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redwingfan19

Cherry rips Holland

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Now, I don't like seeing NHL teams fail on Long Island either, but he acts as if Canada invented and trademarked hockey, and nobody else can even think about liking it, or its copyright infringement.

He does act rather self-entitled about it but Canada DID invent hockey...

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I agree with the whole sentiment that Detroit doesnt need a goon and could use another guy who can play a bit and be tough but are you forgetting the team Cherry is in love with? The bruins, to say he wouldnt allow American teams isnt true at all.

I dont think the wings are softer then a few teams out there, but they are definitely soft and could use another Abdelkader in the lineup.

PS isnt it nice to see Abdelkader manning up now and actually scrapping? 5 fights now, probably end up with 6 or 7 before the year is done and hes getting a lot better at it too

To be fair, besides the two best players on that team, they are just about all Canadians.

He does act rather self-entitled about it but Canada DID invent hockey...

Ice Hockey was originated in Canada, but not by Canadians. It was by British troops stationed in Canada who played a variation of their field hockey.

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To be fair, besides the two best players on that team, they are just about all Canadians.

Ice Hockey was originated in Canada, but not by Canadians. It was by British troops stationed in Canada who played a variation of their field hockey.

Yeah but Cherry has never hated America or Americans. Everyone rips on him here but noone has ever memtioned how he did a piece on Abdelkader a couple weeks ago blocking a shot, being hurt and than trying to block another one. He gives Americans plenty of credit all the time. People just dont notice that because after doing that, he'll call the wings soft. Which to be honest they are a pretty soft team, one huge hitter in Kronwall, a couple solid ones with Stuart and Abdelkader, Helm is good for a big one but not consistently at all and ABdelkader seems like the only somewhat willing fighter that plays.

I dont know why people care so much that Cherry points it out. The wings are still a very elite team, but they are fairly soft compared to most teams and definitely are in the bottom 6 or so

ManLuv4Clears likes this

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I used to love Grapes. But he's an old windbag who keeps taking shots at Detroit for no reason. Babcock and Holland have there way, oh ya, the way that WINS. For him to call out Babs, a guy who's won a cup, a gold medal for our country that Don is so proud of, a world championship for that country and a world junior medal makes me sick. Shut your damn mouth Don, that win at the 2010 games is reason enough that Babs is a true Canadian coach and for Don to s*** talk all Detroit does and all the class they build in there organization is a joke. We had a grittier team in 2008, and Don didn't acknowledge that. He never talked about Downey like he talks about Orr, he never mentioned Drake as a catalyst like he did with Mark ******* Recchi last year for the Bruins. He's a fool, as a Canadian, and a damn proud one at that, to hear Don spout off about one of the best Canadian coaches and GMs in the past 10s really pisses me off.

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Ice Hockey was originated in Canada, but not by Canadians. It was by British troops stationed in Canada who played a variation of their field hockey.

By that argument American colonial history is actually British history.

newfy likes this

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The problem with Cherry is that people still watch him. More and more people are turning on him and his 1970's views, but they continue to give him high ratings.

Honestly, I haven't watched Don in about 10 years.

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The problem with Cherry is that people still watch him. More and more people are turning on him and his 1970's views, but they continue to give him high ratings.

Honestly, I haven't watched Don in about 10 years.

He's good for a laugh I guess. Like any reality TV show or something.

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Too bad, indeed. I have tried reasonable discourse, multiple times on this board. All it gets me is hyperbole thrown back, strawmen, and outright personal attacks. So, I fall back on humor.

For #1 Fan, I'll tell you one thing: if Boston ends up not making Shawn Thornton an offer for next year, I REALLY hope the Wings are waiting outside his apartment to get a deal done. He would be perfect for the Winged Wheel. Holland may even go for it because if I recall correctly, Thornton turns 35 this year and we could call it "veteran leadership".

This your first day on the internet?

