Nightfall 871 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 This discussion was brought about in another thread so I am giving it life here and to see what the Red Wings community thinks of it. The whole discussion started with someone saying that Osgood was a Cup winning goalie in 97-98 and 2007-2008 seasons. I corrected him and said Osgood won the cup in 96-97 as well. After all, he played over 40 regular season games. Just because he didn't win a game in the playoffs doesn't matter. His name should still be inscribed on the cup and he deserves to be a champion that season and have 3 cup wins by his name. Seems that some people don't agree and if you didn't win games in the playoffs you shouldn't be able to have your name put on the cup. So I got to thinking what notable names would be omitted from the stanley cup if this were true. Obviously, the backup goalie in almost every instance wouldn't be on the cup then. What about Konstantinov when his name was on the cup in 97-98 season without playing a single game? Should Konstantinov be considered a champion for that season? I suppose you could even be as selective as removing players such as McCarty last year for only playing selective roles. IMHO, anyone who contributes for half the games in the regular season or has played some games in the playoffs should be put on the cup and be considered a champion. That player has payed their dues so to speak and contributed in some way to the team winning it all. As for backup goalies, the backup should also be considered a stanley cup winning goalie. It doesn't matter if they rode the pine during the game for Brodeur or some other top goalie. That goalie has paid his dues by working out with the team every day, playing their role that they were signed to play. The NHL rule that dictates who should have their name on the cup has got it right in this instance. I believe its over half of the regular season games or at least one game in the finals. What are your thoughts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilmickeyli 40 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) I think the current criteria are fine given the possibility to petition.. The wings petition when one doesn't meet the criteria. Just because they didnt play a game in the finals or if they missed a good part of the regular season, they are no less a teammate. Vlad was an exception because of his tragedy and the team rallied around him. They wouldn't petition anyone who didn't work for it. Edited March 18, 2009 by ilmickeyli Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightfall 871 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 I think the current criteria are fine given the possibility to petition.. The wings petition when one doesn't meet the criteria. Just because they didnt play a game in the finals or if they missed a good part of the regular season, they are no less a teammate. Vlad was an exception because of his tragedy and the team rallied around him. They wouldn't petition anyone who didn't work for it. I think the NHL rule is spot on correct. What is disappointing are people who like to omit names from being champions. Take Osgood for instance in 97. Vernon played the games, and there are some people who consider Osgood to not be a champion that season. Same goes for Brodeur's backup, Roy's backup and so on. Same goes for players like Konstantinov who didn't play a game in the 98 championship. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cusimano_brothers 1,655 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 What the League says, at nhl dot com: "To have one's name engraved on the Stanley Cup certain requirements must be met. A player must have at least 41 games played with the club or one game played in the Stanley Cup Finals. However, in 1994 a stipulation was added to allow a team to petition the Commissioner for permission to have players' names put on the Cup if extenuating circumstances prevented them from being available to play." As long as the possibility of petition exists, I see no problem with the League's system the way it stands. Also remember there is the "or" in the above statement, not "and". I wonder why the "petition stipulation" was added in 1994? Hmmm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
betterREDthandead 58 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Co-sign the above. The NHL's criteria are fine. The only thing I would add is a certain number of games, maybe 12, in the playoffs leading up to the Finals. Say somebody missed four months of the regular season, came back for the playoffs, and got hurt again for the Finals. I don't doubt they'd allow a petition in that case, but I think anyone who plays a majority of non-Finals playoff games is clearly a part of the team and should be automatic enough. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maltbymaniac 13 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 I think the current criteria are fine given the possibility to petition.. The wings petition when one doesn't meet the criteria. Just because they didnt play a game in the finals or if they missed a good part of the regular season, they are no less a teammate. Vlad was an exception because of his tragedy and the team rallied around him. They wouldn't petition anyone who didn't work for it. Spot On. