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Legwand to Detroit for Eaves, Jarnkrok + cond 3rd/2nd



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#1001 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 01:32 PM

The trade came in at 259 cause Poile did his job and holland caved just like snow did with vanek .... Legwand is 33 and a ufa , jarnkrok is 22 .... Yes we lost that one

You said it yourself he was on the 4th line and he was one of the younger players so I doubt he got much ice time

Legwand is a 33 yr old ufa who's clearly not a top liner and of those 3 you mentioned as well as jarnkrok is over payment .... If Matt moulson fetched 2 2nd rounders i think it would of fetched legwand as well .... A 3rd round pick becomes a 2nd if we miss the playoffs .... 2 2nd rounders and eaves would of been more than enough in my opinion

Well never know now

If jarnkrok is expendable as you say we would of been better off putting Him in a package deal for a defensemen we needed not for legwand

Edited by nyqvististhefuture, 10 March 2014 - 01:34 PM.


#1002 wingslionstigers

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 02:04 PM

 

If jarnkrok is expendable as you say we would of been better off putting Him in a package deal for a defensemen we needed not for legwand

I'm done arguing with you about the rest of the stuff because we been over it all 10 times.. But this part shows you clearly have no credibility in knowing what your talking about. It won't get the point across to you but everyone else reading will see it.

We WERE going to get a defense-men until we lost all of our centers to injury. A center is MUCH more important than a D in order for this team to make the playoffs. The D we have now can get the job done just like they did last year, the centers we are left with could not. Franzen was being used as a our first line center and Andersson was centering our second line. You do realize how little games are left and our centers are going to be out most of the season if not all of it. You do realize how important centers are right? You do realize center is the most important role on the team to have quality players filling the position? You cannot win in the NHL without decent centers. We have no choice but to get a very capable center if we are going to make the playoffs. Picking up a D would have not helped us much. Our D isn't the best but it's an NHL caliber core that can get the job done. The centers we had left injury free were not NHL caliber. Do you understand hockey? Do you understand how important it is for this franchise to make the playoffs? Whether we make it or not we had to make a move to give ourselves a chance. Holland did exactly that, he made a move that gives us a chance and he made a good one. It was a move that HAD to be made. We don't trade often like the chart on the last page indicates, but we had to do this. It is a business and this business has a lot on the line.



#1003 kipwinger

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 02:17 PM

Yeah because the trade didn't finish and submit to the league within 1 minute of the dead line.

 

At base case scenario he becomes as good as Legwand is now? Yeah we really lost that one.


No I'm judging him because he didn't perform at the world cup and was a 4th line player. You know that thing were all great NHL players performed well at? That's where you get a look at your players for the first time and how they compete with and against other highly praised NHL prospects. That's where Jarnkrok lost value and its for good reason.

 

He didn't perform well in 19 games in the World Championships (which is made up of junior players) but did perform well in more than 19 games in the AHL (made up of professionals).  I'm not sure what your point is here?  That a couple years ago, in a small sub-sample, he didn't perform well?  Agreed.  But it's equally true that he's now playing much better hockey in a much more difficult league.

 

Any value he lost (not sure he did), he regained by being a stud over his last 36 games with the Griffins.


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#1004 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 02:34 PM

He didn't perform well in 19 games in the World Championships (which is made up of junior players) but did perform well in more than 19 games in the AHL (made up of professionals).  I'm not sure what your point is here?  That a couple years ago, in a small sub-sample, he didn't perform well?  Agreed.  But it's equally true that he's now playing much better hockey in a much more difficult league.
 
Any value he lost (not sure he did), he regained by being a stud over his last 36 games with the Griffins.


Nice to see we agree on something for once lol

I'm done arguing with you about the rest of the stuff because we been over it all 10 times.. But this part shows you clearly have no credibility in knowing what your talking about. It won't get the point across to you but everyone else reading will see it.
We WERE going to get a defense-men until we lost all of our centers to injury. A center is MUCH more important than a D in order for this team to make the playoffs. The D we have now can get the job done just like they did last year, the centers we are left with could not. Franzen was being used as a our first line center and Andersson was centering our second line. You do realize how little games are left and our centers are going to be out most of the season if not all of it. You do realize how important centers are right? You do realize center is the most important role on the team to have quality players filling the position? You cannot win in the NHL without decent centers. We have no choice but to get a very capable center if we are going to make the playoffs. Picking up a D would have not helped us much. Our D isn't the best but it's an NHL caliber core that can get the job done. The centers we had left injury free were not NHL caliber. Do you understand hockey? Do you understand how important it is for this franchise to make the playoffs? Whether we make it or not we had to make a move to give ourselves a chance. Holland did exactly that, he made a move that gives us a chance and he made a good one. It was a move that HAD to be made. We don't trade often like the chart on the last page indicates, but we had to do this. It is a business and this business has a lot on the line.


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#1005 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 03:29 PM

If you'd like to guarantee that your post gets deleted, please be sure to include statements about people crying and complaining.  

 

If you'd like to actually discuss the trade, feel free and keep it within forum rules.  

