Firehawk 305 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 (edited) But our top 3 players are not injured. They've got to step it up and play better than what they have been doing. I realize the line combos are different, but Pavel and Hank shouldn't have to depend on others to score their points for them. Superstar players should carry the other players, not the other way around. But when other key players are missing, teams can focus more heavily on the stars. I do agree with what you are saying to an extent, and Zetterberg has done that on occasion. But you have to look at the reality of the situation as well. You can't just simply dismiss the long list of injuries to our offense. The chemistry on this team is completely screwed up right now. All of these things play a major role in the success of a team. Hopefully the team will get used to missing those pieces and adjust, but I am not expecting a miracle, honestly. Star players are better when they have good pieces around them. They have decent players still, but they are missing the exceptional supporting cast. I just think we are all shocked because some on this board probably weren't even born when the wings were playing this average kind of hockey before. EDIT: I am an Osgood lover but lately he has been out of position or just making bad mistakes and costing us goals at key times, like very early in games. I thought the 3rd goal given up to the Predators was terrible. He looked out of position. I think it was the last goal they scored last night, that one was also terrible. No excuse. You have to make those saves. To me Osgood looks like he did last year, messed up. IF we get into the playoffs, I would expect he will step his game up again, but that's a big IF at this point. I just hope we can hold on. Edited November 28, 2009 by Firehawk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Carman 387 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 We aren't the only team in the league facing pretty significant injuries. Granted I don't think anyone is in a worse situation, but there are teams out there playing better and facing injuries to the same type of players. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heroes of Hockeytown 694 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 We can not win unless we score so it is a moot point. Once again, last year our offense was stacked so we were scoring and our sub-par defense/ goal tending did not really hurt us much. This year we are clearly seeing the problems. Well, that's why I say "should." A team of anemic schoolgirls could have posted better than one GFA by sheer dumb luck over the course of the last half dozen games. You're not realistically going to prevent your team from being scored on 2-3 times most nights, but by that same token you're not going to realistically only score one goal most nights either. Something somewhere has to give. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 But our top 3 players are not injured. They've got to step it up and play better than what they have been doing. I realize the line combos are different, but Pavel and Hank shouldn't have to depend on others to score their points for them. Superstar players should carry the other players, not the other way around. This, I agree with. yes, the Wings are injured and not nearly as talented as last year. But if our top guys are as great as we say they are, these are the times when great players carry their teams. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 ... The excuse that I'm sick of the most is "Well the Wings are coming off two very long playoff runs and they are tired." Well so are the Pens. Their playoff runs were just as long as ours the last two years and look at them. And it's not like they didn't have most of June, all of July, and some of August to rest up. These men are PROFESSIONAL hockey players. It's their job to show up and play. And yet the Pens lost 5 of 6 when Malkin and Gonchar were out, including 4 straight where they scored only 3 total goals and were shut out in consecutive games. Yes, we're on a bad streak. Lost 3 in a row, scoring only 1 goal (that was allowed), and 5 of 6, scoring only 5 goals (+1 for the SO win). 3 points in 6 games. Sucks. Prior to that we won 3 in a row scoring 19 goals, 6 of 7, and gained at least 1 point in 8 out of 9 games, scoring 37 goals. I don't think either streak is more indicative of this team's capabilities than the other. The cap cost us the depth that we now need due to injury. Sucks but it's reality. We'll have good streaks and bad streaks. Just need to weather the current storm, there's little else we can do. Significant roster moves just aren't feasible. I'm not saying that some players (all even) are playing fine. Of course they need to play better than they have in the current stretch. That's fairly obvious though, and I'm sure they will improve. But there's no reason to overreact to one short stretch of games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlueMonk 102 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 This, I agree with. yes, the Wings are injured and not nearly as talented as last year. But if our top guys are as great as we say they are, these are the times when great players carry their teams. +1. The injuries are an excuse not to be on top of the NHL standings right now, but I don't think they can explain the team being shut out in back to back games. Lidstrom, Datsyuk and Zetterberg are good enough with the surrounding cast to get things done, but they aren't finding a way. Lidstrom's struggles are the toughest pill to swallow. He was a -3 along with Rafalski last night. Yikes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlueMonk 102 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 A team of anemic schoolgirls could have posted better than one GFA by sheer dumb luck over the course of the last half dozen games. You're not realistically going to prevent your team from being scored on 2-3 times most nights, but by that same token you're not going to realistically only score one goal most nights either. Something somewhere has to give. Yeah, "puck luck" is definitely a factor. The Wings need to create better scoring chances, sure. But let's be honest, no team has as its game plan to be outshot 40-17. The Wings are doing a lot of the right things and if they continue to do them, they will score goals. I think. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Evans_18 4 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Sure we are out shooting opponents but you also need to look at the fact of those shots. A huge majority of those shots are poorly placed or just weak in general. Plus the fact that we have so many blocked shots from players taking the shot with someone right in the lane. I think our best chance to get rolling again is obviously switching up the lines, which I am guessing Babs will do considering back to back games of being shut out. Lets give the younger guys a chance to play with Z and Pavs and lets see what they got. