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Detroit Lions 2009 Thread

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Can you blame them? What have the people-paid-to-perform-on-the-sidelines done to prove they know more than me? I could build an 0-16 football team easy.

That's just it. The moment you go 0-16, you open yourself up. That's the point where absolutely no human being in the world could have done worse than they did. You, me, anyone, could have coached, quarterbacked, or managed that team to 0-16.

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the team did not go 0-16 with this coaching staff. can those of you complaining about last season please wait to see what happens this year before you write off the new coaches and their personnel? i don't understand why some people are quick to hang these people before they've even stepped onto the field in a game that matters with this franchise.

admit it, several of you are ranting to hear your own voice, or because you feel you need to vent frustrations from the past and project them forward. give me a break... the past is exactly that, the past. let it die. see what happens this season and then you can draw your conclusions based on facts.

i'm not claiming to be the voice of reason or better than anyone here. i just have a difficult time being patient with those of you that want to cry foul every chance you get, for the simple fact that you seem to enjoy complaining.

to those of you that know you fit this bill, please feel free not to respond. i'm not intending to debate the obvious here and i certainly don't think its my place to change anyone, or that i have the power to if i could. i'm expressing an opinion that i know has been shared here time and again... these people who lurk around LGW to introduce a pessimistic viewpoint on just about everything if/when given the chance... they can find a new place to dwell, as far as i'm concerned.

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I HATE these picks!!!!!! I agree on Red's arguments on Stafford 100%. What a joke! The pick that pissed me off the most is that safety from WMU. Schwartz was talking about getting a key LB in the draft, and then you take a friken TE, and safety when Big Rey is sitting right there! Yeah we took that Wisky LB, but I've never heard of him hardly, and I follow Big Ten football pretty darn close.

It just really pisses me off we are going to waste our time with another QB for that much money when we could have signed Curry (another need) for way less money.

I will say Derrick Williams is an intriguing pick.

Edited by mannysBETTER3434

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It just really pisses me off we are going to waste our time with another QB for that much money when we could have signed Curry (another need) for way less money.

this is certainly a point of contention but i want to let it play out and see what happens.

the money part is undeniable... something needs to change.

quick observation... although immediate NEEDS weren't filled as most would have made the decision to address, let's not forget that we have secured 3 players rated #1 in their respective positions with this draft.

if that doesn't help, maybe some of you should take a look at oakland and be glad you're not trying to make sense of their team at this point.

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the team did not go 0-16 with this coaching staff. can those of you complaining about last season please wait to see what happens this year before you write off the new coaches and their personnel? i don't understand why some people are quick to hang these people before they've even stepped onto the field in a game that matters with this franchise.

admit it, several of you are ranting to hear your own voice, or because you feel you need to vent frustrations from the past and project them forward. give me a break... the past is exactly that, the past. let it die. see what happens this season and then you can draw your conclusions based on facts.

i'm not claiming to be the voice of reason or better than anyone here. i just have a difficult time being patient with those of you that want to cry foul every chance you get, for the simple fact that you seem to enjoy complaining.

to those of you that know you fit this bill, please feel free not to respond. i'm not intending to debate the obvious here and i certainly don't think its my place to change anyone, or that i have the power to if i could. i'm expressing an opinion that i know has been shared here time and again... these people who lurk around LGW to introduce a pessimistic viewpoint on just about everything if/when given the chance... they can find a new place to dwell, as far as i'm concerned.

No. I used to look forward to every football season. Every year I'd give the Lions the benefit of the doubt, and I would truly believe that the next season would be better than the previous season. That changed after two seasons of matt millen. And after last year there's no way I'm ever giving this organization the benefit of the doubt again. The Lions are my team, and I hope they do well, but they are a s*** franchise from top to bottom, and I have zero faith in everything they do now.

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the team did not go 0-16 with this coaching staff. can those of you complaining about last season please wait to see what happens this year before you write off the new coaches and their personnel? i don't understand why some people are quick to hang these people before they've even stepped onto the field in a game that matters with this franchise.

You'll notice hardly anything has been said in criticism of the new coaching staff. Jim Schwartz, ultimately, is not in charge of the drafting decisions. Martin Mayhew has final say. And Martin Mayhew was a key contributor to the 0-16 mess. Good lord, if we can't say bad things about the team after a season in which they don't win a game, when can we?

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maybe its better put this way, and perhaps i should have just left it at this to begin with:

***** about last season immediately after it ends and perhaps a few days later... but if you're still stuck in yesterday... GET OVER IT.

if this team and franchise is so pointless and a lost cause to some of you... why would you even take time to express yourself in an online forum? if there's no longer value in following the lions, then move along and make more room for people who actually want to discuss the good, bad, and indifferent... NOT just the negative universe some of you choose to focus on obsessively.

