Helm up, McCarty tp GR (+ line combos vs Habs)

[12Newf 0]

Silly argument here. I never said getting rid of one of your star premier forwards was smart. That's just silly... I never expected Gretzky to fight when I watched him play (although he did ocassionally), but I knew that he'd have protection if needed. That's all it is.

You can tell those who have played the game and those who have not. Having a guy that's willing to protect you resinates not only throughout the locker room, but on the ice.

It's scary to me to think that Gary Bettman has gotten through to so many of you... Very scary... From the days of ESPN's primetime to a tiny network called Versus, our 'faithful followers' of Bettman will lead us. Pretty soon... NHL, CONGRATULATIONS- PAY PER VIEW ONLY!

sorry pal but ive played hockey since i was 3, and i understand the role of an enforcer but if youre willing to give your tickets away because we dont have a mediocre fighter like mccarty on the team? please.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

They also need energy, which is why Helm is up for one or two games. I'm actually really curious now, were you serious about selling all of your Wings tickets after McCarty was sent down and before an explanation was given? Sounds like a really weird knee-jerk reaction even for a fight fan.

I mean, it's painfully obvious that McCarty will be with the team for the rest of the season for the most part so I don't see why you jumped off the bridge so quickly.

It's not a McCarty thing. To be quite honest, I think Downey would be more benneficial than Darren in the lineup on a needed basis. McCarty is a middleweight at this point in his career at best. I get discouraged more by the mentality than anything of the Red Wings.

I personally can't stand seeing our team quoted in the paper after a game all bruised, beaten, and players like Holmstrom out with injury to his back (obviously taking repeated UNANSWERED beatings doesnt' help in front of the net), quoted as saying "our powerplay is our enforcer". It's the mentality not McCarty specifically. I could think of 30 players in the league that would be more fitting than McCarty in the NHL for that role.

Yes, I did give away my two tickets for December 30th this morning in the 3rd row. I'd rather spend my money in Grand Rapids, and frankly I'll be traveling so much over the Holidays that I'd rather save the drive.

[Frozen-Man 144]

ZzzzzZZzzzZzzz... It's a SLOW day at the office for me, but my goodness I'm not reading that much!

Well thought out, logical, and persuasive post. If you can't argue the facts then you should just say that.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

sorry pal but ive played hockey since i was 3

Can I have your autograph?

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

and players like Holmstrom out with injury to his back (obviously taking repeated UNANSWERED beatings doesnt' help in front of the net)

I suppose we ought to get someone to come along and beat up every defenseman on the other team? And then Holmstrom can just stand in front of the net and not be cross-checked, and no one will try to clear him out of the crease? Is that what would happen?

[Heaton 1]

Well you've sure twisted it and distorted your reality to see what you want to see.

I think I'll take the winning and stuff and you can take the moral victories. Win-win.

Anyway, have fun, I'm off the merry-go-round that comes whenever the words "McCarty" "Downey" "Fighting" or "Enforcer" start it up again.

[up2here 41]

Well thanks for your second grade declaration.

Please do me a favor - keep on deciding who the Detroit Red Wings need and don't need as fans.

Does your overly intelligent self even know why those teams were listed in my post or no? Probably not.

I never said I was overly intelligent and I certainly didnt resort to insults in my post,something a second grader may do.

Edited November 26, 2008 by UP2HERE

[NeverForgetMac25 483]

It's not a McCarty thing. To be quite honest, I think Downey would be more benneficial than Darren in the lineup on a needed basis. McCarty is a middleweight at this point in his career at best. I get discouraged more by the mentality than anything of the Red Wings.

I personally can't stand seeing our team quoted in the paper after a game all bruised, beaten, and players like Holmstrom out with injury to his back (obviously taking repeated UNANSWERED beatings doesnt' help in front of the net), quoted as saying "our powerplay is our enforcer". It's the mentality not McCarty specifically. I could think of 30 players in the league that would be more fitting than McCarty in the NHL for that role.

Yes, I did give away my two tickets for December 30th this morning in the 3rd row. I'd rather spend my money in Grand Rapids, and frankly I'll be traveling so much over the Holidays that I'd rather save the drive.

You don't think Ryan Smyth takes an unanswered beating in front of the net on the PP? Please.

[Esquire 324]

It's not a McCarty thing. To be quite honest, I think Downey would be more benneficial than Darren in the lineup on a needed basis. McCarty is a middleweight at this point in his career at best. I get discouraged more by the mentality than anything of the Red Wings.

