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Legwand to Detroit for Eaves, Jarnkrok + cond 3rd/2nd



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#1081 pucktividi

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 09:42 AM

Yeah, because a tiny sample size on a completely DIFFERENT team is surely a great way to judge.

 

Fair enough,but it's not about the judgment of LGW posters.It's about Hakan Andersson and he rarely makes the wrong prediction about his picks,Jarnkrok included.



#1082 Euro_Twins

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 09:56 AM

Well my beef more than anything is we should of got legwand without having to give up a jarnkrok ... I'm sorry legwand is a nice player but he's not a star and he is a ufa (doesn't matter if we resign him or not)

We should of guaranteed the 2nd round pick , add another 2nd rounder .... Whatever needed to be done

If we paid that much for a legwand I'd really hate to see what we'd give up for a top 4 dman now ... now I don't even want us to make that deal , rather toughen it out and keep our guys

Look at sheahan everyone thought he'd be a bottom 6 guy and he's been awesome , way exceeded our expectations .... You just never know until you give them a few games

True or you can say nashvilles roster isn't near as good as ours so imagine if he was playing here with a nyquist or Alfie on his wing .... If he was here I think he'd of gotten some points


The deal was put in 1 minute before the deadline, there was no time left for bargains, he tried everything possible, and in the end he gave poile what he wanted, because he had no choice and no time left.

#1083 FireCaptain

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 11:06 AM

My issue is with the fact that every time he scores a point people are like "OMFG he scored another point!!" big freakin deal, we needed an asset, we had to give up an asset. End of story. Stop collectively pining for our ex-girlfriend, she's gone and we're dating a cougar now. (Age joke about legwand, ftw!)

Yeah, because a tiny sample size on a completely DIFFERENT team is surely a great way to judge.   Fair enough,but it's not about the judgment of LGW posters.It's about Hakan Andersson and he rarely makes the wrong prediction about his picks,Jarnkrok included.
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#1084 PavelValerievichDatsyuk

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 11:27 AM

Nobody knows what happened with the logistics of the deal except Holland, Poile, and maybe the NSA. Any guesses as to progression of negotiations are just conjecture and I don't believe they add much weight to any argument.



#1085 Euro_Twins

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 11:29 AM

Nobody knows what happened with the logistics of the deal except Holland, Poile, and maybe the NSA. Any guesses as to progression of negotiations are just conjecture and I don't believe they add much weight to any argument.


Stating a fact isn't conjecture, they were talking till the last minute before they made the deal. I didn't say Holland offered player x and poile declined, Holland was in a tough spot and Poile got as much as he could from Holland

#1086 DickieDunn

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 12:38 PM

A few points. First, like I said earlier the, if I was in Poile's place I would have been asking for Tatar, Nyquist, or Jurco before Jarnkrok. Second, Jarnkrok is a prospect. Tell me about how good he is in a couple seasons. Third, Hakan Andersson is not the God he gets credited as. He misses on a lot of guys too, and he's not the only European scout they have. He's in charge of them but he's not working alone.

Oh this young man has had a very trying rookie season, with the litigation, the notoriety, his subsequent deportation to Canada and that country's refusal to accept him, well, I guess that's more than most 21-year-olds can handle... Ogie Ogilthorpe!


#1087 marcaractac

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 02:18 PM

2 pts in 2games in NSH so far PISSED

 

Are people really gonna get upset and post in here every time he gets a single point?

 

Seriously though, I don't get why people are so worried. Holland is NEVER going to sell the farm. When was the last time he gave up one of our better prospects? Mathias? I don't see anyone flipping out about him getting 10 points in his last 11 games. 

 

Holland made a trade he absolutely had to make. Real life isn't NHL 14. You're not gonna get guys like Legwand for a couple of picks unless you wanna make one of them a 1st rounder. And before anyone mentions Vanek, A solid 2 way center who works his ass off has more value than a one dimensional winger who is lazy on the back check. Especially when said center will very likely resign, and Vanek has specifically said he wants to test the market. 

 

Up until this point, getting Legwand has been a season saving trade. More than worth a prospect. People should just do themselves a favor and stop getting angry every time Jarnkrok gets a point. If that's all you have to worry about in life, you got it pretty good. 



#1088 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 02:35 PM

Are people really gonna get upset and post in here every time he gets a single point?
 
Seriously though, I don't get why people are so worried. Holland is NEVER going to sell the farm. When was the last time he gave up one of our better prospects? Mathias? I don't see anyone flipping out about him getting 10 points in his last 11 games. 
 
Holland made a trade he absolutely had to make. Real life isn't NHL 14. You're not gonna get guys like Legwand for a couple of picks unless you wanna make one of them a 1st rounder. And before anyone mentions Vanek, A solid 2 way center who works his ass off has more value than a one dimensional winger who is lazy on the back check. Especially when said center will very likely resign, and Vanek has specifically said he wants to test the market. 
 