 

On the other hand if you feel the topic has been beat to death, simply don't post in the thread. 



#1006 nawein

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 03:57 PM

If you'd like to guarantee that your post gets deleted, please be sure to include statements about people crying and complaining.  
 
If you'd like to actually discuss the trade, feel free and keep it within forum rules.  
 
On the other hand if you feel the topic has been beat to death, simply don't post in the thread. 


My apologies. My point was simply that the trade was of a benefit to us now because our C group looks substantially better with Legwand as opposed to entirely taken from GR.

#1007 darkmanx

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 04:00 PM

My apologies. My point was simply that the trade was of a benefit to us now because our C group looks substantially better with Legwand as opposed to entirely taken from GR.

 

You are not wrong, most people agree with you. The ones that don't..... yeah, not gonna go there. :lol:



#1008 Son of a Wing

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 04:38 PM

Haven't said much in this thread but I will say this...

 

We are fickle fans.  We demand Holland make more trades for impact players but then crucify him if we have to give up anything of value.

 

The trade was never going to be Eaves a 3rd and Ferraro/marginal prospect.  Nobody wants that. There's next to no value in that trade.

 

We can all debate future and potential but none of that is certain so it's all conjecture for now.

 

Legwand would be a core piece and top 6 guy on any team in this league.  He is that good whether people want to admit that or not.  

 

No he's not a flashy/sexy player like Vanek, but he also isn't a known, pure rental and probably(hopefully) has a future here

 

I also have faith they wouldn't have made this deal if they weren't confident he will re-sign here. 

 

No that does not equate to him being a shoe-in to come here in the off-season regardless of the trade or not.

 

It means a lot to a player when a team pursues and "wants" you and is willing to give up assets to get you.  It sends a message.  Anyone can throw money come UFA time.

 

Combine that with our culture, great group of very well-liked and respected leadership group, young future players and the fact that his he's from Michigan and you've got a great appeal and likeliness to re-sign.

 

Starting next season (possibly this post-season if we can get healthy) we are going to have a very talented and deep group of forwards and I personally cannot wait to see what they are capable of.


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#1009 VM1138

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 06:22 PM

The graph previously posted shows the number of trades has nothing to do woth success or winning Cups. You've got winners all along that spectrum.
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#1010 wingslionstigers

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 08:31 PM

 

He didn't perform well in 19 games in the World Championships (which is made up of junior players) but did perform well in more than 19 games in the AHL (made up of professionals).  I'm not sure what your point is here?  That a couple years ago, in a small sub-sample, he didn't perform well?  Agreed.  But it's equally true that he's now playing much better hockey in a much more difficult league.

 

Any value he lost (not sure he did), he regained by being a stud over his last 36 games with the Griffins.

 

2011-12 stats_arrow.gif Brynäs stats_arrow.gif SHL 50 16 23 39 22 -3 | stats_arrow.gif Playoffs 16 4 12 16 12 12    stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif EHT 6 1 1 2 2 -2 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif WC 8 0 1 1 0 0 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden (all) stats_arrow.gif International 18 2 3 5 2 -6 |                2012-13 stats_arrow.gif Brynäs A.png  loan.pngstats_arrow.gif SHL 53 13 29 42 12 -2 | stats_arrow.gif Playoffs 4 0 0 0 6 -3    stats_arrow.gif Grand Rapids Griffins stats_arrow.gif AHL 9 0 3 3 0 3 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif EHT 5 0 2 2 2 2 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif WC 10 0 1 1 4 -2 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden (all) stats_arrow.gif International 16 0 2 2



#1011 Carman

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 09:31 PM

 

2011-12 stats_arrow.gif Brynäs stats_arrow.gif SHL 50 16 23 39 22 -3 | stats_arrow.gif Playoffs 16 4 12 16 12 12    stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif EHT 6 1 1 2 2 -2 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif WC 8 0 1 1 0 0 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden (all) stats_arrow.gif International 18 2 3 5 2 -6 |                2012-13 stats_arrow.gif Brynäs A.png  loan.pngstats_arrow.gif SHL 53 13 29 42 12 -2 | stats_arrow.gif Playoffs 4 0 0 0 6 -3    stats_arrow.gif Grand Rapids Griffins stats_arrow.gif AHL 9 0 3 3 0 3 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif EHT 5 0 2 2 2 2 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden stats_arrow.gif WC 10 0 1 1 4 -2 |                 stats_arrow.gif Sweden (all) stats_arrow.gif International 16 0 2 2  

Last year and the year before at any level. Not impressive no arguing that. Go look up Zetterberg, Backstrom, Johanson, and other top Swedes when they played at the same level at the same age. Not comparable. Please post a game by game for his last 36 in the AHL I would be curious to see it as I have not yet found it.

 

Kids? Is that more of you making things up to defend your case?

