Bertuzzi = Lang?

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

No, all it suggests is that Bertuzzi is better at 5 on 5 than Franzen or Cleary. You're using the same argument people use when discussing Zetterberg being better defensively than Datsyuk.

Zetterberg is a little better on the pk than Datsyuk. Dats is a total pickpocket, but Z plays the body more, which is important around the net.

But to stay on topic, Cleary and Franzen (cleary especially) are defensively responsible players. What makes you say they're not?

[Richard88 0]

Zetterberg is a little better on the pk than Datsyuk. Dats is a total pickpocket, but Z plays the body more, which is important around the net.

But to stay on topic, Cleary and Franzen (cleary especially) are defensively responsible players. What makes you say they're not?

Being respondsible defensively doesn't mean you're a great defensive player, it means that you're aware of your own zone. Sidney Crosby is defensively respondsible. Bertuzzi back checks harder than Hossa did in his time here and people are saying hes terrible defensively and its insane.

Franzen has one of the best wrist shots in the game but Bertuzzi has him beat in every other facet of the game.

[gcom007 1,465]

The difference between Lang and Bertuzzi is expectation. When Lang came to the Wings he was leading the league in goals and generally speaking a full-blown star. He was making good money too. He also took a lot more of a beating around here than he really deserved. Bertuzzi's coming in at what, $1.5 million? He's pretty old, been through injuries, etc. Everyone knows it's a gamble and everyone knows what we're getting into with him. All things considered, I'm not upset with him at all at this point. He'll probably get better especially if he stays healthy and he's had some really good moments none the less.

Meanwhile, I've been fairly happy with Williams in general. I wasn't thrilled to sign him, but again, all things considered, so far he's looked great.

Edited October 11, 2009 by gcom007

[gcom007 1,465]

There is a huge difference, Robert Lang made 5million a season and rarely played like a 5million dollar player, I would have had no problem with Lang at 1.5 million. That's all Bertuzzi makes, those that expect a 30goal 60pt crushing power forward are setting themselves up for disappointment. Let's be honest, if he were still capable of that he wouldn't be here making 1.5. Level set your expectations then judge his play, he is doing fine, he's not a bargin but he's also not overpaid.

I could've just thumbed-up this and saved myself a minute of writing. Oh well. Well said though...

[GoWings1905 2,694]

Being respondsible defensively doesn't mean you're a great defensive player, it means that you're aware of your own zone. Sidney Crosby is defensively respondsible. Bertuzzi back checks harder than Hossa did in his time here and people are saying hes terrible defensively and its insane.

Franzen has one of the best wrist shots in the game but Bertuzzi has him beat in every other facet of the game.

You keep jumping around on subjects. First, you stated that Bertuzzi is at "Selke calibre" at even strength compared to Cleary and Franzen. To me, that suggests that you feel Bertuzzi is better defensively than Cleary and Mule? You have yet to address how this is possibly true as Cleary and Mule both kill penalties on a team that is very deep with strong defensive forwards.

Bertuzzi isn't terrible defensively, but I think he has average defensive awareness at best. For his career, Bertuzzi is minus 40. Minus 40 and he played with Naslund and Morrison for a time on what was the most dominant line in the league. That doesn't scream better than Cleary and Franzen at even strength to me.

The last sentence on Bertuzzi being better than Mule is a completely different topic. Are we talking Todd Bertuzzi of 2002?

[ComradeWasabi 109]

Franzen has one of the best wrist shots in the game but Bertuzzi has him beat in every other facet of the game.

[gcom007 1,465]

Yes. We need everyone healthy for the playoffs. Holland just signed May for the dirty work

It's great for players who aren't injury prone. Bert is doing absolutly fine the way he is playing. He single handedly saved a goal that resulted in a "W".

Indeed. If he plays smart and stays healthy. He won't compliment Hank and Pav too much if he's out for the rest of the year.

No thanks. I'd prefer watching the Wings win the ultimate prize; Lord Stanley. Perhaps you should find a goon team to root for that probably won't even make the playoffs.

We don't need another Franzen-type injury from key players on this team.

Maybe you're new to hockey, I dunno.. but Bert isn't known to be like Wolverine from X-men that can't be injured. It's no secret Bert has a glass back and is injury prone. Why aggravate it for the meaningless season? Wings don't need the Presidents trophy, they needs to stay healthy.