Up until this point, getting Legwand has been a season saving trade. More than worth a prospect. People should just do themselves a favor and stop getting angry every time Jarnkrok gets a point. If that's all you have to worry about in life, you got it pretty good.


You forgot to add moulson for 2 2nd round picks .... Again legwand is good but he's not a star , it shouldn't of cost us what we gave up to land him

You talk about us not trading the future away it's just 1 guy .... If we gave up a top 3? Top 5 ? prospect for legwand then what would we have to give up for a top 4 dman ? Tatar jurco 1st and ouellet type deal? F that (jarnkrok would of been better used in a deal like that )

And as for legwand love the addition he's surely helped us but I wouldn't say he's saved our season alone .... He's not the reason nyquist has exploded and has been scoring at will .... If anything he's the one who's saving our season with his goal production , I'd still say we would be in the playoff hunt if legwand wasn't here


Just my opinion

#1089 marcaractac

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 02:45 PM

You forgot to add moulson for 2 2nd round picks .... Again legwand is good but he's not a star , it shouldn't of cost us what we gave up to land him

You talk about us not trading the future away it's just 1 guy .... If we gave up a top 3? Top 5 ? prospect for legwand then what would we have to give up for a top 4 dman ? Tatar jurco 1st and ouellet type deal? F that (jarnkrok would of been better used in a deal like that )

And as for legwand love the addition he's surely helped us but I wouldn't say he's saved our season alone .... He's not the reason nyquist has exploded and has been scoring at will .... If anything he's the one who's saving our season with his goal production , I'd still say we would be in the playoff hunt if legwand wasn't here


Just my opinion

 

Moulson is also a winger. Like I said, centers have more value. Jarnkrok isn't a star either, and most likely never will be. 

 

And like I said before. No Legwand makes this a team with only one line that can score. That becomes easy for teams to shut down, and we don't do things like go 3-0-1 in the last 4 games with all of our eggs in one basket. There is absolutely no chance this team is in a wild card spot without this trade happening. You're convincing yourself otherwise, because you are too hung up on giving up Jarnkrok. 

 

You don't get a top six 2-way center with a couple 2nd round picks. This isn't a video game.


Edited by marcaractac, 24 March 2014 - 02:46 PM.


#1090 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 02:54 PM

Moulson is also a winger. Like I said, centers have more value. Jarnkrok isn't a star either, and most likely never will be. 
 
And like I said before. No Legwand makes this a team with only one line that can score. That becomes easy for teams to shut down, and we don't do things like go 3-0-1 in the last 4 games with all of our eggs in one basket. There is absolutely no chance this team is in a wild card spot without this trade happening. You're convincing yourself otherwise, because you are too hung up on giving up Jarnkrok. 
 
You don't get a top six 2-way center with a couple 2nd round picks. This isn't a video game.


Jarnkrok is a top prospect and you don't give them up for 33yr old ufa's(doesn't matter he will probably resign here)

And in my opinion legwand is a good 2way center but no way on a good team is he a top 6 guy , I'd say he'd be a perfect 3rd line guy

You talk about how we wouldn't be succeeding with 1 line scoring well it's pretty much been the kids who have taken over and maybe a few others . Legwand has 7 Pts and 3 in one game right?so basically 4 pts in 9 games which is nothing to brag about

Nyquist tatar alfredsson sheahan has been the main guys up front of late ...... I might be a little obsessed with jarnkrok as you say but I think your giving legwand way too much credit , he's not our saviour

#1091 Euro_Twins

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 02:58 PM

Jarnkrok is a top prospect and you don't give them up for 33yr old ufa's(doesn't matter he will probably resign here)

And in my opinion legwand is a good 2way center but no way on a good team is he a top 6 guy , I'd say he'd be a perfect 3rd line guy

You talk about how we wouldn't be succeeding with 1 line scoring well it's pretty much been the kids who have taken over and maybe a few others . Legwand has 7 Pts and 3 in one game right?so basically 4 pts in 9 games which is nothing to brag about

Nyquist tatar alfredsson sheahan has been the main guys up front of late ...... I might be a little obsessed with jarnkrok as you say but I think your giving legwand way too much credit , he's not our saviour

 

what 3rd line center is putting up 45-50  points/year, and being defensively sound? 



#1092 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:01 PM

what 3rd line center is putting up 45-50  points/year, and being defensively sound?


