Mike Green, are we looking at a new Norris Winner

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

First off, I'd take Nick over anyone if I had 1 game. But it's hard to argue the talent that is Mike Green.

19 goals, 46 points in just 41 games! +21

Right now, at 36 points and less than 30 games to play Nick will need to average almost a point a game just to crack the 60 point mark, which would be relatively low for him.

I don't think anyone would argue Nick isn't the best defender in the league. But we also know the Norris is one of those flukey awards, like the Selke, that doesn't always go to the right guy. I think it's safe to say during his streak, nobody has really challenged Nick. But that's because Nick's numbers have been there on the offensive side.

If he finishes 5th, 6th, 7th in scoring and Mike Green picks up 70+ points and 20+ goals, with his +/-, I think it'll be hard for him not to win it. I don't see Markov overtaking him. I don't see Wideman getting the recognition. Souray won't win it. Boyle? I doubt it. Rafalski? How could you pick him over Green should the numbers remain close?

I'd rather have the Cup than the Norris of course. Just wanted to hear some thoughts.

Who do you think would win the Norris if the season ended today?

Who do you think will win it if everybody in the hunt continues at their current pace?

I know who we all think should win it. But that may very well not happen this year.

[hillbillywingsfan 794]

First off, I'd take Nick over anyone if I had 1 game. But it's hard to argue the talent that is Mike Green.

19 goals, 46 points in just 41 games! +21

Right now, at 36 points and less than 30 games to play Nick will need to average almost a point a game just to crack the 60 point mark, which would be relatively low for him.

I don't think anyone would argue Nick isn't the best defender in the league. But we also know the Norris is one of those flukey awards, like the Selke, that doesn't always go to the right guy. I think it's safe to say during his streak, nobody has really challenged Nick. But that's because Nick's numbers have been there on the offensive side.

If he finishes 5th, 6th, 7th in scoring and Mike Green picks up 70+ points and 20+ goals, with his +/-, I think it'll be hard for him not to win it. I don't see Markov overtaking him. I don't see Wideman getting the recognition. Souray won't win it. Boyle? I doubt it. Rafalski? How could you pick him over Green should the numbers remain close?

I'd rather have the Cup than the Norris of course. Just wanted to hear some thoughts.

Who do you think would win the Norris if the season ended today?

Who do you think will win it if everybody in the hunt continues at their current pace?

I know who we all think should win it. But that may very well not happen this year.

well i agree with you on this but to hear those boobs yesterday said Chara has already won it.

[GMRwings1983 8,804]

Green should win the Selke trophy, not the Norris.

I don't care how good his plus/minus is (thanks to Ovechkin), but he's horrible in his own zone. It would be a travesty to give this award out to some kid who is incompetent as a defenseman.

I think Chara right now is the front runner, primarily because Boston has sucked for 10 years, and all of a sudden they're now good and he's their captain. Unfortunately, just for that they'll give him the Norris.

Lidstrom needs to put on a great run and hope that some of those other guys get injured for him to win the Norris.

[T-Ruff 47]

I think Chara right now is the front runner, primarily because Boston has sucked for 10 years, and all of a sudden they're now good and he's their captain. Unfortunately, just for that they'll give him the Norris.

I think Chara is the front-runner as well but because he deserves to be.... Perhaps Lidstrom's slow start contributed to this, but I won't be outraged like many here will be if (when) Chara wins it

[34Legace34 0]

I don't care how good his plus/minus is (thanks to Ovechkin), but he's horrible in his own zone. It would be a travesty to give this award out to some kid who is incompetent as a defenseman.

I was wondering about this. I havent seen much of Green, Is he really THAT bad in his own end, or is he just average? Clearly his +/- is inflated because of his point totals. I like the thought of having this guy around at next year's olympics for Canada, but if he is not responsible in his own end than you might as well not invite him to camp. My buddy and I were at the Knights game Friday watching John Carlson play, this guy is also very offensive minded (drafted 15-25ish in the 08 draft) once he arrives in Washington they will have lots of firepower on the back end.

[Reds4Life 51]

Green is atrocious defensively. He's not gonna win Norris until he gets a LOT better in his own zone.

History proves defensive play is really important to win a Norris. I can't see Green winning it over Chara or Lids.

Edited February 9, 2009 by Reds4Life

[Datsyerberger 279]

I don't drop this one down often, but Mike Green is a perfect definition of a 4th forward. If you factor in defensive play, he's about as deserving for the Norris as Ovy is for a Selke.

[SweWings 45]

Green is a great kid but Chara seems like a fair choice this season. Obviously I want Lids to win it but I'm not going to complain too much if Chara gets it.

[egroen 384]

Green needs to put up Coffey-like numbers to win the Norris, though he might get a nomination just on his points alone.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Green needs to put up Coffey-like numbers to win the Norris, though he might get a nomination just on his points alone.

Yeah, that's sort of the point I was making. We've all seen dmen win it that we were fairly certain only did so because of offensive numbers. Seeing as how nobody puts up Coffey like numbers anymore, if a dman can put up 70-80 points and 20-25 goals, that may very well be "coffey like" in today's era.

I don't know anything of Green's defensive play as I don't watch the Caps.

I totally forgot about Chara. You can't really argue that he can dominate all around the ice. He's as good an all around dman as there is. I think I would be just fine with him winning it. Of course I desperately want Nick to win it.

Yup, that's GS&T being a homer. You saw it here first folks.

[BeeRYCE 2]

Combining offensive input, time on ice, overall effectiveness on their respective team, PK time, powerplay time, all of the above... The award goes to Jay Bouwmeester.

[C-TownWing 0]

Yeah, that's sort of the point I was making. We've all seen dmen win it that we were fairly certain only did so because of offensive numbers. Seeing as how nobody puts up Coffey like numbers anymore, if a dman can put up 70-80 points and 20-25 goals, that may very well be "coffey like" in today's era.