Based on past post from you, maybe you prefer to join this forum and spend all your time over there = http://www.mmaforum.com/

GMR, don't take your eye off the ultimate prize in the NHL: the Stanley Cup. Everything else is pure meaningless.

For once I totally agree with you.

[Superman54 91]

I don't believe Bertuzzi is as good as Cleary, or Franzen defensively, but I have actually seen the big guy hussle back and break up plays in his own zone.

[Wombat 26]

Yeah, if he can't score with Pavel and Hank on the same line, then he'll never score here.

Like I said last night, what I want to see the most from him is punishing hits and him running people into the boards. Haven't seen it so far.

You're looking for the wrong player then. He hasn't been that player since he was in Vancouver, 5 teams ago for him. Whether it's easing off because of the Moore incident, injuries (particularly to his back), age, or a combo of all of those, he has not been the player he was that gave bone crunching hits and ran people consistently. maybe if he feels healthy he can do some of that again, but I'm not expecting it.

To me it seems like another case of expecting too much out of a player. Should we expect him to use his body and hit some? Sure. But I think it's folly to expect him to crush people almost every shift.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Yes. We need everyone healthy for the playoffs. Holland just signed May for the dirty work

It's great for players who aren't injury prone. Bert is doing absolutly fine the way he is playing. He single handedly saved a goal that resulted in a "W".

Indeed. If he plays smart and stays healthy. He won't compliment Hank and Pav too much if he's out for the rest of the year.

No thanks. I'd prefer watching the Wings win the ultimate prize; Lord Stanley. Perhaps you should find a goon team to root for that probably won't even make the playoffs.

We don't need another Franzen-type injury from key players on this team.

Maybe you're new to hockey, I dunno.. but Bert isn't known to be like Wolverine from X-men that can't be injured. It's no secret Bert has a glass back and is injury prone. Why aggravate it for the meaningless season? Wings don't need the Presidents trophy, they needs to stay healthy.

Based on past post from you, maybe you prefer to join this forum and spend all your time over there = http://www.mmaforum.com/

GMR, don't take your eye off the ultimate prize in the NHL: the Stanley Cup. Everything else is pure meaningless.

That's a funny post considering how I've been here longer than you. Join a MMA forum?

Apparently you're saying Bertuzzi should shy away from physical contact in order to stay healthy. However, injuries can occur whether a guy is shy or not. He should play up to his potential and not be afraid of it. Injuries are hard to predict.

Just because we signed May doesn't mean other players should be afraid to hit.

[dobbles 252]

Sheeesh..he's played only 4 games in a system he's not all use to. I think he's doing fine.

i am not basing my opinion off of 4 games though. i am basing it on the probably 30 or 40 flames games i watched last year, and the opinions of many other flames fans that are knowledgeable. i know how he played last year, and i am saying so far he looks like the same exact player this year.

[Booster313 138]

i am not basing my opinion off of 4 games though. i am basing it on the probably 30 or 40 flames games i watched last year, and the opinions of many other flames fans that are knowledgeable. i know how he played last year, and i am saying so far he looks like the same exact player this year.

Last year Todd Bertuzzi had 15 Goals, and 29 Assists for 44 points. If you're telling me that Bertuzzi looks the same as last year, I'll take that to the bank. Yes he was -13 but Phaneuf was -11 and even the great Iginla was -2, consider the team as well.

[Snazzy 0]

That's a funny post considering how I've been here longer than you. Join a MMA forum?

Yet I've been here since 2002 under a different alias. Nice try though.

Using the post count ideology....? You must have a small penis. Rhetorical question, stubby.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

Yet I've been here since 2002 under a different alias. Nice try though.

Using the post count ideology....? You must have a small penis. Rhetorical question, stubby.

Wow, what a mature poster you are? Let's see if you joined in 2002, that means you are about 13 years old now?

I'm guessing you were banned for acting like a prick (pun intended) so that's why you had to change your name.

Anyway, grow up sunshine and stop thinking about penises so much.

Another smartass trying to bait me into something. Leave it to the pros like Shoreline and Opie. Not you.

Edited October 12, 2009 by GMRwings1983

[T.Low 1,011]

This. His defense is improving and they're still sorting out chemistry.

This thread is lazy and it sucks.â„¢

Thank you.

I haven't been able to see a game yet, so its good to see so many posts defending and supporting Bertuzzi because he's playing decent so far.

NOT TO MENTION ITS ONLY THE FOURTH FRIKIN GAME!

[Holmstrom96 347]

I didn't want to see Bert here, not a big fan of him, but I think he's done good in the first four games.