He's currently a top 6 here isn't he? And he was in Nashville cause they never had any forward on the team .... I'm saying I don't think he's a top 6 player in actuality

#1093 Euro_Twins

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:06 PM

He's currently a top 6 here isn't he? And he was in Nashville cause they never had any forward on the team .... I'm saying I don't think he's a top 6 player in actuality

 

I am saying he is, he can put up the points, he has even put up over 60 points before, and has 47 points this year. Flip was our 2nd line center for some time and only put up 40 points/year. I would love to have enough depth to have him as a 3rd center, but that doesn't mean isn't top 6. He isn't a superstar, but he is good defensively, and is a good playmaker who chips in a few goals. Most 3rd line centers put up 15-30 points/year, he doubles that production.



#1094 number9

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:09 PM

Yeah, because a tiny sample size on a completely DIFFERENT team is surely a great way to judge.
 


Lol I was being a bit sarcastic, I'm glad he's had at least a good start so far for them

#1095 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:16 PM

I am saying he is, he can put up the points, he has even put up over 60 points before, and has 47 points this year. Flip was our 2nd line center for some time and only put up 40 points/year. I would love to have enough depth to have him as a 3rd center, but that doesn't mean isn't top 6. He isn't a superstar, but he is good defensively, and is a good playmaker who chips in a few goals. Most 3rd line centers put up 15-30 points/year, he doubles that production.


Legwand got 60 pts once

if a player keeps getting a lot of ice time chances are they'll rack up points , now if weiss actually wakes up then he's gonna likely be our 2nd Line guy no? In fact if sheahan keeps playing the way he is by next season or 2 yrs I'd think he'd be ahead of him


Jordan staal got 40 + on the 3rd line in Pittsburgh ....berglund has 30 + so far .... Brad Richards and brassard have 46 and 40 now ... Couturier 35 PTs so far .... Only checked a few teams


Chances are if your 3rd line center is getting 15-30 pts the team is likely one of the bottom teams or battling for a spot

Legwand would be a perfect 3rd line guy in my opinion

#1096 Son of a Wing

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:19 PM

He's currently a top 6 here isn't he? And he was in Nashville cause they never had any forward on the team .... I'm saying I don't think he's a top 6 player in actuality

 

I'd love to hear your reasoning for that...


And...you just posted it as I asked...


I disagree.  Top 6 for sure.


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#1097 marcaractac

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:23 PM

Jarnkrok is a top prospect and you don't give them up for 33yr old ufa's(doesn't matter he will probably resign here)

And in my opinion legwand is a good 2way center but no way on a good team is he a top 6 guy , I'd say he'd be a perfect 3rd line guy

You talk about how we wouldn't be succeeding with 1 line scoring well it's pretty much been the kids who have taken over and maybe a few others . Legwand has 7 Pts and 3 in one game right?so basically 4 pts in 9 games which is nothing to brag about

Nyquist tatar alfredsson sheahan has been the main guys up front of late ...... I might be a little obsessed with jarnkrok as you say but I think your giving legwand way too much credit , he's not our saviour

 

Once again, you undervalue Legwand, and overvalue Jarnkrok. Legwand certainly is a 2nd line center. For you to say he isn't a top 6 forward on a good team is actually kind of insane. This is the cap era. Teams don't get to have 50 point guys on their 3rd line anymore. Maybe a team will luck out and have that for 1 year, but even that doesn't happen much. 

 

I agree. The kids have been huge for us. But without Legwand actually giving us a top line for other teams to focus on shutting down, the kids wouldn't find as much success as they currently are. 7 points in 9 games for Legwand has been fantastic, considering everything else he brings to the table as well. If you want to cheer for a team that is afraid to trade a young player or two to improve their team for a playoff run, I'm sure the Oilers would welcome you with open arms.


Legwand got 60 pts once

if a player keeps getting a lot of ice time chances are they'll rack up points , now if weiss actually wakes up then he's gonna likely be our 2nd Line guy no? In fact if sheahan keeps playing the way he is by next season or 2 yrs I'd think he'd be ahead of him


Jordan staal got 40 + on the 3rd line in Pittsburgh ....berglund has 30 + so far .... Brad Richards and brassard have 46 and 40 now ... Couturier 35 PTs so far .... Only checked a few teams


Chances are if your 3rd line center is getting 15-30 pts the team is likely one of the bottom teams or battling for a spot

Legwand would be a perfect 3rd line guy in my opinion

 

Jordan Staal on the 3rd line. And where is he now? A team cannot cap-wise sustain that kind of production on their 3rd line in this league today. 



#1098 nyqvististhefuture

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:36 PM

Once again, you undervalue Legwand, and overvalue Jarnkrok. Legwand certainly is a 2nd line center. For you to say he isn't a top 6 forward on a good team is actually kind of insane. This is the cap era. Teams don't get to have 50 point guys on their 3rd line anymore. Maybe a team will luck out and have that for 1 year, but even that doesn't happen much. 
 