I personally can't stand seeing our team quoted in the paper after a game all bruised, beaten, and players like Holmstrom out with injury to his back (obviously taking repeated UNANSWERED beatings doesnt' help in front of the net), quoted as saying "our powerplay is our enforcer". It's the mentality not McCarty specifically. I could think of 30 players in the league that would be more fitting than McCarty in the NHL for that role.

Yes, I did give away my two tickets for December 30th this morning in the 3rd row. I'd rather spend my money in Grand Rapids, and frankly I'll be traveling so much over the Holidays that I'd rather save the drive.

Wait. Are you saying that if the Wings had an enforcer that Holstrom wouldn't be abused so much? Because I'm pretty sure that the reason he gets abused is because he's in the goalies lap most nights.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

I suppose we ought to get someone to come along and beat up every defenseman on the other team? And then Holmstrom can just stand in front of the net and not be cross-checked, and no one will try to clear him out of the crease? Is that what would happen?

Seriously how old are you? Have you watched hockey in the early 80s? You sound like a classic product of the bettman era, like 18-22 years old they're aiming for. And the soccer Moms.

[Frozen-Man 144]

You can tell those who have played the game and those who have not.

Yes, you and the people who agree with you about hockey are the only ones who have every played, everyone else is just guessing based upon NHL2007 video game they play.

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

Seriously how old are you? Have you watched hockey in the early 80s? You sound like a classic product of the bettman era, like 18-22 years old they're aiming for. And the soccer Moms.

You sound like a guy who flings vague ad-hominems around and ignores my point. Right on, old-timer.

[egroen 384]

I could think of 30 players in the league that would be more fitting than McCarty in the NHL for that role.

So can I... but please inform us as to how the Wings go about getting one of them and fit him on the team given the salary cap predicament.

[Frozen-Man 144]

Seriously how old are you? Have you watched hockey in the early 80s? You sound like a classic product of the bettman era, like 18-22 years old they're aiming for. And the soccer Moms.

You know they also used to use sticks that were made of wood and had no curve. Also goalies didn't have masks and there were no helmets. I guess if the Wings reverted back to those things we would be a lock for the Cup. The NHL of 2008 is NOT the NHL of 1980. That is really bad in some ways and really good in others but the REALITY for Holland and Babcock is playing the game under today's structure, setting, rules, interpretations, and style. A team that played like they did in the 80's would never be out of the box. If you don't like how the GAME is played now that is fine (there are things that I don't like about it) but the Wings are going to play a 2008 style game, win lots of games, lots of President's Cups and probably a few Stanley Cups.

[The Secret 304]

Shouldn't you swap your Bob Probert Avatar for Sid the kid?

Get into the new millenium soon or you will miss it man. Probie did his thing in a different era, playing a very different game. And how many times did Laraque, from the 4th line, have to go out and protect Sid, on the 1st line? ... the answer is 0.

I'm all for a tougher presence, I enjoy a good tussle. But, McCarty, God bless him, is a shadow of his former self. He fights, if thats what you want to call it, but it brings nothing to our current game. Downey, although I'm sure is a fantastic guy, can't play hockey and he is a terrible fighter. If we could add a tough power guy like Lucic, who can hit/fight/score, then we'd all be happy but that is not an option. Helm brings more to the game then Downey or McCarty can. f***, even if Laraque was in the game tonight, how much ice-time do you think he would get against us? Let alone how many times would they put him out against Hossa, or Zetterberg? Think about it.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

I'm beginning to think I'm too old for this board. Seriously. To think I thought Bettman was a horrid Business minded GM, not HOCKEY minded gm... and that he wasn't getting through to the kids out there. Apparently he is. Yikes, NHL is in more trouble than I thought if this is true.

Is there an age limit at this board? Like 25 and under? Seriously, it's so evident.

[b.shanafan14 733]

As much as I appreciate Mac's fisticuffs lately, this is a great move. This is replacing a guy you will play for 4 minutes with a guy that has the potential to add a lot of speed and maybe break out that 3rd line if he is put with Flip and Huds. Love this move.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

You know they also used to use sticks that were made of wood and had no curve. Also goalies didn't have masks and there were no helmets. I guess if the Wings reverted back to those things we would be a lock for the Cup. The NHL of 2008 is NOT the NHL of 1980. That is really bad in some ways and really good in others but the REALITY for Holland and Babcock is playing the game under today's structure, setting, rules, interpretations, and style. A team that played like they did in the 80's would never be out of the box. If you don't like how the GAME is played now that is fine (there are things that I don't like about it) but the Wings are going to play a 2008 style game, win lots of games, lots of President's Cups and probably a few Stanley Cups.