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nkuehnl 0 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) I agree with almost everything you posted. However, I think it's disingenuous to call Osgood a 3 time Cup champ just as much as it is to call Hasek a 2 time Cup champ. -Would Detroit have won the Cup in 96-97 if Osgood was the starter? Who knows? -Would Detroit have rallied and won last year if Hasek stayed in for the rest of the playoffs? Who knows? -Is it fair to say that Brodeur and Osgood are both 3-time Cup champs? I don't think so. Brodeur played in all of those games; Osgood didn't. Nobody calls Gerber or Bryzgalov Stanley Cup winning goaltenders. Hasek and Osgood were parts of their respective teams and they deserve the rings and their names on the Cup, but referring to them as 2-time or 3-time winners isn't honest in terms of what they did (e.g. Hasek won one Cup and was part of another Cup winning team; he didn't physically play and win two Cups). Edited March 18, 2009 by nkuehnl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maltbymaniac 13 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 its not about a single person, its a TEAM that wins not one individual.thats how i see it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DMAC 25 18 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 as long as you play 40 games i think you should be able to have your name on the cup. my point is that they had to do somewhat good during those games otherwise 1. they wouldnt be playing over half the games and 2. their team wouldnt have made the playoffs so i think it should stay the same. but i'm not sure about the Konstantinov thing, hes an awsome guy and i feel really bad that his career ended early but that just confused me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
up2here 41 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 They should put MY name on the cup. Ive lived and died with this team for 22 years,I deserve it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightfall 871 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 I agree with almost everything you posted. However, I think it's disingenuous to call Osgood a 3 time Cup champ just as much as it is to call Hasek a 2 time Cup champ. -Would Detroit have won the Cup in 96-97 if Osgood was the starter? Who knows? -Would Detroit have rallied and won last year if Hasek stayed in for the rest of the playoffs? Who knows? -Is it fair to say that Brodeur and Osgood are both 3-time Cup champs? I don't think so. Brodeur played in all of those games; Osgood didn't. Nobody calls Gerber or Bryzgalov Stanley Cup winning goaltenders. Hasek and Osgood were parts of their respective teams and they deserve the rings and their names on the Cup, but referring to them as 2-time or 3-time winners isn't honest in terms of what they did (e.g. Hasek won one Cup and was part of another Cup winning team; he didn't physically play and win two Cups). Then is it disingenuous to call Vladdy a 2 time cup winning defenseman? What about Jiri Slegr who played 1 game in the finals for the wings back in 2002? Where is the line drawn here? Is the onus all on goaltenders here? It seems that when it comes to the goalie, some people think only the primary should have the distinction of being the "champion". The other guy IMHO should be considered a cup winning goalie as well. After all, he did everything that was required of him to bring a cup to the city. Osgood is a 3 time cup champion and will be remembered as such. Hasek a 2 time champion and the recordbooks show it. Gerber and Bryzgalov are considered cup champs as well. http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/bio/?i...ame=nhl-coyotes http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/bio/?i...nhl-maple_leafs Anyone saying otherwise is disingenuous IMHO. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 Anyone who ever played with the Wings. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
maltbymaniac 13 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) They should put MY name on the cup. Ive lived and died with this team for 22 years,I deserve it. wait a minute here.....if you died, how did you make this post and i only wear red wings t-shirts. am i qualified to have my name on the cup 2? Edited March 18, 2009 by maltbymaniac Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Konnan511 1,736 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) wait a minute here.....if you died, how did you make this post and i only wear red wings t-shirts. am i qualified to have my name on the cup too? Short answer: Yes Long answer: Yessir Edited March 18, 2009 by Konnan511 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
55fan 5,133 Report post Posted March 18, 2009 (edited) wait a minute here.....if you died, how did you make this post You'd be amazed the places that have internet access these days. :angel: I consider the team to be a championship team, and the backup goalie is just as much a part of the team as the coaches and owners and others who get their names on the Cup without skating. They all have a job to do, and if they all do it right, they win the Cup. That includes the back up goalie. Ozzie= :champs: Dom= :champs: Edited March 18, 2009 by 55fan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eva unit zero 271 Report post Posted March 19, 2009 Each of Ozzie and Dom played in 2 games during their 'questionable' Cup run. The TEAM won the Cup. Those two, in those years, did their job as backup for that run. That counts enough for me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted March 19, 2009 Anyone saying otherwise is disingenuous IMHO. Is that how they say it politely these days? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