________________________________

09/10 hasn't even begun and we have no basis for damning players that haven't even played a down in a lions uniform, period.

this opinion isn't directed at anyone particular... just that people who can't find one good thing to say should just shut their mouth altogether. there's more than enough of those types on the freep.com and detnews.com boards if you're looking for like minded bashers, please do us all a favor and leave criticism reserved for areas where it may be warranted and only if its based on fact... nobody ever said critical opinions weren't welcome but some of you dance around here, spouting off your BS about how you disowned this or that team, only to find you still lurking (or more confusing yet, posting) on this board.

if you've given up... nobody is standing in your way... feel free to leave anytime. for those of you who choose to look at life more realistically, thanks for your valuable input and i look forward to hearing your informed takes on this upcoming season.

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maybe its better put this way, and perhaps i should have just left it at this to begin with:

***** about last season immediately after it ends and perhaps a few days later... but if you're still stuck in yesterday... GET OVER IT.

if this team and franchise is so pointless and a lost cause to some of you... why would you even take time to express yourself in an online forum? if there's no longer value in following the lions, then move along and make more room for people who actually want to discuss the good, bad, and indifferent... NOT just the negative universe some of you choose to focus on obsessively.

________________________________

09/10 hasn't even begun and we have no basis for damning players that haven't even played a down in a lions uniform, period.

this opinion isn't directed at anyone particular... just that people who can't find one good thing to say should just shut their mouth altogether. there's more than enough of those types on the freep.com and detnews.com boards if you're looking for like minded bashers, please do us all a favor and leave criticism reserved for areas where it may be warranted and only if its based on fact... nobody ever said critical opinions weren't welcome but some of you dance around here, spouting off your BS about how you disowned this or that team, only to find you still lurking (or more confusing yet, posting) on this board.

if you've given up... nobody is standing in your way... feel free to leave anytime. for those of you who choose to look at life more realistically, thanks for your valuable input and i look forward to hearing your informed takes on this upcoming season.

I agree on giving coaches, players, management a chance. I will do that, BUT I think it is fine to criticize this team. With Marenelli, and now Schwartz we were promised we would be "blue collared", "pounding the ball", and "mean". If you want to do this you need to build from the trenches, and go out from there. They have hardly addressed this at all over the past several years. Instead of getting the hard nosed big fellas every year we fall in love with the "can't miss" QB, and "game changing WR's".

I understand the Lions could draft any position this year since every place on the field needs help, but if you want to put your stamp on the future you need to do things different IMO. Like I said above Schwartz said he wanted a big time LB, and not only do we skip out on Curry, but also Manaluga, Laurenitis, etc later on. Yes, we got Follet, and Levy but I would rather have the others listed above.

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I understand the Lions could draft any position this year since every place on the field needs help, but if you want to put your stamp on the future you need to do things different IMO. Like I said above Schwartz said he wanted a big time LB, and not only do we skip out on Curry, but also Manaluga, Laurenitis, etc later on. Yes, we got Follet, and Levy but I would rather have the others listed above.

you would be hard pressed to find somebody who can PRESENTLY make a case for how passing up the players you mentioned was a good idea, yet i believe there must be reasons based on information we are not privy to at this point. we don't have and likely will not have the full story. this might be a case of scouts being outplayed, and at the same time their picks might end up being a great investment. its fair to say that nobody knows for certain until their play speaks for itself on the field, and probably not before a season or two since it sometimes takes that long to develop.

bottom line, none of these people have played in the NFL and they all deserve their respective opportunities to impress the fans/critics.

if i have an impression at all from the lions, i would honestly say there were two things that have stuck out (in my opinion): (1) too much money given to stafford, yet i realize that's the nature of the beast in a non-rookie cap atmosphere. (2) i'll admit to my bias but i would have absolutely loved seeing oher as a lion... so i was obviously jaded when they passed on him (as i know several of you were, too).

all that being said... let's see what some of these kids do in the next season or two and then we'll have the basis we need to make solid claims, for better or worse.

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good insights from everyone that posted. Pretty much sum up what i was thinking on draft day. I left work and raced home to catch the draft (was glad that the wings first round was over so i could focus on the draft)...knew that Stafford was gonna be first and honestly, i hope it works out for him in detroit. I am not thrilled about it but even next year, i wouldnt be thrilled about it. the 20th and 33rd overall picks really bug me. Schwartz came on from Tennessee, which is known for building a team FROM THE INSIDE OUT, and came here stating...WE ARE GONNA BUILD A TEAM FROM THE INSIDE OUT...and what happens. A TE and a Safety.

Pettigrew is very good TE but i agree with a previous poster in that it is a luxury to have a good TE, not a way to rebuild your team. Not when you have Oher on the board. You pick oher, move backus to guard and suddenly your offense line is respectable. As far as Delmas, yes he is a good safety from a small school so you have no idea what your getting. He reminds me of a Bob Sanders type player but adds one more thing to this defense that we seem to have enough already. GUYS THAT MISS TACKLES. Melauga or even Laurinitius would have been a steal at the ILB position and both would tackle well for this team. This was a great linebacker draft and to get one of these guys in the early 2nd round should be illegal.