They also used to sell out the Joe even know they had losing seasons too... What's your point? The Joe sounds like a funeral anymore.

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Get into the new millenium soon or you will miss it man. Probie did his thing in a different era, playing a very different game. And how many times did Laraque, from the 4th line, have to go out and protect Sid, on the 1st line? ... the answer is 0.

I'm all for a tougher presence, I enjoy a good tussle. But, McCarty, God bless him, is a shadow of his former self. He fights, if thats what you want to call it, but it brings nothing to our current game. Downey, although I'm sure is a fantastic guy, can't play hockey and he is a terrible fighter. If we could add a tough power guy like Lucic, who can hit/fight/score, then we'd all be happy but that is not an option. Helm brings more to the game then Downey or McCarty can. f***, even if Laraque was in the game tonight, how much ice-time do you think he would get against us? Let alone how many times would they put him out against Hossa, or Zetterberg? Think about it.

I agree with the Lucic point. Lucic would be the ultimate presence on the Red Wings.

[Pskov Wings Fan 71]

It has nothing to do with the fight itself. Sure, they're entertaining, but it's for protection. If you've known anything about the origins of hockey, fighting was a direct result of protection for star players. Howe was one of the nastiest fighters there was in Old Olympia Stadium. Take out protection and self policing and there will be some of the worst stick work you've ever seen.

It'll quickly become a Sean Avery dominated league.

And how exactly two fighters fighting would prevent hits on star players? It is usually not the fighters doing the hitting and more likely than not they would not answer the call to fight. I think fear of retaliation against your team's star players does a lot more to protect said star players than fighting.

I guess it is a matter of personal taste, I prefer to see team, which makes the opponent look silly rather trying to beat them to a pulp.

[Johnny Law 15]

I'm beginning to think I'm too old for this board. Seriously. To think I thought Bettman was a horrid Business minded GM, not HOCKEY minded gm... and that he wasn't getting through to the kids out there. Apparently he is. Yikes, NHL is in more trouble than I thought if this is true.

Is there an age limit at this board? Like 25 and under? Seriously, it's so evident.

[/size]GET OFF MY LAWN !!!!!

If you are the hockey oracle you seem to think you are what are you doing here ? The Stars need you !

Edited November 26, 2008 by Johnny Law

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Anyone want tickets to the December 30th game against chicago for free, btw?

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

I'm beginning to think I'm too old for this board. Seriously. To think I thought Bettman was a horrid Business minded GM, not HOCKEY minded gm... and that he wasn't getting through to the kids out there. Apparently he is. Yikes, NHL is in more trouble than I thought if this is true.

Is there an age limit at this board? Like 25 and under? Seriously, it's so evident.

And it's pretty evident you are acting well under the age of 25 with your insults of people.

Nobody's forcing you to stay on here.

[whatNext? 0]

Well you've sure twisted it and distorted your reality to see what you want to see.

I think I'll take the winning and stuff and you can take the moral victories. Win-win.

Anyway, have fun, I'm off the merry-go-round that comes whenever the words "McCarty" "Downey" "Fighting" or "Enforcer" start it up again.

Ya I head ya, I am off the merry go round when it comes to the words "lets add another mid sized, par winger to the roster."

So I guess we are the same on that front - the merry go round front.

And while I am on the topic I would love to point out the scholars who rebuttal is "ya, why don't we blow the team up, and start the team from scratch with guys like Prust, Parros, Big George, etc." Because you know that's clearly what we are arguing for.

Get a grip, and take a look at the teams that do well, including the Red Wings, over the past five years. They have one thing in common, they are well rounded.

That is my only point, I am not calling for bench clearing brawls, blood or anything else some of you like to spout off in a fountain of gibberish.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

I'm beginning to think I'm too old for this board. Seriously. To think I thought Bettman was a horrid Business minded GM, not HOCKEY minded gm... and that he wasn't getting through to the kids out there. Apparently he is. Yikes, NHL is in more trouble than I thought if this is true.

Is there an age limit at this board? Like 25 and under? Seriously, it's so evident.

Awww, I hope you don't leave. You're more perfect for this board than you realize.

Lots of hyperbole and histrionics over a minor roster move. We do that here better than anyone else, and I'm not kidding.

I tend to believe Babcock when he says they want Helm's energy in the lineup. Mac is slow and a shadow of his former self. And if people think this is a front office move forced onto Babcock, I really doubt he would continue coaching here if he had that little control over his roster, especially the season after winning a Stanley Cup.

Edited November 26, 2008 by haroldsnepsts