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thegreat66

Penguins top heavy in talent while Wings more evenly distributed

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What makes this series so great is the disparity in how these 2 teams are built. Penguins are topheavy with superior talent at the elite level(Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar, even Staal) where Wings don't matchup even taking into consideration how great Zetterberg, Lidstrom and Dats are. However, Detroit has an amazing advantage of depth once you move to midtier players. How does it play out is the $64,000 question. I still have to with Pens in 6. Saturday could be one of the best Stanley Cup games in last 15 years.

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What makes this series so great is the disparity in how these 2 teams are built. Penguins are topheavy with superior talent at the elite level(Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar, even Staal) where Wings don't matchup even taking into consideration how great Zetterberg, Lidstrom and Dats are. However, Detroit has an amazing advantage of depth once you move to midtier players. How does it play out is the $64,000 question. I still have to with Pens in 6. Saturday could be one of the best Stanley Cup games in last 15 years.

You really don't think Zetterberg and Lidstrom match up to Gonchar and Staal in terms of talent?

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You really don't think Zetterberg and Lidstrom match up to Gonchar and Staal in terms of talent?

Well I rate Zetterberg on essentially same level as Cros when you factor in his defensive capabilities but I don't see anyone who matches up with Malkin including Dats. Have to pair up the best vs best on each team and move your way down. Yeah you have a point historically Lidstrom would rate higher than Gonch but I don't think in this series so far.

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LOL @ calling Lidstrom anything but elite talent.

He's the best defender in the NHL bar-none. Mentioned in the same breath as people like Bobby Orr.

He's one of the best to ever play the game. That's from Ted Lindsay's mouth.

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Gonchar is a decent player, but Lidstrom is, without a doubt, one of the best defenseman of all time. Like... the comparison between the two doesn't even exist. year in and year out, Lidstroms been dominant over everyone. Gonchar having a good series doesn't change that.

Crosby plays better offense than Zetterberg, I'll admit, but Zetterbergs defense is above and beyond what Crosby can do.

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What makes this series so great is the disparity in how these 2 teams are built. Penguins are topheavy with superior talent at the elite level(Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar, even Staal) where Wings don't matchup even taking into consideration how great Zetterberg, Lidstrom and Dats are. However, Detroit has an amazing advantage of depth once you move to midtier players. How does it play out is the $64,000 question. I still have to with Pens in 6. Saturday could be one of the best Stanley Cup games in last 15 years.

Staal is superior talent? Are you kidding me?

Don't get cocky.

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Well I rate Zetterberg on essentially same level as Cros when you factor in his defensive capabilities but I don't see anyone who matches up with Malkin including Dats. Have to pair up the best vs best on each team and move your way down. Yeah you have a point historically Lidstrom would rate higher than Gonch but I don't think in this series so far.

:rotflmao: :o :rotflmao:

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What makes this series so great is the disparity in how these 2 teams are built. Penguins are topheavy with superior talent at the elite level(Crosby, Malkin, Gonchar, even Staal) where Wings don't matchup even taking into consideration how great Zetterberg, Lidstrom and Dats are. However, Detroit has an amazing advantage of depth once you move to midtier players. How does it play out is the $64,000 question. I still have to with Pens in 6. Saturday could be one of the best Stanley Cup games in last 15 years.

When you talk, do you taste it as it leaves your mouth, because we are tired of stepping in it?

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Staal isn't even the superior talent in his own famlily. In my neck of the woods, we have dubbed him Cap'n Limp Wrist. Up and until the shortie last night, I'd have put a large chunk of the series losing on Staal's back...not chasing down pucks, not planting his stick on the ice, losing sight of the puck on the abs goal and over general malaise. Stall would have most likey fanned or heeled the center from Malkin that Crosby made look like and easy chipper for goal 4 last night.

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When you talk, do you taste it as it leaves your mouth, because we are tired of stepping in it?