[LidstromIsASuperhero 29]

I thought Bert looked pretty good last night. Lol I get the feeling that the man is generally FEARED out there. I remember at one point last night he stumbled backwards and straight up sat on Theodore. When he got up, none of the defenseman said or did s***. They just kind of looked down and to the side. People not named Ovechkin even seemed reluctant to challenge him to a physical battle on the ice. It was like, "Don't f*** with Bertuzzi, he'll snap your neck."

[under_par_00 45]

I thought Bert looked pretty good last night. Lol I get the feeling that the man is generally FEARED out there. I remember at one point last night he stumbled backwards and straight up sat on Theodore. When he got up, none of the defenseman said or did s***. They just kind of looked down and to the side. People not named Ovechkin even seemed reluctant to challenge him to a physical battle on the ice. It was like, "Don't f*** with Bertuzzi, he'll snap your neck."

Haha ya I remember when he sat on Theodore. I thought for sure there was gonna be a scrum, but it was almost like a football game where the other team came over and gently lifted Bert to his feet and gave him a pat on the ass as he skated away.

[esteef 2,679]

[T.Low 1,011]

Being respondsible defensively doesn't mean you're a great defensive player, it means that you're aware of your own zone. Sidney Crosby is defensively respondsible. Bertuzzi back checks harder than Hossa did in his time here and people are saying hes terrible defensively and its insane.

Franzen has one of the best wrist shots in the game but Bertuzzi has him beat in every other facet of the game.

I like Bert. I really do. I really want Bert to succeed in Detroit. But this is a ridiculous statement. Hossa was a frikin monster on the back check. Bert may be giving it his all most of the time, but he certainly doesn't have the depth of power, the determination, and tenacity like Hossa did.

Not even close.

I do think Bert is a potential great value. Let's hope. Keep it up, Todd Bertuzzi.

[dobbles 252]

Last year Todd Bertuzzi had 15 Goals, and 29 Assists for 44 points. If you're telling me that Bertuzzi looks the same as last year, I'll take that to the bank. Yes he was -13 but Phaneuf was -11 and even the great Iginla was -2, consider the team as well.

mikael samuelsson had 40 points and was an even player, yet he was pretty much run out of town and hated by fans for boneheaded plays. so often times there is more than just numbers. and as you mentioned, he had the wirst +/- on the team. and he only played 66 games. could have been even worse had he played more.

todd bertuzzi can still put up a decent amount of points for a depth player, but his defense and decision making is pretty awful. just keep watching; you will see.

[sureWhyNot 19]

He has looked perfectly fine, and will continue to do so barring an injury (knock on wood). People just don't like the guy because his past, and that dislike clouds their jusdgement to such an extent that nothing he does will "look good" to them.

[rage 24]

I thought Bert looked pretty good last night. Lol I get the feeling that the man is generally FEARED out there. I remember at one point last night he stumbled backwards and straight up sat on Theodore. When he got up, none of the defenseman said or did s***. They just kind of looked down and to the side. People not named Ovechkin even seemed reluctant to challenge him to a physical battle on the ice. It was like, "Don't f*** with Bertuzzi, he'll snap your neck."

Yeah, I've noticed that in all the games so far!! And as a Wings' fan, you can't HELP but notice that!! It's not something we see or have seen very often in the last, oh I don't know......how long!?!?!?

[#19forPresident! 1]

He didn't make the score sheet.... but he played a great game defensively, and that registers highly on Babcock's score sheet, and is a positive trend that will hopefully continue... The offensive chemistry should come eventually.

[Guest mindfly]

Babcock don't seem to agree with that :S

"That's as good a game as I've seen Bert play in a number of years," Babcock said. "I thought Bert was excellent and helped those guys. He's big and he skated well, and that was important for us."

With the loss of Johan Franzen for four months with a torn knee ligament, Bertuzzi is one of a number of Wings being counted on to chip in more offensively.

"Just trying to get better each game," Bertuzzi said. "Had a handful of chances, a bounce here, a bounce there could have gone in. But the most important thing is the win. That's all we care about.

"I gotta drive the net and stay in front of the net and try to create some space for them. And make sure defensively you're responsible."

Bertuzzi relishes the chance to play with Zetterberg and Datsyuk.

"I think I'm capable of playing with those guys," he said. "Be nice to get some chemistry with them and try to contribute when the Mule is out for now. I think it's a spot I can be successful in."