I agree. The kids have been huge for us. But without Legwand actually giving us a top line for other teams to focus on shutting down, the kids wouldn't find as much success as they currently are. 7 points in 9 games for Legwand has been fantastic, considering everything else he brings to the table as well. If you want to cheer for a team that is afraid to trade a young player or two to improve their team for a playoff run, I'm sure the Oilers would welcome you with open arms.
 

Jordan Staal on the 3rd line. And where is he now? A team cannot cap-wise sustain that kind of production on their 3rd line in this league today.

And you over value legwand and undervalue jarnkrok .... Guess well never agree

You don't think teams know nyquist is the guy they have to keep there eye on? Having legwand won't prevent teams from checking nyquist ... Nhl know he's got the hot hand now

Legwand got 40+ in Nashville cause they don't have Any players it all depends on the situation nhl players are in .... You think he'd be a 2nd line guy in Boston with Bergeron and krejci? Flyers with giroux schenn ...Pitts Crosby malkin .... Us if we're healthy and weiss wakes up? Rangers ? (Didn't check every single lineup)

I can tell if you I'd he went to islanders he'd. Be a top 6 ... Florida? Calgary? Winnipeg ? Those aren't top teams though .... Hey on a good team he's a great 3rd line center and that will only benefit the redwings having him on the 3rd line it'll give us more depth and more challenges to other teams

And yes staal is gone but there's teams that have 3rd line guys with 40+ pts , if your 3rd line guys getting 20 pts then most chances are the teams struggling

Edited by nyqvististhefuture, 24 March 2014 - 03:38 PM.


#1099 Son of a Wing

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:45 PM

And you over value legwand and undervalue jarnkrok .... Guess well never agree

You don't think teams know nyquist is the guy they have to keep there eye on? Having legwand won't prevent teams from checking nyquist ... Nhl know he's got the hot hand now

Legwand got 40+ in Nashville cause they don't have Any players it all depends on the situation nhl players are in .... You think he'd be a 2nd line guy in Boston with Bergeron and krejci? Flyers with giroux schenn ...Pitts Crosby malkin .... Us if we're healthy and weiss wakes up? Rangers ? (Didn't check every single lineup)

I can tell if you I'd he went to islanders he'd. Be a top 6 ... Florida? Calgary? Winnipeg ? Those aren't top teams though .... Hey on a good team he's a great 3rd line center and that will only benefit the redwings having him on the 3rd line it'll give us more depth and more challenges to other teams

And yes staal is gone but there's teams that have 3rd line guys with 40+ pts , if your 3rd line guys getting 20 pts then most chances are the teams struggling

 

Do you think Kesler, Backes and Dubinsky are top 6 forwards?? Because they have almost an identical points per game as Legwand and are also good defensively...


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#1100 marcaractac

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 03:45 PM

And you over value legwand and undervalue jarnkrok .... Guess well never agree

Legwand got 40+ in Nashville cause they don't have Any players it all depends on the situation nhl players are in .... You think he'd be a 2nd line guy in Boston with Bergeron and krejci? Flyers with giroux schenn ...Pitts Crosby malkin .... Us if we're healthy and weiss wakes up? Rangers ? (Didn't check every single lineup)

I can tell if you I'd he went to islanders he'd. Be a top 6 ... Florida? Calgary? Winnipeg ? Those aren't top teams though .... Hey on a good team he's a great 3rd line center and that will only benefit the redwings having him on the 3rd line it'll give us more depth and more challenges to other teams

And yes staal is gone but there's teams that have 3rd line guys with 40+ pts , if your 3rd line guys getting 20 pts then most chances are the teams struggling

 

Teams like Boston and Philly wouldn't sign Legwand because they already have 2nd line centers. Be realistic here. The teams who would sign Legwand are teams who need someone like Legwand. Boston wouldn't go and sign him for s***s and giggles. If he went to the Islanders? Guess what. They become a better team. A cup contender? No. Because they are missing more than just centers at this point. Legwand was good for 40+ points on a team that barely scored. A team that depended on a solid defensive system and low scoring to win games. Legwand on a team like a healthy Red Wings team will likely be a 60 point player. 

 

But either way, I'm done with this thread. It is silly at this point. It has become a thread of people complaining every time Jarnkrok gets a point. It is pointless. There is no longer a constructive discussion in here. You keep going on saying everyone suddenly thinks jarnkrok is a useless prospect. No, he is not. But he is useless to us because he is with Nashville now. That will not change. So if you want to keep stressing out as if Jarnkrok is all but guaranteed to be a big star, go ahead. I, along with many Wings fans, can actually see the positives in this trade and not dwell on what ifs. 

 

So glad we have a GM who isn't willing to give up on a season because he is too afraid to trade 1 prospect, when we still have many others, and will continue to draft more. 







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