His play back a few years was impacted by his size, which is not a tremendous issue for him anymore. Jarnkrok is a great prospect, there really shouldn't be a need to try and downplay his talent. The whole situation comes down to several reasons that are largely just based on opinions,

Bad Trade:

1. You think this season is a loss already, and should have kept future potential.

2. You think Legwand is only going to play 20 games with the Red Wings and the Wings lost Jarnkrok for nothing.

3. You like Legwand, but are sold on Jarnkrok becoming a top line center.

 

Good Trade.

1. You like Legwand, and think the evidence is there that he will resign.

2. Wings filled an immediate need by giving up a player that wouldn't fill that need for years.

etc.

 

Personally I think Jarnkrok was a great prospect his play the last few months has been fantastic, he's great with the puck, his defense is very underrated, his skating is good, there isn't a negative about him other than he's not going out and hammering people into the boards, but I also felt the Wings need for a center for the present season, outweighed the risk of hoping the development of Jarnkrok a few years down the road.



#1012 number9

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 02:14 AM

If you want Dats and Z winning a cup before they retire, the trade was right. If Weiss becomes the player he was then we have an incredible veteran top 6.

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Alfredsson (all three could reach, or be close to, point per game)
Weiss - Legwand - Franzen (all could hit 60+ points)

Then you have our bottom 6 made up of superb young scorers and grinders to choose from: Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, sheahan, Miller, Helm, Abdelkader, Glendening, Andersson.

Howard and Gus have both struggled with our D (The arguments that Gus is better bc he has "happened" to win more games while in net is ridiculous to me, the skater are not, or at least should not be, affected by the man in the net, I strike it up to coincidence)

We fix the D and this team is a powerhouse



#1013 rrasco

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 03:33 PM

I didn't want Calle to go, but it had to be done.  The biggest thing bumming me out is I started following him on Twitter about 3 hours before he was traded.  Nice foreshadowing Twitter.


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#1014 puckloo39

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 03:51 PM

The graph previously posted shows the number of trades tirades has nothing to do with success or winning Cups. You've got winners all along that spectrum.

 

we have more than enough of one, but apparently not enough of the other.   ;)

 

I wish there had been a quality D man out there, but there wasn't.  Kenny did fine by picking up Legwand, who is hopefully less breakable than some of our current forwards.


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#1015 Internet.Unknown

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 04:02 PM

I didn't want Calle to go, but it had to be done.  The biggest thing bumming me out is I started following him on Twitter about 3 hours before he was traded.  Nice foreshadowing Twitter.

 

Aha! So it's your fault he was traded. :P



#1016 GoOzzieGo

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 05:07 PM

"Weiss - Legwand - Franzen (all could hit 60+ points)"
 

 

 

 

I think you have lofty expectations.  Legwand has reached 60+ points in a season only once, and that was 8 seasons ago.  At age 33/34, do you expect him to suddenly get so much better?  And Franzen has never reached 60 points in a season in his entire career.


Edited by GoOzzieGo, 11 March 2014 - 05:08 PM.


#1017 number9

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 08:13 PM

 

I think you have lofty expectations.  Legwand has reached 60+ points in a season only once, and that was 8 seasons ago.  At age 33/34, do you expect him to suddenly get so much better?  And Franzen has never reached 60 points in a season in his entire career.

The word "could" does not mean I expect anything

Legwand has also been on pace for 60+ three separate seasons, and has never played in a system with good wingers until now. Franzen has been on pace for over 60 twice and is on pace for 70+ right now. So yeah it's something that "could" happen, especially if all this bad injury juju stops



#1018 frankgrimes

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 05:31 PM


 
I think you have lofty expectations.  Legwand has reached 60+ points in a season only once, and that was 8 seasons ago.  At age 33/34, do you expect him to suddenly get so much better?  And Franzen has never reached 60 points in a season in his entire career.



The word "could" does not mean I expect anything
Legwand has also been on pace for 60+ three separate seasons, and has never played in a system with good wingers until now. Franzen has been on pace for over 60 twice and is on pace for 70+ right now. So yeah it's something that "could" happen, especially if all this bad injury juju stops


All I can say is packaging Jarnkrok with a first could have given us Amac and defensive help should have been the number 1 priority going forward.

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#1019 wings4thecup06

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 05:46 PM

All I can say is packaging Jarnkrok with a first could have given us Amac and defensive help should have been the number 1 priority going forward.

 

I have to disagree. What would have happened if we had got Amac for that? Then Andersson still goes down, we don't even have a number one/two centre anymore. Bye bye playoffs. This way, we're still in contention, and, we can get Legwand re-signed then this deal looks all the better. 

 

Plus, what's not to say that Amac was looking for his big payday on the free agent market? Everyone finally knows who he is and what he can do, and there's not a lot out there defensive wise. If he walked, then we've just given up a legitimate prospect and a first, all for what? 2 months of better D. This way, if we re-sign Legwand, we get better depth up front now and moving forward. 


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#1020 Dabura

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Posted 17 March 2014 - 03:06 AM

I like this deal better now that we're struggling. The logic being, Holland might've turned Jarnkrok into several seasons of service from David Legwand (who we'd probably appreciate much more with a fully healthy forward corps) and a really good first-round draft pick who might be better than Jarnkrok (provided we miss the playoffs, of course).


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