

Move Florida to Winnipeg. Move Tampa Bay to Wisconsin. Move Atlanta to Indiana. Move Phoenix to Toronto. Move Anaheim to Portland, ME. Move Dallas to one of the Dakotas.

[Electrophile 3,554]

So, according to this thread, the only qualification for having a team is cold weather?

My dad likes to joke that hockey teams shouldn't play where water can't freeze on its own outside in the winter. Maybe there's some truth to it, because in cold-weather climates, hockey is a seasonal sport to play. Not just professionally, but in school, goofing off with your buddies. Just go find a frozen-over pond, grab some gear and you're good to go. I just can't see people playing hockey with frickin' palm trees in the background. It doesn't look right. I'm aware that there are lucrative markets outside that "cold weather" zone that should be explored (or exploited, as it were), and after living in the South for going on 7 years now I can see how there is marginal interest in hockey. But only marginal. If the ASG wasn't in Atlanta this year, I don't think anyone in the city outside of die-hard hockey fans would have even watched the game. I was meandering around that whole area during those few days and saw more Wings jerseys than anyone else's, I thought I was in Detroit. So the interest is coming from the transplants to these regions, not necessarily the natives.

How do we get the natives interested in hockey? I don't know. Out west, the main sport is basketball, in the South it's college football. It's hard to insert something new into that and hope the people take to it. Basically what I'm wondering is if there's a way to compare the financial viability of Dallas or Phoenix to Milwaukee and Indianapolis.

[FireCaptain 563]

I love your rant, but you said Houston twice.

Regina? Saskatoon?

:lol:

How about Wausau, Wisconsin? DeKalb, Illinois? Ooh! Cedar Rapids! Marquette! Bemidji, Minnesota. And the worst part is, there's some of you who think I'm not joking.

Come on people. Saskatoon is a viable major league market like Peru is a hockey nation. Corporate support my ass.....the problem is NOBODY LIVES THERE!

Even Winnipeg. I can think of about 25 American markets off the top of my head that would make better choices than Winnipeg. Here I go: Milwaukee, Seattle, Houston, Las Vegas, Houston, New Orleans, Hartford, Albany, Grand Rapids, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Kansas City, Wichita, Omaha, Portland, Sacramento, Indianapolis, Louisville, Baltimore, Providence, Austin, Orlando, Jacksonville, Salt Lake City. There. 24 markets with literally hundreds of thousands more people than Winnipeg - in some cases over a million more - and far better corporate support than Winnipeg can offer. Winnipeg is NOT a viable NHL market and never was.

[tiff_luvs_homer 5]

Nashville, Phoenix, Ducks, Tampa bay.... and I don't like the Wild but I think they have a good hockey city.

[FireCaptain 563]

Don't try to make this point. You'll be hammered.

If 3/4 of the LGW crew had their way - there would be 26 teams in Canada and 4 in the U.S. (the "Original 4" as it would be called).

So, according to this thread, the only qualification for having a team is cold weather?