Cmon guys you can argue all day with logical evidence Detroit has better all around team. But you really won't concede that Malkin and Crosby are ahead of anything you guys have at 1 and 2 as far as best players on your team???

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Cmon guys you can argue all day with logical evidence Detroit has better all around team. But you really won't concede that Malkin and Crosby are ahead of anything you guys have at 1 and 2 as far as best players on your team???

At scoring goals, yes.

Detroit puts more than just goals and points on it's number 1 and 2.

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Cmon guys you can argue all day with logical evidence Detroit has better all around team. But you really won't concede that Malkin and Crosby are ahead of anything you guys have at 1 and 2 as far as best players on your team???

When Zetterberg was 20, and he had a pubestache, oh wait, he didn't, but anyway, he was a phenom all on his own. Then he learned to share the puck, play defense, and avoided the ****** devils temptation to go on to be the future captain of one of, if not the best, team the NHL has ever seen. You are honestly comparing two 20 year old kids to experienced, Stanley Cup winning greats. I think not. But, please, do go on. I need more fertilizer. :P

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Cmon guys you can argue all day with logical evidence Detroit has better all around team. But you really won't concede that Malkin and Crosby are ahead of anything you guys have at 1 and 2 as far as best players on your team???

AT HOCKEY: Z + Dats > Malkin + Crosby

AT PUTTING UP POINTS: Malkin + Crosby > Z + Dats

but theres a big factoid here that pens fans seem to ignore when wings fans give them reasons for why Datsyuk and Z are better. It's because Dats and Z are in their prime right now (bot almost 30, pav might be 30) and your top two players are in their early twenties...and them being so young and dominant offensively they are not as rock solid defensively as Hank and Dats.

oh and lol at Staal as an elite talent right now...are you serious? I'll admit that Lidstrom has not played up to what we are accustomed to seeing, but I think once the wings start pressuring Gonchar on the point our PK will improve.

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Well I rate Zetterberg on essentially same level as Cros when you factor in his defensive capabilities but I don't see anyone who matches up with Malkin including Dats. Have to pair up the best vs best on each team and move your way down. Yeah you have a point historically Lidstrom would rate higher than Gonch but I don't think in this series so far.

I think Dats and Malkin are just very different players. Dats is better defensively, and one on one, but Malkin is a much better all around offensive player.

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I gotta agree with the Great 66. I mean, is there anyone here who wouldn't trade Zetterberg and Datsyuk for Crosby and Malkin? The fact that the Wings are more worried about the Pens stars than they are of the Wings stars just shows how quickly Crosby/Malkin have emerged as superstars. The scary part is that they are not even close to their prime yet. If the Pens don't win the Cup this year they will shortly and I think will go on a roll for 2-3 straight.

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Cmon guys you can argue all day with logical evidence Detroit has better all around team. But you really won't concede that Malkin and Crosby are ahead of anything you guys have at 1 and 2 as far as best players on your team???

Crosby is in no way, shape or form better than Pavel Datsyuk. And for that matter, he and Zetterberg are almost on an even plane as far as their overall abilities. The fact that you even mention Staal's name in the same breath as the elite players in this series leads me to believe you have no clue what you're talking about.

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LOL at saying Malkin is far superior to Datsyuk. Datsyuk can put up pretty similar numbers AND play defense (Selke Trophy anyone?) Pens fans sound a little too cocky.

And Staal is elite? He is not better than Dats, Z, Mule, or Hossa (when he's turned on) in my opinion.

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I gotta agree with the Great 66. I mean, is there anyone here who wouldn't trade Zetterberg and Datsyuk for Crosby and Malkin? The fact that the Wings are more worried about the Pens stars than they are of the Wings stars just shows how quickly Crosby/Malkin have emerged as superstars. The scary part is that they are not even close to their prime yet. If the Pens don't win the Cup this year they will shortly and I think will go on a roll for 2-3 straight.

Question. If this team had Malkin and Crosby instead of Zetterberg and Datsyuk, what do you think the outcome of the Anaheim series would be?

