2020 Draft Thread

[Dabura 12,207]

12 minutes ago, Dabura said:

Like marc, I'd want to know exactly what that 1st is.

Unlike marc, I think I'd have to give this offer some serious thought even if the 1st is outside of the top 3, e.g. 4th or 5th.

Consider:

• Suzuki is the Habs' top center prospect. He's put up 33 points in 54 games as a 20-year-old NHL rookie this season. He shoots right.
• Romanov is the Habs' top D prospect. He's playing in the KHL and is coming off an outstanding WJC. He's NHL-ready right now. He shoots left.
• Primeau is the Habs' top G prospect and one of the better goalie prospects out there.

And on top of that, you're (hypothetically) getting a top 2020 prospect, e.g. Drysdale. So, we'd be filling our 2C hole with a guy who's seemingly well on his way to becoming a 1C, we'd be adding a quality LHD prospect who's ready to step into the NHL right now, we'd be adding a quality goalie prospect who's already got a couple of NHL games under his belt, AND we'd be adding a guy like Drysdale or maybe even Stutzle (I'm not at all convinced that Stutzle is a lock for the top 3).

Also, adding all of those pieces would make some of our other pieces more expendable. Maybe you swing big with an AA+Veleno+Cholo package.

Edited February 3, 2020 by Dabura

[krsmith17 7,191]

8 minutes ago, Dabura said:

Like marc, I'd want to know exactly what that 1st is.

Unlike marc, I think I'd have to give this offer some serious thought even if the 1st is outside of the top 3, e.g. 4th or 5th.

Consider:

• Suzuki is the Habs' top center prospect. He's put up 33 points in 55 games as a 20-year-old NHL rookie this season. He shoots right.
• Romanov is the Habs' top D prospect. He's playing in the KHL and is coming off an outstanding WJC. He's NHL-ready right now. He shoots left.
• Primeau is the Habs' top G prospect and one of the better goalie prospects out there.

And on top of that, you're (hypothetically) getting a top 2020 prospect, e.g. Drysdale. So, we'd be filling our 2C hole with a guy who's seemingly well on his way to becoming a 1C, we'd be adding a quality LHD prospect who's ready to step into the NHL right now, we'd be adding a quality goalie prospect who's already got a couple of NHL games under his belt, AND we'd be adding a guy like Drysdale or maybe even Stutzle (I'm not at all convinced that Stutzle is a lock for the top 3).

Yeah, that's a HUGE package (that's what she said), and one you'd definitely have to consider...

That's FOUR high end prospects for Lafreniere. Depending on how far we'd be dropping in the draft, I'd probably pull the trigger on that one.

If we could pull Suzuki (top six center), Raymond (top six winger), Romanov (top four defenseman), and Primeau (potential starting goalie) from this draft, never mind any of our other picks, that would be HUGE...

Of course this would never happen, so it's moot, but still fun to think about haha.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

Would I trade future Patrick Kane for AA, Marchenko, and McCollum?

No

[krsmith17 7,191]

8 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Would I trade future Patrick Kane for AA, Marchenko, and McCollum?

No

Umm what? Not a single one of those are good comparables... LOL

[Dabura 12,207]

1 minute ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Would I trade future Patrick Kane for AA, Marchenko, and McCollum?

No

That'd be the concern, yeah. Though, I'd argue that each of the three Habs assets is better than his Wings counterpart was at his age.

At any rate, it's all moot, like kr said. And it's probably bulls***.

[marcaractac 3,963]

22 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Yeah, that's a HUGE package (that's what she said), and one you'd definitely have to consider...

That's FOUR high end prospects for Lafreniere. Depending on how far we'd be dropping in the draft, I'd probably pull the trigger on that one.

If we could pull Suzuki (top six center), Raymond (top six winger), Romanov (top four defenseman), and Primeau (potential starting goalie) from this draft, never mind any of our other picks, that would be HUGE...

Of course this would never happen, so it's moot, but still fun to think about haha.