I don't know anything of Green's defensive play as I don't watch the Caps.

I totally forgot about Chara. You can't really argue that he can dominate all around the ice. He's as good an all around dman as there is. I think I would be just fine with him winning it. Of course I desperately want Nick to win it.

Yup, that's GS&T being a homer. You saw it here first folks.

I could definitely see Green winning a couple eventually, just on offense. While no D is going to touch Coffey's usual 100 points/year or so in the near future, the Norris still has a pretty tight correlation with "defenseman scoring leader" most of the time. It's why people occasionally bring up the idea of a defensive defenseman award, because the Norris almost always goes to someone putting up numbers, regardless of defensive play.

That said, it's Chara's to lose this year. As disappointing as that is (I want Nick to take a run at Orr's 8 before he's done), I can't legitimately argue it, he's having a great year.

[Datsyerberger 279]

Lidstrom is still the front-runner in my homer mind, but if not him, than almost certainly Chara. I'd like to say someone like Keith, but Norris-caliber defensemen do not lose an edge making a simple play on the puck in the neutral zone giving up a breakaway in which the opposing team scores (to anyone that watched that Van/Chi game the other night...)

There's definitely some good up and coming young players, but for me it goes something like:

Lidstrom

Chara

Everyone else.

[Guest Shoreline]

It is a toss-up between Chara and Green, and I would go Green merely because I've watched games with him in it and he is just fine defensively. If he was much of a liability it would reflect in his play and his +/-. These last two seasons he's improved immensely on his defensive play, however, it is usually the higher scorers who win the Norris, with +/- taken into account. Given both of those, Green is the runaway winner. If Chara wins it isn't because he sucks -- he is good -- but it would definitely be the "celebrity" edge, which would sour the Norris selections in my eyes. So far, it's Green's to lose.

Edited February 9, 2009 by Shoreline

[egroen 384]

The problem for Chara is a lot of Boston fans think Wideman is having a better year.

I don't think there are many who watch the Red Wings every game and think Rafalski is having a better year than Lidstrom.

Could some of the votes get split between Wideman and Chara? Sort of like I bet some Selke votes were split beween Datsyuk and Zetterberg last year.

[up2here 41]

Combining offensive input, time on ice, overall effectiveness on their respective team, PK time, powerplay time, all of the above... The award goes to Jay Bouwmeester.

Due to having 3 Panthers on my fantasy team I have found myself watching a lot of Florida games this year. Bouwmeester seems to have taken a step back this year from last,way too many bone head plays. I havent seen Green play enough to pass judgement but his numbers look pretty damn good.

Edited February 9, 2009 by UP2HERE

[Donaldjr2448 43]

Mike Green is another Mathieu Schneider! Great Offensive skill, but not all that great on D. I have noticed he turns the puck over alot, just like Schnd's did! I think that Greens numbers are helped by the fact that he is on the PP with Ovechkin and Feds!!

I would say that Chara is decent, but Tim Thomas has bailed him out quite a few times as well.

I would say the race is between Chara and Lidstrom, but I think in the end Lidstrom will win it again.

[egroen 384]

Mike Green is literally Washington's 4th or 5th option on the penalty kill. That does not scream good defense to me.

If I was voting, it would take a lot of points to outweigh someone who was a #1 or #2 PK option for their team. If Lidstrom had 60 points and Green had 80, I would still go with Lidstrom -- now if Green had 90 pts, then I start seriously considering him.

Unfortunately, I do not have a vote, and we see someone like Phaneuf get runner-up last year.

[Echolalia 2,961]

I don't think Green has an argument for defensive play, which, last time I checked, is what the Norris is primarily concerned with. Chara is a different story, although I wouldn't be surprised to see either take home the Norris at the end of the year. Voters may want to apply parity to the award shows as well, which means Lidstrom is last in the running in that regard. He is also playing with a Stanley Cup winning team, so many will argue that he has a lot of help, while the likes of Chara and Green last year were playing golf through most of spring. I don't agree with these arguments, but I half expect people to use this type of logic.

[Blueliner 69]

I think Lidstrom is the best defenseman I've ever watched. It's all the simple thinks he does. He does do any of the fancy things like throwing hard checks or a 100 mph shot. Most guys in the league like Chara, Souray, Weber, Phanuef need to rely on those things to be affective. Lidstrom doesn't have to use any of that. Again it's the little things he does. How many times have you seen him bat the puck out of the air along the boards when the opponent tries to chip it past him. It's pretty much impossible to get around him. Just look at the last couple of games. Guys like Ovechkin, Malkin, Crosby went one-on-one with him and they lost each time.

[esteef 2,679]

Well it certainly won't be evil Lidstrom with his spolied brat, elitist, too good for the ASG, vacation taking ass!

esteef

edit: forgot "evil"

Edited February 9, 2009 by esteef

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Mike Green leads ALL NHL Dmen in Giveaways. Hes 3rd overall in the NHL in giveaways with 61.

[LeftWinger 5,153]

...if Green or Chara, or anyone for that matter that is not named Lidstrom, win it, it is ONLY because Nick has played like a human this season. That's ok, spread it around, there's always next year, besides I think Nick would rather have a different trophy...

[mjlegend 155]

Green has a lot of time over the next decade to improve his D zone game.

J. Bouw is turning the puck over a lot and is 18 points out of the points lead for defencemen on a team that's not making the playoffs.

It comes down to Chara, Lidstrom and Boyle, with maybe Andrei Markov thrown in. I'd even put Keith over Bouwmeester.

[MacK_Attack 108]

I think Chara has been the best all-around defenceman in the league this year. The Norris is his to lose, IMO.