I am beginning to think that Mayhew is the puppet master behind Millen because this draft just seems like a Matt Millen run draft. I dont see where this team is gonna be anything but mediocre from here on out. That being said i will still watch and still yell at the TV screen over this team. I just wish that someday in my lifetime that this team is not the laughing stock of the NFL. I am only 30 so i believe i still have plenty of time.

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I just want to highlight a few key points from this draft.

TE's drafted: 2

ILB's drafted: 0

I really don't understand the selection of a TE with that last pick. OK, it's the last pick, 99% chance it means nothing, but I think it's a symptom of a totally directionless draft. Lack of tight end depth was not really a major cause of 0-16. If you're so high on Pettigrew that you ignore massive holes on defense and the O-line to get him, what on earth do you need another TE for?

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I really don't understand the selection of a TE with that last pick. OK, it's the last pick, 99% chance it means nothing, but I think it's a symptom of a totally directionless draft. Lack of tight end depth was not really a major cause of 0-16. If you're so high on Pettigrew that you ignore massive holes on defense and the O-line to get him, what on earth do you need another TE for?

definitely a mystery... only rational explanation is special teams but even that's in the air.

i doubt they're going to deal any of their existing TEs to make room behind pettigrew but its hard to say what they're doing exactly. we'll hopefully know more after camp.

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I really don't understand the selection of a TE with that last pick. OK, it's the last pick, 99% chance it means nothing, but I think it's a symptom of a totally directionless draft. Lack of tight end depth was not really a major cause of 0-16. If you're so high on Pettigrew that you ignore massive holes on defense and the O-line to get him, what on earth do you need another TE for?

If anyone listened to Karsch and Anderson this morning, it's exactly like they said. A TE is a LUXURY pick. It's something you pick when you have a solid offense to build around. The Lions have far from that. And besides, their defense is still abysmal. If they would have gone Curry/Manaluga (sp?), our defense would be exponentialy better and we might stand a chance of winning 6, 7 ,8. maybe more games . Now, I see them winning 1 if they are lucky against STL.

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Here is my draft.

1. Stafford. Don't know what to think about him, but I understand we were 0-16, and need a face for the franchise.

20. Oher. Did you see that guy when he got drafted? Kid has been to hell and back, and that doesn't mean he is a lock to be good, but you know he'll give it his all, and it gives us 2 first round picks on the OL.

33. Manaluga. We get a real good LB to join Peterson, and Sims. I agree with Timothy here. Getting a guy like this in the 2nd round is a crime.

76. Rashad Johnson from Alabama. Then we have our safety, and he is real good value at the pick.

82. Derrick Williams. Like I said I think this pick is intriguing. We could have a poor man's Hester here, and I think he fills the spot where Furrey was.

115. I have no idea about this Sammie Lee Hill guy, and I think everyone else is in this boat as well. So I guess keep him there. I do think if they wanted this position a guy like Terrence Taylor would be smarter, but Lee Hill has 20+ pounds, and a good 3 inches on Taylor. On the other hand Taylor played in the Big 10, and Lee Hill is from D2.

174. This Aaron Brown sounds like another Derrick Williams except more injury prone. Why not trade up a round, and draft Javon Ringer? Then you got a change of pace RB that can compliment Smith's speed. I will say if he doesn't get hurt it could be a interesting pick. He was very good his freshmen/sophomore years of college.

The other picks are a crap shoot so I guess I have no complaints, because everyone at that point is looking for diamonds in the rough.

This is just my opinion here. I understand a single guy has not played in the NFL, and the Lions draft could end up 100 times better then my opinion. Just thought I would share.

Edited by mannysBETTER3434

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174. This Aaron Brown sounds like another Derrick Williams except more injury prone. Why not trade up a round, and draft Javon Ringer? Then you got a change of pace RB that can compliment Smith's speed. I will say if he doesn't get hurt it could be a interesting pick. He was very good his freshmen/sophomore years of college.

I'm not really complaining about the Brown pick too much. I think you can never have too much RB depth and you should probably pick one up at least every other draft. I will say, if they wanted a running back, there wasn't even any need to trade up - they could have just stayed where they were and not traded their 6th-round pick to the Broncos (they got a 5th-rounder next year for it - no biggy) and gotten either Ringer or Ced Peerman, both of which are surely better than this Brown character.

That said, though, the more chances to bump Aveion Cason off the roster for the 8th or 9th time, the better.

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I like move. My only concern is Foote is going from a talented 3-4 defense to a not so talented 4-3 defense. Still worth the pickup. I wish it was a longer contract tho.

I agree on your 3-4 vs. 4-3 concerns. I have the same, but he has got to be better then whoever was there before right?! The one year deal is bad for the Lions but good for Foote. He is trying to max out his value for a final, loaded contract. I would bet if things go well with this he will stick around because of his love for the D.

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