Agreed, except swap Raymond For Drysdale and then acquire Puljujarvi for that righty winger 

It's also the kind of dumb trade I'd expect the Habs to make.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

Umm what? Not a single one of those are good comparables... LOL

You say that with such confidence, but you really have no idea

I could also say: Would I trade future Yakupov for Veleno, Seider, and Howard. Suddenly that looks a lot nicer.

The risk in a trade like that is Primeau, Romanov, and Suzuki could all amount to middling NHL players or complete busts. Whereas Lafren is probably gonna be real friggin good. Imagine if we traded Petruzelli, Veleno, and McIsaac for Lafren. I would do that trade in a heartbeat, and I think the team giving up Lafren for that package would be a fool to take it.

 

[Dabura 12,207]

Just now, krsmith17 said:

Umm what? Not a single one of those are good comparables... LOL

I think his point is more that those are realistic worst-case scenario playouts. Suzuki could easily end up being a good-not-great middle-six forward. Romanov is more dynamic than Marchenko, but he's not a proven point-producer. (Granted, he's a kid defenseman who's spent the past two seasons in the KHL.) There's a lot of HYPE! surrounding Primeau, but his numbers as an AHL rookie are only slightly better than McCollum's and goalies are voodoo anyway.

So: could be a win for us, could be a loss for us, could be a win for each organization. At the end of the day, the Wings would probably be better off keeping Patrick Kane 2.0 and the Habs would probably be better off not gutting their organizational depth for one player.

[krsmith17 7,191]

5 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

You say that with such confidence, but you really have no idea

You said, "Would I trade future Patrick Kane for AA, Marchenko, and McCollum?"... Sounds like you're the one speaking with such confidence...

I'm saying not a single one of them are good comparables, but it's not just one sided...

I think you're underselling Lafreniere, comparing him to Kane. I think you're underselling Suzuki, comparing him to Athanasiou. I think you're underselling Romanov, comparing him to Marchenko. I agree though that Primeau could be a bust.

14 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I could also say: Would I trade future Yakupov for Veleno, Seider, and Howard. Suddenly that looks a lot nicer.

I would say these comparables are just as bad, but mainly because you'd be massively underselling Lafreniere, comparing him to Yakupov. Veleno to Suzuki is at least a decent comparable. Seider to Romanov could be decent comparables. Who knows with Primeau...

21 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

The risk in a trade like that is Primeau, Romanov, and Suzuki could all amount to middling NHL players or complete busts. Whereas Lafren is probably gonna be real friggin good. Imagine if we traded Petruzelli, Veleno, and McIsaac for Lafren. I would do that trade in a heartbeat, and I think the team giving up Lafren for that package would be a fool to take it.

You're also forgetting that pick (2nd-6th) coming back the other way, which could be a very good player as well.

Would you trade Stutzle, Veleno, McIsaac and Petruzzelli for Lafreniere?

[krsmith17 7,191]

17 minutes ago, Dabura said:

I think his point is more that those are realistic worst-case scenario playouts. Suzuki could easily end up being a good-not-great middle-six forward. Romanov is more dynamic than Marchenko, but he's not a proven point-producer. (Granted, he's a kid defenseman who's spent the past two seasons in the KHL.) There's a lot of HYPE! surrounding Primeau, but his numbers as an AHL rookie are only slightly better than McCollum's and goalies are voodoo anyway.

So: could be a win for us, could be a loss for us, could be a win for each organization. At the end of the day, the Wings would probably be better off keeping Patrick Kane 2.0 and the Habs would probably be better off not gutting their organizational depth for one player.

I understood the point. I was more so talking about the comparables in general. I think Lafreniere is closer to a Draisaitl (on the wing), than Kane. I understand the "worst case scenario" angle, but I just don't see it playing out that way. I'm not even saying I'd make the trade, but you'd definitely have to think long and hard about it, depending on the pick coming back. Which is also something CRL didn't mention, being the biggest piece in the trade...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

20 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

You said, "Would I trade future Patrick Kane for AA, Marchenko, and McCollum?"... Sounds like you're the one speaking with such confidence...

