Konnan511 1,736 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 And how many 'solid defense' guys are both available and affordable? I think we're looking at three groups: Prospects that haven't panned out trying to rekindle their careers and be the next Cleary; Untested kids trying to be the next Draper/Maltby; and Borderline over-the-hill vets trying not to be the current Draper/Maltby. 'Liability' is something I think we just have to accept given our cap situation. You are right, there aren't many guys we can pick from right now, but that doesn't mean "we", the fans, have to be worried when our fourth line is out there. There are still a few guys left that would be excellent additions to the fourth line. We have some Griffins that are signed for the cheap and play very solid defense ala the Detroit Mantra of defense for a forward. Eric Perrin plays very good defense, although he is a forward and he can be signed for the cheap. Chris Thorburn, young and plays very nice defense. Plus, for that toughness crowd, look at these PIM numbers the past 3 seasons (69,92,102) Stephane Yelle, plays great defense and is a very good PK'r. There are plenty more players that could do very well for the Wings for the cheap. And none of them would be a 'liability'! Happy free agent hunting Wings! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) And F. Michael, since when do 14 year olds not watch hockey? And since when does not living in Michigan or a place that has snow/ice suddenly make a person not know anything about Kirk Maltby or the Red Wings? Maybe a child can have a good understanding of hockey. Maybe everyone living in the san Francisco isn't a self-important ******. Maybe everyone who thinks these guys are cool doesn't deserve to have their oppinions on everything dismissed out-of-hand. It would take a lot to convince me of the last one though. ...lol, and you accuse ME of trying to look tough and failing. Write your buddies in Kamelot a note. I'm sure they'd be happy to hear from their fan. Edited August 4, 2009 by micah Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Maybe a child can have a good understanding of hockey. Maybe everyone living in the san Francisco isn't a self-important ******. Maybe everyone who thinks these guys are cool doesn't deserve to have their oppinions on everything dismissed out-of-hand. It would take a lot to convince me of the last one though. Actually, they should have their opinions dismissed, when it's based on not only faulty logic, but clearly not a direction Kenny nor any coaches under him have went toward for well over a decade. This is NOT and has NOT been a fighting team since a few years before the Wings won Stevie Y his first cup. The people that keep deluding themselves into thinking this is the case while the Wings were sitting at the bottom in fighting majors, and getting just about all of the media attention to the Russian 5, or gritty grind line, are simply living in la-la land. The team that threw their bodies around in the 2008 playoffs were no different than the ones that did in 1997. As for Maltby, his role was grinder, a mucker, a guy who can score an off goal or two, play on the PK, and more than anything, agitate opponents. His role, while diminished for the most part due to age, is still very much useful. Some people seem to think that we can just sign anyone we like, and I'd be for the replacement of Maltby if this were the case, but given we're in a cap era now and can't spend as much with little restraint, Maltby will do until Kenny/Babs finds a replacement. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) It would take a lot to convince me of the last one though. ...lol, and you accuse ME of trying to look tough and failing. Write your buddies in Kamelot a note. I'm sure they'd be happy to hear from their fan. I don't need to try and look tough. It's the internet. Welcome. That tough internet guy thing is your expertise. I don't go around telling people I'm going to fight them because they trash talk. And Kamelot, while doing a song or two with Shagrath, is not a "tough" band either. Might want to actually listen to some of their songs which include personal battles within the self, or love songs, of course, with power/symphonic metal. Being that the avvy was of a picture I took of their drum head after seeing them live, you're, once again, batting .000 Big Mac. Less juice/angst, more studying. Edited August 4, 2009 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
uk_redwing 495 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Meh. Even I cant be bothered getting into these arguments anymore. You all deserve a medal for persistance: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ilmickeyli 40 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) Edited August 4, 2009 by ilmickeyli Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Which one is your favorite? They're all pretty dreamy, I mean, but which one do you think is most rad? Is it the scrawny bucktoothed guy with the leather pants and turtleneck? I bet his chums call him "Lady Killer". Is it "I'm too sexy for my sleeves and hair"? He looks like the leader. I mean, the other guys are just standing still. He's emerging from the smoke, walking right at you. I think he likes you. Maybe it's Soul Patch? He looks like he's ready to throw down. I wonder if he could take Maltby? Probably. He looks like 130 pounds of pure dynamite. Is it Blondie? I shouldn't have called him that, doing so implies that on some level, be it musical tallent, sexiness or toughness, he's on par with Debbie Harry. He isn't. I can now so much understand how you don't think Maltby is a cowardly weakling. It's all relative I guess. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 You're trying to way too hard to be insulting, and really it all sounds stupid. I can give props to people who can insult and make some sense at the same time, but what the hell is the mess you just posted about? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted August 4, 2009 I don't need to try and look tough. It's the internet. Welcome. That tough internet guy thing is your expertise. I don't go around telling people I'm going to fight them because they trash talk. Did I tell someone that I was going to fight them? Oh yeah, I remember now. No. No I didn't. There are people I'd be willing to fight, but nobody that I'm actively (or even passivly) seeking out. Meh. And Kamelot, while doing a song or two with Shagrath, is not a "tough" band either. Might want to actually listen to some of their songs which include personal battles within the self, or love songs, of course, with power/symphonic metal. Being that the avvy was of a picture I took of their drum head after seeing them live, you're, once again, batting .000 Big Mac. Less juice/angst, more studying. I never said they were tough, silly. I was mocking them because they are dorks, trying to look tough. METAL!!!! I bet you own a Dream Theatre album, don't you? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Did I tell someone that I was going to fight them? Oh yeah, I remember now. No. No I didn't. There are people I'd be willing to fight, but nobody that I'm actively (or even passivly) seeking out. Meh. I never said they were tough, silly. I was mocking them because they are dorks, trying to look tough. METAL!!!! I bet you own a Dream Theatre album, don't you? Dream Theater. If you notice the one thing they have in common -- they have a more progressive sound. As in, that silly bassist is used far more frequently and prominently than traditional metal, Geezer aside. Tool was a master of this as well. And while I'm not too heavy on vocalists (except when they get in the way of music, which is a turn-off), Roy Khan is one of the best metal has to offer today. LaBrie's ain't bad either. Reminds me of Mustaine. Peace sells.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Konnan511 1,736 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Where's that guy who always brings up politics randomly. That's what this thread needs, more politics. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) Where's that guy who always brings up politics randomly. That's what this thread needs, more politics. Nono, it needs more "fighting". This board isn't tough enough. Edited August 4, 2009 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Dream Theater. If you notice the one thing they have in common -- they have a more progressive sound. As in, that silly bassist is used far more frequently and prominently than traditional metal, Geezer aside. Tool was a master of this as well. And while I'm not too heavy on vocalists (except when they get in the way of music, which is a turn-off), Roy Khan is one of the best metal has to offer today. LaBrie's ain't bad either. Reminds me of Mustaine. Peace sells.. Everything you just talked about sucks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Everything you just talked about sucks. Yeah, not enough fighting or tough guy s***. 'scuse me while I step into my nut huggers and jump on my horse with lift kit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 It's funny to me when people say the Wings werent ough under Yzerman in the 90's, seems like people outside of our ridiculous fanbase, think otherwise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest micah Report post Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) Yeah, not enough fighting or tough guy s***. 'scuse me while I step into my nut huggers and jump on my horse with lift kit. I have no idea what you're talking about. Edited August 4, 2009 by micah Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chrisdetroit 189 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 The Stanley Cup Champions, who already had Eric Godard (one of the best enforcers in the league) on their '09 team just picked up New Jersey's '09 enforcer Mike Rupp, and Carolina's '09 enforcer Wade Brookbank before going into '10 to defend their title. Your thoughts on the subject, sir??? Can you tell me with a straight face that the Pens were the best team in the league last year? Yeah, they won the cup and they played hard and deserved it but I doesn't matter which enforcer they picked up, they are not going to be a threat this year. They won't defend the title. The Pens were IMO the 4th "best" team in the playoffs last year. The top three were Detroit Boston Aneheim Not necessarily in that order. Aneheim lost in a brutal 7 game series to Detroit, Detroit lost the cup in game seven to the Pens while their top 2 D-men and their top forward were playing injured. Boston lost in OT in game 7 to Carolina. The 4th best team won the cup and enforcers had noting to do with it. Eric who? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Can you tell me with a straight face that the Pens were the best team in the league last year? Yeah, they won the cup and they played hard and deserved it but I doesn't matter which enforcer they picked up, they are not going to be a threat this year. They won't defend the title. The Pens were IMO the 4th "best" team in the playoffs last year. The top three were Detroit Boston Aneheim Not necessarily in that order. Aneheim lost in a brutal 7 game series to Detroit, Detroit lost the cup in game seven to the Pens while their top 2 D-men and their top forward were playing injured. Boston lost in OT in game 7 to Carolina. The 4th best team won the cup and enforcers had noting to do with it. Eric who? None of what you said means a damn thing, they won the Stanley Cup. It makes it hard to hate them when fans try to discredit what they did. Pittsburgh will be a Top 4 team in the East next season, and have a good shot to give it another go. What did they really lose this offseason? Garon sucks, Scuderi is overated, Satan and Sykora were dead weight, anything else? Nope, I'd be willing to say they have as good a chance as us, or better. And that team added more grit and toughness, what does that tell you? Many teams in the East have gotten bigger and tougher to contend. Carolina, Toronto, Boston, Philly, Pittsburgh, the list goes on. The West already is big and tough enough, but were not. I believe we can play with any team in the league, but when the physical game picks up, we'll see if we can keep up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 It's funny to me when people say the Wings werent ough under Yzerman in the 90's, seems like people outside of our ridiculous fanbase, think otherwise. I saw that video long ago. All it shows are guys hitting and having an attitude, not fighting. By these standards, the 2008 cup team was "tough". Some tough guy nutjobs though are gonna be pissed, though, that Malts was called a tough guy in that video. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Shoreline Report post Posted August 4, 2009 (edited) None of what you said means a damn thing, they won the Stanley Cup. It makes it hard to hate them when fans try to discredit what they did. Pittsburgh will be a Top 4 team in the East next season, and have a good shot to give it another go. What did they really lose this offseason? Garon sucks, Scuderi is overated, Satan and Sykora were dead weight, anything else? Nope, I'd be willing to say they have as good a chance as us, or better. And that team added more grit and toughness, what does that tell you? Many teams in the East have gotten bigger and tougher to contend. Carolina, Toronto, Boston, Philly, Pittsburgh, the list goes on. The West already is big and tough enough, but were not. I believe we can play with any team in the league, but when the physical game picks up, we'll see if we can keep up. Anaheim series. 'nuff said. Who won again? Oh yeah. Wings will be run over by "tough" teams. How many times does this analogy have to be proven wrong before people stop typing it over and over again? Hell, and the only reason it went to 7 games was because of a stifling defense which shut down the Sharks too. Not toughness like people here elude to. Edited August 4, 2009 by Shoreline Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Anaheim series. 'nuff said. Who won again? Oh yeah. Wings will be run over by "tough" teams. How many times does this analogy have to be proven wrong before people stop typing it over and over again? Hell, and the only reason it went to 7 games was because of a stifling defense which shut down the Sharks too. Not toughness like people here elude to. We go them once, they've gotten us twice. It was very rewarding to see the Wings beat Anaheim, just because I hated seeing them pushed around in 07 and it was nice redemption. But man, it wasnt just stifling defense, Anaheims forwards grinded on all the forwards. Datsyuk, Hossa, Holmstrom, all invisible, Marchant, Niedermayer and those guys finished every check on those guys. If not for the Zetterberg line and our depth forwards, we probably wouldnt have won. But if Rafalski's healthy all series I'd imagine we'd have won quicker, but that's just what ifs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heroes of Hockeytown 694 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 But if Rafalski's healthy all series I'd imagine we'd have won quicker, but that's just what ifs. Do you suppose Holland should gameplan for having one of his top pairing defensemen missing? The Wings are good enough to beat the Ducks when healthy and when less-than-healthy, so good on them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
titanium2 867 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 that's just what ifs. A bigger and more serious what if may be what if they actually allowed that Hossa goal in Game 3? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 A bigger and more serious what if may be what if they actually allowed that Hossa goal in Game 3? We're not great in overtime, but with the momentum in our favor, probably would've changed the series and had the Wings win in 5. And maybe that would've awoken the sleeping sloth in Hossa and got him going, we shall never know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skacore 2 Report post Posted August 4, 2009 Can you tell me with a straight face that the Pens were the best team in the league last year? Yeah, they won the cup and they played hard and deserved it but I doesn't matter which enforcer they picked up, they are not going to be a threat this year. They won't defend the title. The Pens were IMO the 4th "best" team in the playoffs last year. The top three were Detroit Boston Aneheim Not necessarily in that order. Aneheim lost in a brutal 7 game series to Detroit, Detroit lost the cup in game seven to the Pens while their top 2 D-men and their top forward were playing injured. Boston lost in OT in game 7 to Carolina. The 4th best team won the cup and enforcers had noting to do with it. Eric who? lol STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS... they won the f***in cup dude get over it... they beat the Wings in a 7 game series... period... they have the right to be called the STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