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I think Irish and many other Wings fans are missing something very important. When you talk about Zetterberg and Dats being older and in their prime I view that as an advantage for Pens. What I'm saying is even though Dats hasn't played compare the difference between Zetterberg and Dats vs Crosby/Malkin last year as opposed to this year. Last year they were head and shoulders above Crosby/Malkin and it showed on ice. This year that gap has shrunk substantially if there is a gap at all. That's a trend that should continue going forward. Let's say we meet again in 2010 for Stanley Cup. Who do you think is going to be the better pair at that point in time a year older? Zet/Dats or Crosby/Malkin?

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I think Irish and many other Wings fans are missing something very important. When you talk about Zetterberg and Dats being older and in their prime I view that as an advantage for Pens. What I'm saying is even though Dats hasn't played compare the difference between Zetterberg and Dats vs Crosby/Malkin last year as opposed to this year. Last year they were head and shoulders above Crosby/Malkin and it showed on ice. This year that gap has shrunk substantially if there is a gap at all. That's a trend that should continue going forward. Let's say we meet again in 2010 for Stanley Cup. Who do you think is going to be the better pair at that point in time a year older? Zet/Dats or Crosby/Malkin?

Let say Malkin and Crosby get into a car accident in 2010 and wind up as brain dead vegatables, who do you think is going to be the better pair?

You can't say who's the better player based on how they might perform, only how they have performed.

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Question. If this team had Malkin and Crosby instead of Zetterberg and Datsyuk, what do you think the outcome of the Anaheim series would be?

Wings in 3?

:D

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I think Irish and many other Wings fans are missing something very important. When you talk about Zetterberg and Dats being older and in their prime I view that as an advantage for Pens. What I'm saying is even though Dats hasn't played compare the difference between Zetterberg and Dats vs Crosby/Malkin last year as opposed to this year. Last year they were head and shoulders above Crosby/Malkin and it showed on ice. This year that gap has shrunk substantially if there is a gap at all. That's a trend that should continue going forward. Let's say we meet again in 2010 for Stanley Cup. Who do you think is going to be the better pair at that point in time a year older? Zet/Dats or Crosby/Malkin?

You're neglecting the Wings' scouting and prospect development. Prospects spend ages in development but they make damn sure that the ones that make the cut are going to be able to fill the gaps that would otherwise emerge when you have guys enter the NHL late. Will Datsyuk be putting up the same kind of numbers in a couple years? Probably not, but we have guys like Helm and Leino that are being groomed to take their place at that point anyway. The Wings' management is very much a generational process, it's inaccurate to throw in age as a factor since it isn't just about Datsyuk and Zetterberg, it's about making as sure as possible that their kind of play can last beyond them.

Edited by Cern

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Whoa! Did this Pen fan just make this thread to say Gonch and Staal are more elite in talent than Lidstrom and Franzen?

I'll give you Crosby and Melkan, but, Lol @ Gonch and Staal! :D

Let me guess: "My daddy can lick your daddy", too, right? Flex dem big arms, champ.... ghrrrr, we love dem big boys over here! Whoop!

Edited by Snazzy

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I would be someone who wouldn't do that trade. Is Sid and Malkin great, yes, two of the best in the game. But you can't compare the two duos. I absolutely believe that Datsyuk and Zetterberg puts up less points because of their defensive responsibilities. Heck Pavel only started shooting more recently after the urging of Babs and his teammates.

If Zetterberg and Datsyuk was to play an all out offensive game and not backcheck their asses off. I would believe Datsyuk would be contending for the the top point getter.

I gotta agree with the Great 66. I mean, is there anyone here who wouldn't trade Zetterberg and Datsyuk for Crosby and Malkin? The fact that the Wings are more worried about the Pens stars than they are of the Wings stars just shows how quickly Crosby/Malkin have emerged as superstars. The scary part is that they are not even close to their prime yet. If the Pens don't win the Cup this year they will shortly and I think will go on a roll for 2-3 straight.

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