I'm saying not a single one of them are good comparables, but it's not just one sided...

I think you're underselling Lafreniere, comparing him to Kane. I think you're underselling Suzuki, comparing him to Athanasiou. I think you're underselling Romanov, comparing him to Marchenko. I agree though that Primeau could be a bust.

I would say these comparables are just as bad, but mainly because you'd be massively underselling Lafreniere, comparing him to Yakupov. Veleno to Suzuki is at least a decent comparable. Seider to Romanov could be decent comparables. Who knows with Primeau...

You're also forgetting that pick (2nd-6th) coming back the other way, which could be a very good player as well.

Would you trade Stutzle, Veleno, McIsaac and Petruzzelli for Lafreniere?

Where'd you buy the crystal ball?

[krsmith17 7,191]

15 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Where'd you buy the crystal ball?

What are you talking about? You're the one that started with the player comparisons...

I simply think you're projections are way off base.

Where did you get your crystal ball?

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

What are you talking about? You're the one that started with the player comparisons...

I simply think you're projections are way off base.

Where did you get your crystal ball?

I didn't project anything. I compared Lafren to Patrick Kane and Yakupov, Suzuki to AA and Veleno, Romanov to Marchenko and Seider, and Primeau to McCollum and Pettruzelli, to make a point that you don't know dick about how good these players are gonna be.

[krsmith17 7,191]

Just now, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I didn't project anything. I compared Lafren to Patrick Kane and Yakupov, Suzuki to AA and Veleno, Romanov to Marchenko and Seider, and Primeau to McCollum and Pettruzelli, to make a point that you don't know dick about how good these players are gonna be.

You did that AFTER the post I replied to... You have a real knack for taking things out of context don't you? Your point was understood, but *in my opinion* your player comparisons are off on both sides of the spectrum. Chances are, they fall somewhere in between. Hell, since we "don't know dick about how good these players are gonna be", Veleno could be Athanasiou 2.0, Seider could be Marchenko 2.0, and Petruzzelli could be McCollum 2.0... I think comparing Lafreniere to Kane is underselling him. Is that me saying "I can see the future"? No. But based on everything we've all seen, heard and read about these two players, I don't see how they're really comparable... Except that they're both really good hockey players...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

4 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

You did that AFTER the post I replied to... You have a real knack for taking things out of context don't you? Your point was understood, but *in my opinion* your player comparisons are off on both sides of the spectrum. Chances are, they fall somewhere in between. Hell, since we "don't know dick about how good these players are gonna be", Veleno could be Athanasiou 2.0, Seider could be Marchenko 2.0, and Petruzzelli could be McCollum 2.0... I think comparing Lafreniere to Kane is underselling him. Is that me saying "I can see the future"? No. But based on everything we've all seen, heard and read about these two players, I don't see how they're really comparable... Except that they're both really good hockey players...

Comparing Lafren to Kane - the player who scored more points than any other player in the NHL over the last decade - is underselling Lafren. Hooooooo boy.

Romanov = sucks

Primeau = worse than Comrie

Suzuki = total loser

Those are my official professional projections if you'd like to debate them.

[krsmith17 7,191]

10 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Comparing Lafren to Kane - the player who scored more points than any other player in the NHL over the last decade - is underselling Lafren. Hooooooo boy.

If this is the case, maybe I'm underselling Kane... I don't buy it though. Do you have a link to back up that stat? Either way, yes, I think Lafreniere will be a better player than Kane. 

16 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Romanov = sucks

Primeau = worse than Comrie

Suzuki = total loser

Those are my official professional projections if you'd like to debate them.

Where did you get your crystal ball?

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

2 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

If this is the case, maybe I'm underselling Kane... I don't buy it though. Do you have a link to back up that stat? Either way, yes, I think Lafreniere will be a better player than Kane.

lol

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/blackhawks/patrick-kanes-decade-was-one-history-books

6 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Where did you get your crystal ball?

I don't have one. Same as you, I pulled those right out of my own ass.