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I used to love Grapes. But he's an old windbag who keeps taking shots at Detroit for no reason. Babcock and Holland have there way, oh ya, the way that WINS. For him to call out Babs, a guy who's won a cup, a gold medal for our country that Don is so proud of, a world championship for that country and a world junior medal makes me sick. Shut your damn mouth Don, that win at the 2010 games is reason enough that Babs is a true Canadian coach and for Don to s*** talk all Detroit does and all the class they build in there organization is a joke. We had a grittier team in 2008, and Don didn't acknowledge that. He never talked about Downey like he talks about Orr, he never mentioned Drake as a catalyst like he did with Mark ******* Recchi last year for the Bruins. He's a fool, as a Canadian, and a damn proud one at that, to hear Don spout off about one of the best Canadian coaches and GMs in the past 10s really pisses me off.

Actually he did give that 2008 team credit just this season lol

I get the Cherry hate for the s*** he says, but at least know the facts

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Actually he did give that 2008 team credit just this season lol

I get the Cherry hate for the s*** he says, but at least know the facts

Of course the only few times I tune in he rips Detroit, and the one time he gives them credit I miss it. Figures, he can still suck it :hehe:

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Of course the only few times I tune in he rips Detroit, and the one time he gives them credit I miss it. Figures, he can still suck it :hehe:

Yeah I think when he really rips on the wings people catch wind of it but when he compliments them people forget, you tend to remember the negative and forget positive stuff.

That Abdelkader bit was definitely telling everyone how much guts he had for blocking those shots, and last time he ripped the wings for not being tough enough he was talking about how in 08 they could handle the rough stuff with Downey Mac and Drake regular season and Mac and Drake in the playoffs. He really just said what a lot of people here including myself say at that time

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Yeah I think when he really rips on the wings people catch wind of it but when he compliments them people forget, you tend to remember the negative and forget positive stuff.

That Abdelkader bit was definitely telling everyone how much guts he had for blocking those shots, and last time he ripped the wings for not being tough enough he was talking about how in 08 they could handle the rough stuff with Downey Mac and Drake regular season and Mac and Drake in the playoffs. He really just said what a lot of people here including myself say at that time

No doubt Cherry makes good points, I just think he takes it a little too far at times. I agree with him in that we need to play grittier to succeed in the playoffs, but the amount of fighting majors a team has does not guarantee anyone the Cup.

Cherry takes about Vancouver being "Tough", listing Lapierre and Weise, and Volpatti, who has been hurt all year. They're a bunch of spot-pickers. The only gritty player on Vancouver I respect is Byron Bitz. We've handled them pretty well in the fighting department this year. Abdelkader has smoked Yapierre twice, and Bertuzzi handled Ballard pretty easily.

Edited by Bring Back The Bruise Bros
F.Michael likes this

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When was the last time that Hank, Pav, or Lidstrom missed a game because someone took a run at them, mugged them, or otherwise hurt them? I object to the idea that we should change our already good lineup around in order to protect against some hypothetical problem which never actually happens, even when we don't have an enforcer. Especially when we've got real problems, like the inability of our second line to produce/play defense when facing tougher matchups on the road. Fix that problem via trade, not this mythical "protect the stars from muggings" b.s. which I'm fairly sure is just used as an excuse to bring in a fighter because some people have a preference for that type of hockey.

It's not so much changing the line-up as it is making an addition, or two...Guys like Moen/Gaustad are respectable 3rd/4th line guys who can play a decent defensive game in our own end of the ice while adding a physical presence to our forward lines.

I agree with jroc86 concerning the last few minutes of any game in which the Red Wings may have a significant lead; some teams like the Sharks/Ducks may go ahead, and "send a message" by attempting to rough up some of our guys...Personally I'd rather have someone like Moen/Gaustad out there so in case if something happens.

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It's not so much changing the line-up as it is making an addition, or two...Guys like Moen/Gaustad are respectable 3rd/4th line guys who can play a decent defensive game in our own end of the ice while adding a physical presence to our forward lines.

I agree with jroc86 concerning the last few minutes of any game in which the Red Wings may have a significant lead; some teams like the Sharks/Ducks may go ahead, and "send a message" by attempting to rough up some of our guys...Personally I'd rather have someone like Moen/Gaustad out there so in case if something happens.