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GORM19 0 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 when drew miller is the only one who has a goal in the past 3 games i would say everyone is under achieving right now.The intensity is not there for anyone plus everyone is holding on to the puck to long and then they end up turning it over.and it looksmlike lids is a scared to get hit again that is why he is turning the puck over so much this year Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 +1. The injuries are an excuse not to be on top of the NHL standings right now, but I don't think they can explain the team being shut out in back to back games. Lidstrom, Datsyuk and Zetterberg are good enough with the surrounding cast to get things done, but they aren't finding a way. Lidstrom's struggles are the toughest pill to swallow. He was a -3 along with Rafalski last night. Yikes. Well put. I guess that's what I wanted to say without being able to articulate it as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theophany 110 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 +1. The injuries are an excuse not to be on top of the NHL standings right now, but I don't think they can explain the team being shut out in back to back games. Lidstrom, Datsyuk and Zetterberg are good enough with the surrounding cast to get things done, but they aren't finding a way. Lidstrom's struggles are the toughest pill to swallow. He was a -3 along with Rafalski last night. Yikes. Rinne, Pavelec, and Kiprusoff are reasons for being shut out, though. And Lidstrom is 39, he's bound to decline sometime. I mean he's still great, but obviously something has to give eventually, or else he's going to be playing 'til he's 90+. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Rinne, Pavelec, and Kiprusoff are reasons for being shut out, though. And Lidstrom is 39, he's bound to decline sometime. I mean he's still great, but obviously something has to give eventually, or else he's going to be playing 'til he's 90+. Two of those guys are nobodies. If we can't solve those kinds of goalies, then of course we're going to get shutout by Kiprusoff. The chances are there, but too many shots are going wide or hitting players in front. Maltby has had better scoring touch than most of our stars this season. That's inexcusable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Slabby 3 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Two of those guys are nobodies. If we can't solve those kinds of goalies, then of course we're going to get shutout by Kiprusoff. The chances are there, but too many shots are going wide or hitting players in front. Two of those guys are two of the top young goalies in the league. Pavelec is going to be a star. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Evans_18 4 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Did everyone forget how much trouble Rinne gave us last year in the regular season also? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyphoenix 153 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Rinne and Pavelec are both excellent goaltenders. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
uk_redwing 495 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Rinne and Pavelec are both excellent goaltenders. Yeh, so excellent noone has ever scored against them... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Rinne and Pavelec are both excellent goaltenders. Since when does "decent young goalie" mean the same thing as "excellent"? We make these goalies look better than what they really are. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dobbles 252 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Yeh, so excellent noone has ever scored against them... what a dumb post. contributes nothing to the thread... on topic - having seen a lot of ahl hockey the last few years, both rinne and pavelec have bright futures. while neither is old enough to have established himself as a legit #1, there was also a time when the 3rd guy on the list (kipper) was just a 3rd stringer languishing in the san jose system. i honestly love when people have no idea who a player is so they instantly assume they suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 what a dumb post. contributes nothing to the thread... on topic - having seen a lot of ahl hockey the last few years, both rinne and pavelec have bright futures. while neither is old enough to have established himself as a legit #1, there was also a time when the 3rd guy on the list (kipper) was just a 3rd stringer languishing in the san jose system. i honestly love when people have no idea who a player is so they instantly assume they suck. If Bettman has never heard of these players, then why should we? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Evans_18 4 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Same goes for Bobby Lou when he was in Florida, No one knew what a talent he would be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
puckbags 863 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Two of those guys are nobodies. Nobodies compared to who? Osgood and Howard? I dont know much about the other guy but Rinne is a very good goalie ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
uk_redwing 495 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 what a dumb post. contributes nothing to the thread... on topic - having seen a lot of ahl hockey the last few years, both rinne and pavelec have bright futures. while neither is old enough to have established himself as a legit #1, there was also a time when the 3rd guy on the list (kipper) was just a 3rd stringer languishing in the san jose system. i honestly love when people have no idea who a player is so they instantly assume they suck. That is also a dumb post that contributes nothing to the thread. This about players underperforming, not a debate about whether some other teams goalies are hot prospects or not. Now go away. Shoo. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyphoenix 153 Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Since when does "decent young goalie" mean the same thing as "excellent"? We make these goalies look better than what they really are. I reached with Pavelec because he's been good for Atlanta this year...but Rinne is excellent. A 2.39GAA in the NHL and a .917SV% is better than decent, esepcially when you play for Nashville. His stats last season placed him in the top 10 goaltenders in both GAA and SV%. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dobbles 252 Report post Posted November 29, 2009 That is also a dumb post that contributes nothing to the thread. This about players underperforming, not a debate about whether some other teams goalies are hot prospects or not. Now go away. Shoo. ok, you are dumb. my post actually did contribute. it gave the opinion that these goalies were good. and its based onactually seeing them play. and while the goalie issue was tertiary, it does contribute to the topic at hand because the point of contention was that the team wasn't necessarily playing poor, but running into hot goalies. while i am not sure i agree with that initial point, i was agreeing that those goalies are better than some realize as they are not big names yet. so while i was contributing, you were trolling. so just shut your mouth until you have something to actually say. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,804 Report post Posted November 29, 2009 Enough guys. No flame wars allowed in my threads unless I'm the one involved. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