[krsmith17 7,191]

5 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

lol

https://www.nbcsports.com/chicago/blackhawks/patrick-kanes-decade-was-one-history-books

Cool. Didn't know that. Would you say he was the best player of the decade? NBC had him ranked 15th...

6 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I don't have one. Same as you, I pulled those right out of my own ass.

So why can you pull them from your ass, but when I do, you're all like "WhErE'd YoU BuY ThE CrYsTaL BaLl?" durrr...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

8 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Cool. Didn't know that. Would you say he was the best player of the decade? NBC had him ranked 15th...

Top5

Still think I'm underselling Lafren?

10 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

So why can you pull them from your ass, but when I do, you're all like "WhErE'd YoU BuY ThE CrYsTaL BaLl?" durrr...

Because your know-it-all statements, like "not one of those are a single good comparison LOL", are tragic and completely miss the point.

And my ass projections, like Suzuki = total loser, are cheeky and fun.

[krsmith17 7,191]

4 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Top5

Still think I'm underselling Lafren?

Nah, top 5 would be fair I suppose...

5 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Because your know-it-all statements, like "not one of those are a single good comparison LOL", are tragic and completely miss the point.

And my ass projections, like Suzuki = total loser, are cheeky and fun.

And again... You made the "cheeky and fun" projection AFTER I replied to your post...

*In my opinion*, comparing Suzuki, who is over half a point per game center in the NHL, as a 20 year old, to Athanasiou, who was at a similar pace in the AHL, as a winger at the same age, is a bad take...

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

And again... You made the "cheeky and fun" projection AFTER I replied to your post...

*In my opinion*, comparing Suzuki, who is over half a point per game center in the NHL, as a 20 year old, to Athanasiou, who was at a similar pace in the AHL, as a winger at the same age, is a bad take...

4 hours ago, Dabura said:

I think his point is more that those are realistic worst-case scenario playouts. Suzuki could easily end up being a good-not-great middle-six forward. Romanov is more dynamic than Marchenko, but he's not a proven point-producer. (Granted, he's a kid defenseman who's spent the past two seasons in the KHL.) There's a lot of HYPE! surrounding Primeau, but his numbers as an AHL rookie are only slightly better than McCollum's and goalies are voodoo anyway.

So: could be a win for us, could be a loss for us, could be a win for each organization. At the end of the day, the Wings would probably be better off keeping Patrick Kane 2.0 and the Habs would probably be better off not gutting their organizational depth for one player.

 

[LeftWinger 4,963]

you know what sucks the most about this year? We are NOT going to get the #1 pick, and we just watched (are watching) the worst statistical year in my entire life!! we will not even be rewarded with the one player that would not only turn us around quicker, but drafting him could possibly attract some  other players more to want to come play here.  I don't think the likes of Byfield, Stutzle, Rossi, etc... would have that same impact. And it's absolutely stupid that the worst team in the league has an odds on better chance of dropping than they do keeping the #1. Lottery is so flawed! Plus no way a #14 team should be able to jump to a top 5, let alone a #1!!!

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

49 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

you know what sucks the most about this year? We are NOT going to get the #1 pick, and we just watched (are watching) the worst statistical year in my entire life!! we will not even be rewarded with the one player that would not only turn us around quicker, but drafting him could possibly attract some  other players more to want to come play here.  I don't think the likes of Byfield, Stutzle, Rossi, etc... would have that same impact. And it's absolutely stupid that the worst team in the league has an odds on better chance of dropping than they do keeping the #1. Lottery is so flawed! Plus no way a #14 team should be able to jump to a top 5, let alone a #1!!!

I'd rather have Lafren than Montreals entire prospect pool

[LeftWinger 4,963]

12 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I'd rather have Lafren than Montreals entire prospect pool

Well, odds are, we aren't getting either. To Hell with this lottery system!

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

5 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Well, odds are, we aren't getting either. To Hell with this lottery system!

I'm with you there. The draft is communism and gambling rolled all into one. It's ******* clown world out there.