Again, you want to change the roster in order to fix a problem that "may" happen in the "last few minutes". I don't see what Moen or Gaustad are going to do in the last couple of minutes that Bert or Abby can't. The reason we don't have tough guys on in those cases is not because we don't have them, it's because Babs doesn't put them on the ice at the end of the game. I don't see that philosophy changing just because we bring in a guy like Gaustad or Moen. Don't get me wrong, they're good players, but they don't give us anything we don't already have, and they don't protect us against anything other than the chance that somebody, somewhere, sometime, might take a run out of frustration. And like I said, when was the last time one of our stars missed a game because of that?

Note: Also, fighting rarely happens in the playoffs, either for or against. So presumably, if we're advocating bringing someone over to protect our guys, then we're talking about protecting them during the duration of the regular season. As we haven't lost any key players to dirty hits or muggings so far this season, and in a month or two nobody will be fighting anymore anyway, what's the point? What are we going to do, lose a pick or prospect for Moen or Guastad in order to keep Hank, Pav, or Lidstrom safe and healthy for a next month?

Edited by kipwinger

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Fighting doesn't help protect anyone, if anything it makes the game more dangerous and emotional, players are going to take dirty hits depending on the situation the person being checked is in, not because there is someone on the bench that will try and challenge them to a fight they don't have to accept . Fighting's only use is for entertainment and a way to get momentum back in the game, that's it. And the second one works against your team 50% of the time. I'd personally prefer a team that just wins games rather than .

kipwinger likes this

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Cherry is harmless. I love his rhetoric but lately he's gone too dinosaur with his bruiser talk. He needs to find a new topic otherwise he;ll end up like the original HNIC theme song.

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Again, you want to change the roster in order to fix a problem that "may" happen in the "last few minutes". I don't see what Moen or Gaustad are going to do in the last couple of minutes that Bert or Abby can't. The reason we don't have tough guys on in those cases is not because we don't have them, it's because Babs doesn't put them on the ice at the end of the game. I don't see that philosophy changing just because we bring in a guy like Gaustad or Moen. Don't get me wrong, they're good players, but they don't give us anything we don't already have, and they don't protect us against anything other than the chance that somebody, somewhere, sometime, might take a run out of frustration. And like I said, when was the last time one of our stars missed a game because of that?

Note: Also, fighting rarely happens in the playoffs, either for or against. So presumably, if we're advocating bringing someone over to protect our guys, then we're talking about protecting them during the duration of the regular season. As we haven't lost any key players to dirty hits or muggings so far this season, and in a month or two nobody will be fighting anymore anyway, what's the point? What are we going to do, lose a pick or prospect for Moen or Guastad in order to keep Hank, Pav, or Lidstrom safe and healthy for a next month?

Changing the roster :blink:

Well for what it's worth Holland has been rumored looking into both of these guys (meaning trying to acquire 1, but not necessarily both); I'm sure there's a reason for that...Add to the fact that both of these guys can play, have good size, and don't mind the rough stuff from time to time only adds to their value for what could potentially be a long playoff run which btw if ya haven't noticed - we've lost to the Sharks these past few years - ya know - that team that has some good size guys on their roster, and aren't afraid to use that size to their advantage.

It's not so much about "protecting our stars" as it is adding an element to the roster that IMHO has been lacking these past few years...If they can be out there to keep the puck in the oppositions end of the ice by mucking and grinding in the corners, help kill off a penalty, help protect a lead in the last minutes of the game, or be out there if the other team wants to send a message - then great cause that's what we can use guys like Moen/Gaustad for.

Fighting doesn't help protect anyone, if anything it makes the game more dangerous and emotional, players are going to take dirty hits depending on the situation the person being checked is in, not because there is someone on the bench that will try and challenge them to a fight they don't have to accept . Fighting's only use is for entertainment and a way to get momentum back in the game, that's it. And the second one works against your team 50% of the time. I'd personally prefer a team that just wins games rather than .

Hmm - I always thought fighting was a way to "vent" so to speak...Would you rather see a 2-handed stick swinging competition?

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The rare times I might see Don Cherry on TV, I just view him for entertainment purpose and to see what spiffy suit he has on next.

While what he might typically say about toughness or brass knuckles is accurate, generally speaking, he goes so overboard with it that I don't take him seriously and it's not worth getting panties in a bunch over his same schtick.

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Changing the roster :blink:

Well for what it's worth Holland has been rumored looking into both of these guys (meaning trying to acquire 1, but not necessarily both); I'm sure there's a reason for that...Add to the fact that both of these guys can play, have good size, and don't mind the rough stuff from time to time only adds to their value for what could potentially be a long playoff run which btw if ya haven't noticed - we've lost to the Sharks these past few years - ya know - that team that has some good size guys on their roster, and aren't afraid to use that size to their advantage.

It's not so much about "protecting our stars" as it is adding an element to the roster that IMHO has been lacking these past few years...If they can be out there to keep the puck in the oppositions end of the ice by mucking and grinding in the corners, help kill off a penalty, help protect a lead in the last minutes of the game, or be out there if the other team wants to send a message - then great cause that's what we can use guys like Moen/Gaustad for.

Hmm - I always thought fighting was a way to "vent" so to speak...Would you rather see a 2-handed stick swinging competition?

1. Don't see a lot of two handed stick swinging competitions either, whether in the regular season or the playoffs. 2. I hope you're not insinuating that you want Gaustad or Moen to fight against the big guys from San Jose in the playoffs. 3. I don't mind the idea of acquiring a forward because they're good in the defensive zone, or because they use their size and strength to cycle the puck, or finish their checks, or any number of other things. I wasn't arguing against acquiring good and helpful players. I was suggesting that some people attempt to justify roster changes based on something that never happens. If you want to get Gaustad or Moen because they're potentially helpful...fine. If you want to get them because they'll "stop Thornton from mugging our stars", then you're blind or lying...because our stars aren't getting mugged. That's all.

Edited by kipwinger

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1. Don't see a lot of two handed stick swinging competitions either, whether in the regular season or the playoffs. 2. I hope you're not insinuating that you want Gaustad or Moen to fight against the big guys from San Jose in the playoffs. 3. I don't mind the idea of acquiring a forward because they're good in the defensive zone, or because they use their size and strength to cycle the puck, or finish their checks, or any number of other things. I wasn't arguing against acquiring good and helpful players. I was suggesting that some people attempt to justify roster changes based on something that never happens. If you want to get Gaustad or Moen because they're potentially helpful...fine. If you want to get them because they'll "stop Thornton from mugging our stars", then you're blind or lying...because our stars aren't getting mugged. That's all.

No, those guys are helpful and will help protect the stars. Late in a game where you used to see the Ducks goon guys at the buzzer in playoffs, Gaustad or Moen can be trusted out there. Noone has ever said get these guys cause they can fight. Fighting is definitely part of it but its because theyre useless in other areas as well that this team is really lacking.

If people wanted someone to just fight they wouldnt be suggesting these guys, they would be suggesting Colton Orr

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No, those guys are helpful and will help protect the stars. Late in a game where you used to see the Ducks goon guys at the buzzer in playoffs, Gaustad or Moen can be trusted out there. Noone has ever said get these guys cause they can fight. Fighting is definitely part of it but its because theyre useless in other areas as well that this team is really lacking.

If people wanted someone to just fight they wouldnt be suggesting these guys, they would be suggesting Colton Orr

Dude I agree with everything you said, but if you look back over the posts you'll see my whole line of comments came as a response to someone who thought we should get these guys to stop Joe Thornton, and guys like him, from "mugging" Pavel, Hank, and Lidstrom. I just said that this particular justification is stupid. Not that Moen or Gaustad where bad players. And after watching Franzen blow his coverage last night on the game tying goal in the waning seconds of the third, I'd be thrilled to see almost any player on the ice in the last minute rather than him and big Bert. No knock on Bert, but maybe someone with a little defensive acumen when you're trying to protect a lead. Nevermind, that's beside the point.

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No, those guys are helpful and will help protect the stars. Late in a game where you used to see the Ducks goon guys at the buzzer in playoffs, Gaustad or Moen can be trusted out there. Noone has ever said get these guys cause they can fight. Fighting is definitely part of it but its because theyre useless in other areas as well that this team is really lacking.

If people wanted someone to just fight they wouldnt be suggesting these guys, they would be suggesting Colton Orr

This right here.

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